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Newbie Defense
RedSovereign
Member Posts: 4
Okay so i'm on my 14 Day Trial, though after this down time and feelin this withdrawal i think i may have to pick it up for a full account. In my travels i was buying upgrades for my ship. I had just purchased a Rifter frigate and was flying around space picking up all my parts for armament. As i'm autopiloting to each of my destinations I come through a Stargate and am immediately attacked by Ship 200km away with a Tachyon Laser II. The only reason i know this is because after he destroyed my ship he also killed my pod, so i got a nice little EVEmail telling me who killed, in what ship and so forth. Now i tried to jump out but the laser hit me so hard i had no more power to warp. My question is, for us newbies running courier missions and the like that aren't experienced enough to handle 0.0 space. What is the best way to avoid being savagely raped by ships far superior to you. I don't mean to fight them, just to run past them. I've now learned a little about warp stabilizers but is there anything i can equip on my ship that can boost the defense so i can take those hits long enough to warp out or maybe something that would cloak me or make me impossible to hit at that range. Anyting would be a help for a newbie like me. Thanks
Comments
I shudder at the response you'll get from the EVE vets on this issue. Typically, you'll probably hear these things from them, no particular order:
Wait and get X ship with Y, Z parts, that you'll have neither the skill, nor the ISK to acquire soon.
Join a corp, knowing full well that no corp is going to waste time on a player who can't survive a gate camp.
Five lectures on social darwinism.
Ten accusations of being a carebear.
And twenty requests to stop whining, because "its your own fault for taking the mission."
Typically though, most of the agents that will talk to you at this stage won't send you to 0.0. They may send you to losec (0.4-0.3 usually). But you can avoid most of the losec in transit if you click the "prefer safer routes" on the galactic map options.
__________________________
"Its sad when people use religion to feel superior, its even worse to see people using a video game to do it."
--Arcken
"...when it comes to pimping EVE I have little restraints."
--Hellmar, CEO of CCP.
"It's like they took a gun, put it to their nugget sack and pulled the trigger over and over again, each time telling us how great it was that they were shooting themselves in the balls."
--Exar_Kun on SWG's NGE
Sadly autopilot doesn't give you the normal warning that jumping through low sec space does. It assumed you noticed your route brought you into dangerous areas.
The main way of preventing this is by F10 / Autopilot / Prefer Safer. That'll keep your route, if possible, locked into high sec (safe) areas only. In some cases, mostly trips between empires, this will make your trip much longer. Say, 22 jumps vs 15 jumps. However, it'll keep you out of 0.4 systems like the one you were killed in. I'm guessing you were flying through Amamake perhaps? It's a 0.4 "chokepoint" system in the Minmatar region.
Cloaking will take you a few weeks of training for perhaps, and really not worth it for a cheap little frigate like the Rifter. For the most part as a newbie simply stay out of low sec space. Try not to use agents in 0.5 systems, since they often send you to low sec space for missions.
Warp stabs will help a little bit, and instabook marks are vital for trying to avoid gate camps like that. Information however will be your best tool. F10 / Display Settings / Stars / Ships killed last hour and Pods killed last hour, combined with Active pilots in space and Pilots docked will tell you how busy/dangerous a system is. If there have been ships killed recently, might be best to wait till later to fly through, or plot a course around that system.
I'm sorry, but I must disagree with this. If you join a PvP corp full of experienced members then, yes, that's probrably the attitude you'll get. There are however plenty of corps that are newbie friendly.
Have a look on the offices tab of a station and read some of the corp descriptions. Another tactic would be to ask around in your local chat channel.
The best way to learn about the game is in a player corporation as you'll get to know the folks there and have some fun socially whilst learning.
Obviously the advice about the autopilot settings holds true, but it's possible to get this sort of information before you need it, by joining a newbie friendly corp.
Hope you stick with it.
Masema
Takes a long time for a BS to lock a frigate. Speed is your best friend.
Use AB or MWD to make it to the gate before the lock.
Also, when you set a destination, you can see small dots at the side of your screen, coresponding to the security levels of the stops on your destination. They range from blue (1.0 space), to red (danger). Anything from blue to yellow means the system is safe. But if it dips into orange, then that is losec, and a free fire zone.
