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Why all the AA hate?

vidiotkingvidiotking Member Posts: 587

I've been playing AA for a couple of months and find it pretty enjoyable. Why all the hate?

I hear people saying it is P2W because you can buy an extra 2k LP a day. Ok, I get that. It's a little P2W'ish. I know I won't be buying any LP potions. I have never once run out of LP. And yes, I craft, a lot. 

The game is fun for me. The crafting is deep'ish. There is open world housing and farming. The combat is pretty same'ish, but ok. There are naval battles. Gliders, mounts....

Graphics are ok, runs pretty well, no major bugs that I've encountered.

I've been playing mmo's since EQ in '99, and this one is atleast in the top half, imho. It's the closest thing to SWG, my all time fav, that I've played.

So tell me, why all the hate?

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Comments

  • grimalgrimal Member UncommonPosts: 2,907
    Usually the "hate" comes around to counteract the "love" here.  When there's one, there's always the other.
  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 33,542
    Just the latest MMO on the release radar, will die down post launch.

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  • ThumbtackJThumbtackJ Member UncommonPosts: 669

    I don't think anyone hates the game as a whole (well, I'm sure there are some, but whatever, there will always be those types of people). I could see not liking the standard quests or combat, but there's so much more to it than that. The main issue people have is the LP system.

     

    You can't really blame them. From a glance, it truely does seem like some sort of Facebook-Style cash-grab energy-esque system. Without playing it extensively, and experiencing that system first hand, all you have to go on are the words of others.

     

    Personally, I'm of two minds about it. When it eventually launches, I'll try out and subscribe for a month. If the LP system doesn't effect my enjoyment and the amount of time I can put into gathering, then I'm good.

  • WraithstarWraithstar Member UncommonPosts: 70
    i have a feeling most the hate stems from people who cannot afford the 15$ patron fee, which is somewhat understandable. but i just ignore it, if you have the $ to sub (which anyone over the age of 16) should have then the game is a lot of fun ive been in alpha since the release and it`s been the only mmo that  has kept my interest this long
  • RobsolfRobsolf Member RarePosts: 4,595

    Let's "metagame" for a bit, here.

    If you're sincerely asking that question, then do a search on this site for...

    why all the hate

    ...and I challenge you to find a AAA game that doesn't have at least one thread asking that same question.

    I have no issue with the game, myself, I'm just tired of people pretending that the game they like is under some kind of unique negative scrutiny that no other game has experienced.

    If you like the game, that's great, talk about how you like the game and why.  But please knock off all the "AA is the victim of unprecedented scrutiny" crap.  Some people don't like the game.  They'll go overboard in their rhetoric, as lovers of the game will go overboard in theirs.  Please just talk about why you like the game and please knock it off with the victim stuff.

    History proves that that will absolutely not happen, but hey, I gave it a try...

     

     

  • vidiotkingvidiotking Member Posts: 587
    Originally posted by Robsolf

    Let's "metagame" for a bit, here.

    If you're sincerely asking that question, then do a search on this site for...

    why all the hate

    ...and I challenge you to find a AAA game that doesn't have at least one thread asking that same question.

    I have no issue with the game, myself, I'm just tired of people pretending that the game they like is under some kind of unique negative scrutiny that no other game has experienced.

    If you like the game, that's great, talk about how you like the game and why.  But please knock off all the "AA is the victim of unprecedented scrutiny" crap.  Some people don't like the game.  They'll go overboard in their rhetoric, as lovers of the game will go overboard in theirs.  Please just talk about why you like the game and please knock it off with the victim stuff.

    History proves that that will absolutely not happen, but hey, I gave it a try...

     

     

     I guess I should have less faith in my fellow human being.

    I try to be reasonable and respectful. I have not gone overboard w/ the rhetoric. I'm only putting the game in the top 1/2, so far.

    Your answer is a good one.

  • jadzYajadzYa Member UncommonPosts: 44

    I can tell you where my "hate" comes from.

