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[Column] General: MMOs As a Grown Up

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  • jpnolejpnole Member UncommonPosts: 1,698
    Good post! With my twin babies and my wife I pretty much only play games when they are taking their afternoon nap on weekends or after they go to bed. I find I can get about 3 solid hours in on Fri/Sat nights. It's definitely not like the old days but I wouldn't trade it for anything. Dad/Husband first, gamer second.
  • RoseSymphonyRoseSymphony Member UncommonPosts: 5

    I'm not married nor do I have children but I go to school full time and work practically full time (trying to cut back on hours so I can actually have time to do homework) so it's very difficult for me to find time to play MMOs.  It was very hard for me to accept that I'm just a casual now and even now it's still hard to deal with because I'm always on Raidcall with my friends/guildies and it's a bummer to hear them all having fun together since they have time to play and I'm unable to join them.  They still encourage me to play with them and that my level doesn't matter but it's not the same as it used to be when I was able to join them for dungeon and boss runs.

    I am, however, gradually coping with it better and have very recently come to the decision that I will indeed play whatever, whenever I want because I do want to have fun.  Logging on because you feel you have definitely ruins the experience.  And if that means playing more than one MMO by myself and simply logging on to any one of them on a whim then so be it.  I enjoy getting immersed in the stories and quest dialogue and taking my time to do side quests and such and even roleplaying if there's a RP server.

  • xanthmetisxanthmetis Member UncommonPosts: 141
    its funny what different majors and schools require out of you... my ba in marketing and management i partied all night long almost every night and rolled into school and got a 3.6... for my second degree I went to nursing school... I barely sleep and peed with books in hands... to say the least there was no gaming remotely possible...
  • xanthmetisxanthmetis Member UncommonPosts: 141
    Originally posted by Razeekster
    Originally posted by Vladric_Hellsinger
    19 and in college. I still have loads of time to play mmo's : D

    Hooooow?! If I don't study constantly I fail quizzes because they give you freaking 5 question quizzes over 100 page content where I go. Freaking ridiculous since you basically have to hope whatever you memorized is on the quiz because I literally have a day and then the next day it's the quiz Q~Q

     
     

    my post was in response to this...

  • CryolitycalCryolitycal Member UncommonPosts: 205

    You seem to have written an article to justify the way you have to play MMOs these days. Some might be fitting for this playstyle, some aren't though, and you gonna be left behind all time. How is that remotely fun?

    Easy to say "don't even try to keep up", yet you will always be an undergeared, underskilled (cause lack of practice of high end gameplay) player from now on.

    And yes, MMOs do begin at the endgame. It's either raiding (which LFR is not, as you can't die in it) or competitive PvP, or else, why bother? Questing? Too easy.  Dungeons? Too easy. If things aren't challenging, then there's no fun in losing time on it, as games are just a loss of your time, after all. Bioware's games are better for immersing in a world at your own pace. Witcher 3 will be awesome as well, soon. 

     
  • Azaron_NightbladeAzaron_Nightblade Member EpicPosts: 4,829
    Originally posted by Cryolitycal

    You seem to have written an article to justify the way you have to play MMOs these days. Some might be fitting for this playstyle, some aren't though, and you gonna be left behind all time. How is that remotely fun?

    Easy to say "don't even try to keep up", yet you will always be an undergeared, underskilled (cause lack of practice of high end gameplay) player from now on.

    And yes, MMOs do begin at the endgame. It's either raiding (which LFR is not, as you can't die in it) or competitive PvP, or else, why bother? Questing? Too easy.  Dungeons? Too easy. If things aren't challenging, then there's no fun in losing time on it, as games are just a loss of your time, after all. Bioware's games are better for immersing in a world at your own pace. Witcher 3 will be awesome as well, soon. 

     

    In the last couple of years there's been a strong focus on making questing fun, rather than just a threadmill to prepare for the endgame. SWTOR, TSW and ESO all offer great leveling experiences. MMOs don't have to be all about the boring endgame grind. I haven't seriously participated in that for quite a while now, and I still have fun doing a mix of things, such as grouping for dungeons, or PvP, or simply doing my own thing and enjoying the game world's lore and stories.