__________________________
"Its sad when people use religion to feel superior, its even worse to see people using a video game to do it."
--Arcken
"...when it comes to pimping EVE I have little restraints."
--Hellmar, CEO of CCP.
"It's like they took a gun, put it to their nugget sack and pulled the trigger over and over again, each time telling us how great it was that they were shooting themselves in the balls."
--Exar_Kun on SWG's NGE
I appreciate the help. And i hope Vet players don't try and flame me with that carebear garbage because i'm not complaining about being killed, i just want to know if there was a way for a less experienced player in an inferior ship to survive gate camps by battle cruisers. Side question: When you gate you go transparent, i thought this was a form of stealth to protect you from gate camping. Being that i was shot while in this status i'm assuming that it's purely visual, is this true?
I have survived a gatecamp from a BS. I was in a shuttle though, might as well have been an atron or executioner though, I think I might have been able to outrun him better. I head to the station, I was there to pick up an item, a very pricey 800k ISK item. Pick it up head to outside the gate near a planet. try to scan, and he is on top of me already locking on at 100k . -10 sec on him... I warp back to the station and just wait it out....
When you go through the gate and you're glimmery, you are cloaked. This cloak gets canceled the second you move anywhere. If your autopilot was on, it moves right away, and you cancel the cloak. Don't move with the autopilot, use the gate cloak to your advantage. (note that it expires after a certain number of seconds)
A gankageddon is designed to be an extreme long range very fast locking ship.
Methods to avoid getting hit by a gankageddon:
1. Warp to the nearest thing your ship is pointing at. This incurs less of an alignment time penalty.
2. Fit a harder tank to soak up any damage
3. Punch the AB the second you start moving
4. Get intel: Use the map - look for any podkills and ships destroyed when traveling in lowsec space, stay out of known ganking systems
Two questions in response to the last post:
- Fit a harder tank? I'm assuming you mean add armor to a ship? I know how the term tank applies in EQ2 and such but not in EVE.
-Is there a hotkey for warping and/or quick targeting what's ahead of you?
Actually qhile i'm asking, is there quick key to Lock target as well?
I'm guessing in the retail version the manual has a list of the hotkeys, but the tutorial didn't really go over them. Thanks again for all the info.
It depends if you are shield tanking or armor tanking. (Amarr is armor tank, Caldari is shield tank, Gallente and Minnie can do both for the most part).
Shield tanking has several key modules:
- Hardners (Photon Scattering Field, Invulnerbility Field): these increase your damage resists. A damage resist of 50% is like having 2x more armor. These come in both passive and active varities.
- Shield boosters (Repair shields)
- Amplifiers (increase effectiveness of boosters)
- Extenders (simply add HP to your sheild)
- Mostly mid-slot modules
Armor tanking:
- Hardners (Energized ... Plate, Armor .. Hardner) same as above
- Armor repairers
- Plates (increase HP)
- Mostly lo-slot modules
No hotkey for moving ahead. Look at the screen, find the nearest icon to dead ahead, click on it, hit warp to in overview.
Hotkey for locking: Ctrl+Click in space or overview
Thing is - you mentioned getting caught when you were picing up equipment for your new ship... That can happen to anyone anytime.
an Unequpped ship is not so safe - but everyone has to do it time to time.
When travelling in a frigate, try to boost your advantages - speed and agilty. Nanofibers in lows are pretty good.
Also, if your not intending combat, fit oversized shield extenders - like a med shield extender on a rifter. I often use that even in combat, as it allows me some extra time to take damage but still get the hell out of there if i get in trouble.
Best advice I can give is to learn how to use you map F10. And check out ships/pods destroyd in the last hour and try to stay out of those systems. Using an alt to scout out systems is also an idea if you need to go through low sec systems that are being camped. This way you can see what gates are camped.
As Cenn mentioned using Nanofibers in the lowslots is good for getting past gate camps, as the campers get less time to lock you before you warp out.
Battleships and Heavy Assault Cruisers can tank the sentrys in .4 -.1, and if they are running a sniper settup they can almost insta lock you.
