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[Column] General: How to Make Military Shooter MMOs Better

SBFordSBFord Former Associate EditorMember LegendaryPosts: 33,127

I often wish I could enjoy realistic military shooters like World of Tanks. I have tried them before, and the closest I came to joy was when I was piloting an old aircraft over a massive battlefield... then I was shot down. Because these games are skill-based shooters, it’s often the case that when you die you just stay dead; there’s no room for error. The last time I played World of Tanks I grew so impatient I just logged out. I probably appeared to be the world’s most sore loser.

Read more of Beau Hindman's Not So MMO: How to Make Military Shooter MMOs Better.

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¯\_(ツ)_/¯ 


Comments

  • DistopiaDistopia Member EpicPosts: 21,183
    Make them actual MMO's?

    For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson


  • ArklithArklith Member UncommonPosts: 4
    I read the first line then stopped I don't need to know the ideas of someone that thinks WoT is a realistic military shooter.
  • rojoArcueidrojoArcueid Member EpicPosts: 10,720

    a realistic military shooter would not limit my gameplay to the entrails of a tank or a plane. Im part of a trained military corp so i should be able to control a character, use mortars, anti tank equipment, anti aerial equipment, etc if i so desire. 

     

    World of Tanks, War Thunder, Armored Warfare, even Hawken, would be better military shooters if you were able to get out of those machines and play a more tactical role while having the risk of being overwhelmed by the obvious heavy artillery threat.

     

    I think think the few shooters that have done that all fell a bit short in some way.

     

    Thats just my opinion and i would love to see a game like that really well done.





  • MMOGamer71MMOGamer71 Member UncommonPosts: 1,988
    Originally posted by Arklith
    I read the first line then stopped I don't need to know the ideas of someone that thinks WoT is a realistic military shooter.

    Was thinking the same thing, though I read the article and wondered why Orcs Must Die is mentioned in a military shooter column.

     

  • KonfessKonfess Member RarePosts: 1,667
    Originally posted by MMOGamer71
    Originally posted by Arklith
    I read the first line then stopped I don't need to know the ideas of someone that thinks WoT is a realistic military shooter.

    Was thinking the same thing, though I read the article and wondered why Orcs Must Die is mentioned in a military shooter column.

     

    "Let’s get to the news."  Because talk of shooters was over.

     

    Why no decorating of tanks?  Because of game engine optimization?  First step of optimization is to remove stuff that doesn’t have to be drawn every screen refresh.  Load the basic model, and basic textures.  Loading extra models and textures is considered a waste of resources and will slow down the engine.    Another reason, getting sued by another company that owns a copyright over a technique or process, that your generic implementation infringes upon.


    After I clean the pool and setup for the party I will try a test.  But my gut feeling is sure it can be done (decorations), but the number of gaming rigs that can handle it would be small or limited.

    Pardon any spelling errors
    Konfess your cyns and some maybe forgiven
    Boy: Why can't I talk to Him?
    Mom: We don't talk to Priests.
    As if it could exist, without being payed for.
    F2P means you get what you paid for. Pay nothing, get nothing.
    Even telemarketers wouldn't think that.
    It costs money to play.  Therefore P2W.

  • EncephalitisEncephalitis Member UncommonPosts: 78
    Originally posted by rojoArcueid

    a realistic military shooter would not limit my gameplay to the entrails of a tank or a plane. Im part of a trained military corp so i should be able to control a character, use mortars, anti tank equipment, anti aerial equipment, etc if i so desire. 

     

    World of Tanks, War Thunder, Armored Warfare, even Hawken, would be better military shooters if you were able to get out of those machines and play a more tactical role while having the risk of being overwhelmed by the obvious heavy artillery threat.

     

    I think think the few shooters that have done that all fell a bit short in some way.

     

    Thats just my opinion and i would love to see a game like that really well done.

    pretty sure the game you're looking for then is called "battlefield".

  • rojoArcueidrojoArcueid Member EpicPosts: 10,720
    Originally posted by Encephalitis
    Originally posted by rojoArcueid

    a realistic military shooter would not limit my gameplay to the entrails of a tank or a plane. Im part of a trained military corp so i should be able to control a character, use mortars, anti tank equipment, anti aerial equipment, etc if i so desire. 

     

    World of Tanks, War Thunder, Armored Warfare, even Hawken, would be better military shooters if you were able to get out of those machines and play a more tactical role while having the risk of being overwhelmed by the obvious heavy artillery threat.

     

    I think think the few shooters that have done that all fell a bit short in some way.

     

    Thats just my opinion and i would love to see a game like that really well done.

    pretty sure the game you're looking for then is called "battlefield".

    like i said, the few games that have done it fell a bit short in some way. Battlefield has been focusing too much on the Call of Duty gameplay and as a result, the features that made BF shine feel more tacked on (to me personally).





