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Confused... What Do MMO Players Want??

Spankster77Spankster77 Member UncommonPosts: 487

I don't really know what MMO players are after these days?  I look at the player ratings for games on this site and GW2 is the highest rated MMO, really?  Followed by TSW, again really?

 

Without sounding like a fanboy how do you rate GW2 and TSW over games like Rift, WoW, Wildstar?  I don't play WoW or Rift anymore but I lasted 1 month in both GW2 and TSW and can't see how you can possibly really think that GW2 or TSW have more depth as an MMO than WoW, Rift, or Wildstar...  Heck I would probably put ESO over GW2, TSW, and Darkfall. 

 

That's my two cents, I may be crazy but I don't get it.  Is it that people aren't into raiding?  All the highest ranked games on this site don't have raids, so maybe that's it?? 

 

What are people looking for in a game?

«13

Comments

  • Agent_JosephAgent_Joseph Member UncommonPosts: 1,361

    you should to know we liked different stuff !

    for me ESO is crap game not worth spend time or HDD space , but you like it & it is ok

    for me EVE should to be number one MMO game but ,that game has user score 7.9 , & I don't care for that user score,I enjoying in game

  • AeonbladesAeonblades Member Posts: 2,083
    Originally posted by Spankster77

    I don't really know what MMO players are after these days?  I look at the player ratings for games on this site and GW2 is the highest rated MMO, really?  Followed by TSW, again really?

     

    Without sounding like a fanboy how do you rate GW2 and TSW over games like Rift, WoW, Wildstar?  I don't play WoW or Rift anymore but I lasted 1 month in both GW2 and TSW and can't see how you can possibly really think that GW2 or TSW have more depth as an MMO than WoW, Rift, or Wildstar...  Heck I would probably put ESO over GW2, TSW, and Darkfall. 

     

    That's my two cents, I may be crazy but I don't get it.  Is it that people aren't into raiding?  All the highest ranked games on this site don't have raids, so maybe that's it?? 

     

    What are people looking for in a game?

    People play what is fun. WoW, Rift, WildStar are fun to some people and not to others. People are chasing enjoyment and fun is all it amounts to.

     

    To cover your later point, no, I don't raid anymore if I can help it. FFXIV is the first game that has made me consider raiding again in about 6 years. Raiding is, for the most part, terrible filler content to me. Like achievement systems, it serves no purpose other than to be annoying and have something to brag about on the internet. This is my opinion of course.

    Currently Playing: ESO and FFXIV
    Have played: You name it
    If you mention rose tinted glasses, you better be referring to Mitch Hedberg.

  • DerrosDerros Member UncommonPosts: 1,216
    dont look at "mmo players" as a single entity, think of them like Europe, everyone has their own self interests and cultures but they all fall under the same banner.
  • handlewithcarehandlewithcare Member Posts: 322
    I never played star wars galaxies but everyone loves it looks like and what do the devs. do they make a zombie game.
  • BearKnightBearKnight Member CommonPosts: 461
    Originally posted by Spankster77

    I don't really know what MMO players are after these days?  I look at the player ratings for games on this site and GW2 is the highest rated MMO, really?  Followed by TSW, again really?

     

    Without sounding like a fanboy how do you rate GW2 and TSW over games like Rift, WoW, Wildstar?  I don't play WoW or Rift anymore but I lasted 1 month in both GW2 and TSW and can't see how you can possibly really think that GW2 or TSW have more depth as an MMO than WoW, Rift, or Wildstar...  Heck I would probably put ESO over GW2, TSW, and Darkfall. 

     

    That's my two cents, I may be crazy but I don't get it.  Is it that people aren't into raiding?  All the highest ranked games on this site don't have raids, so maybe that's it?? 

     

    What are people looking for in a game?

    What's there to be confused about? It's very, VERY simple and has been repeated numerous times over the years!

     

    -An MMO that goes back to what MMOs were made to be, social interactions on a MASSIVE scale. 

    -In-Depth crafting, haven't seen anything like this since SWG from 10years ago.

    -MMO Producers to stop lying about what the game is and is not. 

    -NOT A "FREE TO PLAY" PIECE OF GARBAGE! <===One of the major points.

    -No Cash Shops, they end up ruining the game as a whole over time.

    -PvP AND PvE morphed into one product but seperate entities. Look at DAOC and how amazing that was until Mythic decided to kill it with TOA and then sell themselves to the devil of gaming.

    -World Interaction that matters.

     

    All of these things existed prior to the WoW-i-fication of the market. You don't look at McDonalds and go "Man, i wish we had more McDonalds!" ~~~ Hell no.

