I have yet to see a WoW of sandbox MMOs, so I'm hoping someone can do a sandbox right. I suppose there's EVE Online, but the difference between EVE and most MMOs can be offputting.
I'm still waiting for the term 'Reboot' in older mmorpg's like their doing in the movies today
Dark Age of Camelot Reboot, Ultima Online Reboot, Anarchy Online Reboot, Shadowbane Reboot and my favorite Star Wars Galaxies Reboot - well you get the picture. Milk something old, new again.
OMG... Pong as an MMO! That is brilliant! Why hasn't someone thought of that before? Open world, PVP and PVE, no quests, neither stylized nor realistic, no more tab-targetting, no leveling, no grouping... it's just what everyone has been asking for!
Rather than a revolution, I sought a renaissance. Firefall reminds me of so much Tribes, Unreal, and the manga Appleseed, and that is why I play it so hard now. Rather than looking for something to break the mold, some people look for things that remold the mold. The beauty of a story, after all, is in its retelling, IMHO.
This have been discussed a numerous amount of times. Due to the long development curve of MMO's, ideas that are revolutionary and groundbreaking today, may not be in 5-8 years from now.
Care to explain then, how all the pre 2004 MMOs managed to have entirely unique and innovative ideas with new features, whereas modern AAA MMOs all had the same exact design in almost every aspect?
Because your assumption is even wrong. Not any game before 2004 was revolutionary. Not even near to that.
UO was rather innovative, but nevertheless just a evolution of MUDs before it.
EQ was more or less a DikuMUD clone with 3D Graphic and larger scale and not a lot more.
DAoC was EQ with RvR added as one unique element.
SWG was a evolution of UO and not a lot more.
The only thing, which was actually unique for a lot of new players(in comparsion to today) was the internet, play with a lot of other players together, experience, which just a few MUD veteran got before. Nowadays you have hundreds of choices to make something with other people(worldwide) on the internet.. so that experience is hugely gone.
UO and EQ didn't jump straight from MUDs or DikuMUD to a graphical setting. There were games before that where players could get online, in an RPG setting no less and play together. Once the internet existed, the possibilities expanded greatly for what could be done. Hindsight being what it is, it is not a surprise that someone took advantage of it.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
Originally posted by AylChico Rather than a revolution, I sought a renaissance. Firefall reminds me of so much Tribes, Unreal, and the manga Appleseed, and that is why I play it so hard now. Rather than looking for something to break the mold, some people look for things that remold the mold. The beauty of a story, after all, is in its retelling, IMHO.
+1, well said. All the "new" games will really just be iterations of what's really there to begin with anyways, so just have the one that tickles your fancy the most. In my case, sci fi shooters, so Firefall may work for me such as Wildstar did.
At the heart of it, an MMORPG is a work of art, and its developers are artists.
nah ... mmorpgs are entertainment products. The good ones are more than Avengers (movie) than Mona Lisa.
i have to somewhat correct u.
At this moment in time they are mere entertainment products. However they used to be works of art.
Nearly all past games were works of art (yes even pong, devs where limited in what they could do at the time) Specially MMO's the grandness of the world and everything wich came looking with it where mindboggling.
Now indeed they are mere entertainment products. all aboard the moneywagon!
What we really need are some dev studios with a passion for their game without any influence of shareholders and what net. That would bring back greatness and innovation
The solution always has been and always will be when people stop spending money on things they don't like.
Anyone claiming ignorance in this day and age of multiple betas, youtube, hundreds of gaming journalism outlets, internet forums filled with people telling you exactly what to expect is a moron.
Stop buying what you claim you don't want. It will resolve itself. Otherwise, stfu and get back to your quest hub that you secretly love.
Why do people always think that everyone else is the problem. Everyone else is the addict. Everyone else has impulse control problems. Why is that people can never just accept that other people like different things. Why must the other person always have a problem, just because they happen to like or do something that I/we don't.
Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it is bad.
Why do people always think that everyone else is the problem. Everyone else is the addict. Everyone else has impulse control problems. Why is that people can never just accept that other people like different things. Why must the other person always have a problem, just because they happen to like or do something that I/we don't.
I mostly agree with you but, in practical terms, it IS a problem that other people like stuff I don't. If everyone liked what I liked, I'd have way more positive social interaction with others and way more available entertainment options that were my cup of tea, and fewer moments of feeling excluded/disdained/etc. It might even be the fundamental problem of humanity that we always disagree about everything.
