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delete5230delete5230 Member EpicPosts: 6,929

Me first,

I'm not playing any mmo right now.  Reason :

1) Cash shop, I've never gave a dime to a cash shop.....They don't belong. Sub or maybe B2P only.

2) Small zones.  It's not immersive if your loading.

3) Short 30 day games. Graphics seem to have to be high end for the picky players, yet they complain about not enough content.

4) Dungeon finders, it's an mmo they don't belong. ( give better social tools to find groups )

5) If the mmo has cross server anything it will not last.

6) Easy, fast leveling, solo content, with dynamic events. Well then it's not an mmo.

 

Each one was introduced within the last five or six years, and each one is an mmo killer on there own.

 

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Comments

  • HorusraHorusra Member EpicPosts: 4,411
    Originally posted by delete5230

    Me first,

    I'm not playing any mmo right now.  Reason :

    1) Cash shop, I've never gave a dime to a cash shop.....They don't belong. Sub or maybe B2P only.

    2) Small zones.  It's not immersive if your loading.

    3) Short 30 day games. Graphics seem to have to be high end for the picky players, yet they complain about not enough content.

    4) Dungeon finders, it's an mmo they don't belong. ( give better social tools to find groups )

    5) If the mmo has cross server anything it will not last.

    6) Easy, fast leveling, solo content, with dynamic events. Well then it's not an mmo.

     

    Each one was introduced within the last five or six years, and each one is an mmo killer on there own.

     

    Yeah no way this cross server fad will last...WoW is done....

  • Azaron_NightbladeAzaron_Nightblade Member EpicPosts: 4,829
    Originally posted by KaitarBesh

    2) They're all same-old-same-old at this point. I don't even mean mechanics-wise, I mean a literal cut and paste of linear boring grind to "end game" asap and then grind end game. Somewhere along the way, MMOs became about end game and not about enjoying the world, the journey, the story and the people around you.

     

    That's actually exactly what MMOs like SWTOR, GW2, TSW and ESO were going for. MMOs where the journey was meant to be fun instead of just a boring grind to end game.

    But the only correct answer to this thread is:

    Today's MMOs are bad. Like soooo very, very bad! (It's a Deletenumbersomething thread. They are all the same.)

    My SWTOR referral link for those wanting to give the game a try. (Newbies get a welcome package while returning players get a few account upgrades to help with their preferred status.)

    https://www.ashesofcreation.com/ref/Callaron/

  • BruceYeeBruceYee Member EpicPosts: 2,556

    When I started playing MMO's they had the most out of this world experience available to me at that time.

    They provided me with another world to go to everyday in a format(online game) that didn't exist when I was growing up.

    Now the world has gotten so crazy and moves so fast that worlds I found interesting 10 years ago seem slow/boring/dull.

    Turn on the news and I see a real life GTA or Call of Duty happening right before my eyes.

    I now look for "quick fix" video games to fit into my busy schedule which are mostly AARPGs or MOBAs.

    If an MMO is made that gives me good reward/time spent like those types of games I will probably play them again.

  • HorusraHorusra Member EpicPosts: 4,411
    Originally posted by KaitarBesh
    Originally posted by Azaron_Nightblade
    Originally posted by KaitarBesh

    2) They're all same-old-same-old at this point. I don't even mean mechanics-wise, I mean a literal cut and paste of linear boring grind to "end game" asap and then grind end game. Somewhere along the way, MMOs became about end game and not about enjoying the world, the journey, the story and the people around you.

     

    That's actually exactly what MMOs like SWTOR, GW2, TSW and ESO were going for. MMOs where the journey was meant to be fun instead of just a boring grind to end game.

    But the only correct answer to this thread is:

    Today's MMOs are bad. Like soooo very, very bad! (It's a Deletenumbersomething thread. They are all the same.)

