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Trion must be desperate.....

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  • BoraellBoraell Member UncommonPosts: 93
    Originally posted by Gdemami

     


    Originally posted by Boraell

     

    And of course we all believe its the user's fault! Trion can state what they like, I have a separate password for every game I play, each one is a non-sequential and random combination of letters and numbers so not something that can be guessed at, I am very security conscious, do not download suspect programs or access suspect websites and they still accessed my account and tried to charge founders pack.....yes yes, it was all my fault....


     

    Think of it this way:

    Who is capable to pretect better their data? A company with department of IT professionals and millions of USD poured into security or you, average user?

    Considering your comments on debit/credit cards, I think you are not as tech savvy as you think :-P

    Or you are much more gullible than you think. A subscription to a game is classed as a continuous authority payment, and as it is made on a credit or debit card the direct debit guarantee does not apply. Yes I do know what i'm talking about, no you do not, your merely spouting what you believe to be true with no basis in fact. try researching it instead of blindly assuming.

    P.S. I'm AAT qualified in accountancy.

  • BoraellBoraell Member UncommonPosts: 93
    Originally posted by mbrodie
    Originally posted by Boraell
    Originally posted by Gdemami

     


    Originally posted by Aparition

     

    all cards in my country have like a 2 or 3 year expiry on them, that doesnt change all your details though


     

    And why do you think there is an expiration date? It changes enough to make the card invalid...

    Your lack of critical thinking is astounding but not surprising and so is your ego - yeah, definitely not a mistake that happens to anyone, an intention...

    Actually for debit cards the expiration date means squat, as the card is linked to a bank account funds can still be withdrawn even if it has expired. I know this for a fact as I had a big argument with my bank about it, and eventually got a refund after  many complaints. For a credit card its slightly different, again personal experience from the two attempted Archeage gift packs.....strangely enough the only thing hat has been installed recently was Archeage beta....

     

    i just tried to make purchases online using 

    A - Visa Debit Card x 2 (2 different accounts)

    B - Visa Credit Card

    C - Mastercard Credit Card

     

    i used incorrect expiration dates for each card with all the other details correct and they all came back denied. the expiration date is there for a reason.. prevents fraudulent activity from old credit card databases :P

     

    Edit - also, when i purchased Defiance PC, i was double charged $100... i contacted support, they had a refund in my bank account in 48 hours... mistakes happen and trion is quick to remedy a mistake.

    Trying to make a new purchase is different to a continuous authority payment.

  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 36,523
    Originally posted by mbrodie

    Originally posted by Boraell
    Originally posted by Gdemami
      Originally posted by Aparition   all cards in my country have like a 2 or 3 year expiry on them, that doesnt change all your details though

     

    And why do you think there is an expiration date? It changes enough to make the card invalid...

    Your lack of critical thinking is astounding but not surprising and so is your ego - yeah, definitely not a mistake that happens to anyone, an intention...

    Actually for debit cards the expiration date means squat, as the card is linked to a bank account funds can still be withdrawn even if it has expired. I know this for a fact as I had a big argument with my bank about it, and eventually got a refund after  many complaints. For a credit card its slightly different, again personal experience from the two attempted Archeage gift packs.....strangely enough the only thing hat has been installed recently was Archeage beta....

     

    i just tried to make purchases online using 

    A - Visa Debit Card x 2 (2 different accounts)

    B - Visa Credit Card

    C - Mastercard Credit Card

     

    i used incorrect expiration dates for each card with all the other details correct and they all came back denied. the expiration date is there for a reason.. prevents fraudulent activity from old credit card databases :P

     

    Edit - also, when i purchased Defiance PC, i was double charged $100... i contacted support, they had a refund in my bank account in 48 hours... mistakes happen and trion is quick to remedy a mistake.

     

    Yet somehow, when I bought ArcheAge founders pack with a special debit card I only use for large purchases, they managed to reactivate my Rift subscription somehow with debit card info that expired 2 years ago. (Different card btw) My bank reissues the same number with a different exp date and Cva number, but that didn't stop Trion from charging me somehow. Had to fight with them a bit to prove the error was on their side, which they finally agreed to when they verified they had expired card info on file.

    Edit, I removed that old card info after that incident so I should be good during this current situation.

    "See normal people, I'm not one of them" | G-Easy & Big Sean

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing FO76 at the moment.

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding, but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • GdemamiGdemami Member EpicPosts: 12,283


    Originally posted by Boraell

    P.S. I'm AAT qualified in accountancy.

