reading this thread made me go check out my achievement stats in WoW.
My God!!!
My little level 90 gnome has killed so many things he makes Freddy Kruger look like Bambi.
And not only killed but then he's harvested "parts" for some quest: Gizzards, livers, hearts, brains, murloc eyeballs, god only knows what else; I can't even begin to remember them all... (maybe a good thread topic... What have YOU harvested?)
I think the issue with this thread is that in WoW, GTA, or most other games, there is no doubt that its a game where in the promo video.... that looks like something I eventually expect to see on the evening news.
Great posts guys. I'm really glad this forum is able to have a realistic conversation on this, rather then the "this is too violent" "stfu n00b dont play it if u dont like it" "w/e ur a sociopath for liking this game" type of posting going on at Reddit.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I find all this talk about story lines disturbing.
I have done mass random shooting in GTA and I couldnt tell you for the life of me what the story line is in that game.
more over I really dont think the violence in GTA is really 'cartoonish' then again I havent seen this other game so I cant compare.
To me its not so much an issue of too violent, its an issue of too much violence and by that I mean to many games that go in this direction. Arent there other things we can do in games?
Edit; Just watched the thing and it seems in pretty poor taste, I doubt I'll be playing. It's not the violence that bothers me but that you play some sadist who's just going around killing people for the fun of it. I know you could say that's not much different from GTA but at least there's some context in GTA. I do not want to even pretend to be the "hero" of this game.
That's just an assumption on your part. He may view it as his job to exterminate the human race as they are a disease that needs to be wiped out. I didn't see him laughing in the video, doubt he was having fun.
I won't be playing it, don't like the Isometric view. XCOM is OK but it's turn based not real time, makes it easier to see waht you are doing.
Hmm, I recently started playing a game on my phone called "Plague, Inc." and the goal is to evolve your disease to exterminate humanity.
(Congratulations, you have succeeded in eliminating the human race, the last remnants are curled up in a hole waiting to die)
Am I going to hell?
I have the PC version, I played it again recently after the Ebola scare as I thought it would be interesting to see how it would wipe out the human race... right now it's a toss up between Ebola and the Putin as to who will kill us all.
Watched the trailer, I wouldn't say the game is anymore violent than any other game out there. However, I think the true sticking point for many is the perceived plot that's underlined in the trailer.
You have this lone, death metal looking guy, loading himself down with various armaments with a monologue about how it's time to take out as many people as he can before he dies. Playing as an implied sociopath probably doesn't sit well with most folks, unless it's over-the-top to the point of being cheesy.
Honestly, I'm more offended at the idea that a developer could present a completely crap looking game, with a very cliche "plot" presentation in a trailer that isn't animated or voice acted well at all. They are clearly attempting to bank on the idea that all of our inner sociopaths are going to giggle gleefully as we are wrecking havoc in a videogame.
The utter lack of perceived effort on the part of the developer is what offends me the most.
As far as being offended at the gratuitous violence. Meh...honestly the No Russian level from MW2 was more disturbing than what Hatred looks to be.
I proposed that 'story' and 'context' only served to maybe allow a player to rationalise that it's ok to play a mass murdering psychopath in a game because it has some 'artistic merit', when in reality they were just playing a mass murdering psychopath and getting off on it.
Maybe stripping something like this (maybe) taking out all story and context just forced some to look at what they have been doing all along, but without anything to intellectually explain it away or hide behind. Maybe they just didn't like what they actually saw, the truth of the games they were defending.
I largely agree with this. I was discussing this game with a friend who is a psychology graduate, and she said nearly the same thing as Vesavius. We as gamers tend to justify violence by putting it in context or storyline, but at the end of the day, violence is just violence, right?
I don't totally agree with this part about "violence being violence". Violence with a reason is bad although you could argue that if defending your homeland or some other really strong reason violence is justifiable in some cases. But violence with no reason other than "fun" is the worst kind of violence. Yes giving story and context will make us feel better about doing something that we maybe on some level just enjoy for the sake of it in computer fantasy world. But the fact that many people need that context to enjoy it is still a good thing. I'm not going to go as far as to say people shouldn't play this but I have to wonder about people who would find playing a character like this very entertaining.
This is utterly gratuitous, there appears to be no plot, context or purpose to the game whatsoever.
