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Why are Indies so much better?

SEANMCADSEANMCAD Member EpicPosts: 16,775

That is my question.

 

Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.

Please do not respond to me

Comments

  • AeonbladesAeonblades Member Posts: 2,083
    Which game(s) are you referring to? I haven't seen a good indie title come out in the genre, but there are some good ones coming up soon supposedly if they pan out.

    Currently Playing: ESO and FFXIV
    Have played: You name it
    If you mention rose tinted glasses, you better be referring to Mitch Hedberg.

  • SEANMCADSEANMCAD Member EpicPosts: 16,775
    Originally posted by Aeonblades
    Which game(s) are you referring to? I haven't seen a good indie title come out in the genre, but there are some good ones coming up soon supposedly if they pan out.

    Darkfall

    Wurm Online

    Fallen Earth

    EVE (although questionably not an Indie)

    Space Engineers

    Kerbal Space Program

    Banished

     

    Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.

    Please do not respond to me

  • AeonbladesAeonblades Member Posts: 2,083
    Originally posted by SEANMCAD
    Originally posted by Aeonblades
    Which game(s) are you referring to? I haven't seen a good indie title come out in the genre, but there are some good ones coming up soon supposedly if they pan out.

    Darkfall

    Wurm Online

    Fallen Earth

    EVE (although questionably not an Indie)

    Space Engineers

    Kerbal Space Program

    Banished

     

    Well I guess it's a matter of perspective. I haven't heard of the last 3 to be honest. Darkfall was a pretty decent game in it's hey day. Wurm Online would be better if the community wasn't as hostile and it didn't cater to certain play styles.

    Fallen Earth I haven't played and heard much about either, but it seems to be a love it or hate it game with average reviews. EvE was indie at one point, but the way it's managed now is much more "mainstream" I guess you would call it.

     

    It's definitely a matter of perspective, but I really wouldn't call any of these games better than the AAA options on the market and coming down the pipes in the next year or two. I guess the only indie game, if you could call it that, I'm looking forward to is Camelot Unchained.

    Currently Playing: ESO and FFXIV
    Have played: You name it
    If you mention rose tinted glasses, you better be referring to Mitch Hedberg.

  • SEANMCADSEANMCAD Member EpicPosts: 16,775
    Originally posted by Aeonblades
    Originally posted by SEANMCAD
    Originally posted by Aeonblades
    Which game(s) are you referring to? I haven't seen a good indie title come out in the genre, but there are some good ones coming up soon supposedly if they pan out.

    Darkfall

    Wurm Online

    Fallen Earth

    EVE (although questionably not an Indie)

    Space Engineers

    Kerbal Space Program

    Banished

     

    Well I guess it's a matter of perspective. I haven't heard of the last 3 to be honest. Darkfall was a pretty decent game in it's hey day. Wurm Online would be better if the community wasn't as hostile and it didn't cater to certain play styles.

    Fallen Earth I haven't played and heard much about either, but it seems to be a love it or hate it game with average reviews. EvE was indie at one point, but the way it's managed now is much more "mainstream" I guess you would call it.

     

    It's definitely a matter of perspective, but I really wouldn't call any of these games better than the AAA options on the market and coming down the pipes in the next year or two. I guess the only indie game, if you could call it that, I'm looking forward to is Camelot Unchained.

    oh and I forgot Mount and Blade.

     

    All those games (for me) where much better than the mainstream titles.

    As a side note I dont know why people say what they say about Wurm Community I think its a fine society, I have never had trouble, People giving me stuff even when I ask them not to.

    but to be fair I tend to keep to myself

    Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.

    Please do not respond to me

  • kakasakikakasaki Member UncommonPosts: 1,205
    Originally posted by SEANMCAD

    That is my question.

     

    Not a good question since your premise is subjective and unique to each individual who will reply. For some people, indies aren't much better, for some they are an for most, the answer would be on a game-by-game basis. 

     

    For me, EvE is a good indie game (it was indie when it first came out), if not the best niche/indie game. Darkfall and Fallen Earth in my opinion were duds that were not good indie games.

     

    Hell, might as well start a thread that says "Why is chocolate ice-cream so much better than all other ice cream flavors...

     

     

    A man is his own easiest dupe, for what he wishes to be true he generally believes to be true...

  • ApraxisApraxis Member UncommonPosts: 1,509

    It is as always every sword or coin does have two sides.

    Not all Indies are so much better.. more the contrary.. there is so much more indy garbage, but because it is indy and garbage noone ever hears about it.

    But why are some indies that good? Quite simple.. Indies can do whatever they want.. they are not bound to market research, surveys, or what is trendy at the moment. Most Indies do what they think could be cool and are completely free to do whatever they want.. and that boosts creativity and innovation.. and the result is just more innovative, more creative and often more fun games as you get from AAA developers, which actually do what is already there.

    And you could add to that indy list DayZ, Minecraft, Dwarfen Fortress and endless more.. but as i said already there is a lot of indy garbage noone ever heard off, too.

  • SEANMCADSEANMCAD Member EpicPosts: 16,775
    Originally posted by Reham79
    Originally posted by SEANMCAD

    That is my question.