     

    No, ESO GW2 and SWTOR just slapped a different skin on the same formula and tried to gimmick it up and call it "different". There was absolutely -nothing- innovative about any of those titles. They were all very shallow, linear and "quick reward for 0 effort", like most new generation MMOs. And yes, I've tried them all. TSW is the exception, but the game is so clunky and the setting so cheesy I can't bring myself to get into it.

    Do not have to be innovative to be fun. 

  • bcbullybcbully Member EpicPosts: 11,813

    The last 3 years have been the most fun I've had in the mmorpg world.  

     

    I'm a pen and pad gamer at the core.  3 years ago I started Age of Wushu. I had never played a more immersive, believable game. From there I went to ESO. I've spent the past year in Cyrodiil creating new ways to play with the TES lore as a backdrop. ESO character customization takes back to my early days of pen and paper gaming. I'm able to develop and play my character the way want. 

    "We see fundamentals and we ape in"
  • Entris38Entris38 Member UncommonPosts: 401
    Originally posted by DMKano

    Finding happiness in a mmorpg is a lot like finding happiness in a relationship 

    Sure I can sit here and nitpick every little thing about every game I play

     

    Or

    I can look for fun things and have fun

     

    In the end we create our own happiness and fun 

    So I tell you - choose fun

     

     

     

    This forum needs a /like button! This couldn't be more true.

  • mayankingmayanking Member UncommonPosts: 162
    to easy not enough creativity.
  • WizardryWizardry Member LegendaryPosts: 19,332

    Most notable?

    Cheaper productions costs over last couple years.

    Unfinished game releases disguised as early access,Alpha tests.Tough to disguise when you charge money to play as any FINISHED product would do.

    smaller content updates,yet devs TRY to brag about how big and expansive they are,so in essence just lying.

    More and more instance content rather than game world

    Continued hand holding and gaming on rails.

    I'll end it there as that is enough to show how poor quality game design has become.

    Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.

  • CrazKanukCrazKanuk Member EpicPosts: 6,130
    Originally posted by KaitarBesh
    Originally posted by Azaron_Nightblade
    Originally posted by KaitarBesh

    2) They're all same-old-same-old at this point. I don't even mean mechanics-wise, I mean a literal cut and paste of linear boring grind to "end game" asap and then grind end game. Somewhere along the way, MMOs became about end game and not about enjoying the world, the journey, the story and the people around you.

     

    That's actually exactly what MMOs like SWTOR, GW2, TSW and ESO were going for. MMOs where the journey was meant to be fun instead of just a boring grind to end game.

    But the only correct answer to this thread is:

    Today's MMOs are bad. Like soooo very, very bad! (It's a Deletenumbersomething thread. They are all the same.)

     

    No, ESO GW2 and SWTOR just slapped a different skin on the same formula and tried to gimmick it up and call it "different". There was absolutely -nothing- innovative about any of those titles. They were all very shallow, linear and "quick reward for 0 effort", like most new generation MMOs. And yes, I've tried them all. TSW is the exception, but the game is so clunky and the setting so cheesy I can't bring myself to get into it.

    You could insert this same idea for any game or genre and not be wrong. It generalizes so heavily that it's actually a little sad. If you can't see the innovation in ESO, GW2 and SWTOR then you are completely and utterly blind or have a standard of innovation that is completely unrealistic. It seems like the only game that would be innovative to you would be one where you walked around upside down. Thing is, that doesn't even seem like a fun feature. Why the hell would I want to do that? Or I need to play with inverted controls. There's a balance between innovation and usefulness that always needs to be maintained. You don't innovate just for the sake of innovating or you die on the sword.

    Crazkanuk

    ----------------
    Azarelos - 90 Hunter - Emerald
    Durnzig - 90 Paladin - Emerald
    Demonicron - 90 Death Knight - Emerald Dream - US
    Tankinpain - 90 Monk - Azjol-Nerub - US
    Brindell - 90 Warrior - Emerald Dream - US
    ----------------

  • alivenaliven Member UncommonPosts: 346

    Ofc i play MMO. All the time. Got hard time commiting to one after wow (all are supbar to me) but still playing them. WS maybe will go b2p or f2p to cant wait for it. 