  • TheRabidsmurfTheRabidsmurf Member UncommonPosts: 146
    Purpose or finale goal seems missing from these fps games. Not mmo, like territory control(after the fight), benefit of territory control/resource, and varied path to said reasons to pewpew. Most shooters are team-solo deathmatch arena.
  • Loke666Loke666 Member EpicPosts: 21,441

    First of all, I wouldn't call these games MMOs but whatever.

    With customization I have to agree to some part, even if I don't want to see pink Tigers with loads of naked ladies on them. Allowing the player to do customization in a garage is a good idea and you could give each stuff they add a cost (like XP) that we have to gain by playing.

    I think the German Airforce of WW1 is a great example here. First of all did each Jasta usually have several different plane types and they sometimes got planes that just were made in a few (or even single) test planes. Pfalz Dr1 (a triplane) were there only made 12 of, they werent happy with the performance but still sent them out to the front. The pilot with most kills were asked first if he wanted in and then it went downwards.

    The leader of the Jasta decided how the planes of none "kanonen" (aces with 10 kills) were painted and his own plane. Von Rictoffen went for a fully red plane himself and decided all other planes had to have some red parts on them. The rest of his aces (and Jasta 11 is still the best squadron in history) painted their planes how they liked it, besides that they all needed to have something red on them.

    Also, people who were aces tended to put modify their planes, many Nieuport 17 aces (Not Germans but French and British) added a lewis gun over their wing besides the Vicker gun, it took away some performance but gave a higher fire power. Verner Voss of Jasta 11 put a Nieuport engine on his Fokker dreidecker, totally against regulations but who cares, he had a Blue max medal around his neck.

    Mechanics like this is easy to make, fun for the players and add a slightly MMO like factor to the game. You get a plane or tank that is yours.

    Beside that I think many of these games needs to have far more scenarios, too many of them focus on just killing the opponets or playing capture the flag. Heck, I play a WW1 tabletop called Blue Max were we run loads of different scenarios with different win conditions (we even have XP and ace abilities for the few pilots that survives a game or more).

    I do think these games are interesting and they could be a lot more fun with some fresh ideas. That still doesn't make them MMOs though but fun is fun.

  • DelCabonDelCabon Member UncommonPosts: 257

    I started my military career as an 11BC02 or Dragon Gunner (Anti-Tank) shoulder fired wire fed 1000m 35' back blast pre-tow 100. In the movies they were referred to as Bazookas but for some reason my trainers in AIT hated this term.

     

    I agree with rojoArcueid. I would love to see a game that incorporated more true to life tactical elements. Just having tanks on a field seems too far from reality. Give me a Tow and a dragon sight and I would love to join the fray.

     

    I personally tend to avoid military games and especially mech based shooters for the simple fact that while it seems fun to roll around in a tank the truth is I wouldnt wish a mech MOS on anyone. Id rather hump a mortar base in full gear for the Manchu March than spend one day in any tank.

     

    With that said I might consider a military based shooter MMO if it offered enough field elements where I could choose my role and play up through some type of tiered command structure.

     

    Del Cabon
    A US Army ('Just Cause') Vet and MMORPG Native formerly of Trinsic, Norath and Dereth. Currently playing LOTRO. 

  • WizardryWizardry Member LegendaryPosts: 19,332

    What has ruined military combat games for me since the first COD has been the presence of RADAR in these games.I hate radar,we used to call radar a cheat in fps games,now it is a staple in most every game.

    It is not FUN if you know where everyone is and there should be friendly fire damage as well.I want there to be lots of cover also,i hate ANY pvp game that just pits players standing out in the open or even in a tank out in the open.

    As to trying for the most possible realism,nah that is not fun,because you don't fight wars anymore like that,you fight them with computers and technology now.

    Everyone seems in a rush now a days in gaming.I would rather see some fun strategy like your team gets to spend 10 minutes laying out mines and traps on the map the opponents have to infiltrate.

    I think a tank game could be really fun if done right.One of my fave games as a kid was Battle tank.However as i mentioned,soon i see any kind of radar,then i'm not into it at all.

    Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.

  • jitter77jitter77 Member UncommonPosts: 469
    Originally posted by Wizardry

    What has ruined military combat games for me since the first COD has been the presence of RADAR in these games.I hate radar,we used to call radar a cheat in fps games,now it is a staple in most every game.

    It is not FUN if you know where everyone is and there should be friendly fire damage as well.I want there to be lots of cover also,i hate ANY pvp game that just pits players standing out in the open or even in a tank out in the open.

