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Why all the AA hate?

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  • vidiotkingvidiotking Member Posts: 587
    Originally posted by Robsolf
    Originally posted by vidiotking

    Maybe I'm being the drama queen here.

    I've been on these forums for 6 years now, and my twisted, biased brain thinks this game is getting more hate than most.

    Funny thing is, I'm not really defending the game. It's not "OMG Totally Great" or anything. It's just an above average mmo to me. 

    I guess that's why I'm a little surprised there seems to be, to me anyway, so many people un happy w/ this game.

    Well... if you drop by on occasion, I apologize for being a bit harsh.  But the criticism AA has gone through is honestly nothing new. 

    I think it deserves to be defended, and I think you should continue to defend it.  It may well be the best game I'll never buy.

    Your last sentiment is shared by SO MANY PEOPLE.  Surely you've had friends show you games they thought were brilliant that you thought could play second fiddle to "snake"?

     

    YES! Spiral Knights! My long time friend and gaming partner loves Spiral Kights. I was very "meh".

  • KangaroomouseKangaroomouse Member Posts: 394

    AA has a very bad identity crisis because it is a hodgepodge of good ideas, badly implemented with a facebook-esque money milking scheme. This is where the negativity comes from, it divides the player base on so many levels it's in deep trouble if you ask me.

    Let me explain why i think that:

    ----

    Firstly, the game is neither F2P nor P2P. It's a highly monetized system in place not to gate content or slow down progression but to extract the maximum amount of money out of players. There are so many other methods to gate content or restrict item inflation other than using a system like LP that are directly connected to your wallet.

    If i pay a monthly subscription i want access to all content and i want to play as much as i have time. This is not the case with AA and that is why i give it a pass.

    ----

    Secondly the game is neither PvP nor PvE. Both is incredibly dull and boring for me. It's not engaging enough and while i kinda like the whole pirate and trade route idea it boils down to the same old PvP content we seen many times before.

    ----

    Thirdly, the game is neither Sandbox nor Theme Park. In fact i don't see any Sandbox elements at all. Having a house and a farm is not a sandbox feature, FFXIV has that, hell you can even raise Chocobos in FFXIV and no one would ever call it a Sandbox. 

    ----

    These are my opinion based on the facts and the 2 BETAS i participated in.

  • TamanousTamanous Member RarePosts: 3,025
    This may be shocking to many but perhaps it is just people revealing they didn't actually like the game.

    You stay sassy!

  • RobsolfRobsolf Member RarePosts: 4,606

    YES! Spiral Knights! My long time friend and gaming partner loves Spiral Kights. I was very "meh".

    Spiral Knights... but that game is second to nothing!  A hex on you!  No... you're not worth it!  A singular Heck on you!!!

    I kid, I kid... :)

  • syriinxsyriinx Member UncommonPosts: 1,383

    1.  All games have 'hate'

    2. ArcheAge seems to be crammed down our throats on this site.  A column about how its more elder scrolls than TESO is a great example.  Its an absurd premise (AA is nothing like Elder Scrolls, at least TESO has the combat if little else) that shouldn't be a feature, opinion piece or not. 

    3.  Its a niche game, and some people don't understand that (on both sides).  this includes the fact that its NOT meant to be a deep PvE game.

    4.  The payment model is dubious.  This includes extraordinarily high alpha price and p2w line straddling LP pots, as well as being a sub game pretending to be a f2p game.  Personally, the only one of these I have an issue with is LP pots (the whole idea of LP to me is trash, you could limit items entering the economy in other ways)

     

    given the above 4 things, I think AA is actually getting off pretty easy compared to some games

    And despite the fact that the above may have sounded negative, I recognize AA is a very good game for those looking for a PvP game with some sandbox elements.

     

  • GiffenGiffen Member UncommonPosts: 276
    I would say because AA is over-hyped and under-delivers.  Now that details of the cash shop are coming out the pay2win criticisms are also being made.
  • rodarinrodarin Member EpicPosts: 2,607
    Originally posted by Giffen
    I would say because AA is over-hyped and under-delivers.  Now that details of the cash shop are coming out the pay2win criticisms are also being made.

    How can free to log in games under deliver? I never got that premise. This isnt ESO with a MANDATORY subscription just to log intot he game. ANYONE will be able to log in once it releases.

     

    As for the 'pay to win' cash shop. Stupid made up shit by people grasping at straws to find something negative.