I want to help design and develop a PvE-focused, solo-friendly, sandpark MMO which combines crafting, monster hunting, and story. So PM me if you are starting one.
Why do people always think that everyone else is the problem. Everyone else is the addict. Everyone else has impulse control problems. Why is that people can never just accept that other people like different things. Why must the other person always have a problem, just because they happen to like or do something that I/we don't.
When you ask them what they like in raiding, most answer something like "what else if not raiding?" or "raiding is pinnacle of end-game, cuz it was that way in wow". They often don't know about other end-game activities or they know but don't want to put much thoughts in complex ones, while raiding is simple and familiar way to get some cheap sense of achievement.
Back to topic: revolutionary game would most likely be niche one, it wont satisfy all mmo players. It's clones would cover more, but how much time can whole cycle take? I dont lead life healthy enough to live that long.
I'd bet on more realistic option: fast evolution from developing few heavyweights from scratch into cheap standardized developing of thousands of niche games. 200k of SWG lovers can get their SWG clone and it will be profitable due to originally low budget. A big publisher will have few dozens of MMOs with 10k+ players each in his list instead of 10 big projects with 300k-2m. Some of these tiny games will go big and get larger dev teams, rest will stay with small happy audience. This way is more flexible.
d&d online is a way better game than wow so I don't know why it's still doing as good as it is. Maybe because it got dumbed down and can run on a toaster so more people can have access to it.
I think the future of mmo's lies with products like the Oculus Rift etc.. The world has yet to experience a fully immersive virtual reality mmorpg. Granted, part of WoW's success was that it was easily accessible over a variety of pc specs due to its low system requirements. Games utilizing Oculus-like technology will have a limited consumer base at first until the tech becomes more affordable. Still, I look forward to the day when I can wear a headset and simply look around the room instead of having to use mouse/keyboard to turn my character's head. If Chris Roberts can succeed with the Oculus Rift integration in Star Citizen, I think there is hope for us to see more immersive mmorpg games in the future.
Just my thoughts.
This. Agreed.
Del Cabon A US Army ('Just Cause') Vet and MMORPG Native formerly of Trinsic, Norath and Dereth. Currently playing LOTRO.
At the heart of it, an MMORPG is a work of art, and its developers are artists.
nah ... mmorpgs are entertainment products. The good ones are more than Avengers (movie) than Mona Lisa.
i have to somewhat correct u.
At this moment in time they are mere entertainment products. However they used to be works of art.
Nearly all past games were works of art (yes even pong, devs where limited in what they could do at the time) Specially MMO's the grandness of the world and everything wich came looking with it where mindboggling.
Now indeed they are mere entertainment products. all aboard the moneywagon!
What we really need are some dev studios with a passion for their game without any influence of shareholders and what net. That would bring back greatness and innovation
and the distinction is irrelevant to me. The only question is whether a game is fun.
I would much prefer a fun (for me, of course) entertainment products than a boring (to me) piece of art. I use games as entertainment, not to put them on a pesdestal and admire them.
Why do people always think that everyone else is the problem. Everyone else is the addict. Everyone else has impulse control problems. Why is that people can never just accept that other people like different things. Why must the other person always have a problem, just because they happen to like or do something that I/we don't.
Fairly said, I like it. I dream of a world where I can enjoy my humble F2P games like Firefall and Grand Chase alongside my triple-A sub releases like ESO. A world where there are virtually no boundaries, and no Pay 2 Win. A world where cosmetic upgrades are fairly priced and are uber-stylish, all of them. I have a dream.
Comments
OMG... Pong as an MMO! That is brilliant! Why hasn't someone thought of that before? Open world, PVP and PVE, no quests, neither stylized nor realistic, no more tab-targetting, no leveling, no grouping... it's just what everyone has been asking for!
UO and EQ didn't jump straight from MUDs or DikuMUD to a graphical setting. There were games before that where players could get online, in an RPG setting no less and play together. Once the internet existed, the possibilities expanded greatly for what could be done. Hindsight being what it is, it is not a surprise that someone took advantage of it.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
+1, well said. All the "new" games will really just be iterations of what's really there to begin with anyways, so just have the one that tickles your fancy the most. In my case, sci fi shooters, so Firefall may work for me such as Wildstar did.
nah ... mmorpgs are entertainment products. The good ones are more than Avengers (movie) than Mona Lisa.
i have to somewhat correct u.