    My SWTOR referral link for those wanting to give the game a try. (Newbies get a welcome package while returning players get a few account upgrades to help with their preferred status.)

    https://www.ashesofcreation.com/ref/Callaron/

  • RazeeksterRazeekster Member UncommonPosts: 2,591
    Originally posted by xanthmetis
    its funny what different majors and schools require out of you... my ba in marketing and management i partied all night long almost every night and rolled into school and got a 3.6... for my second degree I went to nursing school... I barely sleep and peed with books in hands... to say the least there was no gaming remotely possible...
     

    Yeah, that was like my first semester... Even had one night that was so bad that I had to do the shameful sunglasses in class thing, where everyone clearly knew I was hung over but was polite enough not to say anything... Fast forward to second semester and the next year, and all I have time for now is an occasional joint when I know I won't have to use my brain, but even that's super rare.

     

    Smile

  • crasset15crasset15 Member UncommonPosts: 194

    I'm close to 25 years old and facing a similar situation. MMOs and gaming in general is starting to take a backseat in my life. I regret the fact that I embraced the hardcore lifestyle so much for the past 12-15 years, because it has made me into the extremely introverted person I am now. 

    When I was still living with my parents and living my "hardcore gamer" dream, I always wanted to get my job, apartment, and then spend all my free time on gaming without anyone bothering me. But those kinds of plans are rarely as fun in real life as they sound on paper. I found a job, I rented an appartment, and then I realised something. I don't enjoy gaming anymore. The main reason was that moving out removed any real-life socialising that I used to have, and I started feeling very lonely and unmotivated to do anything with the computer.

     

    Now I'm trying to mix my life up a bit by doing sports, trying to be social (mostly failing right now because I'm rusty) and I'll probably have my first girlfriend at the age of 25, yeah, sad gamer life facts, I know :P

     

    I think the lesson to take out of this is that all things are best enjoyed in moderation. I always used to have this philosophy that if you do something, dedicate your entire energy to that thing, but only now I've started realising that pushing everything else in life aside for one hobby or obsession is only going to make you and the people around you miserable. Sure you might be the best player on the server, but that doesn't change the fact that you're a miserable loser with no friends in real life, because lets be honest here, who wants to be friends with a person who sets a video game above other people.

     

    As Stephen Fry has once said: "Let's forget what successful people have in common. If there is a thing unsuccessful people have in common, it's that they talk about themselves all the time. Their first two words are usually I need, and that's why nobody likes them, and that's why they'll never get where they want to be. If you use your eyes to look out, not to be looked into, then people want to be around you." In other words, don't expect people to care about you if gaming is your main priority during your free time.

     
  • oolouoolou Member Posts: 7


    Good article - thanks!

     

    As for further advice/tips I'd add, don't take on more than you can manage.

    During the beta phase of a game that launched last year, I joined a guild that sounded like a good fit. Relaxed fun atmosphere, started by a group who knew each other from WoW, who would be mostly playing in my preferred timeslot. The leadership of the guild was shared between three of them, with the notion that if someone got RL busy, they could cover each other.

    Sounded good. Except that all three of the leaders had big life events happening to deal with after the first few months of launch. And when they did log in, each would be disappointed to not see their mates around. Basically the guild ground to a halt fast.

     

    I understand why they made the guild. They were excited, they wanted to get involved and they wanted to gather up a group of like minded players with whom to enjoy the game and they wanted to recapture the glory days of the past. 

    I know it can be hard to accept that you're now a casual player, especially if you want to recapture the fun had in the past. But yeah ... don't take on guild roles unless its something you know you have the time to manage it. As you just disappoint the others in your guild.

     

     

     

  • kilunkilun Member UncommonPosts: 829
    Originally posted by daterxies
    For everyone who liked SWG take a look at "The Repopulation". Lots of swg, including my self there.

