Originally posted by Kriggles OP post = trollingWildstar has a near identical 10% buff for people who bother to get the 2 step Google Authenticator tied to their account to cut down on hacking. And Wildstar is a P2P only game. Is it P2W for them too? #dontfeedthetrolls
i agreed with your post up until the hashtag. hate those damn things. lol
No. Doesn't sound like P2W. Sounds like unsurprisingly typical subscription bonus incentives. Even a little lowball compared to others. There should be bonuses for subbing. Especially if you've been a loyal player since the beginning...but still..doesn't sound like P2W to me. More like"P2LFTTOG"." Pay to level faster than the other guy".
Originally posted by jmlane223 lol so in example someone who subs theoretically saves 6 minutes ever hour compared to a non sub player (mind you time actually playing and obviously not COMPLETELY accurate but a rough estimate ) and that's a huge unfair advantage? Have not been playing to many games lately but what it takes 30 hours or so to max out usually for you average joe? Saving someone all of 3 hours?
Nah the most important item is:
- Access to all downloadable content for the duration of membership.
B2P with a content subscription paywall isn't B2P, it's the exact same thing as the subscription model they changed from.
Only if that DLC can't be bought by the non subbed player. If a non subbed player can pay a one off fee for the DLC I don't see the problem.
A subbed player doesn't have to pay anything for the DLC.
Zenimax will not gate content behind a sub. You either get it free as a subbed player or you will pay a one of fee for it.
This isn't pay to win. You all need to re-adjust your perceptions on what pay to win is.
Can subs buy power? If I sub and you do not, do I have access to more powerful gear with increased and better stats that are exclusive to subs only? The answer is no. It is not pay to win.
So what if I can level 10% faster because Im a sub. Is that one champion point that I may get 10% faster going to make a difference...in anything? No. It isnt. Does one paragon point make or break your gameplay in diablo 3? No. If you claim this is pay to win because someone can acquire champ points 10% faster, I encourage youto check out Diablo 3's paragon system. The increase in "power" is not noticeable point to point. You only start to see an difference when you've wracked up 50 paragon points.
So by this logic, assuming you and I play equal amount of time and do the same thing, when I've garnered 30 champ points, and you have 27 ... that three point difference wont be impactful.
Get a grip. It isnt pay to win.
No people need to stop clinging to the literal meaning of P2W and look at the context.
I know people look for any excuse to throw Pay to Win at a game and very little of them people actually understand what pay 2 win means and have actually never played a pay 2 win game. The bonus are not that much and bar the slight gold increase it really isn't going to effect end game play.
With them Bonus's I don't see why anyone would subscribe to me it looks like your getting a bum deal.
The first time me and my friends talked about pay to win was on ragnarok online.
At some point you could rent a weapon from the cash shop. The weapon would deal +50% more damage to other players and was on par / better than hardcore weapons you would have to spend years on, to get them.
THAT was pay to win - 10% more exp and gold isn't even something that would remotely encourage me to play at a faster pace.
This isn't pay to win. You all need to re-adjust your perceptions on what pay to win is.
Can subs buy power? If I sub and you do not, do I have access to more powerful gear with increased and better stats that are exclusive to subs only? The answer is no. It is not pay to win.
So what if I can level 10% faster because Im a sub. Is that one champion point that I may get 10% faster going to make a difference...in anything? No. It isnt. Does one paragon point make or break your gameplay in diablo 3? No. If you claim this is pay to win because someone can acquire champ points 10% faster, I encourage youto check out Diablo 3's paragon system. The increase in "power" is not noticeable point to point. You only start to see an difference when you've wracked up 50 paragon points.
So by this logic, assuming you and I play equal amount of time and do the same thing, when I've garnered 30 champ points, and you have 27 ... that three point difference wont be impactful.
Get a grip. It isnt pay to win.
No people need to stop clinging to the literal meaning of P2W and look at the context.
What context? Trolling and bringing this same tired old discussion that has been debated for years at this site to this forum for another spin?
That's the context of all "I want to play for free and I want everything" BS threads like this one.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
If 10% is considered pay to win then GW2 is heavy play to win.