  • SEANMCADSEANMCAD Member EpicPosts: 16,775
    Originally posted by Spankster77

    I don't really know what MMO players are after these days?  I look at the player ratings for games on this site and GW2 is the highest rated MMO, really?  Followed by TSW, again really?

     

    Without sounding like a fanboy how do you rate GW2 and TSW over games like Rift, WoW, Wildstar?  I don't play WoW or Rift anymore but I lasted 1 month in both GW2 and TSW and can't see how you can possibly really think that GW2 or TSW have more depth as an MMO than WoW, Rift, or Wildstar...  Heck I would probably put ESO over GW2, TSW, and Darkfall. 

     

    That's my two cents, I may be crazy but I don't get it.  Is it that people aren't into raiding?  All the highest ranked games on this site don't have raids, so maybe that's it?? 

     

    What are people looking for in a game?

    Short answer:

    Darkfall

     

    Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.

    Please do not respond to me

  • nomotagnomotag Member UncommonPosts: 166
    Well sense you asked. I think the mmo I want most is be the agency. That would have been neat to play. My big problem is I tend to like mmos that don't exist more then mmos that exists. I'm batty that way.
  • SovrathSovrath Member LegendaryPosts: 32,076
    Originally posted by Spankster77

    I don't really know what MMO players are after these days?  I look at the player ratings for games on this site and GW2 is the highest rated MMO, really?  Followed by TSW, again really?

     

    Without sounding like a fanboy how do you rate GW2 and TSW over games like Rift, WoW, Wildstar?  I don't play WoW or Rift anymore but I lasted 1 month in both GW2 and TSW and can't see how you can possibly really think that GW2 or TSW have more depth as an MMO than WoW, Rift, or Wildstar...  Heck I would probably put ESO over GW2, TSW, and Darkfall. 

     

    That's my two cents, I may be crazy but I don't get it.  Is it that people aren't into raiding?  All the highest ranked games on this site don't have raids, so maybe that's it?? 

     

    What are people looking for in a game?

    I would play ESO over GW2 and The Secret World as well.

    but I would play Guild Wars 2 and The Secret World EASILY over WoW, Rift and Wildstar. Easily.

    I think you are going to have to accept the fact that people like different things.

     

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    Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w


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    Try the "Special Edition." 'Cause it's "Special." https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/64878/?tab=description

    Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo 
  • neobahamut20neobahamut20 Member Posts: 336
    Originally posted by Spankster77

    Without sounding like a fanboy how do you rate GW2 and TSW over games like Rift, WoW, Wildstar?  I don't play WoW or Rift anymore but I lasted 1 month in both GW2 and TSW and can't see how you can possibly really think that GW2 or TSW have more depth as an MMO than WoW, Rift, or Wildstar...  Heck I would probably put ESO over GW2, TSW, and Darkfall.

    When it was released, WoW was crap. Rift was disapointing and we can totally exclude the bore-fest that is Wildstar from this conversation.

    GW2 had a huge following from GW1 and the little things it does make the other MMOs unplayable. I tried to dodge in the last MMO I tried, uninstalled 10 minutes later. Although compared to what the PR had said, they killed some of their ideas when they hired the Maple Story cash shop person that made it P2W. If you do only PvE, GW2 is by far the best game out there. Only in WvW is it fully P2W. I only quit because it lacked content, mainly due to them gating everything.

     

    TSW is EA. Need I say more? They probably paid their rating, EA does what EA does.

     

    Rift well, given the previous failure of the shill, people were still mad at the load of crap Warhammer was and probably downrated it even more. It is not that great of a game either. There is nothing really new, but at least they have done very well it seems in staying in the green, so props to them.

     

    WoW is old and when they changed their whole game around to make it very easy even for bad players to succeed, people started hating on it and that obviously mattered in the ratings. I literally quit that one because it had become harder to find good players to play with than doing the content was. For someone who only cares about heroic mode, that game was no longer worth 15$ a month. I am not mad though, but some were and still are and they are most likely responsible for that rating.

     

    ESO, at the moment, looks worse than TORtanic, except for the fact they didn't spend 300 million developping the game so they can dream of P2P success a while longer.

     

     

    So to answer your title, I think what gamers really want is one quality game where the quest for cash isn't visible from inside the game. Nothing more really. No deceptions, no advantages to those who pay more, nothing.

    Boycotting EA. Why? They suck, even moreso since 2008.