    Remains to be seen.  The intro to the game is a complete garbage and mess.  It doesn't look or feel anything like SWG.  The menus and such are horribly laid out for a game released in 2000, let alone 2003 or even 2014/15.

     

    I honestly find people who date have less time than people who have families.  Your trying to find that "one" you lack the leisure  not go home at night, spend a bit of time with the family, let the kids go to bed, cuddle with the wife, and then hit the keyboard.

     

    You want to game?  Get your kids playing.  Simple. Done.  To many people are about lets take our kids here, play date here for what?  To spend zero time with your kids.  Yeah your doing stuff with your kids, but are you actually being active.  Oh, we took the kids to the park and went to build-a-bear.  Did you play with them?  "I watched them, while I facebooked my friends, play lameo app, and let the clerk at build-a-bear help my child while I did the same."  95% of the parents in the world right there.

    Me?  We slayed 3 sets of bounties in D3.  Blew up mechs in Mechwarrior online, and then I got rocked by a 5 year old in King of Tokyo after I showed my 7 yr/old son who is the King.  After that we had a Nerf battle.  Who's the better parent?  

  • GameByNightGameByNight Hardware and Technology EditorMMORPG.COM Staff, Member RarePosts: 704
    Originally posted by Cryolitycal

    You seem to have written an article to justify the way you have to play MMOs these days. Some might be fitting for this playstyle, some aren't though, and you gonna be left behind all time. How is that remotely fun?

    Easy to say "don't even try to keep up", yet you will always be an undergeared, underskilled (cause lack of practice of high end gameplay) player from now on.

    And yes, MMOs do begin at the endgame. It's either raiding (which LFR is not, as you can't die in it) or competitive PvP, or else, why bother? Questing? Too easy.  Dungeons? Too easy. If things aren't challenging, then there's no fun in losing time on it, as games are just a loss of your time, after all. Bioware's games are better for immersing in a world at your own pace. Witcher 3 will be awesome as well, soon. 

     

    I can see your point, but I think you're writing from a different perspective. You can choose to hold yourself to a competitive standard or accept that you're not going to be able to compete at the pace of other players. I hold nothing against anyone who wants to be competitive. It's fun! It's also just unrealistic for a lot of us who, quite honestly, are aging out of that hardcore bracket. But the answer isn't to go play single player RPGs. Why? If someone likes playing MMOs and can find the fun in them without needing to commit to a raid schedule or ranked PvP, then they should be able to do that. (That said, I don't think MMORPGs should be designed around players like myself, since I agree that some of the best payoff from these games come from the extra investment).

     

    I also take a lot of issue with "the real game begins at endgame" mindset. Please understand that this isn't a directed attack at you, but it's completely and utterly stupid. Let's say it takes 100 hours to get to level cap in a given game. That's no less than five complete $60 single player games and probably closer to 10 with today's ~10 hour campaigns. All of that time isn't the real game? I take even greater issue with it because I actually enjoy leveling. Maybe not multiple times, but that first experience of progressing a character and building him up from nothing is fun. The dings, hunting through dungeons, improving your skills... that is RPG 101 right there. Raiding really isn't. It's a trial and error gear hunt primarily focused on completing dance steps. I enjoy raiding too, for the record. 

     

    The point is, leveling is the point of contact for every single new player to experience a new MMO. If that's not the "real game" then the game has failed. Players who die on that statement do so from their own narrow corner of the world and mostly seem to be unwilling to understand that other players may enjoy different things from them.

  • GameByNightGameByNight Hardware and Technology EditorMMORPG.COM Staff, Member RarePosts: 704
    Originally posted by kilun
    You want to game?  Get your kids playing.  Simple. Done.  To many people are about lets take our kids here, play date here for what?  To spend zero time with your kids.  Yeah your doing stuff with your kids, but are you actually being active.  Oh, we took the kids to the park and went to build-a-bear.  Did you play with them?  "I watched them, while I facebooked my friends, play lameo app, and let the clerk at build-a-bear help my child while I did the same."  95% of the parents in the world right there.

