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is this why all ram perform similarly ?

drbaltazardrbaltazar Member UncommonPosts: 7,856
OK I was rereading ram article and my mind felt I was misunderstanding something,so i checked pcie MSI (message signal interrupt),you know bored!then it hit me while rereading MSI definition,MSI and pcie play a huge role for ram.
Want to know what the issue is?look at pcie (speed etc)then look a message signal interrupt (and its extended variant if it apply)MSI use pcie to mention ram intent,I suspect in some circumstance either pcie cant keep up ,or MSI can't keep or both(because the os is preventing it or there aren't enough interrupt (recommended by ms for normal home desktop is 1 per core ,but they set it at 1 per socket,why?easier on programmer at amd nvidia and all other pc part maker.if they had to set 1 interrupt per CPU core ,imagine and,they have 1 ,2,3,4,6,8 core variant!yep its just less costly.so your ram not affected by speed mean something between CPU and ram (or GPU)is preventing it,since I know CPU GPU and ram can all keep up together only one part might not be able to ,the link between.either the pcie or MSI (I think its a combination,like the priority of pcie and MSI are in conflict and cause the slowdown

Comments

  • QuizzicalQuizzical Member LegendaryPosts: 22,094
    PCI Express has nothing to do with memory.  In modern CPUs, the memory controller is integrated into the same chip as the CPU, and provides a dedicated bus for accessing system memory.  PCI Express is a separate bus entirely, with different pins connecting to different wires that go different places, and it uses an entirely different protocol to transfer the data.
  • ThebeastttThebeasttt Member RarePosts: 1,130

    RAM gives off the illusion of similiar performance. it's not that all RAM is the same, it's that RAM is never a bottleneck in your system because you can buy truck loads for pennies on the dollar. Your system is always held back by a poor:

    GPU>CPU>Power Supply>Internet Speed>SSD>Cooling System>Motherboard>OS>User>Mouse>Keyboard>Monitor>Mouse Pad>Desk>Cabling>Aesthetic Case...............GIANT GAP HERE>RAM

     

    In that order

  • AthisarAthisar Member UncommonPosts: 666

    It's more that RAM is now generally fast enough never to cause a problem in practice. The only applications that are really affected by memory speeds are memory benchmarks.

    One exception is with AMD's APUs. The integrated GPU is connected to system memory (as it has no dedicated memory), and the GPU is powerful enough that it can be held back by slower memory, so you see performance increases in games with higher memory speeds.

  • GruntyGrunty Member EpicPosts: 8,657

     

    Scott Mueller's Upgrading and Repairing PCs.  Any recent edition is a great reference source for learning how a computer works.  Find a used copy in a used book store if needed. You can probably get a copy in french.

    http://www.quepublishing.com/imprint/series_detail.aspx?st=87406

    Just don't get his Upgrading and Repairing Laptop PC edition. It is literally the PC version with the words 'portable computer' or 'laptop' copy and pasted wherever the other edition refers to a computer.

    "I used to think the worst thing in life was to be all alone.  It's not.  The worst thing in life is to end up with people who make you feel all alone."  Robin Williams
  • GdemamiGdemami Member EpicPosts: 12,175


    Originally posted by drbaltazar

    OK I was rereading ram article and my mind felt I was misunderstanding something,so i checked pcie MSI (message signal interrupt),you know bored!then it hit me while rereading MSI definition,MSI and pcie play a huge role for ram.
    Want to know what the issue is?look at pcie (speed etc)then look a message signal interrupt (and its extended variant if it apply)MSI use pcie to mention ram intent,I suspect in some circumstance either pcie cant keep up ,or MSI can't keep or both(because the os is preventing it or there aren't enough interrupt (recommended by ms for normal home desktop is 1 per core ,but they set it at 1 per socket,why?easier on programmer at amd nvidia and all other pc part maker.if they had to set 1 interrupt per CPU core ,imagine and,they have 1 ,2,3,4,6,8 core variant!yep its just less costly.so your ram not affected by speed mean something between CPU and ram (or GPU)is preventing it,since I know CPU GPU and ram can all keep up together only one part might not be able to ,the link between.either the pcie or MSI (I think its a combination,like the priority of pcie and MSI are in conflict and cause the slowdown

    I am not sure what you are up to there...

    Signaling is handled via dedicated interrupt line (PCI - 4 interrupts per device) or there is used I/O mapped memory(MSI) used by ie. PCIe.

    The limit on interrupts using MSI is iirc 32. The difference in number of interrupts has no bearing on performance. Although, MSI should be sligtly faster and easier to work with since it bypass all the hassle with DMA write.

  • drbaltazardrbaltazar Member UncommonPosts: 7,856
    http://www.google.com/patents/US8463969

    I think I found out why ,in this paper they mention the drawback of msi msix ,LATENCY.oh well,golfing ,maybe I should quit gaming and begin golfing
  • drbaltazardrbaltazar Member UncommonPosts: 7,856
    As for wanabe,I just want silk smooth gaming !and every time it begin to may be be smooth ,os maker disable something to slow everything
  • HulluckHulluck Member UncommonPosts: 830
    Originally posted by Thebeasttt
    Originally posted by Grunty
    Originally posted by Thebeasttt

    RAM gives off the illusion of similiar performance. it's not that all RAM is the same, it's that RAM is never a bottleneck in your system because you can buy truck loads for pennies on the dollar. Your system is always held back by a poor:

    GPU>CPU>Power Supply>Internet Speed>SSD>Cooling System>Motherboard>OS>User>Mouse>Keyboard>Monitor>Mouse Pad>Desk>Cabling>Aesthetic Case...............GIANT GAP HERE>RAM

     

    In that order

    [mod edit]

    [mod edit]

     

    What about games like rts's. Something like Sins of a Solar Empire huge maps. How is GPU more important than CPU. It depends on what a person intends to do with a system. Having to choose I will personally take a bigger CPU over GPU because of the types of games I like.
  • grndzrogrndzro Member UncommonPosts: 1,156

    Just like some people here have said.

    Ram is not usually a bottleneck in a system. For example my Phenom 2 x6 is perfect for DDR3 1600 7-7-7. Same with intel quad cores.

    Now Intel 6 core and OC AMD 8 cores are a bit bottlenecked by 1600 and could really use some fast DDR3-1866.

    AMD APU's need DDR3 2200-2400 for top performance.

  • drbaltazardrbaltazar Member UncommonPosts: 7,856
    I wish I knew more about computer!was reading the patent about MSI/x ,and one part said drawback:latency.irq sharing wasn't so bad after all especially now a day.sadly disabling MSI/x is above my capability especially with window 8.1 64 bit.maybe ms will add an option.gees now I see gamer have very different need then server.
  • QuizzicalQuizzical Member LegendaryPosts: 22,094

    It's pretty easy to make memory into a bottleneck if you're so inclined.  Just get a Windows 7 or later system with only 1 GB of system memory.

    But ultimately, once something is fast enough that it's not a meaningful bottleneck, making that component faster yet doesn't gain you anything.

  • RidelynnRidelynn Member EpicPosts: 7,060


    Originally posted by drbaltazar
    I wish I knew more about computer!was reading the patent about MSI/x ,and one part said drawback:latency.irq sharing wasn't so bad after all especially now a day.sadly disabling MSI/x is above my capability especially with window 8.1 64 bit.maybe ms will add an option.gees now I see gamer have very different need then server.

    Windows 8 isn't the server-oriented OS, that's Server 2012.

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