Originally posted by Acvivm Definitely sad news but honestly I was never that excited with what they have shown with Landmark and EQ Next. Both games reek of nothing but "ideas" and with a questionable ability to execute on those ideas. Voxels, dynamic questing and destructibility in online games has always had issues that I have little confidence they can pull off. The engine Landmark uses is an absolute mess right now even with only 5-10 people on the shard, this game would be unplayable with hundreds of players and dynamic AI running around fighting. I think they have bitten off more then they can chew at this point and I don't think this game is going to even come close to its original vision.
I have the opposite opinion of this. I never cared if EQNext was going to be a great game but getting someone to put those ideas onto the market is a huge step in the right direction for this genre. This genre has completely stagnated and nothing but garbage is being put out. The first revolutionary game that is going to change things is probably going to be very rough around the edges and I'm fine with that, someone just has to get it made and released. I was ready to support it becomes of the ideas behind it, had nothing to do with whether it fully succeeded or not.
Most likely the project will be turned into another crappy theme park and I won't touch it.
Originally posted by Acvivm Definitely sad news but honestly I was never that excited with what they have shown with Landmark and EQ Next. Both games reek of nothing but "ideas" and with a questionable ability to execute on those ideas. Voxels, dynamic questing and destructibility in online games has always had issues that I have little confidence they can pull off. The engine Landmark uses is an absolute mess right now even with only 5-10 people on the shard, this game would be unplayable with hundreds of players and dynamic AI running around fighting. I think they have bitten off more then they can chew at this point and I don't think this game is going to even come close to its original vision.
I have the opposite opinion of this. I never cared if EQNext was going to be a great game but getting someone to put those ideas onto the market is a huge step in the right direction for this genre. This genre has completely stagnated and nothing but garbage is being put out. The first revolutionary game that is going to change things is probably going to be very rough around the edges and I'm fine with that, someone just has to get it made and released. I was ready to support it becomes of the ideas behind it, had nothing to do with whether it fully succeeded or not.
Most likely the project will be turned into another crappy theme park and I won't touch it.
Its been built from the ground up as a sandbox game. They would need to start over to make it a themepark. Not sure the new owners would want to foot that bill but who knows maybe your right.
Originally posted by Nanfoodle Originally posted by Ender4Originally posted by AcvivmDefinitely sad news but honestly I was never that excited with what they have shown with Landmark and EQ Next. Both games reek of nothing but "ideas" and with a questionable ability to execute on those ideas. Voxels, dynamic questing and destructibility in online games has always had issues that I have little confidence they can pull off. The engine Landmark uses is an absolute mess right now even with only 5-10 people on the shard, this game would be unplayable with hundreds of players and dynamic AI running around fighting. I think they have bitten off more then they can chew at this point and I don't think this game is going to even come close to its original vision.
I have the opposite opinion of this. I never cared if EQNext was going to be a great game but getting someone to put those ideas onto the market is a huge step in the right direction for this genre. This genre has completely stagnated and nothing but garbage is being put out. The first revolutionary game that is going to change things is probably going to be very rough around the edges and I'm fine with that, someone just has to get it made and released. I was ready to support it becomes of the ideas behind it, had nothing to do with whether it fully succeeded or not.Most likely the project will be turned into another crappy theme park and I won't touch it.Its been built from the ground up as a sandbox game. They would need to start over to make it a themepark. Not sure the new owners would want to foot that bill but who knows maybe your right.
It really wouldn't have to be. They scrap the storybricks which aren't done, they scrap the procedural PvE content which isn't done. They scrap the world AI which allows mobs to redicrect themselves which isn't done. Very little of what is going to make this game a sandbox is likely done at this point looking at where Landmark is atm. They could keep the destroyable voxel based world and scrap all the rest of the sandbox stuff and get the game released a lot faster.
It really wouldn't have to be. They scrap the storybricks which aren't done, they scrap the procedural PvE content which isn't done. They scrap the world AI which allows mobs to redicrect themselves which isn't done. Very little of what is going to make this game a sandbox is likely done at this point looking at where Landmark is atm. They could keep the destroyable voxel based world and scrap all the rest of the sandbox stuff and get the game released a lot faster.