Where the likes of GTA have a tongue-in-cheek, absurdist edge to them and the violence is the sort of excessive cartoon violence you find in a Schwarzenegger movie; this game strikes me as more of a mass murder simulator. I fail to see the point of this game.
So, after seeing one short trailer you already know that there is no plot, context or purpose to the game? I'm sure they showed everything there is to this game in one two minute trailer, just like all announcement trailers for games do.
Even if it is just a murder simulator, so what? The developers wanted to make this kind of game, and with all the controversy surrounding it a lot of people are going to want to play it. The point of the game is to make the developers money, and I'm sure it will.
my take on 'its a murder simulator so what' is this.
For me its not (and I repeat this because I dont want anyone to miss it) its NOT about the moral question of the content itself.
What is is about (to me) is pure unadulterated boredom with so many murder simulators. Ok I get it you guys like that but for the love of christ can we try something different.
Case in point would Plague, Inc really be any less satisifing if it was just called Vaccine, Inc
GTA has violence, but it is not the main objective of the game. The game does not come out and tell you that your objective is to get in a jet and bomb the streets for as long as you can. The mechanics are made available to the player but it is ultimately his choice to do so.
The beginning of the Hatred trailer outlines the game's plot (if you would like to call it that) and the character's objective. He even says "genocidal crusade." Your objective in the game is to slaughter as many people as possible in as many different ways as possible. The developers are putting you in that mindset right from the get-go.
I would say that is a considerable difference between GTA and Hatred. I think people should be allowed to develop whatever game they want if we are to consider video games a form of art and expression, but some people should think about the impact of their project on the community and what people might think of the community if this game were to be released.
So, should hardcore porn be acceptable to be shown in the daytime on an open channel if it has a story and context to excuse the fucking? Story and context is what makes everything acceptable?
To be honest, i think if more people would fuck each other instead of shooting each other, this world would be a far better place to live.
But back to topic. I think this discussion is kind of bigoted. It´s not the violence that disturbs the people it´s the lack of justification for it. If this long haired dude would have a short haircut, a US uniform and would fight some arabic speaking guys dressed like talibans, people would have no problems if he shoots those in the head.
So they've pretty much remade Postal 1 as a 3d shooter. Honestly looks like a game developers desperate cry for attention. Nothing to see here move along.
I'm sure Op-ed journalists and politicians will have a field day over this. And certain groups will once again lose their shit claiming video game violence has no impact on real world violence, yet will also claim that video game misogyny can cause real world misogyny. Go figure. Not my circus. Not my monkeys.
. If this long haired dude would have a short haircut, a US uniform and would fight some arabic speaking guys dressed like talibans, people would have no problems if he shoots those in the head.
But if he would rampage around killing Arabic speaking civilians they would. Why do some people always have to reach for the race card?
In fact if this was an white American guy killing non-white people "just for fun" it would almost definitely get banned [with quite a bit of justification.]
. If this long haired dude would have a short haircut, a US uniform and would fight some arabic speaking guys dressed like talibans, people would have no problems if he shoots those in the head.
But if he would rampage around killing Arabic speaking civilians they would. Why do some people always have to reach for the race card?
Dude relax please. This is only an example. If he would kill civilians there goes the justification. This has nothing to do with arabic people in particular, if he would kill people that most people think are evil the problem with violence goes away.
Why do some people always have to play the white knight..............
Originally posted by Rusque Take a sad browser looking game, add swear words and a columbine outfit = instant publicity.
Oh no you didn't. Wait, yes you did! /facepalm
Oh gawd!! Wait a second! Dude! WTF is wrong with your hand?!? Ok, maybe you're right. I'm not sure where this guy is from, but I'm certain that he's going on a killing spree after years of being made fun of for his monstrous ape-hands. Actually, I think that ape-hands are even more developed than those.
Dude relax please. This is only an example. If he would kill civilians there goes the justification. This has nothing to do with arabic people in particular, if he would kill people that most people think are evil the problem with violence goes away.
Yeah I agree with that. Sorry I thought you were trying to bring race into it.
This game proves that gamers are totally fine with violent video games, as long as they don't have to think or be emotionally disturbed by the violence. It challenges our thought structure in a way that I applaud. The gameplay looks outdated and crappy though, so I won't be playing it.
While I agree about the bad taste and doubtful morals it seems to promote, this game proves nothing because it isn't published yet. This game isn't even technically a game yet.