    I've been playing eve since forever and I will keep doing it, but in during the slower period I would LOVE to play a good MMORPG. I started playing Lineage 2 and it was a wonderful game (but I botted in order to keep up with the rest of the bots and because it was easier and I’ve got banned) so I was left with the feeling that that was a wonderful mmo that I did not get to fully enjoy but I could never bring myself back to restart everything all over again, especially on a 1x server. So since then I've been "waiting" for the next ultimate MMO that offers the same endgame value as L2 did.

    I've played AION and enjoyed it thoroughly till I realised that it all comes down to RNG and you can spend what you made in 6 month to get an item from +6 to +4. Not my cup of tea to just throw "hard work" away so I left.

    I've played TERRA and I liked it, but it never truly caught me. It is a beautiful game but it lacks.. I don't know… character.

    I've played GW2 and it is cool and innovative but again it never truly caught me. I think I’ve enjoyed GW1 more for some reason.

    I've played POE and Warframe and they are lovely games (yes I know, not MMORPGS) but ya.. played them a couple of month, took a break, played them again 6 months later. Nice substitute, but not the real thing.

    I've played FF14 and it is an AWESOME game. Till you kind of realise it really lacks an endgame. Doing raids to get better gear, to do what with that gear? More raids? Not enough motivation for me to keep grinding.

    I've played a couple of days of WILDSTAR and man that game is just flavourless...

    So AA was the “promised land”. The looong waited MMORPG that has EVERYTHING and will blow WoW (which I've never started cause was too cartoonish and I've lost the train a long time ago anyway) out of the water. And what do we get? Average at best game (graphics, combat, pve, etc) with major stability issues (for a lot of people, if you read the forums, including myself) and with discussible and limiting game mechanics witch seem to point strongly towards cash grabs. Probably the game is not as bad as we "haters" make it sound, but I think a lot of the frustration comes from both the obvious limitations of the game topped up with our own personal disappointment that yet again this game is not the ultimate MMORPG it could be and we hyped for.

     

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  • BinafusBinafus Member UncommonPosts: 230
    Originally posted by vidiotking
    Originally posted by Robsolf

    Let's "metagame" for a bit, here.

    If you're sincerely asking that question, then do a search on this site for...

    why all the hate

    ...and I challenge you to find a AAA game that doesn't have at least one thread asking that same question.

    I have no issue with the game, myself, I'm just tired of people pretending that the game they like is under some kind of unique negative scrutiny that no other game has experienced.

    If you like the game, that's great, talk about how you like the game and why.  But please knock off all the "AA is the victim of unprecedented scrutiny" crap.  Some people don't like the game.  They'll go overboard in their rhetoric, as lovers of the game will go overboard in theirs.  Please just talk about why you like the game and please knock it off with the victim stuff.

    History proves that that will absolutely not happen, but hey, I gave it a try...

     

     

     I guess I should have less faith in my fellow human being.

    I try to be reasonable and respectful. I have not gone overboard w/ the rhetoric. I'm only putting the game in the top 1/2, so far.

    Your answer is a good one.

    Some people when they get on the internet can't seem to help being jerks and put stuff down.

    You do not have to go any further than looking at the reply you got.

    I'm like you seems like a lot of hate maybe it is with every game, the only forum I'm reading here now is AA so I really do not know.

    The better question is what makes people go to a game forum that they hate and post.  I stay away from stuff I don't like.

  • CalexCalex Member UncommonPosts: 99
    Originally posted by vidiotking

    Originally posted by Robsolf
    Let's "metagame" for a bit, here. If you're sincerely asking that question, then do a search on this site for... why all the hate ...and I challenge you to find a AAA game that doesn't have at least one thread asking that same question. I have no issue with the game, myself, I'm just tired of people pretending that the game they like is under some kind of unique negative scrutiny that no other game has experienced. If you like the game, that's great, talk about how you like the game and why.  But please knock off all the "AA is the victim of unprecedented scrutiny" crap.  Some people don't like the game.  They'll go overboard in their rhetoric, as lovers of the game will go overboard in theirs.  Please just talk about why you like the game and please knock it off with the victim stuff. History proves that that will absolutely not happen, but hey, I gave it a try...    