  • VorthanionVorthanion Member RarePosts: 2,749
    Niche gaming can be more profitable that most people realize.  The industry is heading in that direction in a round about way, but it will likely get there eventually.  As far as I'm concerned, they can't get there soon enough.

    image
  • JedirenJediren Member UncommonPosts: 26
    Hey all, I have been playing mmo's for about six years and in my experience the WoW formula still seems the norm. Imo. its what a lot of people are use too and more comfortable  with, however it is slowly changing as new ideas are being implemented.  There hasn't been anything really big on innovation yet, that more people will accept , as their new way of a  mmo benchmark, but I think its coming soon.
  • DoomsDay01DoomsDay01 Member UncommonPosts: 783
    I want one thing. FEAR! I want to fear for my character. I want zones you have to carefully walk through as to not get killed. No more linear zones. I want to have to watch my back for that level 40 creatures walking around in a level 20ish area. I could care less about pvp. If I want to stroke my e-peen, I will go play an fps game. I want to explore again and most of all, I want to be afraid while doing it. Until they bring back fear into the mmo, Its just going to be the same re-hash of every other crappy mmo that is out there.
  • RavingRabbidRavingRabbid Member UncommonPosts: 1,168
    MMO players and what they want is as diverse as the races, cultures and nations of this planet. There is no pinning it down to a few things.

    All my opinions are just that..opinions. If you like my opinions..coolness.If you dont like my opinion....I really dont care.
    Playing: ESO, WOT, Smite, and Marvel Heroes

  • neobahamut20neobahamut20 Member Posts: 336
    Originally posted by DoomsDay01
    I want one thing. FEAR! I want to fear for my character. I want zones you have to carefully walk through as to not get killed. No more linear zones. I want to have to watch my back for that level 40 creatures walking around in a level 20ish area. I could care less about pvp. If I want to stroke my e-peen, I will go play an fps game. I want to explore again and most of all, I want to be afraid while doing it. Until they bring back fear into the mmo, Its just going to be the same re-hash of every other crappy mmo that is out there.

    A lot is wrong with this:

    Fear for a cartoon character? That's a little over the top. Most people have more important things in their lives that whatever happens in a game doesn't matter. The problem with that concept you define is that it will only define gated paths instead of zones. This is not really innovation and most good players won't even see it like you do. The problem after that point also is that once a character reaches level 40, the whole design becomes pointless. A lot of effort for a balanced zone that only lasts for 40 levels, not at all worth trying even.

     

    When you get something of value in your life, you will understand there is no such thing as fear in a game. I played TF2 last night, as pyro, I was the only one able to reach enemy zones  because I do not care about dying. I have the same attitude in MMOs. Perma-death would be nice, except I can just start a new character and not lose my knowledge of the areas. I could just team up with someone, say my gf and build ourselves so we never die. We've done it before and with perma-death, it would be designed to either progress fast or have near-invincible team builds, so it would be obvious from the start. But then, only very few people would make it to max level and we'd play on ghost servers after a very short time.

     

    <Its only a game>

    Boycotting EA. Why? They suck, even moreso since 2008.

  • eldariseldaris Member UncommonPosts: 353

    GW2 kept me interested in game much more time than ESO (1 month) or Rift (2-3 months) managed to.
    Lost my interest in Rift after beta thanks to small world and cities then ,when I bought the game and I was enjoying levelling my rogue, developers decided that I should be in same pvp teams as those heretic defiants which destroyed the already poor lore of rift for me. With ESO is even more simple - until they have a normal auction house and allow people to skip enemy factions areas I am not interested in the game.
    World of Warcraft needs more content added before I subscribe again, is a joke they ask for a monthly subscription and do not add quests/areas to game for months .

    Not all people expect the same thing from a mmo and contrary to the popular belief on this site,even less people want to go back to eq1. If WOW is Mc Donalds then EQ1 is like a pie sold by Dibbler from Discworld (something compared to which even hamburgers are a "fine meal")

  • GdemamiGdemami Member EpicPosts: 12,342


    Other people liking different stuff than you do confuse you?

    Seriously...

  • DoomsDay01DoomsDay01 Member UncommonPosts: 783
    Originally posted by neobahamut20
    Originally posted by DoomsDay01
    I want one thing. FEAR! I want to fear for my character. I want zones you have to carefully walk through as to not get killed. No more linear zones. I want to have to watch my back for that level 40 creatures walking around in a level 20ish area. I could care less about pvp. If I want to stroke my e-peen, I will go play an fps game. I want to explore again and most of all, I want to be afraid while doing it. Until they bring back fear into the mmo, Its just going to be the same re-hash of every other crappy mmo that is out there.