What would be worrying is if it really takes on a life of its own and becomes Halo-esque in popularity. I hope it remains a niche game the day it launches. I also predict there will be a lot of controversy, especially given the synopsis.
That being said, the Linkin Park song in the background is pretty awesome
My problem with the game is that it basically reinforces the prejudice us gamers have been labelled with ever since violent video games were brought into the spotlight. If anything. this game will harm the gaming community if any windbag in the media catches it and decides to use it as an example of what Gamers as a group are 'into'.
"The problem with quotes from the Internet is that it's almost impossible to validate their authenticity." - Abraham Lincoln
While I completely condone and approve a game like this exists the issue as I see it is that this just gives Liberals, SJW's, and mommies more fuel to assign blame that video games are "the problem" or "the cause" for something...
These groups need to assign the blame of the school shooters, maniacs with a gun, thug wannabes, etc and video games seem to be the popular "reason" not poor parenting or whatever in the sme way they used to try to pin it on heavy metal where Ozzy Ozbourne was the poster personality for male violence back in the day.
Kudos to the devs but this really is a fucking step backwards in terms of how video games are perceived in the general public eye.
Comments
side bar comment.
reading this thread made me go check out my achievement stats in WoW.
My God!!!
My little level 90 gnome has killed so many things he makes Freddy Kruger look like Bambi.
And not only killed but then he's harvested "parts" for some quest: Gizzards, livers, hearts, brains, murloc eyeballs, god only knows what else; I can't even begin to remember them all... (maybe a good thread topic... What have YOU harvested?)
I think the issue with this thread is that in WoW, GTA, or most other games, there is no doubt that its a game where in the promo video.... that looks like something I eventually expect to see on the evening news.
I have a life, its just different from yours.....
Hmm, I recently started playing a game on my phone called "Plague, Inc." and the goal is to evolve your disease to exterminate humanity.
(Congratulations, you have succeeded in eliminating the human race, the last remnants are curled up in a hole waiting to die)
Am I going to hell?
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I find all this talk about story lines disturbing.
I have done mass random shooting in GTA and I couldnt tell you for the life of me what the story line is in that game.
more over I really dont think the violence in GTA is really 'cartoonish' then again I havent seen this other game so I cant compare.
To me its not so much an issue of too violent, its an issue of too much violence and by that I mean to many games that go in this direction. Arent there other things we can do in games?
That's just an assumption on your part. He may view it as his job to exterminate the human race as they are a disease that needs to be wiped out. I didn't see him laughing in the video, doubt he was having fun.
I won't be playing it, don't like the Isometric view. XCOM is OK but it's turn based not real time, makes it easier to see waht you are doing.
I have the PC version, I played it again recently after the Ebola scare as I thought it would be interesting to see how it would wipe out the human race... right now it's a toss up between Ebola and the Putin as to who will kill us all.
Watched the trailer, I wouldn't say the game is anymore violent than any other game out there. However, I think the true sticking point for many is the perceived plot that's underlined in the trailer.
You have this lone, death metal looking guy, loading himself down with various armaments with a monologue about how it's time to take out as many people as he can before he dies. Playing as an implied sociopath probably doesn't sit well with most folks, unless it's over-the-top to the point of being cheesy.
Honestly, I'm more offended at the idea that a developer could present a completely crap looking game, with a very cliche "plot" presentation in a trailer that isn't animated or voice acted well at all. They are clearly attempting to bank on the idea that all of our inner sociopaths are going to giggle gleefully as we are wrecking havoc in a videogame.
The utter lack of perceived effort on the part of the developer is what offends me the most.
As far as being offended at the gratuitous violence. Meh...honestly the No Russian level from MW2 was more disturbing than what Hatred looks to be.
I don't totally agree with this part about "violence being violence". Violence with a reason is bad although you could argue that if defending your homeland or some other really strong reason violence is justifiable in some cases. But violence with no reason other than "fun" is the worst kind of violence. Yes giving story and context will make us feel better about doing something that we maybe on some level just enjoy for the sake of it in computer fantasy world. But the fact that many people need that context to enjoy it is still a good thing. I'm not going to go as far as to say people shouldn't play this but I have to wonder about people who would find playing a character like this very entertaining.
my take on 'its a murder simulator so what' is this.