     

    Irony is there are a lot of negatives to the game people just arent citing them.

     

    Also this game has been out almost a year and a half in a couple countries so the hate bandwagon is very late to the party. Trion isnt magically going to make it a better game either. In fact thyere a scapegoat at best because the game might be worse in the NA form than it is in the other parts of the world.

     

    Game is a great blueprint for an awesome game it just doesnt go far enough with what it has and doesnt seem to have a real direction. The lack of direction is what some people cite as 'sand box' but it really isnt. 

     

    But its free to get into and you can play it without spending a dime despite what people want to claim. It surely isnt competitive enough from what I can see to make people think they MUST spend money to keep up with everyone else. There are plenty of way to excel in the game for free. If one of those several ways isnt what you want to do spend some money or leave the game, its pretty simple.

     

    But guys just love to piss and moan about every game that comes out, but usually for all the wrong reasons. Since this game is free there really arent any reasons to whine about it. If it were subscription only then maybe, but even then and even as a half finished product it does offer more than ESO did which was a sub game (and not worth the sub). So if Archeage was getting hye like ESO, was charging a sub AND throwing a cash shop in the mix then yes I could understand the backlash. But no free to play game should get bashed by anyone. Its frigging free for crying out loud. If you feel you need to spend money to compete then dont play it whining to other people tryign to convince them your paranoia is justified is just sad.

  • Bad.dogBad.dog Member UncommonPosts: 1,131
    Originally posted by Kangaroomouse

    AA has a very bad identity crisis because it is a hodgepodge of good ideas, badly implemented with a facebook-esque money milking scheme. This is where the negativity comes from, it divides the player base on so many levels it's in deep trouble if you ask me.

    Let me explain why i think that:

    ----

    Firstly, the game is neither F2P nor P2P. It's a highly monetized system in place not to gate content or slow down progression but to extract the maximum amount of money out of players. There are so many other methods to gate content or restrict item inflation other than using a system like LP that are directly connected to your wallet.

    If i pay a monthly subscription i want access to all content and i want to play as much as i have time. This is not the case with AA and that is why i give it a pass.

    ----

    Secondly the game is neither PvP nor PvE. Both is incredibly dull and boring for me. It's not engaging enough and while i kinda like the whole pirate and trade route idea it boils down to the same old PvP content we seen many times before.

    ----

    Thirdly, the game is neither Sandbox nor Theme Park. In fact i don't see any Sandbox elements at all. Having a house and a farm is not a sandbox feature, FFXIV has that, hell you can even raise Chocobos in FFXIV and no one would ever call it a Sandbox. 

    ----

    These are my opinion based on the facts and the 2 BETAS i participated in.

    A fool and their money soon parts ....no matter how often you spew this crap the average patron isn't going to be spending money on LP potions , they just won't need more then the 5k they can bank

    F2P is a another monster in itself , I'm sorry folks don't get the point ...you don't have to buy the game ...you don't have to sub ...you get a free trail of the pve content . That's it in a nutshell !!

    It's got a 30 level training session on rails ....sorry I'm not a fan of this but just following general chat and posts on every forum you see some folks could use 100 levels of training and still not have  the most basic clue of what's going on .

    Lots of sandbox in AA but having a farm and a house isn't a sandbox I agree

    Finally I just can't grasp after having only played two beta's ...how anyone would have even the most basic understanding of LP system yet you've managed to spew disinformation about this entire topic in at least 50 posts

     

     

  • TalketzantoTalketzanto Member UncommonPosts: 205
    Games great! All my friends have been having a good time and its been awhile since we found a mmo that kept us interested...jump in and play!
  • Eir_SEir_S Member UncommonPosts: 4,438

    I don't hate AA.  I just don't like it.  I don't see a problem.  I didn't waste any money on it or anything, it's great if people are enjoying it.

    Like someone else said, every AAA title has it's non-fans.  Big deal.

  • JabasJabas Member UncommonPosts: 1,249
    Originally posted by Kangaroomouse

    AA has a very bad identity crisis because it is a hodgepodge of good ideas, badly implemented with a facebook-esque money milking scheme. This is where the negativity comes from, it divides the player base on so many levels it's in deep trouble if you ask me.

    Let me explain why i think that:

    ----

    Firstly, the game is neither F2P nor P2P. It's a highly monetized system in place not to gate content or slow down progression but to extract the maximum amount of money out of players. There are so many other methods to gate content or restrict item inflation other than using a system like LP that are directly connected to your wallet.