     

    Playing lol and watching Walking Bed currently. 

  • CyraelCyrael Member UncommonPosts: 239
    I'm very, very happy with Eve at the moment. Most of the things that people are constantly clamoring for on this site, Eve has.
  • FoomerangFoomerang Member UncommonPosts: 5,628

    I think the genre is ramping up toward a second golden age.

  • SiveriaSiveria Member UncommonPosts: 1,414
    Originally posted by KaitarBesh

    Not playing one either. No idea if and when I'll pick another MMO up. Going to depend on if anything ever releases again that gave me the feeling FFXI, Vanilla WoW, or  Vanilla EQ2 did.

     

    Major reasons I'm not playing beyond that?:

    1) Communities in these games definitely are not what they were a decade ago. Heck, they aren't what they were 5-8 years ago for that matter.  No reason to play an MMO if the community is so toxic you can't stand to talk to anyone in the game.

     

    2) They're all same-old-same-old at this point. I don't even mean mechanics-wise, I mean a literal cut and paste of linear boring grind to "end game" asap and then grind end game. Somewhere along the way, MMOs became about end game and not about enjoying the world, the journey, the story and the people around you.

     

    3) Small, linear zones laden with gating and invisible walls. Yes, because I want to feel like I'm playing a game in this tiny tunnel with quests and mobs oh-so- convienently spaced along that path, rather than a huge world I could go explore.

     

    4) Time - I'm working on a book series right now. I'm raising a 2 year old toddler who gave up naps 6 months ago and is extremely high-needs-high-energy (yes, more than most 2 year olds, trust me). I could set aside my writing to play at night, but why bother? Working on my book is more interesting than any of the MMOs out there at this point.

    I feel the same on 1,2 and 3. 4 isin't an  issue for me I got too much free time if anything. I'll also add that I feel msot "mmos" have lost the mmo aspect for the most part, in most of them you don't really need other players till level cap. What happened thr the classics like ff11 before square wrecked it by making it a joke? Where you had to group up to do anything really. The leveling up also felt like a journey since its not over in 2-3 days, well now a days you can go from 1-99 in a day so now it doesn't count, I am talking back before Abbysea came out, thats what ruined FF11. The community in FF11 also was not very toxic like most, mainly because you required people to do things, and if you had a bad rep people would avoid you like you had ebola or some other highly infectious illness.

    I also miss big worlds with stuff to find via exploring that are not on the beaten path of the quest hub. FPS games for example are just as bad, most fps games your doing nothing but walking down the same tunnels over and over, no secrets, no hidden things or anything of the sort anymore. See this image for example:

    I believe all the casuals have ruined mmorpg and gaming in general, since every devoloper pretty much caters to their whiney asses, resulting in mostly horrifically dumbed down games coming out that hold your hand every step of the way.

    Being a pessimist is a win-win pattern of thinking. If you're a pessimist (I'll admit that I am!) you're either:

    A. Proven right (if something bad happens)

    or

    B. Pleasantly surprised (if something good happens)

    Either way, you can't lose! Try it out sometime!

  • sketocafesketocafe Member UncommonPosts: 950

    With few exceptions, they all feel like the same game I've been playing for a decade. I started out liking them. Then I accepted them. After that I began to dislike them. Now I don't even want to play them. Stupid ass AI, hotbar combat, least possible resources invested in creation questing, tacked on crafting, 'convenience' features that shrink the world and lead to splintered communities and isolated players, instances everywhere, tiny worlds and on and on and on. If your game has these, then I've fucking played it before and grown sick of it, so don't bother. 

    How in the name of fuck can I enjoy the physical act of playing EVE more than any hotbar action MMO released in the last half decade? How does that even make sense? EVE's ui is something you have to get past to get into the game, not something that should depress you less than any other game out there in the genre. 