For me its not (and I repeat this because I dont want anyone to miss it) its NOT about the moral question of the content itself.
What is is about (to me) is pure unadulterated boredom with so many murder simulators. Ok I get it you guys like that but for the love of christ can we try something different.
Case in point would Plague, Inc really be any less satisifing if it was just called Vaccine, Inc
GTA has violence, but it is not the main objective of the game. The game does not come out and tell you that your objective is to get in a jet and bomb the streets for as long as you can. The mechanics are made available to the player but it is ultimately his choice to do so.
The beginning of the Hatred trailer outlines the game's plot (if you would like to call it that) and the character's objective. He even says "genocidal crusade." Your objective in the game is to slaughter as many people as possible in as many different ways as possible. The developers are putting you in that mindset right from the get-go.
I would say that is a considerable difference between GTA and Hatred. I think people should be allowed to develop whatever game they want if we are to consider video games a form of art and expression, but some people should think about the impact of their project on the community and what people might think of the community if this game were to be released.
To be honest, i think if more people would fuck each other instead of shooting each other, this world would be a far better place to live.
But back to topic. I think this discussion is kind of bigoted. It´s not the violence that disturbs the people it´s the lack of justification for it. If this long haired dude would have a short haircut, a US uniform and would fight some arabic speaking guys dressed like talibans, people would have no problems if he shoots those in the head.
We really haven't changed all that much
"Be water my friend" - Bruce Lee
So they've pretty much remade Postal 1 as a 3d shooter. Honestly looks like a game developers desperate cry for attention. Nothing to see here move along.
I'm sure Op-ed journalists and politicians will have a field day over this. And certain groups will once again lose their shit claiming video game violence has no impact on real world violence, yet will also claim that video game misogyny can cause real world misogyny. Go figure. Not my circus. Not my monkeys.
But if he would rampage around killing Arabic speaking civilians they would. Why do some people always have to reach for the race card?
In fact if this was an white American guy killing non-white people "just for fun" it would almost definitely get banned [with quite a bit of justification.]
Dude relax please. This is only an example. If he would kill civilians there goes the justification. This has nothing to do with arabic people in particular, if he would kill people that most people think are evil the problem with violence goes away.
Why do some people always have to play the white knight..............
Oh no you didn't. Wait, yes you did! /facepalm
Oh gawd!! Wait a second! Dude! WTF is wrong with your hand?!? Ok, maybe you're right. I'm not sure where this guy is from, but I'm certain that he's going on a killing spree after years of being made fun of for his monstrous ape-hands. Actually, I think that ape-hands are even more developed than those.
Crazkanuk
----------------
Azarelos - 90 Hunter - Emerald
Durnzig - 90 Paladin - Emerald
Demonicron - 90 Death Knight - Emerald Dream - US
Tankinpain - 90 Monk - Azjol-Nerub - US
Brindell - 90 Warrior - Emerald Dream - US
----------------
Yeah I agree with that. Sorry I thought you were trying to bring race into it.
(\ /) ?
( . .)
c('')('')
While I agree about the bad taste and doubtful morals it seems to promote, this game proves nothing because it isn't published yet. This game isn't even technically a game yet.
What would be worrying is if it really takes on a life of its own and becomes Halo-esque in popularity. I hope it remains a niche game the day it launches. I also predict there will be a lot of controversy, especially given the synopsis.
That being said, the Linkin Park song in the background is pretty awesome
My problem with the game is that it basically reinforces the prejudice us gamers have been labelled with ever since violent video games were brought into the spotlight. If anything. this game will harm the gaming community if any windbag in the media catches it and decides to use it as an example of what Gamers as a group are 'into'.
"The problem with quotes from the Internet is that it's almost impossible to validate their authenticity." - Abraham Lincoln
While I completely condone and approve a game like this exists the issue as I see it is that this just gives Liberals, SJW's, and mommies more fuel to assign blame that video games are "the problem" or "the cause" for something...
These groups need to assign the blame of the school shooters, maniacs with a gun, thug wannabes, etc and video games seem to be the popular "reason" not poor parenting or whatever in the sme way they used to try to pin it on heavy metal where Ozzy Ozbourne was the poster personality for male violence back in the day.
Kudos to the devs but this really is a fucking step backwards in terms of how video games are perceived in the general public eye.
What are your other Hobbies?
Gaming is Dirt Cheap compared to this...