    If i pay a monthly subscription i want access to all content and i want to play as much as i have time. This is not the case with AA and that is why i give it a pass.

    ----

    Secondly the game is neither PvP nor PvE. Both is incredibly dull and boring for me. It's not engaging enough and while i kinda like the whole pirate and trade route idea it boils down to the same old PvP content we seen many times before.

    ----

    Thirdly, the game is neither Sandbox nor Theme Park. In fact i don't see any Sandbox elements at all. Having a house and a farm is not a sandbox feature, FFXIV has that, hell you can even raise Chocobos in FFXIV and no one would ever call it a Sandbox. 

    ----

    These are my opinion based on the facts and the 2 BETAS i participated in.

    This is one of a big example why some ppl might create hate against AA.

    AA is a little diferent from the current AAA mmorpgs release in last years, most of the times ppl claim that want something diferent but when something diferent comes up they scream in forums because they fear what they cant understand. A normal behave in alot of humans. Games release by Funcom is a nice example.

    AA dont shine in feature nº 1, 6 or 20, it shines in the way all features are connected and all make sense in game world.

    LP is one of that features, talking alone about it and releated only with cash shop gives suport the idea write above. After playing 3 months AA i have a diferent idea about LP, i didnt like it inicially because i didnt understand it, LP is a really nice system to promote indirect player dependence and a diferent lvl of chalenge in-game. LP must be maneged wiselly, if someone keep missing LP is doing something wrong, its supose to manage it and use other people to help in that. Wow, a mmorpg where we need others....

     

    All the rest is just opinions without facts involve, but in the end say "These are my opinions based on facts...."  Really? image

  • ScypherothScypheroth Member Posts: 264
    i do not hate AA BUT i am not supporting its cash grab methods....i was probly the most stoked ot of everyone in the world...then they released the price....the fact that they think they can charge 150 for a alpha and not give ANYTHING physical for that price is why im not supporting this game....untill launch...then i will sub for 15 a month since the gaem itself will b free....
  • GeezerGamerGeezerGamer Member EpicPosts: 8,852
    Originally posted by vidiotking

    I've been playing AA for a couple of months and find it pretty enjoyable. Why all the hate?

    I hear people saying it is P2W because you can buy an extra 2k LP a day. Ok, I get that. It's a little P2W'ish. I know I won't be buying any LP potions. I have never once run out of LP. And yes, I craft, a lot. 

    The game is fun for me. The crafting is deep'ish. There is open world housing and farming. The combat is pretty same'ish, but ok. There are naval battles. Gliders, mounts....

    Graphics are ok, runs pretty well, no major bugs that I've encountered.

    I've been playing mmo's since EQ in '99, and this one is atleast in the top half, imho. It's the closest thing to SWG, my all time fav, that I've played.

    So tell me, why all the hate?

    Big difference between hating a game and hating a business model.

  • DkuangDkuang Member UncommonPosts: 37

    I don't hate AA, I just dislike it and find it boring. Minus all the issues with LP and their payment models, the game by itself is mediocre imo.

    I barely could stay on the the CB2 last week to hit level 16 because well...the game was just mind numbingly boring. Quests are standard do this do that, even with the whole hand in with less % complete or over charged, but what made it worse by far was its combat. I found its tab targeting yet again boring and the skills not that responsive. (TESO, for all its crap at least got combat done better)

    Yes, yes everyone says they have gliders, housing, open world pvp, crafting, boats and all that jazz...but if I have to beat my head on the keyboard and drool all over it just to make it to level 30 to even remotely enjoy the game...no thank you. I'll pass on AA because having houses, gliders, boats, and butt pirates doesn't take away from all the "boring" (yet again) aspects of the game.

    Did I mention the graphics and animations are sub par? No? Well they are and that combined with the said above doesn't paint a pretty picture of the game for me, but thats just me.

    You reap what you sow.

  • vidiotkingvidiotking Member Posts: 587

    I craft a lot and I never have run out of LP. Have 3 properties and have never run out of LP. I don't see it being an issue for patrons. Maybe if you're "SUPER HARDCORE" and play a lot, but not the average player.

    Will it be a problem for F2P players, I dunno.

    It seems to be TRION/XL wants people so sub, so they are probably making it hard for F2P players. On some level, that's understandable.