With what content? Static content doesn't appear overnight. They were working toward procedural because that take less dev-time to generate and thus is cheaper on the long run.
Originally posted by AcvivmDefinitely sad news but honestly I was never that excited with what they have shown with Landmark and EQ Next. Both games reek of nothing but "ideas" and with a questionable ability to execute on those ideas. Voxels, dynamic questing and destructibility in online games has always had issues that I have little confidence they can pull off. The engine Landmark uses is an absolute mess right now even with only 5-10 people on the shard, this game would be unplayable with hundreds of players and dynamic AI running around fighting. I think they have bitten off more then they can chew at this point and I don't think this game is going to even come close to its original vision.
I have the opposite opinion of this. I never cared if EQNext was going to be a great game but getting someone to put those ideas onto the market is a huge step in the right direction for this genre. This genre has completely stagnated and nothing but garbage is being put out. The first revolutionary game that is going to change things is probably going to be very rough around the edges and I'm fine with that, someone just has to get it made and released. I was ready to support it becomes of the ideas behind it, had nothing to do with whether it fully succeeded or not.Most likely the project will be turned into another crappy theme park and I won't touch it.
Its been built from the ground up as a sandbox game. They would need to start over to make it a themepark. Not sure the new owners would want to foot that bill but who knows maybe your right.
It really wouldn't have to be. They scrap the storybricks which aren't done, they scrap the procedural PvE content which isn't done. They scrap the world AI which allows mobs to redicrect themselves which isn't done. Very little of what is going to make this game a sandbox is likely done at this point looking at where Landmark is atm. They could keep the destroyable voxel based world and scrap all the rest of the sandbox stuff and get the game released a lot faster.
Ya Landmark is not the EQN build, its the Landmark build. Even when you are testing a game, you are not playing the dev build that tends to be much farther along. All I do know is they have been working on this iteration of EQN for many years. Taking off in the direction of Themepark would need to scrap a lot of work done and start building from there. Themepark content does not just appear. They would need to go back to the planing stage on how all systems would interact with the new plan that they dont even have yet. I doubt this is going to happen. If anything themepark is added, it will be systems that can integrate with current sandpark elements.
Originally posted by azarhal Originally posted by Ender4It really wouldn't have to be. They scrap the storybricks which aren't done, they scrap the procedural PvE content which isn't done. They scrap the world AI which allows mobs to redicrect themselves which isn't done. Very little of what is going to make this game a sandbox is likely done at this point looking at where Landmark is atm. They could keep the destroyable voxel based world and scrap all the rest of the sandbox stuff and get the game released a lot faster.
With what content? Static content doesn't appear overnight. They were working toward procedural because that take less dev-time to generate and thus is cheaper on the long run.
They most certainly are not cheaper. They still have to create all the same amount of content for the basic world. The procedural stuff is for the outskirts and it has to make use of resources they already created, it just isn't static. It is much more expensive to make a true sandbox game which is why one doesn't exist. I'm talking a sandbox PvE game here, not just calling something like Darkfall a sandbox because it has no content. This game would be released much faster and cheaper if all they had to do was throw some quests at it.
Originally posted by Mensur They will Cancel Landmark and focus full on EQ:N, for me Landmark is a joke and a waste of time.
They can't really do this. Players are making content for EQN in Landmark. The players are doing some of the devs work for them. Getting rid of it would be a huge waste of resources at this point.
SoE as a studio has been through this MANY times in the past, first as SISA, then 989, then RedEye which then became Verant, then back to Sony under the SOE name, then Brad quit, formed Sigil and took a large majority of the studio with him who then came back to SoE few years later.
This isn't going to stop development of eqn. This won't be the end of the developers who are leaving, and it surely won't be the end to SoE/Daybreak as a studio. Dave G was a marketing guy playing producer, his passion was a little too fake for me. I've played past games he has ruined (Tribes 2 anyone?) and I was not looking forward to him ruining the EQ Franchise.