    If devs decide to actually put some damn resources into all of the bits of their game that they've just designed on autopilot since ever, maybe I'll like MMOs again. If they keep trying to pass off 2003 shit as something that's acceptable in this day and age, they're just making something I've already played a dozen times and don't need to play again.

  • SalvadorbardSalvadorbard Member UncommonPosts: 100

    I'm generally positive about MMOs (the ones I play at least). It's certainly true that there is as much trash as there is treasure.

     

     I think (and  I've made this point before on here) that it's what you make of it; nobody forces you to play one or any of these games and if they're not fun, don't play them. If the community is asinine, don't play. If the PVP is unbalanced, don't play...the list goes on of features that may be unsatisfactory but the omnipresent reminder is that you're choosing to spend your time and / or money playing a game you don't enjoy. The solution seems obvious to me.

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon Member EpicPosts: 27,775
    Originally posted by delete5230

    Me first,

    I'm not playing any mmo right now.  Reason :

    1) Cash shop, I've never gave a dime to a cash shop.....They don't belong. Sub or maybe B2P only.

    2) Small zones.  It's not immersive if your loading.

    3) Short 30 day games. Graphics seem to have to be high end for the picky players, yet they complain about not enough content.

    4) Dungeon finders, it's an mmo they don't belong. ( give better social tools to find groups )

    5) If the mmo has cross server anything it will not last.

    6) Easy, fast leveling, solo content, with dynamic events. Well then it's not an mmo.

     

    Each one was introduced within the last five or six years, and each one is an mmo killer on there own.

     

    My turn. I am playing Marvel Heroes, Warframe .. and may be some more MMOs. Reasons:

    1) F2P ... you get part of the fun game for free .. why not?

    2) convenient lobby games .. jump in a level and play .. 15 min a session .. don't need to "commit" to playing.

    3) Enough content for a long long time

    4) Dungeon finder ... turning the games into lobby games .. which i like

    5) Both of these games last for a long time ... without a persistent world.

    6) Fast leveling, solo content .. probably not a old style mmo .. but i don't play old style MMOs, i play fun (to me)  games (which more and more MMOs tends to be)

     

  • nbtscannbtscan Member UncommonPosts: 862
    I'm more or less over the genre as a whole.  Only started in the first place because an IP I like (Final Fantasy) had a game that was online only so I figured I'd give it a try.  I got about four years out of FFXI before the tediousness set in and a friend convinced me to try WoW.  It was much more accessible and easier to get things accomplished in the time I had available after work to play.  Eventually I got bored of playing WoW and made the swap to FFXIV when it first came out.  It was a terrible game, but I mostly stuck with it because I had a bunch of old friends from FFXI playing it.  I've been playing it ever since, and until it's no longer enjoyable for me I'll stick with it but I'm pretty sure I will just focus on single player games after my current stint with MMOs is over.
  • AmarantharAmaranthar Member EpicPosts: 5,225
    Originally posted by KaitarBesh

    Not playing one either. No idea if and when I'll pick another MMO up. Going to depend on if anything ever releases again that gave me the feeling FFXI, Vanilla WoW, or  Vanilla EQ2 did.

     

    Major reasons I'm not playing beyond that?:

    1) Communities in these games definitely are not what they were a decade ago. Heck, they aren't what they were 5-8 years ago for that matter.  No reason to play an MMO if the community is so toxic you can't stand to talk to anyone in the game.

     

    2) They're all same-old-same-old at this point. I don't even mean mechanics-wise, I mean a literal cut and paste of linear boring grind to "end game" asap and then grind end game. Somewhere along the way, MMOs became about end game and not about enjoying the world, the journey, the story and the people around you.

     

    3) Small, linear zones laden with gating and invisible walls. Yes, because I want to feel like I'm playing a game in this tiny tunnel with quests and mobs oh-so- convienently spaced along that path, rather than a huge world I could go explore.