    Me?  We slayed 3 sets of bounties in D3.  Blew up mechs in Mechwarrior online, and then I got rocked by a 5 year old in King of Tokyo after I showed my 7 yr/old son who is the King.  After that we had a Nerf battle.  Who's the better parent?  

     

    I can't wait until my son is old enough to enjoy playing games. Child-appropriate for us, I mean, but I totally remember playing Mario and Super Metroid with my dad. It will be a blast to share that fun with my boy.

  • AethaerynAethaeryn Member RarePosts: 3,149
    Originally posted by GameByNight
    Originally posted by kilun
    You want to game?  Get your kids playing.  Simple. Done.  To many people are about lets take our kids here, play date here for what?  To spend zero time with your kids.  Yeah your doing stuff with your kids, but are you actually being active.  Oh, we took the kids to the park and went to build-a-bear.  Did you play with them?  "I watched them, while I facebooked my friends, play lameo app, and let the clerk at build-a-bear help my child while I did the same."  95% of the parents in the world right there.

    Me?  We slayed 3 sets of bounties in D3.  Blew up mechs in Mechwarrior online, and then I got rocked by a 5 year old in King of Tokyo after I showed my 7 yr/old son who is the King.  After that we had a Nerf battle.  Who's the better parent?  

     

    I can't wait until my son is old enough to enjoy playing games. Child-appropriate for us, I mean, but I totally remember playing Mario and Super Metroid with my dad. It will be a blast to share that fun with my boy.

    Absolutely.   So far he has no interest in TV. . or tablets or anything and just wants to be outside. . even in the winter.  I sort of hope it stays that way :)

    Wa min God! Se æx on min heafod is!

  • ErdaErda Member UncommonPosts: 211
    Originally posted by oolou

    I know it can be hard to accept that you're now a casual player, especially if you want to recapture the fun had in the past. But yeah ... don't take on guild roles unless its something you know you have the time to manage it. As you just disappoint the others in your guild.

     

     

     

     

    I think this is great advice to any potential guild leader or guild officer.  So many times I've seen guilds grind to a halt because the leaders jump in 100% yet come up against the wall of spouse/kid agro.    I've personally witnessed a handful of guilds fall apart for this very reason.  One guild leader almost lost his marriage to LOTRO and thankfully he jumped out of the game before his wife divorced him.  I do think that you can have long term casual guilds but everyone needs to have realistic expectations.   The best casual guilds I've belonged to had leadership responsibilities  well delegated and folks could jump in and out of guild events quite easily.

    Getting to the original post though....my hubby and jumped into the MMO scene when we were in our 30s.   We played fairly intensively our first few years.  It was just the two of us and we could spend many hours on our new hobby.   Then kids came along and our tune changed quite dramatically.   We tried the raid scene on one MMO and quite frankly, I grew to hate it.  I hated being obligated to log on at a certain time to spend x amount of hours for weeks at a time.  I remember wasting one beautiful sunny weekend in EQ2 sitting in some raid instance for 6 hours when we could have been outside doing something else.   I vowed that I would never do that again.  

     I've realized that I'm better suited for a games that have loads of solo content and where I can jump into a group at my own pace.  For me a game doesn't necessarily start at end game.   If there are loads of things to do, I can happily play at my own pace and enjoy it quite a bit.  I'm an achievement junkie so I'm happy puttering along at my own pace and doing my own thing.  MMOs still fit in well with my casual playstyle and I hope that I never grow out of them. 

  • CorthalaCorthala Member UncommonPosts: 283

    It was with Rift that I had to accept that i was a casual and that wouldn't change. Each time my guild had something dungeon or raid I would check my life schedule and it was a "no go". Most of time I had time to play I end up in PUGs.

    I love mmo but I don't have time to stay more then 2 hours in front of a pc without wife or kid nagging me.

    "you are like the world revenge on sarcasm, you know that?"