  • JDis25JDis25 Member RarePosts: 1,353
    I just want to login to an open world gone mad with PvP action, and i think I found it. Yeah I'll farm and take care of cute animals, once I am finished glorious battle!
    Now Playing: Bless / Summoners War
    Looking forward to: Crowfall / Lost Ark / Black Desert Mobile
  • cerulean2012cerulean2012 Member UncommonPosts: 492

    I don't hate AA.  I dislike the fact that you have to use lp to identify quest rewards. 

    I do not have any issue with the lp being on the cash shop, to me with it being only able to use once every 12 hours it really isn't that big of a deal/

    My other issue is I like to level with a variety of ways, some quests, some crafting, some exploring, but I can not get a straight answer about if there are quests after level 30.  When asked people always say, well there's more ways to level then by quests.  I get that, I would like to know and would be most appreciative if I could get a straight answer.

  • darkhalf357xdarkhalf357x Member UncommonPosts: 1,237

    People are going to hate get used to it.  It seems if you don't like a game you shit on it instead of understanding it might work for someone else. I've gotten used to it.

    I'm enjoying AA now.  I don't believe in P2W so that doesn't bother me.  We'll see how well I like three months after launch but have good expectations.

    image
  • DkompozeDkompoze Member UncommonPosts: 245
    Originally posted by jadzYa

    I can tell you where my "hate" comes from.

    I've been playing eve since forever and I will keep doing it, but in during the slower period I would LOVE to play a good MMORPG. I started playing Lineage 2 and it was a wonderful game (but I botted in order to keep up with the rest of the bots and because it was easier and I’ve got banned) so I was left with the feeling that that was a wonderful mmo that I did not get to fully enjoy but I could never bring myself back to restart everything all over again, especially on a 1x server. So since then I've been "waiting" for the next ultimate MMO that offers the same endgame value as L2 did.

    I've played AION and enjoyed it thoroughly till I realised that it all comes down to RNG and you can spend what you made in 6 month to get an item from +6 to +4. Not my cup of tea to just throw "hard work" away so I left.

    I've played TERRA and I liked it, but it never truly caught me. It is a beautiful game but it lacks.. I don't know… character.

    I've played GW2 and it is cool and innovative but again it never truly caught me. I think I’ve enjoyed GW1 more for some reason.

    I've played POE and Warframe and they are lovely games (yes I know, not MMORPGS) but ya.. played them a couple of month, took a break, played them again 6 months later. Nice substitute, but not the real thing.

    I've played FF14 and it is an AWESOME game. Till you kind of realise it really lacks an endgame. Doing raids to get better gear, to do what with that gear? More raids? Not enough motivation for me to keep grinding.

    I've played a couple of days of WILDSTAR and man that game is just flavourless...

    So AA was the “promised land”. The looong waited MMORPG that has EVERYTHING and will blow WoW (which I've never started cause was too cartoonish and I've lost the train a long time ago anyway) out of the water. And what do we get? Average at best game (graphics, combat, pve, etc) with major stability issues (for a lot of people, if you read the forums, including myself) and with discussible and limiting game mechanics witch seem to point strongly towards cash grabs. Probably the game is not as bad as we "haters" make it sound, but I think a lot of the frustration comes from both the obvious limitations of the game topped up with our own personal disappointment that yet again this game is not the ultimate MMORPG it could be and we hyped for.

     

    I never heard Trion claim this once. I have never heard this once from anyone in the community that isn't extreme super fanboi or extreme WOW hater.. All i hear is "Will this be the game to do this." A lot of people ask a lot of questions, you cant be mad at that or take their questions/opinions and turn them into factual statements to back up your" WHY I HATE A VIDEO GAME THAT HASN'T BEEN RELEASED" post.....jus sayin

     

  • Xeno326Xeno326 Member UncommonPosts: 77

    The Grind

    My beef with the game is that its just some quest/craft grinder until 30... Before you get to start engaging in fun activities such as open world pvp, etc. Then once you get to that fun, probably some more quest/craft grinding.

    The Story

    No engaging story, just a hop from one npc to the next. I expected that though, no story that gives you the feeling of care towards a character or set of characters doesn't really exist in games like these. So for that I would have to play a Final Fantasy title, but its definitely something MMO's could at least try to do. The way FF titles introduce their characters and unlock the background stories for each character as you progress through the world is actually quite successful and helps with the immersion into the game world a little more.

    The Graphics

    The game looks great.

    The Combat

    The combat seems fun and like it would be fun in PVP once you get to that point, but that's the problem, getting to that point.