     

    4) Time - I'm working on a book series right now. I'm raising a 2 year old toddler who gave up naps 6 months ago and is extremely high-needs-high-energy (yes, more than most 2 year olds, trust me). I could set aside my writing to play at night, but why bother? Working on my book is more interesting than any of the MMOs out there at this point.

    I pretty much agree with this. I'd add a few things:

    1. The linear progression with such power gaps means that your character only fits into a percentage of the content. That content is designed and directed, so you don't have the freedom to play and do what you want (within reason of some sort of progression or support needs, i.e. really tough dungeons should require a skilled group).
    2. Games are being made for Xbox and lack the ability to have lots of options at your fingertips. They've become too simplified.
    3. Games have also dumbed down to accommodate masses with blue ribbon expectations for no real effort or skill. They aren't even "games" anymore in this regard. They are simplified pleasure dispensers.
    4. There's very little mystery, and no way to solve mysteries outside of "running the quest". And of course, everyone runs the same quests so any mystery just dissolves into the quest grind.
    5. Worst of all, and related to my #1, is that players can't form lasting relationships unless they play on the same rate and at the same times -regularly- as some others. Levels divide the player base into tiers and zones. That's not a formula for a social environment.

    Once upon a time....

  • PhryPhry Member LegendaryPosts: 11,004

    Overall feelings for MMO's, i would have to say its really good, there are more good MMO's in the type that i enjoy playing, than i can realistically commit to, the MMO's that i play are fun, social experiences and depending on what i feel like playing at any given time i can log into my game of choice and have a fun experience.

    Which is more than can be said for when i first started playing MMO's when choice was severely restricted, and there were few really good games, they were fun, most certainly, but i had far far less choice then than i do now.

    So i am reasonably happy, and i don't see any clouds on the horizon either, good timesimage 

  • ThebeastttThebeasttt Member RarePosts: 1,130

    Oh man where do I begin.... Why I don't play MMO's anymore:

     

    1. Immersion completely ignored the past decade

    2. MMO's have turned into solo console games with a chat window

    3. Lack of forced grouping has breeded the worst communities on earth, yes it's the developers fault

    4. F2P is an illusion, we all pay with immersion and stripped/monetized gameplay

    5. Companies far worse then blizzard making shitty WoW clones is painful to watch for the n-th time

    6. Every game trying to make you a legendary hero at level 1, the moment you log in for the first time.

    7. Terrible exaggerated asian combat animation spam. An ability called "punch" should not have 50 flashing lights and five movements associated with it. Worst offenders: FFXIV, ArcheAge, EQ2

    8. Mindless solo questing from 1 to max level in every game. Do you guys really enjoy this? Which brings me to my next point:

    9. Poor innovation. Man this is huge, the lack of ground covered in the MMO market for the past ten years has been astonishing. Maybe WoW was ahead of it's time but MMO's have offered almost nothing new since then.

    10. You no longer have an attachment or feel of accomplishment with loot because it's given to you after every quest, or 4 pieces of armor per dungeon, etc.

    11. Stupid/Nonsensical looking armor and weapons+cartoon/disney character models=shoot self

    12. Games now designed to hold your attention for 2 months or less. They rather make 1 million today with a bad rep then 5 million tomorrow with a decent rep

    13. Gameplay beginning to take a back seat to graphics, though this isn't just an MMO problem. Every game on every console is going in this direction except for random steam games.

    14. Absurd leveling speed. How can you appreciate achieving max level when you gain 2 levels per quest, not to mention all the low level content wasted as you speed by, it's silly

    15. Mindless button spamming "action" combat. Few decisions need to be made these days. Your choices are either spamming the same rotation over and over(WoW) or spamming everything until it comes off cooldown(GW2).

    16. Pointless tradeskills and character classes. It boggles my mind how developers can leave entire professions useless for years. It's such an easy fix to make every tradeskill semi useful. Have some raid mobs drop tradeskill items FFS

    17. Slow patching. Everyone could really learn from League of Legends here. You may hate MOBA's but they CARE about their game. If something is imbalanced it is patched within 1 or 2 weeks, if not days.