     I guess I should have less faith in my fellow human being.

    I try to be reasonable and respectful. I have not gone overboard w/ the rhetoric. I'm only putting the game in the top 1/2, so far.

    Your answer is a good one.

     

    People today, on just about everything you can think of not just games, are either 100% all in or 100% against it. Like I said before it's not even just games, it's everything. So if you admit you like something or say you are not interested in it you will offend someone and prevoke some kind extreme response either way. I think it is laughable. lol.
  • RenoakuRenoaku Member EpicPosts: 3,053

    Because the game lacks innovation nothing that hasn't been there done that before including Tab Targeting & Housing nothing new about it you take the ideas from many other games thrown them in trying to make customers happy it doesn't.

    1.) The game lags freezes might be part of Beta but the memory leak is worse than Elder Scrolls Online during the beta.

    2.) The main hate from me for this game is keep it simple out of my entire time as a Beta Tester 1-15 it was a pain understanding the game, or better said what this game needs.

    . All players should be able to freely create a House in this game, and Farm there shouldn't be restrictions having to race to obtain a house based on my knowledge and what I was told in Beta you have to pay in game taxes and all this other stuff just to own such.

    . The part that really kills the game experience for me however is the Labor Points system, Crafting, and Combat, instead of restricting the way I can play the game there should be no Cap's on crafting at all, and Labor points should be removed meaning players can craft all day if they like and max all crafts no restrictions.

    . Combat Why limit players to skills allow players to (Freely) Assign Skill Points to whatever they want to (Respec) for free, and change their skills in game through the In game Hud, or NPC in the game without having to pay a fee, and make it so players can have anywhere between 1-10 different layouts they can swap to any time they need that are pre-set similar to Rift.

    I checked out AA because I got Beta Invite, Reported a few bugs but my game experience felt very Negative, and gave me the feeling of Been there done that whatever then boredom type feeling. I could try to explain how to improve this game to the Devs but I have learn over the years Developers rarely listen or make changes that actually make players want to continue playing its take it like it is or leave and find another game, and I am honestly done with these type of games been in so many of them.

    The last time I actually enjoy a MMO quite well was before all the Micro Transaction became popular and back in early 2000-2004.

  • vidiotkingvidiotking Member Posts: 587

    I understand that some people don't like the LP system. 

    I think of it as a dungeon lock out, except its crafting. Not the whole story, but some of it.

    Not saying this should make people love it, but it does go a little way to explain its existence.

  • TyggsTyggs Member UncommonPosts: 455

    There are actually a couple problems I have with AA. First is, it isn't from from login. Everyone says "It starts getting fun at level 30". That isn't good enough. Not having fun for 30 levels is a waste of time when a game's only purpose for a player is entertainment.

     

    Next issue is that a sub alone does not maximize efficiency. Even with Patron status it is still possible to run out of LP. That wouldn't be a problem if there wasn't the whole "Give us more cash and get more LP" option from the cash shop. A sub should get you the pinnacle of offerings, outside of possibly cosmetics. 

     

    These 2 things completely kill ArcheAge for me. I refuse to suffer through dull content in hopes that a game may become fun later.

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  • vidiotkingvidiotking Member Posts: 587
    Originally posted by Tyggs

    There are actually a couple problems I have with AA. First is, it isn't from from login. Everyone says "It starts getting fun at level 30". That isn't good enough. Not having fun for 30 levels is a waste of time when a game's only purpose for a player is entertainment.

     

    Next issue is that a sub alone does not maximize efficiency. Even with Patron status it is still possible to run out of LP. That wouldn't be a problem if there wasn't the whole "Give us more cash and get more LP" option from the cash shop. A sub should get you the pinnacle of offerings, outside of possibly cosmetics. 

     

    These 2 things completely kill ArcheAge for me. I refuse to suffer through dull content in hopes that a game may become fun later.