    A lot is wrong with this:

    Fear for a cartoon character? That's a little over the top. Most people have more important things in their lives that whatever happens in a game doesn't matter. The problem with that concept you define is that it will only define gated paths instead of zones. This is not really innovation and most good players won't even see it like you do. The problem after that point also is that once a character reaches level 40, the whole design becomes pointless. A lot of effort for a balanced zone that only lasts for 40 levels, not at all worth trying even.

     

    When you get something of value in your life, you will understand there is no such thing as fear in a game. I played TF2 last night, as pyro, I was the only one able to reach enemy zones  because I do not care about dying. I have the same attitude in MMOs. Perma-death would be nice, except I can just start a new character and not lose my knowledge of the areas. I could just team up with someone, say my gf and build ourselves so we never die. We've done it before and with perma-death, it would be designed to either progress fast or have near-invincible team builds, so it would be obvious from the start. But then, only very few people would make it to max level and we'd play on ghost servers after a very short time.

     

    Wow, there is a lot wrong with yours as well. I mean, you played TF2 and won. good for you to win a fps game. Good for you on dieing over and over again in an fps game! Thats exactly how kids today play mmos as well. No respect for the character they create. Lets just rush the boss, who cares if we die 100 times. There is no penalty for it, so no need to be afraid of it. Just like an fps game. Thanks for helping to prove my point even further on how badly fear needs to be brought back into the mmo genre.

     

    Oh and for your information, I have been married over 25 years and have a wonderful teenage daughter that I value more than anything, But thank you for trying to troll me when the conversation is about Massively Multiplayer Online Roleplaying Games and not about what you have or dont have in real life.

  • deniterdeniter Member RarePosts: 1,430

    - Vanilla WoW with better graphics, slower exp gain, paladin and druid specs suitable for tanking, and having all classes be as gear dependant as warriors were in 1.12 (yes, this means grinding).

    - Emphasize crafting and at least triple the number of crafting recipes and formulas, make them uncommon and rare quality. 

    - Make PvP to have some impact on world but don't give gear as a reward

    - Upon an expansion, don't loosen up the exp curve (leveling up should take longer and longer for each level), add some raids but also 5-10 man dungeons in similar difficulty. Make them last at least as long as the old Blackrock Depths.

    There's much more, but you got the idea. I could keep playing this game for years and years.

  • centkincentkin Member RarePosts: 1,527
    [Player 1]
    All we ever want is indecision
    [Player 2]
    All we really like is what we know
    [Player 3]
    Gotta balance style with adherence
    [Player 4]
    Making sure we make a good appearance
    [Player 5]
    Even if you simply have to fudge it
    [All]
    Make sure that it stays within our budget
    [Developer]
    Got to overcome intimidation
    Remember, it's all in the presentation!
     
     
    -------------------------
     
    This was actually from "Art of the Dress" a song in "My Little Pony"
  • DamonVileDamonVile Member UncommonPosts: 4,818

    I'd like to try a skill based non-linear open world game again. One where crafting and gathering where important and quests felt epic rather than like doing someone else's choirs for them.

    When I ask someone where they are, I don't want to know exactly what level they are and what part of the story they're on from their answer.

  • BadaboomBadaboom Member UncommonPosts: 2,380

    Some people want to pvp, while others to pve.  Some people want gameplay primary, while others prefer pretty graphics.  Some people prefer science fiction, others fantasy while others like present day.  Some people want crafting depth, while others don't.  Some people want harsh death penalties while others don't.  Some people want the journey while others want an end game.  Some people want arena pvp while others want open world pvp.  Some people want full loot while others want no consequences.  Some people want quests while others want to make their own content.  Some people want to figure stuff out on their own while other want pretty light trails telling them where to go.

     

     

    tldr:  some people want stuff while other people want other stuff.

  • BMBenderBMBender Member UncommonPosts: 827

    hmmm what do mmo gamers want...it really isn't a difficult question. Even though there is an extreme divergence of what his or that group considers the "perfect game" they all share one thing in common. They want the PR, hype, marketing that originally interested them to actually match the physical product. They want the polish level of the adverted play-styles to match the price point.

    If you have to scatter gun mass market to everyone you prob. got it wrong.

    If you are unable devote the same amount of recourses towards polishing for all shipped systems to an equal level that you adverted, you prob. got it wrong.

    If your design doc looked like a shopping list of "industry standard" features instead of what you yourself want to play, you prob. got it wrong.

    Whatever style of game "you the developer" think is fun there is more than likely a ready made market for it. If however you get greedy and try to shoehorn systems/features in "just because" well that level of passion and interest will come through loud and clear to your audience too.