  • MardukkMardukk Member RarePosts: 2,222
    Originally posted by delete5230

    Me first,

    I'm not playing any mmo right now.  Reason :

    1) Cash shop, I've never gave a dime to a cash shop.....They don't belong. Sub or maybe B2P only.

    2) Small zones.  It's not immersive if your loading.

    3) Short 30 day games. Graphics seem to have to be high end for the picky players, yet they complain about not enough content.

    4) Dungeon finders, it's an mmo they don't belong. ( give better social tools to find groups )

    5) If the mmo has cross server anything it will not last.

    6) Easy, fast leveling, solo content, with dynamic events. Well then it's not an mmo.

     

    Each one was introduced within the last five or six years, and each one is an mmo killer on there own.

     

     

    You need to play Darkfall.  It is none of those things.

     

    I think too many recent MMO's have no risk vs reward.  They have NPC's that order you around and really nothing else to do other than be ordered around and told where to hunt and what to do.

  • observerobserver Member RarePosts: 3,685
    Originally posted by CrazKanuk
    Originally posted by KaitarBesh
    Originally posted by Azaron_Nightblade
    Originally posted by KaitarBesh

    2) They're all same-old-same-old at this point. I don't even mean mechanics-wise, I mean a literal cut and paste of linear boring grind to "end game" asap and then grind end game. Somewhere along the way, MMOs became about end game and not about enjoying the world, the journey, the story and the people around you.

     

    That's actually exactly what MMOs like SWTOR, GW2, TSW and ESO were going for. MMOs where the journey was meant to be fun instead of just a boring grind to end game.

    But the only correct answer to this thread is:

    Today's MMOs are bad. Like soooo very, very bad! (It's a Deletenumbersomething thread. They are all the same.)

     

    No, ESO GW2 and SWTOR just slapped a different skin on the same formula and tried to gimmick it up and call it "different". There was absolutely -nothing- innovative about any of those titles. They were all very shallow, linear and "quick reward for 0 effort", like most new generation MMOs. And yes, I've tried them all. TSW is the exception, but the game is so clunky and the setting so cheesy I can't bring myself to get into it.

    You could insert this same idea for any game or genre and not be wrong. It generalizes so heavily that it's actually a little sad. If you can't see the innovation in ESO, GW2 and SWTOR then you are completely and utterly blind or have a standard of innovation that is completely unrealistic. It seems like the only game that would be innovative to you would be one where you walked around upside down. Thing is, that doesn't even seem like a fun feature. Why the hell would I want to do that? Or I need to play with inverted controls. There's a balance between innovation and usefulness that always needs to be maintained. You don't innovate just for the sake of innovating or you die on the sword.

    Agreed.  I don't see how people can actually believe that the genre hasn't improved or innovated.

    Combat and skill systems are some examples where there has been a lot of innovation.  

  • EncephalitisEncephalitis Member UncommonPosts: 78

    pure, unadulterated disappointment. i've yet to see or play anything in years that i thought was 'amazing', let alone 'good'. i can barely find games that are 'acceptable' or 'meh', and i don't even have standards for things anymore.

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon Member EpicPosts: 27,775
    Originally posted by nbtscan
      I've been playing it ever since, and until it's no longer enjoyable for me I'll stick with it but I'm pretty sure I will just focus on single player games after my current stint with MMOs is over.

    Why bother distinguish them? Some MMOs *are* single player games.

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon Member EpicPosts: 27,775
    Originally posted by observer
     

    Agreed.  I don't see how people can actually believe that the genre hasn't improved or innovated.

    Combat and skill systems are some examples where there has been a lot of innovation.  

    Yeh .. D3 combat is phenomenal .. with all the combo of physical effects. I have high hopes for Lost Ark too.

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