    That does not help you much with your IT security ignorance, does it? :)

    The payment must be authorized and if your credentials are invalid, because they already expired, no payment will be processed. That was already explained to you but you still do not get it...

  • GdemamiGdemami Member EpicPosts: 12,283


    Originally posted by mbrodie

    not only that but if he does indeed have a seperate randomly generated password for everything he plays.. one would be lead to believe he might have a document on his computer somewhere with all the different passwords stored. of course, that will be denied, who would want to admit that.

    Yeah, I will never understand why people invent crap like that... :/

  • mbrodiembrodie Member RarePosts: 1,498
    Originally posted by Kyleran
    Originally posted by mbrodie
    Originally posted by Boraell
    Originally posted by Gdemami

     


    Originally posted by Aparition

     

    all cards in my country have like a 2 or 3 year expiry on them, that doesnt change all your details though


     

    And why do you think there is an expiration date? It changes enough to make the card invalid...

    Your lack of critical thinking is astounding but not surprising and so is your ego - yeah, definitely not a mistake that happens to anyone, an intention...

    Actually for debit cards the expiration date means squat, as the card is linked to a bank account funds can still be withdrawn even if it has expired. I know this for a fact as I had a big argument with my bank about it, and eventually got a refund after  many complaints. For a credit card its slightly different, again personal experience from the two attempted Archeage gift packs.....strangely enough the only thing hat has been installed recently was Archeage beta....

     

    i just tried to make purchases online using 

    A - Visa Debit Card x 2 (2 different accounts)

    B - Visa Credit Card

    C - Mastercard Credit Card

     

    i used incorrect expiration dates for each card with all the other details correct and they all came back denied. the expiration date is there for a reason.. prevents fraudulent activity from old credit card databases :P

     

    Edit - also, when i purchased Defiance PC, i was double charged $100... i contacted support, they had a refund in my bank account in 48 hours... mistakes happen and trion is quick to remedy a mistake.

     

    Yet somehow, when I bought ArcheAge founders pack with a special debit card I only use for large purchases, they managed to reactivate my Rift subscription somehow with debit card info that expired 2 years ago. (Different card btw) My bank reissues the same number with a different exp date and Cva number, but that didn't stop Trion from charging me somehow. Had to fight with them a bit to prove the error was on their side, which they finally agreed to when they verified they had expired card info on file. Edit, I removed that old card info after that incident so I should be good during this current situation.

    did you happen to use paypal where you update your debit card details when you are issued a new card with expiration date / CCV number? i mean it wouldnt suprise me if people have used paypal and then magically thought that trion was using old card details.

  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 36,523
    Originally posted by mbrodie

    Originally posted by Kyleran
    Originally posted by mbrodie
    Originally posted by Boraell
    Originally posted by Gdemami
      Originally posted by Aparition   all cards in my country have like a 2 or 3 year expiry on them, that doesnt change all your details though

     

    And why do you think there is an expiration date? It changes enough to make the card invalid...

    Your lack of critical thinking is astounding but not surprising and so is your ego - yeah, definitely not a mistake that happens to anyone, an intention...

    Actually for debit cards the expiration date means squat, as the card is linked to a bank account funds can still be withdrawn even if it has expired. I know this for a fact as I had a big argument with my bank about it, and eventually got a refund after  many complaints. For a credit card its slightly different, again personal experience from the two attempted Archeage gift packs.....strangely enough the only thing hat has been installed recently was Archeage beta....

     

    i just tried to make purchases online using 

    A - Visa Debit Card x 2 (2 different accounts)

    B - Visa Credit Card

    C - Mastercard Credit Card

     

    i used incorrect expiration dates for each card with all the other details correct and they all came back denied. the expiration date is there for a reason.. prevents fraudulent activity from old credit card databases :P

     

    Edit - also, when i purchased Defiance PC, i was double charged $100... i contacted support, they had a refund in my bank account in 48 hours... mistakes happen and trion is quick to remedy a mistake.

     

    Yet somehow, when I bought ArcheAge founders pack with a special debit card I only use for large purchases, they managed to reactivate my Rift subscription somehow with debit card info that expired 2 years ago. (Different card btw) My bank reissues the same number with a different exp date and Cva number, but that didn't stop Trion from charging me somehow. Had to fight with them a bit to prove the error was on their side, which they finally agreed to when they verified they had expired card info on file. Edit, I removed that old card info after that incident so I should be good during this current situation.

    did you happen to use paypal where you update your debit card details when you are issued a new card with expiration date / CCV number? i mean it wouldnt suprise me if people have used paypal and then magically thought that trion was using old card details.