GW2 is B2P and doesn't require a subscription for ALL PLAYERS to get those bonuses, you must have simply missed that.
It's been a while since I fired up my GW2 account.... how do you get that list of bonuses?
Via playing the B2P game or cash shop, some are even daily log on rewards i.e. Magic Find (Luck). All with no subscription required !!
Returned to GW2 a few days now and i can say game rocks. Imho it has the best payment system, considering its a high quality and polished game.
Just an FYI to everyone in this trail here, you only get XP boosts if you purchase them with gems(which are purchased with real $$).
Same deal.
actually that is incorect, you also get them for compleating certen tasks and getting your cheevo score to certen mile stones. i am sitting on 25% atm and only spend 20 bucks in the gem store for bag slots.
free 7 day sub and unlocks for swtor new accounts and 90+ day inactive subs click here to get it!
Originally posted by doodphaceAs long as everyone is on a even level at endgame, no matter how much money they sink into the game, its not P2W....the only thing that would concern me in that list, is the 10% gold increase.
Yes but the guys playing for free are going to be at a disadvantage-- they can't earn champion points or gold as fast.
heres the answer..............DONT BE A FREELOADER
Ummmmmmmmmmm BUY TO PLAY isn't free.
omg. seriously? "i have to buy the game and pay to play? WHAAAAAAAAAA!!" bunch of damn babies. ok. heres the new answer to all of your crying.........DONT PLAY
You must have Free to Play and Buy to Play confusion, so what part of buying a product (MMO) is freeloading?
Do tell please.
everyone realizes that it costs money to make a game, right? can we all agree that the developers arent complaining that they cant get employees to make the game that you want to play to work for free? you want to be able to download a game and play all for free. companies need to make money so you can continue to play and update your game. personally, i think all games need to be paid for. subs can be optional but understand if you dont sub you do not have the same benefits. just like damn obama care. want crap for free then bitch what you dont pay for.
You do realize that you have to BUY the game to play it yes?
You do realize that single player RPGs make their money for the development of their games from the sales of people BUYING their game yes?
You do realize how you are lacking in using your brain for any amount of critical thinking yes?
The cost of making a single player game is a fraction of the cost of making a MMORPG. B2P for a MMO is not likely enough income to keep the game running over the long term, the cash shop income becomes a necessity for the game's continued survival at one point or another.
Agreed. In fact was there a discussion yesterday where most people said it wasn't worth the sub unless the digital downloads will be really expansive or many...
The horse isn't exactly pay2win either but it is closer than this.
If this is the worst pay2win the game gets the fans should be very happy indeed.
The cost of making a single player game is a fraction of the cost of making a MMORPG. B2P for a MMO is not likely enough income to keep the game running over the long term, the cash shop income becomes a necessity for the game's continued survival at one point or another.
Well, it do depend on the game. Guildwars (1) was able to do it fine but ESO was way more expensive to make and I bet making expansions or campaigns for ESO would cost way more as well.
Then again do they already have gotten that cost covered so theoretically could they probably run the game with GWs model now. But an itemshop will increase the profits as well as smaller digital dungeons and mini expansions.
It is however a fine line, if they become too greedy they will loose players instead of gaining them.
Originally posted by Hermod Or it could be a thank-you for paying the wages for the people that spend a lot of time making the game.
Such a dumb comment...They wouldn't be making the game if they weren't getting place in the first place /fuckingfacepalm. It's a called a job...For a reason.
This thread should be locked and anyone who thinks 10% exp is even slight Pay 2 Win should go protest a bigger company called Blizzard who sells 300% yes 300% you buy RaF account and to dual log and you gain 300% exp...
Originally posted by doodphace As long as everyone is on a even level at endgame, no matter how much money they sink into the game, its not P2W....the only thing that would concern me in that list, is the 10% gold increase.
Yes but the guys playing for free are going to be at a disadvantage-- they can't earn champion points or gold as fast.
Those who plays 8 hour will have more champion points and gold than those who play 3 hours. Your point?
