Originally posted by Talemire *shrugs* The idea sounds legit to me. Sure, have the 25/40 man raids, but something long, deep, and challenging for a soloist would be some good alternative fun to be had. Not only that, but it would also sharpen your skills as a player.
How about 1000 quests to upgrade a single item?
You miss the point, the purpose of solo raiding would be having instances that are hard as raiding and can be considered FUN, done when your friends and guildies are not on, when your facing over a week of no raiding or events.
Not grinding quests or mobs like AA point system, but to have something challenging to do while your playing solo end game. I dont simply understand this, its why so many people quite games in the first place. They sit around towns with nothing to do each week but raid 5 hours a week, then have nothing to do to progress any further, so they quit.
I'm sure your friends, your raid buddies, everyone has been at this point in a game when content runs out, then they quit, its actually antisocial not to have something like this in game because people who cannot progress during down time tend not to do anything at all. If you want to keep your friends in game, and raid buddies, this type of system/content would help do that.
I was talking the guy I quoted. You don't speak for him.
The problem is that it is bullshit. What are asking for is the loot. The risk is easier. You don't have to put up with other people. TO MAKE THIS SIMPLE FOR YOU, IT WILL BE A SIMPLE MATTER OF DPS WHEN YOU SOLO. YOU DON'T HAVE TO WORRY SOME SOMEONE ELSE NOT WORKING AS HARD AS YOU. Very control freaky imo.
Also, you will have the luxury of doing it whenever. You don't have to be on the guild schedule of 8pm raids mon/tue/wed only to wait for 4 or 5 guys to travel to get there.
You want it easy no matter how much you try to sell it as hard. It won't be hard if you have the DPS to beat the mobs.
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what
it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience
because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in
the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you
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Originally posted by Knotwood Most games should have Solo Raiding. When content runs dry and you sit in cities for hours on end doing nothing towards end game progression until the next raid, it really sucks. We should have some form of raid for single/solo players that take 1-2 hours to complete and give a reward like a Legendary Upgrade crafting item or something comparable towards end game progression. What do you all think? Should there be solo raiding? Just to clarify:I'm refering to the difficulty level rather then number of players in raiding. Like a one person Titan Extreme mode, or as challenging as raiding is in other games, but lasts for 1-2 hours each solo raid.andNot a reward comparable to a 12 man raid, but a partial reward towards a 12 man raid item drop. Like 1 legendary upgrade crafting item, or a 1/10th currency towards 1 piece of gear from a 12 man raid.
Some people cant see past the end of their noses. If you had this system then "whats the point"? You go to these solo raids to get shinies for what?, To stand in cities and look cool?
What's the point of doing it in a group? To go stand in cities and look cool? Why does being in a group and doing it "social" justify the activity? Why is progression the purview of groups only? That doesn't seem logical to me at all.
Because these "Raid level" items are used as a power leverage to get through and push team based content.Whats a solo player that farms a solo raid @ 1/12 item efficiency per week going to use them for? killing pigs on maggies farm?If they started to make solo raid progression i think you should really start evaluating why you are playing mmorpgs especially considering usually you are farming a lackluster interior level for $15 a month.
That's a huge load. It's only to push team based content because that's the only content made to be engaged by it. Why not make the content scalable. Why is it the power items used to push team based content is allowed to trivialize the rest of the content? The entire premise is arbitrary and subjective.
Because if content was scaleable then it would be essentially a moving goal post. You would never get a head and the illusion of you being a mouse on a wheel would be unveiled.
I still question why you would pay for an mmorpg when you play by yourself. and im not talking about solo vs group here, I'm talking about gear that never reaches its full potential or in your case gear that is negligible because content will always have a static difficulty.
If its for fun, Then there are cheaper and more engaging single player options like say...Diablo that fit the bill much better.
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Originally posted by Talemire *shrugs* The idea sounds legit to me. Sure, have the 25/40 man raids, but something long, deep, and challenging for a soloist would be some good alternative fun to be had. Not only that, but it would also sharpen your skills as a player.
How about 1000 quests to upgrade a single item?
You miss the point, the purpose of solo raiding would be having instances that are hard as raiding and can be considered FUN, done when your friends and guildies are not on, when your facing over a week of no raiding or events.
Not grinding quests or mobs like AA point system, but to have something challenging to do while your playing solo end game. I dont simply understand this, its why so many people quite games in the first place. They sit around towns with nothing to do each week but raid 5 hours a week, then have nothing to do to progress any further, so they quit.
