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Free to Play is the answer!
sonicwhip2
Member Posts: 86
To those who think I'm crazy for saying this just take a look at the new NCsoft earnings report and compare Aion revenue with Wildstar revenue. Aion is generating a much larger profit and they have been free to play for a few years now while the Wildstar revenue has seen an extreme decrease from last quarter (which was their first) to this quarter.
This is more solid evidence that the pay to play model is really going the way of the Dodo. Even SoE has faced up to the realities by planning a free to play Everquest Next. No new mmo today can successfully operate under P2P only WoW and Eve online can handle it and I bet even they have plans for a business model change somewhere in the far future.
Honestly I don't know what Carbine was thinking when they chose this tired old business model I honestly think they would have actually been most successful under a Guildwars 2 style model of Buy to play and possibly an optional subscription fee with a cosmetic and non essential cash shop. I can't possibly be the only one who thinks that one day not a single mmo will operate under a mandatory monthly charge right?
Comments
Yah sorry to bad, they already have stated its not going fail2play.
When I wake up, the real nightmare begins
Lmao either they will cave in to the pressure or get shut down by NCsoft. Remember they don't have a lot of patience with underperforming titles if you remember city of heroes,exteel, dungeonrunners, tabula rasa, auto assault?
It is just dilusional to ignore the earnings report and think Wildstar can still manage this model.
The reality is that Wildstar has been a massive numerical failure and a change to free to play will likely save them from the NcSoft kill switch even though populations wont change much since the core game is still a very poor design. Aion is proof of this as it is not shut down currently. It is obvious that the general mmo market will not want to spend 60 dollars plus 15 a month for a another game that is trying to mimick WoW while adding a few extra features and an updated combat.
Edit: hilarious how you say "fail2play" and their is a free to play game under the same publisher overshadowing Wildstar by a large amount.
+1
ESO is also subscription game and is also doing quite well with an estimated 800k-1.2m subscribers at the moment according to reports, even despite the criticisms it received at its launch mostly to do with its horrendous launch issues.
It isn't the business model that's causing WS to falter financially and population-wise, it's the game itself that's driving players away. Wildstar is a niche title meant for the hardcore MMO players meant to satisfy the Vanilla WoW veterans, while the current "Big Three" subscription MMOs out at the moment (WoW, EVE Online, Elder Scrolls Online) are more for all types of players which is why they're drawing in a large subscriber base, while the more niche titles like Wildstar and Darkfall attract less players.
Wildstar I think is definitely going F2P if NCSoft and Carbine start losing money because of it, which is certainly not far off, if not already happening.
Well TESO is kind of a special case considering how it has gathered a massive almost religious cult like following through their successful single player games such as Oblivion and Skyrim. If not for that I don't know if it would have gained this success. Even I was pretty hyped for TESO after playing Oblivion for years. I would not be surprised if Carbine were planning the change at this very moment.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
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You can't compare a raiding game to a non raiding game as far as payment model is concerned. The ones that can get away with it are generally PVP based with little to no raiding.
I'm not saying it's impossible. It's really all about the item shop in the end
Actually, what's not going to make a difference is what anyone at Carbine thinks when ncsoft calls up to tell them it's time to start working on a cash shop.
Apparently, any game can be a winner if it is F2P !
It is Known.
Stick in a Cash Shop, fill it with RNGBoxes and put the game on life-support.
Didn't Guildwars 2 only make like a couple of million more than Wildstar? P2P is probably the best, they just went too much with the hardcore theme and lost most of its player base.
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First off, there is a big difference between Profit and Revenue.
Secondly, often a new project will have to include provisions to repay their investors (debt payments, dividends, something), and that often comes out similar to an expense. Aion has been out for a while now, and would have a much lower cost associated with development, maybe nothing if NCSoft has recouped enough from the game to recover all the initial development costs and just has to fund ongoing development. Wildstar, having just been released, is probably seeing it's maximum cost of development.
Revenue does not take into account costs, so if we are looking at Revenue numbers, ok. Profit, however, is definitely not.
So, armed with those two pieces of knowledge - maybe you have the story straight just using the wrong words - I don't know if your argument is valid or not. I just thought I would help flesh out your business knowledge.