     

     

    Simple...they are not.

    ah but they are....not only better they are MUCH better.

     

    and yes this is an 'opinion' however given how often it happens and how reliable the predictable model is its looking more like a fact then an opinion

    Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.

    Please do not respond to me

  • MurlockDanceMurlockDance Member Posts: 1,223

    Well first of all, what is an indie? Some games are released by indie devs that get published or bought up by bigger companies like NCSoft or Perfect World, yet the devs are still pretty much independant. Does that count?

    Some game companies grow big over time, like Mythic and CCP or Funcom.

    A lot of the first generation MMOs were released by then-indie devs. Many MMOs by indie devs are really horrible, but the few that are great really shine. So no, I don't really agree that indies are better in general than AAA titles, there are just a few very bright stars amidst smaller, less established developers.

    Playing MUDs and MMOs since 1994.

    image
  • SovrathSovrath Member LegendaryPosts: 26,972
    Originally posted by SEANMCAD
    Originally posted by kakasaki
    Originally posted by SEANMCAD

    That is my question.

     

    Not a good question since your premise is subjective and unique to each individual who will reply. For some people, indies aren't much better, for some they are an for most, the answer would be on a game-by-game basis. 

     

    For me, EvE is a good indie game (it was indie when it first came out), if not the best niche/indie game. Darkfall and Fallen Earth in my opinion were duds that were not good indie games.

     

    Hell, might as well start a thread that says "Why is chocolate ice-cream so much better than all other ice cream flavors...

     

     

    note to everyone on the planet

    when posting on a forum the vast majority of factual comments are understood to be 'in that persons view'.

    we shall never again get our daily lesson on the word subject because someone left out the phrase 'to me'

     

    thanks

    In that case, there is no point to your discussion because they are in your view therefore why ask us?

    How can we debate something that is in "your view" precisely because if it's in your view then nothing we say is going to change it.

    You're welcome




  • SEANMCADSEANMCAD Member EpicPosts: 16,775
    Originally posted by MurlockDance

    Well first of all, what is an indie? Some games are released by indie devs that get published or bought up by bigger companies like NCSoft or Perfect World, yet the devs are still pretty much independant. Does that count?

    Some game companies grow big over time, like Mythic and CCP or Funcom.

    A lot of the first generation MMOs were released by then-indie devs. Many MMOs by indie devs are really horrible, but the few that are great really shine. So no, I don't really agree that indies are better in general than AAA titles, there are just a few very bright stars amidst smaller, less established developers.

    to your question the answer is no.

    1. the funding for the project then comes from the parent company. where a company gets funding is more of a pillar of the word 'indie' then how big the team is.

    2. on average host companies have a habit of completely destroying innovation.

    Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.

    Please do not respond to me

  • SEANMCADSEANMCAD Member EpicPosts: 16,775
    Originally posted by Sovrath
    Originally posted by SEANMCAD
    Originally posted by kakasaki
    Originally posted by SEANMCAD

    That is my question.

     

    Not a good question since your premise is subjective and unique to each individual who will reply. For some people, indies aren't much better, for some they are an for most, the answer would be on a game-by-game basis. 

     

    For me, EvE is a good indie game (it was indie when it first came out), if not the best niche/indie game. Darkfall and Fallen Earth in my opinion were duds that were not good indie games.

     

    Hell, might as well start a thread that says "Why is chocolate ice-cream so much better than all other ice cream flavors...

     

     

    note to everyone on the planet

    when posting on a forum the vast majority of factual comments are understood to be 'in that persons view'.

    we shall never again get our daily lesson on the word subject because someone left out the phrase 'to me'

     

    thanks

    In that case, there is no point to your discussion because they are in your view therefore why ask us?

    How can we debate something that is in "your view" precisely because if it's in your view then nothing we say is going to change it.

    You're welcome

    when you and your girlfriend come out of a movie and she says 'omg that was the best movie ever'

    do you have this debate?

    hint...

    we 

    have

    all

    heard

    it 

    before

    no need to repeat it but perhaps some effort to understand what is being communcated might now be in order instead?

    Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.

    Please do not respond to me

  • flizzerflizzer Member RarePosts: 2,404
    I find the opposite. I generally prefer the big names over the indie titles. 
  • AeonbladesAeonblades Member Posts: 2,083
    Originally posted by SEANMCAD
    Originally posted by Sovrath
    Originally posted by SEANMCAD
    Originally posted by kakasaki
    Originally posted by SEANMCAD

    That is my question.

     

    Not a good question since your premise is subjective and unique to each individual who will reply. For some people, indies aren't much better, for some they are an for most, the answer would be on a game-by-game basis. 

     

    For me, EvE is a good indie game (it was indie when it first came out), if not the best niche/indie game. Darkfall and Fallen Earth in my opinion were duds that were not good indie games.

     

    Hell, might as well start a thread that says "Why is chocolate ice-cream so much better than all other ice cream flavors...

     

     

    note to everyone on the planet

    when posting on a forum the vast majority of factual comments are understood to be 'in that persons view'.

    we shall never again get our daily lesson on the word subject because someone left out the phrase 'to me'

     

    thanks

    In that case, there is no point to your discussion because they are in your view therefore why ask us?