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1500 crowns at the start of each 30-day membership period
Access to all downloadable content for the duration of membership
Exclusive character progression bonuses for the duration of membership
10% bonus to experience point gain
10% bonus to crafting research
10% bonus to crafting inspiration gain
10% bonus to gold acquisition
90-day Membership:
4500 crowns at the start of each 90-day membership period
Access to all downloadable content for the duration of membership
Exclusive character progression bonuses for the duration of membership
10% bonus to experience point gain
10% bonus to crafting research
10% bonus to crafting inspiration gain
10% bonus to gold acquisition
180-day Membership:
9000 crowns at the start of each 180-day membership period
Access to all downloadable content for the duration of membership
Exclusive character progression bonuses for the duration of membership
10% bonus to experience point gain
10% bonus to crafting research
10% bonus to crafting inspiration gain
10% bonus to gold acquisition
Don't know about you but this looks way worse than offering an exclusive horse with an imperial edition.
Smell like P2W to you?
It seems no matter what they do, they are always on the wrong side. People should just be grateful that they are letting them play for free/b2p, people that decides to support the game should be rewarded, I don't see this as p2w, as long as its not "Buy this to enhance your weapon with real money" or without it there's no way to enhance your weapon, that's pay to win to me.
Some people consider xp potions in cash shops pay-to-win. I, however, disagree. To me, P2W gives you more of an advantage over other players. Now, my problem is....If they nerfed the xp gain for non paying subs by 10% and the "xp bonus" is just "normal" xp...but, until we see the cash shop and what items are placed there, then, I don't think this is P2W.
If we alter the definition of the word "winning" to mean any advantage that allows a player to surpass those not paying the sub fee, then yes... ZOS have implemented a "P2W" subscription model where players that subscribe have a distinct and clear advantage over those that do not.
Just free loaders being free loaders. They whined when it was a sub based game, they whine now due to some useless perks, theyll whine later when they charge for something else.
The game on PC could have and should have stayed Sub based. Then there wouldnt be any problems. Because console players arent nearly the whiney ass bitches PC players are, and they have no problems paying for things. But then all the losers too poor or self entitled to sub for the PC version would have whined about that.
I was hyper critical of this game and ZoS for along time. But they have made a lot of right moves since last year and this constant Pay to win talk is just dumb. I am not sure exactly what you win?
The game is basically a solo game where youre on a server with other people. The PvP isnt nearly competitive or populated enough to even worry about so there is no 'win' there either. Even if they sold armor 10 times better than anything you could make or find in the game it wouldnt effect 95% of the people playing this game because they wouldnt even encounter people who bought said armor.
Just bitches looking to bitch about something and since this is basically the only thing they can find to piss and moan about then IMO its a pretty good transition.
Comments
i agreed with your post up until the hashtag. hate those damn things. lol
No. Doesn't sound like P2W. Sounds like unsurprisingly typical subscription bonus incentives. Even a little lowball compared to others. There should be bonuses for subbing. Especially if you've been a loyal player since the beginning...but still..doesn't sound like P2W to me. More like"P2LFTTOG"." Pay to level faster than the other guy".
Only if that DLC can't be bought by the non subbed player. If a non subbed player can pay a one off fee for the DLC I don't see the problem.
A subbed player doesn't have to pay anything for the DLC.
Zenimax will not gate content behind a sub. You either get it free as a subbed player or you will pay a one of fee for it.
Fucking HELL!
What the hell are you smoking?
Are you also saying that GW2 is P2W too?
They have pretty much the same Boost in BLTC.
Talk about some nit picking and being cheap. I bet your a great tipper barely leaving a 5% tip for your waiter. Don't be that guy!!!
No people need to stop clinging to the literal meaning of P2W and look at the context.
I know people look for any excuse to throw Pay to Win at a game and very little of them people actually understand what pay 2 win means and have actually never played a pay 2 win game. The bonus are not that much and bar the slight gold increase it really isn't going to effect end game play.
With them Bonus's I don't see why anyone would subscribe to me it looks like your getting a bum deal.
This thread still going makes me feel so old.
The first time me and my friends talked about pay to win was on ragnarok online.
At some point you could rent a weapon from the cash shop. The weapon would deal +50% more damage to other players and was on par / better than hardcore weapons you would have to spend years on, to get them.
THAT was pay to win - 10% more exp and gold isn't even something that would remotely encourage me to play at a faster pace.