    I totally agree w/ you on both points. In fact, I almost gave up on AA before the magic lvl 30. After I got a farm and a house though, it really picked up for me.

    This is a major issue in my opinion. I don't know how many people are going to want to hang in there for the 30 level tutorial....

    As far as LP goes. I'm relatively sure they are trying to gate content, just like a dungeon lock out. Do I love the idea, no. Do I understand the need for it, yes.

    Obviously, neither are game breakers for me, but I could understand why they could be for some one.

    What I don't understand (but I do)is how people can allow themselvs to get SO hyped up, and then SO upset about this stuff. I have a passion for it too, but c'mon!

  • observerobserver Member RarePosts: 3,685
    I would say it's the usual MMO hate, but this time it's kind of different.  The actual "hate", or rather, complaints, is that AA prided itself on being a themepark with "sandbox" elements, and failed to deliver with a restrictive Labor Point system.
  • DMKanoDMKano Member LegendaryPosts: 20,859

    There is very little actual hate (there are a handful of posters that just hate Trion, and will trash anything related to them)

    In generl - just a lot of folks who are mistaking personal opinion as fact, happens with every game. 

    This is why you see a lot of these posts where reality "I didn't like this game" ends up being written as "this game sucks".

    Then there is a few trolls who will just make up complete lies to F with people.

    Also there are fans of game X railing on players of game Y - much like extreme sports fans.

    Still true hate is pretty rare - there's a lot more trolling and mud slinging than anything else.

    Lastly - ArcheAge has a lot of systems that are uncommon and poorly understood, which makes people come to erroneous conclusions - example Labor System.

  • kakasakikakasaki Member UncommonPosts: 1,205
    Short answer? Because MMORPG.com is the home for people who claim to love MMOs but the reality is, it's the home for people that love to HATE MMOs. In other words, this site has become a joke.

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  • RobsolfRobsolf Member RarePosts: 4,595
    Originally posted by vidiotking

     I guess I should have less faith in my fellow human being.

    I dunno.  I think you might need more(and so do I).  You seem pretty reasonable.  Surely you can sort through the stuff that is legit criticism, and dump the garbage?  As I had made the point(and Kyleran did earlier with far fewer words), that this occurs with every new game that comes out.  Some people will not like this game, and others... well... they might not like ANY game.

    I try to be reasonable and respectful.

    I wouldn't disagree.

    I have not gone overboard w/ the rhetoric.

    "Why all the AA hate?"  - so I would disagree, here.  Explained all that.  :)

    I'm only putting the game in the top 1/2, so far.

    I hope it stays there.  I love it when a fan finds their game, and vice-versa.  But that doesn't mean folks can't have legitimate criticisms.  I mean, LotRO is my mainstay.  There's no shortage of things to not like about that game.  Doesn't mean critics are haters...

     

  • vidiotkingvidiotking Member Posts: 587

    Maybe I'm being the drama queen here.

    I've been on these forums for 6 years now, and my twisted, biased brain thinks this game is getting more hate than most.

    Funny thing is, I'm not really defending the game. It's not "OMG Totally Great" or anything. It's just an above average mmo to me. 

    I guess that's why I'm a little surprised there seems to be, to me anyway, so many people un happy w/ this game.

  • Bad.dogBad.dog Member UncommonPosts: 1,131
    Originally posted by observer
    I would say it's the usual MMO hate, but this time it's kind of different.  The actual "hate", or rather, complaints, is that AA prided itself on being a themepark with "sandbox" elements, and failed to deliver with a restrictive Labor Point system.

    Without a restrictive Labor Point System this game is 100% screwed ....the average patron couldn't compete ,one or two hardcore mega guilds would dominate the game on every server

  • RobsolfRobsolf Member RarePosts: 4,595
    Originally posted by vidiotking
    Originally posted by Tyggs

    There are actually a couple problems I have with AA. First is, it isn't from from login. Everyone says "It starts getting fun at level 30". That isn't good enough. Not having fun for 30 levels is a waste of time when a game's only purpose for a player is entertainment.