This will be a good thing overall. I am curious to see what Smed will do with the studio direction now without Shu or any of the other bean counters in upper management looking over them. The part you guys are forgetting is that while Investment firms are not game makers, sometimes that is better as long as the studio is self reliant enough to make a profit. They will not meddle in the game to make drastic core changes to gameplay that some schlub who has been milking his position in the gaming industry because he happened to be a tester when gaming took off would be able to make under Sony.
Overall I am happy. The notion that Sony cares more about gamers then an investment firm is laughable at best. BOTH are companies looking to make money. Sony execs meddle all the time in the development process when they have no business doing so, I am more optimistic that the investment firm will be less restrictive as long as the studio proves it can handle the responsibility.
The people that are trying to make the world worse never take a day off , why should I. Light up the darkness Bob Marley
They will probably delay EQN to concentrate on H1Z1 and when that's released move back to EQN. The new company is more streamlined so will need to look at priorities and what they can complete quicker with a more limited number of employees. Whichever game is closest to completion get it finished so money can start rolling in and they can move back to other games to complete or in some cases start anew.
Every comment coming from this company oozes a console / mobile love affair. I see no reason for them to continue chasing the more expensive and less lucrative PC market. Sure, there is money to be made off of PC gaming, but it requires too much time, effort and initial investment for a company like this. I mean, we know they're lazy or they'd have created their own development company and brand rather than the easy and more hawkish route of buyouts.
Originally posted by Nanfoodle I wonder if EQN will take a new direction. I hope back to EQ roots, tab targeting. Less about action combat and return of the trinity? Or will it be business as always?
If they change EQN to tab target. I'll basically lose all interest. If you want tab target, you have EQ1 and EQ2 to play.
If you like action combat you have quake to play.
Action combat in the old days of mmos wasn't available due to restrictions of tech at the time. That is no longer the case. All the newest mmos and ones in development (minus one or two) are either full on action combat or some kind of tab target/action hybrid like GW2. You might want to get used to that. Whether you want it to come or not. It's here and it's gonna stay.
If you still want the old system. You have plenty of older mmos that are still running with niche groups. There is also obviously WoW as well. Also, there is no strict exclusive definition that an mmo has to have tab target to be a "true mmo". As some of the old bitter vets like to claim.
It's not surprising that people start jumping ship when a product isn't perceived as deliverable. I just wonder if he did a flip & slide out of the office - one, two or no hands?
Originally posted by Galia It's not surprising that people start jumping ship when a product isn't perceived as deliverable. I just wonder if he did a flip & slide out of the office - one, two or no hands?
Hopefully they weren't in a parking lot or bowling alley when they got the news.
I'm glad DG is gone. He actually smiled and pretended to be excited showing that reveal of EQNext while the audience made the McKayla Maroney face. I have been nothing but annoyed by him ever since.
not seeing "the great" lose at all. Both eq 1 and eq2 where very monotone in what they deliver in terms of content. Nothing I saw in either game really made me think of anyone working on the title or the ideas they came from where revolutionary or groundbreaking.
SOme people have tired and out dated methods that arent reaching the next generation of gamers, so having fossils like this removed means a better game direction can take hold with current ideas and current technologies.... Maybe back in the 20th century when aall of the ideas came together from Brad Macquaid, ,, yeah , Brad did make eq didnt he, funny ow we all forget....
If the industry thought as you did, the PC would have died ages ago and all we'd have are consoles and mobiles for gaming. All I can say is thank god there are enough reasonable people out there to realize that smaller markets are still worth pursuing as the aggregate of many small markets is just as good as one large one.
Comments
I have the opposite opinion of this. I never cared if EQNext was going to be a great game but getting someone to put those ideas onto the market is a huge step in the right direction for this genre. This genre has completely stagnated and nothing but garbage is being put out. The first revolutionary game that is going to change things is probably going to be very rough around the edges and I'm fine with that, someone just has to get it made and released. I was ready to support it becomes of the ideas behind it, had nothing to do with whether it fully succeeded or not.
Most likely the project will be turned into another crappy theme park and I won't touch it.
Its been built from the ground up as a sandbox game. They would need to start over to make it a themepark. Not sure the new owners would want to foot that bill but who knows maybe your right.