Also, I think F2P has it's place, but it's not a magical fix. It doesn't make a bad game good, and it brings on an entire slew of problems of it's own. Be careful what you wish for.
What your not taking into account is it's just a bad game.
Nothing to do with the payment.
Unless YOUR looking for a FREE game
I think that will happen, WS will join that club sadly. I like housing and the idea of paths, but I have to agree Overlord above (and for some extent the other posters too), it's not the subscription, it's the game. WS is not a bad game, like many say, but it's a badly positioned game.
And there were warning voices of it right from the beginning... Carbine was like saying (after the several oil peaks and emission norms and safety regulations) "remember the cars of the '60s, huge cruisers, drinking 15-20 litres, no bullshit like safety belts or airbags, (those are for the wuss anyways), a real men's hardcore car - we'll bring it back, those were the times we all loved!" and then they're surprised that the "all" is now only a handful of people... Simply the surroundings are changed, the people changed, the expectations changed. Nowadays (at least for the majority of the playerbase) it's all about quick fun, short bursts, easy and fast gameplay, solo if possible.
If WS would go f2p, (even backed with a big campaign to spread the word), a lot of folks would sign up - just to leave shortly after, when facing all those elements they aren't used to: the grind, the more grind, the many hours long sessions, etc. And while Carbine could say to them: that's hardcore, those were the standard years ago - won't matter, there's a market filled with "easier" mmos they can go back to.
WS's problem is not the subscription fee, their problem is that the game was aimed towards an audience which during the years became a niche, and also dwindling (at least their %, as the playerbase as a whole is growing constantly). Those folks whom Carbine could reach with an f2p switch probably wouldn't stay in the game longer than a month... And since the other way, changing the whole game, would cost tons of money, I think their only chance now is to go after that niche and try to keep them. If NCsoft is giving them enough time for that, I mean...
(but hey, maybe I'm wrong, I've said the same for TSW, still they switched to b2p and on the long run it wasn't a bad move. And lockboxes were out of the Store for more than a year, too... /sarcasm
just kidding, love TSW)
Feels more like you are mad. You are spamming that phrase all over the forum. How about you post some useful input for once instead of copy pasting that line everywhere?
Also NC will be making the call and if they decide it's time then Carbine will bend to them.
Seeing how all other NC games are f2p or b2p anyway it's naive to think that this wasn't their plan from the beginning.
I would argue that Carbine doesn't have the skill to make a game F2P, this mean they have to make a working cashshop and have updated items to place into the shop.
Carbine can't even release Halloween or Christmas, and are so far behind their hot fixes need hot fixes, and remember they took an extra several months to released a functioning drop, and they still release a buggy mess.
So I don't think F2P is going to save them.
Many mmo's have stated the same thing in the past shortly before switching to free to play.
if its not going free to play nothing stops it going buy to play
i am wonder why they didnt go buy to play at the start they looked like they had a solid game
for each person who buys a game you need a subscriber to play for 4 months to pay the same amount as most mmo's lose 50% of the population in the first month and continue to lose 30% month after month from that point
it just makes me wonder if the subscription is more or less than the increase in box sales
problem is if they go f2p now they dont get box sales and most who play the f2p wont pay £20 in the life time of the game
but a buy to play at lease the company gets a income from the box sale
This is a very good statement. They need to fix their various problems before they could dare to try a b2p relaunch.
What bugs me about this is the other side of the coin.
Subscription based games are supposed to have a higher standard in quality because players pay for new content and updates rather than for someone working on items for the cash shop.
Carbine isn't even close to that expectation.
If they repair the problems, then this type of game will flourish as f2p, its been proven time and time again... With this type of game its okay to go f2p
not that f2p is the answer for all games, with ESO for example, i think its better to stay P2P, its a different kind of players and a whole different gameworld...... when ESO is finalised then they need to lure people back with free trials..
Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)
I think the game has already gone fail2play...because it seems like everyone is failing to play it.
Players leaving WS aren't saying the games too expensive, they arem't even saying they'd come back it was F2P they are leaving because the games not fun. A Bad P2P game made F2P is still a bad game.
+1
It wasn't the payment method that is killing / has virtually killed WS it is just a bad game.
I personally prefer the sub model over FTP or a hybrid model ie GW2
If you have a good game people won't care what business model they choose whereas if a game is bad people will not play it.