    One of those great lines from The Secret World

  • FetishistFetishist Member Posts: 4
    Payment models FTP or Sub. I don't mind paying for content, but when I don't know how many hours I can clock each month I tend to hang around the FTP scene. Would love to have a 'hours paid for hours played' model. Buy 10 hours of game time with an expiry. Can't say it doesn't work because pre-paid phones have been around for a while now. If your game is good, I'll continue to feed you money.
  • sketocafesketocafe Member UncommonPosts: 950

    You don't have to play a casual game to be able to play a game casually. I'd like to see more games with EVE's skill system.  If you and I start playing on the same day, and I make a job of it and you get in half an hour a day, we're both going to have the same skill points after a week, a month, a year.  This skill system is a good setup for those who don't have the time to play all day and don't want to fall behind in their character's power with those that do. 

    All I see now are developers seizing upon this casual trend by making casual games instead of just making a game that can be experienced casually. 

     

  • BlackWatchBlackWatch Member UncommonPosts: 972

    Great article.  And honestly, some amazing replies.  Overall, a very solid line of thought here and I can really relate to a lot of you.  

    image

  • breygonbreygon Member UncommonPosts: 12

    Truly a great article, (shameless Plug alert!), the folks at The Hammerfist Clan truly understand about how "Real Life" can get in the way of the important stuff like Gaming. We try to provide a stress-free, no drama zone for the Mature Adult Gamer.

    We are an 18+, international multi-game community, come take a look around.

     

  • WylfWylf Member UncommonPosts: 376

    I will echo most comments here, great article, you have voiced what is reality for many gamers. Myself included.  I loved reading many of the comments, sometimes I felt as if I was alone out there with time issues. I have become a causal, am proud of it, and find as was mentioned, that you can immerse yourself in a great game rather than just rushing through to get to the level cap.  Well said sir.

     

  • BrithilluinBrithilluin Member Posts: 1

    "Erillion: Imagine when all these people enter old age and start to play games and MMOs..."

     

    I hope to be one of those! my only fear is arthritis and losing my sight!

     
     
  • JaedorJaedor Member UncommonPosts: 1,173

    Great post!

     

    Totally agree on the letting go of the Joneses. I volunteered to step down from my raider rank so I can game at my own pace and emphasize the "play" and "fun" aspects of gaming. While they refused to demote me, it was a huge relief to be able to mentally walk away from the grind and the stress. :)

  • SoulticeSoultice Member UncommonPosts: 112

    Honestly I have the time my two sons one 36 the other 38 grew up on gaming along with me.  We game together when we can.  Honestly I just do not like many games anymore.  There is no thinking nor any real death penalty if you die from being stupid.  Run die poof repair return.

    I know I am about to get blasted for it but you had to figure out what to do know how to mange your threat without all the mods telling you what to do.  WOW is a game a trained monkey can now play. 

    Gear equaling success in a game really sucks to me anyway.  I can remember when you could go into most dungeons with almost any gear with the exception of the tanks.  Now gear is what it is all about and stat numbers. 

    I like WOW when it first came out challenging but everyone must see all the content and I think it is better to see those elite guys running around in special gear.  I am casual and can live with it.  If I got something close I was cool with that.  All game will always be a time sink from lineage 2 on.   The mystery is gone the fear of dying is gone, the magic is gone for me. 

    I am hoping maybe EQ next may change that but most likely with the I want it all gaming mentality it will not change anything.

  • ZimoonZimoon Member UncommonPosts: 1
    Originally posted by Dauzqul

    I'm 35. I have a wife, two kids, and a job. Thus, my playing time is usually late in the evening or on the weekend.

    This is why I enjoy games like Star Wars Galaxies so much. I enjoy delving deep into crafting, bartering for rare tissues for my weapons, and hosting one of the more popular trade shops on the server.
    Amen
  • FoomerangFoomerang Member UncommonPosts: 5,628

    The lesson to be learned is stop breeding. Seriously. You'd think it was some kind of mandate or something to get married and crank out kids. It's not. Stop doing things just because society expects you to do them. You'll find yourself with more time and money and generally less stress.

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