     

    Next issue is that a sub alone does not maximize efficiency. Even with Patron status it is still possible to run out of LP. That wouldn't be a problem if there wasn't the whole "Give us more cash and get more LP" option from the cash shop. A sub should get you the pinnacle of offerings, outside of possibly cosmetics. 

     

    These 2 things completely kill ArcheAge for me. I refuse to suffer through dull content in hopes that a game may become fun later.

    I totally agree w/ you on both points. In fact, I almost gave up on AA before the magic lvl 30. After I got a farm and a house though, it really picked up for me.

    This is a major issue in my opinion. I don't know how many people are going to want to hang in there for the 30 level tutorial....

    As far as LP goes. I'm relatively sure they are trying to gate content, just like a dungeon lock out. Do I love the idea, no. Do I understand the need for it, yes.

    Obviously, neither are game breakers for me, but I could understand why they could be for some one.

    What I don't understand (but I do)is how people can allow themselvs to get SO hyped up, and then SO upset about this stuff. I have a passion for it too, but c'mon!

    The thing about Tygg's issues is, from what I see, the game is designed as it is designed, so in the places you 2 agree are issues?  They'll never be resolved.  Trion may yet make a liar out of me, but I know a thing or two about software design...

    and personally(ME ME ME)... when AA locks REAL crafting behind PvP(not to mention the other $ issues raised), they've lost me.  That is a deal breaker.  SWG never insisted on this.  In SWG I built my house on Tatooine, built and planted my harvesters, and didn't have to worry about others collecting the contents.  But I could still declare and go PvPing to my heart's desire.

    This is where some people's concept of sandbox and my own disagree.  And that's fine.  But I have no "hate" for this game, unless I had to play it in order to get to work, tomorrow.

  • FlawSGIFlawSGI Member UncommonPosts: 1,379

     I don't hate the game per se. I was really looking forward to it. But then they started doing things that i personally found a little too much on the greed side of things and it turned me off. It started with that awful price to beta test with some tacked on bling to cover up the ridiculous cover charge. Then came the rumors and speculation regarding the cash shop and that started to turn my stomach. And the last straw for me was the realization that much of those rumors regarding the cash shop were actually founded so I decided to pass.

     

    I was going to subscribe to the game because it looked like it had enough sandbox elements to offer some decent longevity for a change. But sadly  I found out that you can sub and still be goaded into spending money in their cashshop. I can abide by a sub game that includes a cash shop that sells cosmetic only and had no problem with it in the past although I would prefer there be no cash shop what-so-ever. But seeing how the game has a system in place to almost push you to still spend money and to read that they are offering things like bag space expansion as well as exp boosts and LP pots, I cannot shake the feel of a FTP title which I can't stand. If I sub to a game, I don't want the cash shop to even be on the radar and if subscribers didn't have to deal with the LP and bag expansion shenanigans, I wouldn't feel the need to complain. If the game has a sub then a less intrusive cash shop would have been acceptable. I'll speak with my wallet on this one. I am glad to see others enjoying the game and continue to fish around for hopeful news, but its looking bleak.

    RIP Jimmy "The Rev" Sullivan and Paul Gray.

  • vidiotkingvidiotking Member Posts: 587
    Originally posted by Robsolf
    Originally posted by vidiotking
    Originally posted by Tyggs

    There are actually a couple problems I have with AA. First is, it isn't from from login. Everyone says "It starts getting fun at level 30". That isn't good enough. Not having fun for 30 levels is a waste of time when a game's only purpose for a player is entertainment.

     

    Next issue is that a sub alone does not maximize efficiency. Even with Patron status it is still possible to run out of LP. That wouldn't be a problem if there wasn't the whole "Give us more cash and get more LP" option from the cash shop. A sub should get you the pinnacle of offerings, outside of possibly cosmetics. 

     

    These 2 things completely kill ArcheAge for me. I refuse to suffer through dull content in hopes that a game may become fun later.