    As to trying for the most possible realism,nah that is not fun,because you don't fight wars anymore like that,you fight them with computers and technology now.

    Everyone seems in a rush now a days in gaming.I would rather see some fun strategy like your team gets to spend 10 minutes laying out mines and traps on the map the opponents have to infiltrate.

    I think a tank game could be really fun if done right.One of my fave games as a kid was Battle tank.However as i mentioned,soon i see any kind of radar,then i'm not into it at all.

    Well I understand your point, but with satellites and what not now it is pretty much like radar in a game

     

  • EntinerintEntinerint Member UncommonPosts: 868

    Writer needs to play Planetside 2, like, yesterday. It does everything they are "suggesting."

     

    I would love an Arma 3 style game with the scale of Planetside 2. Right now the best you get in Arma 3 is 75 person servers. I want that, with those landmasses, but with 2000 players on a map, a command structure, etc. That would be amazing.

     

    The only two true military MMOs I can think of aren't listed in this column, oddly, and that is Planetside/2 and WW2 Online. Planetside 2 I wouldn't call realistic, though it is a lot of fun, and WW2 online is also fun but underpopulated and incredibly outdated.

     

    Destiny, WoT, and all those other mentioned games are not MMOs, they are hub world games at best. Can we get a new acronym please? How about POGs (Persistent Online Game) or something like that. There are far too many non-MMOs trying to convince us they are MMOs and too many MMOs trying to convince us that they're not MMOs.

     

    I would also love to see a beefed up WW2 Online - that game can be amazingly fun when everything comes together.

     

     

     
  • Loke666Loke666 Member EpicPosts: 21,441
    Originally posted by jitter77

    Well I understand your point, but with satellites and what not now it is pretty much like radar in a game

    Yeah, in a modern game it makes sense. In a WW2 or WW1 game on the other hand it is just unrealistic and frankly don't make the game more fun.

  • AkruxAkrux Member UncommonPosts: 56

    World of Tanks - if you die simply leave the battle and start a new battle in a different tank

    Overlord - I refuse to play a game that encourages bunny jumping as it is a totally silly mechanic in a game. Imagine in real life that an enemy is targeting you so the best thing for you to do is repeatedly jump into the air?????? How about a game that emphasis taking cover instead?

  • mmoguy43mmoguy43 Member UncommonPosts: 2,770

    Umm so...

     

    Planetside 2 with 1000 players fighting in the same space.

    Yep that's about it.

  • RuffceyxRuffceyx Member UncommonPosts: 1
    Originally posted by Arklith
    I read the first line then stopped I don't need to know the ideas of someone that thinks WoT is a realistic military shooter.

    It gave me a good chuckle also. One of those.. sad.. head shaking chuckles.

  • Loke666Loke666 Member EpicPosts: 21,441
    Originally posted by Ruffceyx
    Originally posted by Arklith
    I read the first line then stopped I don't need to know the ideas of someone that thinks WoT is a realistic military shooter.

    It gave me a good chuckle also. One of those.. sad.. head shaking chuckles.

    Everything is relative. Compared to wizards calling down meteors and men in tights that fly WoT is realistic...

  • kenpokillerkenpokiller Member UncommonPosts: 321

    SilentHunter3MMO

     

    but also one for Tanks & airplanes.

     

    Omg, do it.

    Sway all day, butterfly flaps all the way!

  • KonfessKonfess Member RarePosts: 1,667
    Originally posted by Akrux

    World of Tanks - if you die simply leave the battle and start a new battle in a different tank

    Overlord - I refuse to play a game that encourages bunny jumping as it is a totally silly mechanic in a game. Imagine in real life that an enemy is targeting you so the best thing for you to do is repeatedly jump into the air?????? How about a game that emphasis taking cover instead?

    Bunny hopping is the skill that fps gamers claim they have in twitch games.  The twitch mmo is extremely vulnerable to exploitations.  Unfortunately twitch gamers wrong believe that exploiting is a skill.

     

    Gamers want to fire from cover.  The limitations of the technology require that fire be done, out of cover.

    Pardon any spelling errors
    Konfess your cyns and some maybe forgiven
    Boy: Why can't I talk to Him?
    Mom: We don't talk to Priests.
    As if it could exist, without being payed for.
    F2P means you get what you paid for. Pay nothing, get nothing.
    Even telemarketers wouldn't think that.
    It costs money to play.  Therefore P2W.

  • beauhindmanbeauhindman ColumnistMember UncommonPosts: 8

    Just to be clear, I wasn't asking for MORE realism by decorating a kitchen inside a tank. I was asking for more fun.

    Also, to those who seem to think this a column about MMOs, please note the title: 

    Not So MMO

    :)

     

    Beau

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