    Game design is after all a creative process and paint by the numbers isn't all that interesting to either the creator or the audience.

    image
  • neobahamut20neobahamut20 Member Posts: 336
    Originally posted by DoomsDay01
    Originally posted by neobahamut20
    Originally posted by DoomsDay01
    I want one thing. FEAR! I want to fear for my character. I want zones you have to carefully walk through as to not get killed. No more linear zones. I want to have to watch my back for that level 40 creatures walking around in a level 20ish area. I could care less about pvp. If I want to stroke my e-peen, I will go play an fps game. I want to explore again and most of all, I want to be afraid while doing it. Until they bring back fear into the mmo, Its just going to be the same re-hash of every other crappy mmo that is out there.

    A lot is wrong with this:

    Fear for a cartoon character? That's a little over the top. Most people have more important things in their lives that whatever happens in a game doesn't matter. The problem with that concept you define is that it will only define gated paths instead of zones. This is not really innovation and most good players won't even see it like you do. The problem after that point also is that once a character reaches level 40, the whole design becomes pointless. A lot of effort for a balanced zone that only lasts for 40 levels, not at all worth trying even.

     

    When you get something of value in your life, you will understand there is no such thing as fear in a game. I played TF2 last night, as pyro, I was the only one able to reach enemy zones  because I do not care about dying. I have the same attitude in MMOs. Perma-death would be nice, except I can just start a new character and not lose my knowledge of the areas. I could just team up with someone, say my gf and build ourselves so we never die. We've done it before and with perma-death, it would be designed to either progress fast or have near-invincible team builds, so it would be obvious from the start. But then, only very few people would make it to max level and we'd play on ghost servers after a very short time.

     

    Wow, there is a lot wrong with yours as well. I mean, you played TF2 and won. good for you to win a fps game. Good for you on dieing over and over again in an fps game! Thats exactly how kids today play mmos as well. No respect for the character they create. Lets just rush the boss, who cares if we die 100 times. There is no penalty for it, so no need to be afraid of it. Just like an fps game. Thanks for helping to prove my point even further on how badly fear needs to be brought back into the mmo genre.

     

    Oh and for your information, I have been married over 25 years and have a wonderful teenage daughter that I value more than anything, But thank you for trying to troll me when the conversation is about Massively Multiplayer Online Roleplaying Games and not about what you have or dont have in real life.

     

    If you really had a child, you'd not even care about what happens to your characters in game. What's the worse that can happen? Your character is perma-dead and you get to spend time with your family? Gee, what a "punishment". A videogame character is the most superfluous thing there is. Placing value in it is as sad as those who spend 60 hours a week playing an auction house trying to get rich in a game... instead of opening a business and getting rich in real life.

     

    Not to mention that the terms of use specifically say that your characters are not even yours, so respecting something that is rented and disposable is like respecting toilet paper.

    Boycotting EA. Why? They suck, even moreso since 2008.

  • Spankster77Spankster77 Member UncommonPosts: 487

    All great answers... 

     

    While I know my question was a bit loaded, I find that people that play MMOs as their main genre of game are hard to satisfy.  We all want to go back to a place that no longer exists.  Companies like Blizzard changed the direction of WoW because they wanted to make it more "casual" friendly, yet by doing this they alienated the "hardcore".  GW2 comes along and is the cure all for gamers by doing away with the trinity and making it so that anyone can fill any role, except it wasn't the cure all and was in fact not much more than a good RPG with PvP and catered to people that don't seek thrills in character progression.  ESO comes along riding the coattails of an awesome franchise yet fails to deliver.  Big budget, great marketing, well known brand, etc.

     

    So I guess I would have to agree that the true future of MMOs is in niche gaming.  We all want the next mega hit MMO that has millions of subscribers (or in f2p terms active accounts), yet among us we all want something different.  I played WoW for years, I loved that game but it was as popular as it was largely in part to the options being limited. 

     

    As for me, Wildstar is the first MMO I have really enjoyed since TBC WoW and I foresee myself playing it for quite some time.  I understand that its not everyone's cup of tea.

     

     

  • RzepRzep Member UncommonPosts: 767

    You are confused because you seem to think "mmo players" means something. That "mmo players" is some all encompasing term. There are:

    -mmo players looking for a creative PvE sandbox

    -mmo players looking for a PvP sandbox

    -mmo players looking for a fantasy theme park

    -mmo players looking for a sci fi theme park

    -mmo players looking for hotbar combat

    -mmo players looking for action combat

    -mmo players looking for hybrid combat

    And so on, and so forth.

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