Agents have a tendency to send you off to the same systems multiple times, so if you are running missions close to low sec make bookmarks to the closest systems and the routes you are using.
Insta Bookmarks = bookmarks that warps you directly ontop of the gate so you can jump straight through. Use people and places -> Places -> Add bookmark. When you warp to a gate just head in a straight line towards a spot about 10k behind the gate and make your bm there. Give you bm's names so you know where you are coming from and where they are taking you.( Bantish GT -> Azedi GT) And test it. These bm's also make travelig much faster and safer
These will only help you when warping to the gate not when you are coming out on the other side of the gate.
/emote goes into lecturing mode
Alright class, today we talk about avoiding bad evil people who think of you as their personal target dummy. How to see them and how to avoid them.
First before travel starts:
1.) Don't go to lowsec and/or 0.0, only if really necessary.
2.) The Map is your best friend: If you set a course into your autopilot then check first if your plotted course brings you to into a possible troublespot with evil people in it. Do this by calling up the map (F10). Then set your autopilot to "stay in higher sec (0.5 and above) whenever possible". If you need to go through lowsec nonetheless, then additionally look up the "ships destroyed in last hour" and "podkills in the last hour" (look for those options on the "star" tab of your map controls). If your course would go through a starsystem with a a very bright spot (meaning evil people do their work) then you should either set an other course around (by setting waypoints) or, if that is the only possible path maybe postpone the travel. You can always check the starsystems and their security rating on the left side of the screen (that funny view that looks like a coloured pearl chain - anything orange and closer to red is ... bad, I mean ... potentially dangerous)
3.) Instant Boomarks are even better friends: Well, how to setup Instant bookmarks has been explained by other people way better (i.e. check EVE Forums), so check out those posts. Using them is easy and they provide one of the best possibilities to avoid problems. Basically you turn off your Autopilot and move from bookmark to bookmark, so you land on top (ideally) of the next gate and avoid that louzy, boring 15km move to the gate, thereby making you nearly immune to those evil people trying to snipe you away.
But there are other considerations
4.) Fitting your ship: Fitting your ship is an additional help. Use Nanofibers Is in the lowslots of your ship. They are the essential stuff of the seasoned traveller. They make you go to warp faster, because they improve the acceleration agility of your ship and because they improve the turning rate of your ship. All in all a small ship with as much nanofibers as possible on it combined with instant bookmarks is nearly uncatchable. Even an industrial ship is very hard to catch with those nice things.
Additionally fit and MWD when travelling. Not for the 15km approach to the gate (that 15km will be take care of by the instant bokmarks), but to go faster into warp. You do this: when your ship starts aligning into warp, and just decloaks, then press the MWD just once, and your ship will align faster. The heavier your ship the more you will notice a difference. It's just split seconds, but you need every bit of advantage you can get when travelling in dangerous areas.
Second, when you are there:
1.) Set an autopilot course, but NEVER activate it in those lowsec places... NEVER. The set course you see on the left side of your screen should only help you to see what bookmarks you need (to what gate). Ofc if you didnt listen to me and you dont have bookmarks you need to use the autopilot, but that is not recommended in lowsec.
2.) Look at your scanner (ALWAYS): If you see a larger ship over 100km away you should get suspicious. If you see a battleship 10km away you should get suspicious too..... hmm on the other hand ... be ALWAYS suspicous in lowsec. Dont do ANYTHING, because after jump your ship stays cloaked for one minute as long as you dont move. If the scanner is clear you can ease a bit .... right?.... NO!!!! WRONG!! Didn't you listen? ALWAYS be suspicious in lowsec. There could be a cloaked ship at the gate for example. Now... If you havent done the points above AND there is a ship showing up on scanner (anything else than shuttle or industrial ship ofc) then you might be screwed, tough luck. If you did the points above then stay calm... if you dont move and lose nerves then you have all the time you need. Simply right click on the background and warp to the appropriate bookmark you need. And dont forget to grin as the evil person tries to lock you but you are too fast into warp for him to do anything about it... because?... YES.. because you fitted nanofibers. And grin a bit even more when you warp right on top of the next gate and you see an evil person there too, waiting for you to go those 15km.... buuut ... yes... you are using instant bookmarks ..... so.... yes... grin, and then jump. See?.... easy? Now go and practice it a bit.