    No, I don't use new fangled tools like Paypal, direct entry of a debit card only.

     

    "See normal people, I'm not one of them" | G-Easy & Big Sean

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing FO76 at the moment.

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding, but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • GdemamiGdemami Member EpicPosts: 12,283

    [mod edit]

  • maybebakedmaybebaked Member UncommonPosts: 305
    Trion is an awesome company and I really don't think they would charge people money without them knowing. If that were true, and got out, that would be a huge hit for a mostly online gaming company. Do you really think they would do this? Start a conversation about this on their subreddit and I bet someone from Trion, maybe even the CEO, responds, doing it on here is just you trying to make Trion look bad.
  • GdemamiGdemami Member EpicPosts: 12,283

    [mod edit]


     


    Oh dear...

    This is not the case of reccuring payment. This is not the case of recurring payment still going after the the expiration date.

    Once you cancel the sub, there is no longer any reccuring payment going on. If you want to subscribe again, you need valid card info. Period.

  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 36,523
    [mod edit]

    "See normal people, I'm not one of them" | G-Easy & Big Sean

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing FO76 at the moment.

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding, but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • BoraellBoraell Member UncommonPosts: 93
    Originally posted by maybebaked
    Trion is an awesome company and I really don't think they would charge people money without them knowing. If that were true, and got out, that would be a huge hit for a mostly online gaming company. Do you really think they would do this? Start a conversation about this on their subreddit and I bet someone from Trion, maybe even the CEO, responds, doing it on here is just you trying to make Trion look bad.

    I don't think it's Trion doing it, it's not what I've said and anyone who believes a company of that size would needs to lay off the drugs. That doesn't change the fact that it could be an issue at their end and not the user, nor does it change the 'expired card' debate.

    We have many verified instances of gaming companies being hacked/exploited and user's information being stolen, just this month we have had this: http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/136677-Russian-Hackers-Have-Stolen-Over-A-Billion-Internet-Passwords

     

  • maybebakedmaybebaked Member UncommonPosts: 305
    Originally posted by Boraell
    Originally posted by maybebaked
    Trion is an awesome company and I really don't think they would charge people money without them knowing. If that were true, and got out, that would be a huge hit for a mostly online gaming company. Do you really think they would do this? Start a conversation about this on their subreddit and I bet someone from Trion, maybe even the CEO, responds, doing it on here is just you trying to make Trion look bad.

    I don't think it's Trion doing it, it's not what I've said and anyone who believes a company of that size would needs to lay off the drugs. That doesn't change the fact that it could be an issue at their end and not the user, nor does it change the 'expired card' debate.

    We have many verified instances of gaming companies being hacked/exploited and user's information being stolen, just this month we have had this: http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/136677-Russian-Hackers-Have-Stolen-Over-A-Billion-Internet-Passwords

     

    Ya so I'm going to change my Trion passwords now.....

  • NibsNibs Member UncommonPosts: 287
    Originally posted by Aparition
    ludicrous my ass, there is money being deducted from my bank account under the guise of Trion Rift, for the purchase of a Trion Archeage founders pack, they obviously have my credit card details on file somewhere from years ago when i payed a sub for Rift, and now some newb in there has decided to charge me for a game i dont even wanna play, so all your bs about they "cant " do this and they " cant" do that, is ludicrous

    You are so clueless.

    When you cancelled your sub to Rift did you delete your credit card details? I'm guessing not. Therefore all I have to do is somehow acquire your Rift account details and I can then log into Trion's system. From there I can order stuff using your saved details. I never actually need to know your credit card details, just your Rift account details, which are far less ecure.

    I would suggest whenever you cancel any online sub you delete your saved card details before cancelling the sub.

    The accusation that Trion themselves are responsible for this are laughable.

  • GdemamiGdemami Member EpicPosts: 12,283


    Originally posted by Boraell
    Originally posted by maybebaked Trion is an awesome company and I really don't think they would charge people money without them knowing. If that were true, and got out, that would be a huge hit for a mostly online gaming company. Do you really think they would do this? Start a conversation about this on their subreddit and I bet someone from Trion, maybe even the CEO, responds, doing it on here is just you trying to make Trion look bad.
    I don't think it's Trion doing it, it's not what I've said and anyone who believes a company of that size would needs to lay off the drugs. That doesn't change the fact that it could be an issue at their end and not the user, nor does it change the 'expired card' debate.