Its been built from the ground up as a sandbox game. They would need to start over to make it a themepark. Not sure the new owners would want to foot that bill but who knows maybe your right.
It really wouldn't have to be. They scrap the storybricks which aren't done, they scrap the procedural PvE content which isn't done. They scrap the world AI which allows mobs to redicrect themselves which isn't done. Very little of what is going to make this game a sandbox is likely done at this point looking at where Landmark is atm. They could keep the destroyable voxel based world and scrap all the rest of the sandbox stuff and get the game released a lot faster.
With what content? Static content doesn't appear overnight. They were working toward procedural because that take less dev-time to generate and thus is cheaper on the long run.
Ya Landmark is not the EQN build, its the Landmark build. Even when you are testing a game, you are not playing the dev build that tends to be much farther along. All I do know is they have been working on this iteration of EQN for many years. Taking off in the direction of Themepark would need to scrap a lot of work done and start building from there. Themepark content does not just appear. They would need to go back to the planing stage on how all systems would interact with the new plan that they dont even have yet. I doubt this is going to happen. If anything themepark is added, it will be systems that can integrate with current sandpark elements.
mmorpg junkie since 1999
They most certainly are not cheaper. They still have to create all the same amount of content for the basic world. The procedural stuff is for the outskirts and it has to make use of resources they already created, it just isn't static. It is much more expensive to make a true sandbox game which is why one doesn't exist. I'm talking a sandbox PvE game here, not just calling something like Darkfall a sandbox because it has no content. This game would be released much faster and cheaper if all they had to do was throw some quests at it.
They can't really do this. Players are making content for EQN in Landmark. The players are doing some of the devs work for them. Getting rid of it would be a huge waste of resources at this point.
cracks me up how everyone is doomsdaying this.
SoE as a studio has been through this MANY times in the past, first as SISA, then 989, then RedEye which then became Verant, then back to Sony under the SOE name, then Brad quit, formed Sigil and took a large majority of the studio with him who then came back to SoE few years later.
This isn't going to stop development of eqn. This won't be the end of the developers who are leaving, and it surely won't be the end to SoE/Daybreak as a studio. Dave G was a marketing guy playing producer, his passion was a little too fake for me. I've played past games he has ruined (Tribes 2 anyone?) and I was not looking forward to him ruining the EQ Franchise.
This will be a good thing overall. I am curious to see what Smed will do with the studio direction now without Shu or any of the other bean counters in upper management looking over them. The part you guys are forgetting is that while Investment firms are not game makers, sometimes that is better as long as the studio is self reliant enough to make a profit. They will not meddle in the game to make drastic core changes to gameplay that some schlub who has been milking his position in the gaming industry because he happened to be a tester when gaming took off would be able to make under Sony.
Overall I am happy. The notion that Sony cares more about gamers then an investment firm is laughable at best. BOTH are companies looking to make money. Sony execs meddle all the time in the development process when they have no business doing so, I am more optimistic that the investment firm will be less restrictive as long as the studio proves it can handle the responsibility.
The people that are trying to make the world worse never take a day off , why should I. Light up the darkness Bob Marley
Action combat in the old days of mmos wasn't available due to restrictions of tech at the time. That is no longer the case. All the newest mmos and ones in development (minus one or two) are either full on action combat or some kind of tab target/action hybrid like GW2. You might want to get used to that. Whether you want it to come or not. It's here and it's gonna stay.
If you still want the old system. You have plenty of older mmos that are still running with niche groups. There is also obviously WoW as well. Also, there is no strict exclusive definition that an mmo has to have tab target to be a "true mmo". As some of the old bitter vets like to claim.
Hopefully they weren't in a parking lot or bowling alley when they got the news.
I'm glad DG is gone. He actually smiled and pretended to be excited showing that reveal of EQNext while the audience made the McKayla Maroney face. I have been nothing but annoyed by him ever since.
If the industry thought as you did, the PC would have died ages ago and all we'd have are consoles and mobiles for gaming. All I can say is thank god there are enough reasonable people out there to realize that smaller markets are still worth pursuing as the aggregate of many small markets is just as good as one large one.