    How can we debate something that is in "your view" precisely because if it's in your view then nothing we say is going to change it.

    You're welcome

    when you and your girlfriend come out of a movie and she says 'omg that was the best movie ever'

    do you have this debate?

    hint...

    we 

    have

    all

    heard

    it 

    before

    no need to repeat it but perhaps some effort to understand what is being communcated might now be in order instead?

    A debate without a willingness to alter your opinion based on other's opinions or information is no longer a debate, it's merely an argument.

    Currently Playing: ESO and FFXIV
    Have played: You name it
    If you mention rose tinted glasses, you better be referring to Mitch Hedberg.

  • MurlockDanceMurlockDance Member Posts: 1,223
    Originally posted by SEANMCAD
    Originally posted by MurlockDance

    Well first of all, what is an indie? Some games are released by indie devs that get published or bought up by bigger companies like NCSoft or Perfect World, yet the devs are still pretty much independant. Does that count?

    Some game companies grow big over time, like Mythic and CCP or Funcom.

    A lot of the first generation MMOs were released by then-indie devs. Many MMOs by indie devs are really horrible, but the few that are great really shine. So no, I don't really agree that indies are better in general than AAA titles, there are just a few very bright stars amidst smaller, less established developers.

    to your question the answer is no.

    1. the funding for the project then comes from the parent company. where a company gets funding is more of a pillar of the word 'indie' then how big the team is.

    2. on average host companies have a habit of completely destroying innovation.

    I think you are wrong on 1. A game company can be indie and be bought up after the game is released by another, bigger company. Look at DAoC. To me that was an indie game because at the time it was released Mythic was small, not really established and called their own shots. They then got bought up by EA.

    Also I think you are confusing publisher with ownership. It is very different if a company is owned by another as compared to being published by another.

    Playing MUDs and MMOs since 1994.

    image
  • AeonbladesAeonblades Member Posts: 2,083

    I give up. Telling people they aren't as intelligent as you is not a way to explain yourself or your position on an issue. Let's get this thread locked up please mods, I think it's just here to start forum drama.

     

    In the meantime, here is some light reading that explains why people think this thread is silly.

     

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illusory_superiority

    Currently Playing: ESO and FFXIV
    Have played: You name it
    If you mention rose tinted glasses, you better be referring to Mitch Hedberg.

  • SEANMCADSEANMCAD Member EpicPosts: 16,775
    Originally posted by MurlockDance
    Originally posted by SEANMCAD
    Originally posted by MurlockDance

    Well first of all, what is an indie? Some games are released by indie devs that get published or bought up by bigger companies like NCSoft or Perfect World, yet the devs are still pretty much independant. Does that count?

    Some game companies grow big over time, like Mythic and CCP or Funcom.

    A lot of the first generation MMOs were released by then-indie devs. Many MMOs by indie devs are really horrible, but the few that are great really shine. So no, I don't really agree that indies are better in general than AAA titles, there are just a few very bright stars amidst smaller, less established developers.

    to your question the answer is no.

    1. the funding for the project then comes from the parent company. where a company gets funding is more of a pillar of the word 'indie' then how big the team is.

    2. on average host companies have a habit of completely destroying innovation.

    I think you are wrong on 1. A game company can be indie and be bought up after the game is released by another, bigger company. Look at DAoC. To me that was an indie game because at the time it was released Mythic was small, not really established and called their own shots. They then got bought up by EA.

    Also I think you are confusing publisher with ownership. It is very different if a company is owned by another as compared to being published by another.

    I think we can disagree with that. I think funding is the critical pillar.

    Its the critical pillar between 'public radio' and welll..everything else (as an example).

    Never the less we can look it up but one thing I have notice for sure is that if a game gets its funding from a company acting like an investor it pretty much goes badly.

    Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.

    Please do not respond to me

  • SEANMCADSEANMCAD Member EpicPosts: 16,775
    Originally posted by Aeonblades

    I give up. Telling people they aren't as intelligent as you is not a way to explain yourself or your position on an issue. Let's get this thread locked up please mods, I think it's just here to start forum drama.

     

    In the meantime, here is some light reading that explains why people think this thread is silly.

     

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illusory_superiority

    I think you are over-reacting and taking it personal when its not.

    I apoligise i didnt mean to offend you

    Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.

    Please do not respond to me

  • SovrathSovrath Member LegendaryPosts: 26,972
    Originally posted by SEANMCAD
     

    when you and your girlfriend come out of a movie and she says 'omg that was the best movie ever'

    do you have this debate?

    hint...

    we 

    have

    all

    heard

    it 

    before

    no need to repeat it but perhaps some effort to understand what is being communcated might now be in order instead?

    I think Aeonblades said it best. Are you open to debate or just looking for an argument?

     




  • AmanaAmana Moderator UncommonPosts: 3,912
    This thread has a title that makes an assumption but you have to present something substantial to discuss, otherwise it comes off as a bait. 

    To give feedback on moderation, contact mikeb@mmorpg.com

This discussion has been closed.