What context? Trolling and bringing this same tired old discussion that has been debated for years at this site to this forum for another spin?
That's the context of all "I want to play for free and I want everything" BS threads like this one.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
Only someone who has not played this game more than 10 minutes could say a 10% extra gold DROP is P2W.
For the rest of it, ever heard of Rings of Mara or PVP buffs?
actually that is incorect, you also get them for compleating certen tasks and getting your cheevo score to certen mile stones. i am sitting on 25% atm and only spend 20 bucks in the gem store for bag slots.
free 7 day sub and unlocks for swtor new accounts and 90+ day inactive subs click here to get it!
Click here for trove referral, bonuses to both!
SNIP
The cost of making a single player game is a fraction of the cost of making a MMORPG. B2P for a MMO is not likely enough income to keep the game running over the long term, the cash shop income becomes a necessity for the game's continued survival at one point or another.
Agreed. In fact was there a discussion yesterday where most people said it wasn't worth the sub unless the digital downloads will be really expansive or many...
The horse isn't exactly pay2win either but it is closer than this.
If this is the worst pay2win the game gets the fans should be very happy indeed.
Well, it do depend on the game. Guildwars (1) was able to do it fine but ESO was way more expensive to make and I bet making expansions or campaigns for ESO would cost way more as well.
Then again do they already have gotten that cost covered so theoretically could they probably run the game with GWs model now. But an itemshop will increase the profits as well as smaller digital dungeons and mini expansions.
It is however a fine line, if they become too greedy they will loose players instead of gaining them.
Such a dumb comment...They wouldn't be making the game if they weren't getting place in the first place /fuckingfacepalm. It's a called a job...For a reason.
This thread should be locked and anyone who thinks 10% exp is even slight Pay 2 Win should go protest a bigger company called Blizzard who sells 300% yes 300% you buy RaF account and to dual log and you gain 300% exp...
So grow up and stop trolling.
SNIP
Those who plays 8 hour will have more champion points and gold than those who play 3 hours. Your point?
Boobs are LIFE, Boobs are LOVE, Boobs are JUSTICE, Boobs are mankind's HOPES and DREAMS. People who complain about boobs have lost their humanity.
This is not Pay 2 Win.
10% on xp etc is not going to make anyone more powerful than someone else.
Go play some games that charge $3000 for a weapon that 1 shots people in PvP... You will see Pay 2 Win then.
It seems no matter what they do, they are always on the wrong side. People should just be grateful that they are letting them play for free/b2p, people that decides to support the game should be rewarded, I don't see this as p2w, as long as its not "Buy this to enhance your weapon with real money" or without it there's no way to enhance your weapon, that's pay to win to me.
Some people consider xp potions in cash shops pay-to-win. I, however, disagree. To me, P2W gives you more of an advantage over other players. Now, my problem is....If they nerfed the xp gain for non paying subs by 10% and the "xp bonus" is just "normal" xp...but, until we see the cash shop and what items are placed there, then, I don't think this is P2W.
If we alter the definition of the word "winning" to mean any advantage that allows a player to surpass those not paying the sub fee, then yes... ZOS have implemented a "P2W" subscription model where players that subscribe have a distinct and clear advantage over those that do not.
Just free loaders being free loaders. They whined when it was a sub based game, they whine now due to some useless perks, theyll whine later when they charge for something else.
The game on PC could have and should have stayed Sub based. Then there wouldnt be any problems. Because console players arent nearly the whiney ass bitches PC players are, and they have no problems paying for things. But then all the losers too poor or self entitled to sub for the PC version would have whined about that.
I was hyper critical of this game and ZoS for along time. But they have made a lot of right moves since last year and this constant Pay to win talk is just dumb. I am not sure exactly what you win?
The game is basically a solo game where youre on a server with other people. The PvP isnt nearly competitive or populated enough to even worry about so there is no 'win' there either. Even if they sold armor 10 times better than anything you could make or find in the game it wouldnt effect 95% of the people playing this game because they wouldnt even encounter people who bought said armor.
Just bitches looking to bitch about something and since this is basically the only thing they can find to piss and moan about then IMO its a pretty good transition.
Not p2w to me... just a little xp boost.