Well class, these are the main things to consider when travelling in the potentially dangerous areas of the EVE cluster. These tactics work well to avoid cowardly and lame snipers. But there are other tactics, which are too evil to speak of them openly, which could mean your end nonetheless, thought those are rarely used, so you should be quite safe in most cases. Stay calm and sharp, use instas, and you will get to your destination in one piece.
Yes? ... you have a question
that is a bonus but not essential for safe travel No Hover the mouse over your future target on the overview. Click on it while holding CTRLAnything else?.. Good.....
Ah the bell is ringing. See you next time.
>> Oh and kudos for not whining about getting killed in lowsec. I have seen too many posts about that. Take care.
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Originally posted by Mandolin
Designers need to move away from the old D&D level-based model which was never designed for player vs player combat in the first place.
If you are just travelling and do not want to be shot at even in low sec areas can I suggest the following
Get a cheap but fast frig with 2/3/or more low slots. Equip those losw slots with Internal NanonFibres. They make the ship weaker but also make it faster and more importantly help it to align and warp fast. In addition to this train the appropriate navigation skill that boosts manoeverability/alignment to at least 4. With a setup like that you start to align on the next gate before you even uncloak and get to warp EXTREMELY quickly The time an enemy has to lock you is almost 0.
Stick a 1 MN MWD in mid slot and activate it as soon as you come out of warp on the other side. Your speed will shoot up over 3k in under a second and you will be through the gate before anyone can stop you. Of course if you afk you wont be able to activate MWD and you will simply amble to the gate and get ganked.
I have used a basic Executioner (Amarr beginner frigate) as my 'taxi' since the start of EVE and have never once been caught at a gate camp even running through enemy infested systems like HED-GP.
Do not EVER use a regular shuttle to move around in dangerous space. Sure you will warp very fast after jumping into a system but with no MWD on the shuttle you will easily be caught at the gate on the way out of system by anyone with a fast lock + webber...
Amarr Victor
One way to aid yourself would be to set waypoints ahead of the gate by about 15km's, so when you warp to them, you're right on the gate and can immediately make the jump. With the time between the ganker realizing a new guy came in and targetting, (no matter how fast the said targetting is,) you should be able to go invisible and jump before he can get a shot off.
Setting these waypoints requires trial-and-error in knowing just where to put them, as well as patience since you'll have to set one for ever gate and travel manually. But with patience and selective usage of the <0.5 systems, you can map out these handy waypoints at every system you'll need. Practice this waypoint placement in 1.0-0.6 space first so you have it down for when you need to put the waypoints in a hurry.
But before all that, just fly safe systems, as was previously advised, until you can survive a hit or two in <0.5.
And always insure you're ship. And always upgrade your clone. That's advice for all situations, but ESPECIALLY <0.5 space.
SWG's NGE = EVE's Primary Source of New Players
When you select a destination with auto-pilot... you get a list of waypoints. Avoid the systems marked as red because those are the systems you can be *POPPED* in (0.4 to 0.0).
Also, you can change the settings of your auto-pilot to only go through safe systems and to avoid low-sec (dangerous) systems.
SobaKai.com
There are two types of people in this world - people that suck... and me.
This is a great thread for a noob (such as myself!) Lots of useful advice. I have currently put my learning skills on hold to learn the skills necessary to enable me to fly a frigate with 2x Local Hull Conversion Nanofiber Structure 1s and a 1MN Microwarpdrive (and yes, I do need to save up first!)
I am wondering what ship to get however (Caldari) I am thinking about getting a Kestrel, would this be the preferred choice to quickly and discreetly get from system to system or would one of the others be a better choice? (I had a quick look and saw the Herron was slightly faster I think)
Thanks
If your going to travel in a caldari ship, my suggestion would be to use a Condor as they are the fastest one available, and also one of the cheapest (with the money you save on this instead of a Kestrel you should be able to buy those needed skills, though the kestrel or merlin is immensely more powerful in combat they are quite slow). Also as the Condor has the lowest mass of the caldari frigates so not being able to fit a second nano won't be much of a problem as it's acceleration is already very good.
What makes you say that?