    The Manueverability

    The movement seems kinda clunky at times compared to what I'm used to, more of a fluid free-style type of movement all the time.

    Other Notes

    Other than that its a good thing the game is F2P, I'll be able to fight the grind eventually in the future once its released to finally experience what I'm after in the game and that's open world pvp, but getting through the themepark starter areas to that point is just something I don't want to invest too much time into on a limited beta weekend and an eventual wipe before open/beta live release.

  • NyghthowlerNyghthowler Member UncommonPosts: 392

    I played CB2 this last weekend; my first excursion into AA.

    I enjoyed the gameplay although wasn't anything new or ground breaking. Tab target and hit your hotkeys. Neither a plus or minus in my book.

    It ran good on my system. Only had one CTD the entire weekend .

     

    The only thing I dislike IMMENSELY is using LP for everything. Open a coin bag = LP. Open a quest reward = LP. Pray at a shrine after you die = LP. Sell to merchants = LP.

    I understand the use of it for crafting and it's just another control mechanic to keep the market from being flooded. That's not an issue. It's everything else its used for that blows.

     

    And no, I won't be F2P if I decide to play it. I will subscribe. I just don't like the direction they went with the LP system.

     

     

    I also think Gilda Stars should be sellable. I don't craft so have no use for them as a reward.

  • BinafusBinafus Member UncommonPosts: 230
    Originally posted by Nyghthowler

    I played CB2 this last weekend; my first excursion into AA.

    I enjoyed the gameplay although wasn't anything new or ground breaking. Tab target and hit your hotkeys. Neither a plus or minus in my book.

    It ran good on my system. Only had one CTD the entire weekend .

     

    The only thing I dislike IMMENSELY is using LP for everything. Open a coin bag = LP. Open a quest reward = LP. Pray at a shrine after you die = LP. Sell to merchants = LP.

    I understand the use of it for crafting and it's just another control mechanic to keep the market from being flooded. That's not an issue. It's everything else its used for that blows.

     

    And no, I won't be F2P if I decide to play it. I will subscribe. I just don't like the direction they went with the LP system.

     

     

    I also think Gilda Stars should be sellable. I don't craft so have no use for them as a reward.

    You can turn in TradePacks for Gold or Crafting Mats and sell them on the AH.

    The main story line you have to take Gilda Stars but you can buy items like a Boat or Aquafarm etc, sell them on the AH.

    Trion said they are looking at adjusting the LP stuff, should see some changes in CB3 next Thursday.

  • BinafusBinafus Member UncommonPosts: 230
    Originally posted by cerulean2012

    I don't hate AA.  I dislike the fact that you have to use lp to identify quest rewards. 

    I do not have any issue with the lp being on the cash shop, to me with it being only able to use once every 12 hours it really isn't that big of a deal/

    My other issue is I like to level with a variety of ways, some quests, some crafting, some exploring, but I can not get a straight answer about if there are quests after level 30.  When asked people always say, well there's more ways to level then by quests.  I get that, I would like to know and would be most appreciative if I could get a straight answer.

    You can quest all the way to 50 there are plenty of quests you will not run out.

     

     

  • AmbrosiaAmorAmbrosiaAmor Member Posts: 915
    Originally posted by vidiotking

    Maybe I'm being the drama queen here.

    I've been on these forums for 6 years now, and my twisted, biased brain thinks this game is getting more hate than most.

     

    Stop being such a drama queen!


     

    But in all seriousness, AA isn't getting as much hate as AAA MMO titles with a strong IP (or at least one that has a history) whether it stems from console games or online PC games. At least it’s in the radar where people want to talk about the good and the bad. Now compare that to some 3rd rate Asian game where the last post was 2 years ago... I don't think you want that!

     

    The two main gripes seem to be the first 30 levels as well as the LP system. Maybe TRION can do something about the first issue. The second issue probably won't be so easily resolved since it revolves around XL Games. They understand that we don't want the system that was in place for both the Korean and Russian client, but at the same time they want Dinero™. The question is how they can balance the cash shop without it becoming P2W in the future while making it alluring enough to want to spend money on it.

     

    And don’t ever become a drama queen. I mean sure you get diamonds and a castle and a beautiful crown… but the downside is that one day some turtle will kidnap you and then someone will have to save you.

    image

  • LobotomistLobotomist Member EpicPosts: 5,935

    Because, again - people were hyped for different game than what they got.

    Instead of sandbox they got somewhat bad themepark , with farmville element



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