    We have many verified instances of gaming companies being hacked/exploited and user's information being stolen, just this month we have had this: http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/136677-Russian-Hackers-Have-Stolen-Over-A-Billion-Internet-Passwords

     


    You better read the article you linked so you understand why it is "always" client/user fault...

  • MagikrorriMMagikrorriM Member UncommonPosts: 223
    Can't believe people use their bank debit cards or their personal credit cards on the net. A word of advice use either game time cards or pre paid debit cards. As of late a lot of gaming companies are getting hacked, companies have payment processing problems, etc. . Using game time cards or pre paid debit cards insures you don't have your money stolen.
  • GdemamiGdemami Member EpicPosts: 12,283


    Originally posted by BoraellWhy do I bother...You can lead a idiot to knowledge but you can't make him intelligent.

    That is why you are an accountant, right? :-P

    Even in the link it is stated that the data are gathered from households and small sites. Why? Because those are obviously the easiest to breach.

    Gathering and further usability of data is far more efficient to do in quantity of small targets rather than trying to breach well protected international entity.


    I am not saying that big companies do not suffer from breaches, no security is 100% but the chance to break a security of large company is much smaller than to steal info from average user of the household. Thus, security weakest spot is client/user.

  • JeroKaneJeroKane Member EpicPosts: 6,385

    Issue seems to be legit atm, With a lot of People affected. So there is something going on for sure:

    http://forums.archeagegame.com/showthread.php?32011-Trion-World-Unauthorized-Purchased./page10

    The fact that People with authenticators got compromised, made cringe a little and that something happend on TRION's end they don't want to admit.

    I at least just logged in and saw I still had a paypal Reference as payment Method and instantly deleted it in Glyph, as I am not going to do any business with TRION anymore anyway (for different reasons).

  • GdemamiGdemami Member EpicPosts: 12,283


    Originally posted by JeroKane

    The fact that People with authenticators got compromised, made cringe a little and that something happend on TRION's end they don't want to admit.

    Forum posts =/= facts.

  • JeroKaneJeroKane Member EpicPosts: 6,385
    Originally posted by Gdemami

     


    Originally posted by JeroKane

    The fact that People with authenticators got compromised, made cringe a little and that something happend on TRION's end they don't want to admit.

     

    Forum posts =/= facts.

     In this case it weren't some rants. There are some very constructive posts in that topic among the usual rants as you say.

    Also, someone pointed out to a possible breach on the front end side of Glyph, that a hacker might have been able to break into the web server and managed to point people to a phising site for a short period of time until it was discovered and fixed by TRION.

    That one actually could sound very plausible and would render an authenticator useless ofcourse. And not something TRION would likely admit and announce to the world, especially if it was discovered and fixed quickly enough to limit damage.

    Post #97 : http://forums.archeagegame.com/showthread.php?32011-Trion-World-Unauthorized-Purchased./page10

     

  • VicDynamoVicDynamo Member Posts: 234
    Trion isn't randomly charging $149.99 out of desperation to make money. That assertion is ridiculous. 
  • blueturtle13blueturtle13 Member LegendaryPosts: 12,450
    They are not desperate they made a mistake and admitted it. You will get your money back as everyone will. I was charged as well but it is only $150 and they have already refunded it to my card. People need to chill

    거북이는 목을 내밀 때 안 움직입니다












  • kitaradkitarad Member EpicPosts: 6,080
    When they issue a new credit card it comes with that 3 digit code that changes (CVV) and usually the transaction cannot go through without that code being correct.

  • GdemamiGdemami Member EpicPosts: 12,283


    Originally posted by JeroKane

    In this case it weren't some rants. There are some very constructive posts in that topic among the usual rants as you say.Also, someone pointed out to a possible breach on the front end side of Glyph, that a hacker might have been able to break into the web server and managed to point people to a phising site for a short period of time until it was discovered and fixed by TRION.That one actually could sound very plausible and would render an authenticator useless ofcourse. And not something TRION would likely admit and announce to the world, especially if it was discovered and fixed quickly enough to limit damage.Post #97 : http://forums.archeagegame.com/showthread.php?32011-Trion-World-Unauthorized-Purchased./page10 

    Yes, I have read that post. Still does not make it a fact...

    I find it hard to believe a company would try to cover thing like this up as the damage potential is just too real and too large. Second, if there was such a focused effort to attack a particular company, I somewhat doubt that they would let them deny the breach.

    Anyway, we just do not know and it is silly to jump to conclusions. Only Trion and rogues knows the truth.

  • HermodHermod Member UncommonPosts: 35
    Got the same e-mail, good job my card was out of date
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