    I totally agree w/ you on both points. In fact, I almost gave up on AA before the magic lvl 30. After I got a farm and a house though, it really picked up for me.

    This is a major issue in my opinion. I don't know how many people are going to want to hang in there for the 30 level tutorial....

    As far as LP goes. I'm relatively sure they are trying to gate content, just like a dungeon lock out. Do I love the idea, no. Do I understand the need for it, yes.

    Obviously, neither are game breakers for me, but I could understand why they could be for some one.

    What I don't understand (but I do)is how people can allow themselvs to get SO hyped up, and then SO upset about this stuff. I have a passion for it too, but c'mon!

    The thing about Tygg's issues is, from what I see, the game is designed as it is designed, so in the places you 2 agree are issues?  They'll never be resolved.  Trion may yet make a liar out of me, but I know a thing or two about software design...

    and personally(ME ME ME)... when AA locks REAL crafting behind PvP(not to mention the other $ issues raised), they've lost me.  That is a deal breaker.  SWG never insisted on this.  In SWG I built my house on Tatooine, built and planted my harvesters, and didn't have to worry about others collecting the contents.  But I could still declare and go PvPing to my heart's desire.

    This is where some people's concept of sandbox and my own disagree.  And that's fine.  But I have no "hate" for this game, unless I had to play it in order to get to work, tomorrow.

    If you have a farm, you don't have to worry about people taking your stuff. I'ts only if you plant stuff off of your farm that you have to worry.

    Small point I know....

  • kartoolkartool Member UncommonPosts: 517

    No one is ever going to be happy and like every game. Read any thread on this site, and you'll see that everyone wants something different. I've had a chance to try Archage, and while I didn't love it - I also didn't hate it. I may check it out when it goes live, but I doubt I will invest much time in it.

    The reason being, I've started judging games on how devs treat the beginning of the game - the first 20 levels or so. If I'm not having fun at that point, I'm not going to keep playing. I think all aspects of a game are important. I haven't really followed Archage, but I was expecting an interesting sandbox from the little I've heard. What I got was 2004 era questing. I hear things open up at lvl 30, but why should I as a paying or non-paying customer slog through 30 levels of stuff I don't enjoy just to get to the good part of the game.

    MMOs should be fun from lvl 1 right through to max level and beyond. I think people are tired of questing and leveling to get to the fun part. 

  • FlawSGIFlawSGI Member UncommonPosts: 1,379
    Originally posted by Bad.dog
    Originally posted by observer
    I would say it's the usual MMO hate, but this time it's kind of different.  The actual "hate", or rather, complaints, is that AA prided itself on being a themepark with "sandbox" elements, and failed to deliver with a restrictive Labor Point system.

    Without a restrictive Labor Point System this game is 100% screwed ....the average patron couldn't compete ,one or two hardcore mega guilds would dominate the game on every server

    I agree with you completely. Where I personally take exception is selling the LP in the CS. My distaste has little to do with the cost or the amount of LP offered per 12h, more to do with the principle and what I find acceptable in my MMORPG. There needs to be some sort of speedbump, but to cash in on it, even as a subbing player, stinks.

    RIP Jimmy "The Rev" Sullivan and Paul Gray.

  • RobsolfRobsolf Member RarePosts: 4,595
    Originally posted by vidiotking

    Maybe I'm being the drama queen here.

    I've been on these forums for 6 years now, and my twisted, biased brain thinks this game is getting more hate than most.

    Funny thing is, I'm not really defending the game. It's not "OMG Totally Great" or anything. It's just an above average mmo to me. 

    I guess that's why I'm a little surprised there seems to be, to me anyway, so many people un happy w/ this game.

    Well... if you drop by on occasion, I apologize for being a bit harsh.  But the criticism AA has gone through is honestly nothing new. 

    I think it deserves to be defended, and I think you should continue to defend it.  It may well be the best game I'll never buy.

    Your last sentiment is shared by SO MANY PEOPLE.  Surely you've had friends show you games they thought were brilliant that you thought could play second fiddle to "snake"?

     

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