At this moment in time they are mere entertainment products. However they used to be works of art.
Nearly all past games were works of art (yes even pong, devs where limited in what they could do at the time) Specially MMO's the grandness of the world and everything wich came looking with it where mindboggling.
Now indeed they are mere entertainment products. all aboard the moneywagon!
What we really need are some dev studios with a passion for their game without any influence of shareholders and what net. That would bring back greatness and innovation
I don't want history to repeat itself in this revolution by having these new type of mmorpgs mass produced.
I want a way for companies to express individuality in their designs.
TSW - AoC - Aion - WOW - EVE - Fallen Earth - Co - Rift - || XNA C# Java Development
The solution always has been and always will be when people stop spending money on things they don't like.
Anyone claiming ignorance in this day and age of multiple betas, youtube, hundreds of gaming journalism outlets, internet forums filled with people telling you exactly what to expect is a moron.
Stop buying what you claim you don't want. It will resolve itself. Otherwise, stfu and get back to your quest hub that you secretly love.
WOW's main success was to get those players addicted to the epic gear grind.
For instance, even now you have -adult- players putting raiding on the #1 mandatory content list for a new MMO.
They can't think of a game without it.
That was WoW's main attraction point, to get ppl addicted to it and it earned them a few bucks extra to say the least.
"going into arguments with idiots is a lost cause, it requires you to stoop down to their level and you can't win"
Or maybe they just like to raid?
Why do people always think that everyone else is the problem. Everyone else is the addict. Everyone else has impulse control problems. Why is that people can never just accept that other people like different things. Why must the other person always have a problem, just because they happen to like or do something that I/we don't.
I mostly agree with you but, in practical terms, it IS a problem that other people like stuff I don't. If everyone liked what I liked, I'd have way more positive social interaction with others and way more available entertainment options that were my cup of tea, and fewer moments of feeling excluded/disdained/etc. It might even be the fundamental problem of humanity that we always disagree about everything.
When you ask them what they like in raiding, most answer something like "what else if not raiding?" or "raiding is pinnacle of end-game, cuz it was that way in wow". They often don't know about other end-game activities or they know but don't want to put much thoughts in complex ones, while raiding is simple and familiar way to get some cheap sense of achievement.
Back to topic: revolutionary game would most likely be niche one, it wont satisfy all mmo players. It's clones would cover more, but how much time can whole cycle take? I dont lead life healthy enough to live that long.
I'd bet on more realistic option: fast evolution from developing few heavyweights from scratch into cheap standardized developing of thousands of niche games. 200k of SWG lovers can get their SWG clone and it will be profitable due to originally low budget. A big publisher will have few dozens of MMOs with 10k+ players each in his list instead of 10 big projects with 300k-2m. Some of these tiny games will go big and get larger dev teams, rest will stay with small happy audience. This way is more flexible.
Start with Mincraft for the crafting, building, farming and harvesting. And the randomly spawned monsters and dungeons.
Throw in TERA combat.
Set in an EVE like economy.
http://gnomophobia.com
This isn't a signature, you just think it is.
This. Agreed.
Del Cabon
A US Army ('Just Cause') Vet and MMORPG Native formerly of Trinsic, Norath and Dereth. Currently playing LOTRO.
I found a game I'm excited for. Full loot PvP, all items ingame are crafted, all buildings are crafted. No levels, no classes.
The gear you craft determines who you are. Love it!
Can't wait to start the next Alpha in Sept.
"My Fantasy is having two men at once...
One Cooking and One Cleaning!"
---------------------------
"A good man can make you feel sexy,
strong and able to take on the whole world...
oh sorry...that's wine...wine does that..."
and the distinction is irrelevant to me. The only question is whether a game is fun.
I would much prefer a fun (for me, of course) entertainment products than a boring (to me) piece of art. I use games as entertainment, not to put them on a pesdestal and admire them.
Fairly said, I like it. I dream of a world where I can enjoy my humble F2P games like Firefall and Grand Chase alongside my triple-A sub releases like ESO. A world where there are virtually no boundaries, and no Pay 2 Win. A world where cosmetic upgrades are fairly priced and are uber-stylish, all of them. I have a dream.
I like open world game so I need MMO that gives me freedom.