I'm sure your friends, your raid buddies, everyone has been at this point in a game when content runs out, then they quit, its actually antisocial not to have something like this in game because people who cannot progress during down time tend not to do anything at all. If you want to keep your friends in game, and raid buddies, this type of system/content would help do that.
I was talking the guy I quoted. You don't speak for him.
The problem is that it is bullshit. What are asking for is the loot. The risk is easier. You don't have to put up with other people. TO MAKE THIS SIMPLE FOR YOU, IT WILL BE A SIMPLE MATTER OF DPS WHEN YOU SOLO. YOU DON'T HAVE TO WORRY SOME SOMEONE ELSE NOT WORKING AS HARD AS YOU. Very control freaky imo.
Also, you will have the luxury of doing it whenever. You don't have to be on the guild schedule of 8pm raids mon/tue/wed only to wait for 4 or 5 guys to travel to get there.
You want it easy no matter how much you try to sell it as hard. It won't be hard if you have the DPS to beat the mobs.
So your saying a person who spends much more time then you in game should just not get rewarded for playing the game longer then you... that they should just log off because its not considered raiding so they shouldnt progress any further then 5 hours a week like you?
You should've spent all that excess game time making friends so that you could join them and do something relevant. Thats what MMO's are about. They are not about rewarding you for just BEING there, geez.
So your saying a person who spends much more time then you in game should just not get rewarded for playing the game longer then you... that they should just log off because its not considered raiding so they shouldnt progress any further then 5 hours a week like you?
You should've spent all that excess game time making friends so that you could join them and do something relevant. Thats what MMO's are about. They are not about rewarding you for just BEING there, geez.
Its not about having a ton of friends. I know you cannot understand what its like to play 40+ hours a week in an MMORPG or your tune would be much differant. I'll leave it at that. Play for 40+ hours a week and after raiding for 5 hours a week and then having nothing to do 35+ hours a week to progress yourself end game and see if that doesnt make you want to wait for a new game after 3 months straight of that.
Another thing, what does it matter if a person who lets say is a solo player and loves only solo play, if they get end game rewards also for thier chosen playstyle? Maybe they like to hang out with friends casualy. How does it hurt your gameplay that they got a end game reward equal to yours?
Saying that the 38-40% of people who are starving for this kind of content and the 9% who say maybe which means with conditions, seems almost a bit like saying to them.....
Let them eat cake!
And knowing that others could get the same raid gear you earned though 12+ mans at a far slower pace then you sounds nothing more then a princess whos got a pea under the bed, as it does not affect your game exerpience in any way.
So your saying a person who spends much more time then you in game should just not get rewarded for playing the game longer then you... that they should just log off because its not considered raiding so they shouldnt progress any further then 5 hours a week like you?
You should've spent all that excess game time making friends so that you could join them and do something relevant. Thats what MMO's are about. They are not about rewarding you for just BEING there, geez.
Its not about having a ton of friends. I know you cannot understand what its like to play 40+ hours a week in an MMORPG or your tune would be much differant. I'll leave it at that. Play for 40+ hours a week and after raiding for 5 hours a week and then having nothing to do 35+ hours a week to progress yourself end game and see if that doesnt make you want to wait for a new game after 3 months straight of that.
Another thing, what does it matter if a person who lets say is a solo player and loves only solo play, if they get end game rewards also for thier chosen playstyle? Maybe they like to hang out with friends casualy. How does it hurt your gameplay that they got a end game reward equal to yours?
Thats no small amount of assumption there. It's impossible for someone to have a similar experience and have a totally different opinion about it? Bullshit. Ive played plenty of games that many hours a week, its irrelevant. If you're not enjoying your time on the game, you shouldnt be there. You dont just log in and use up server resources and expect to be rewarded for it. You have an issue with game design, these games are designed the way they are for several reasons.
If we leave everything open for the solo player, and give them the ability to do every thing in game. Content will not last. Developers can only make content so fast, and MMO players already go through it at an alarming rate, suddenly take any need to group out of the equation, were not talking 3 months here, you'll be lucky if your game has a lasting appeal of 2 weeks. There needs to be barriers in place to prevent the locusts from swooping in and devouring everything. You cant hold them out forever, but you can put something in their way. Group content stops people like yourself from whinging that there is nothing to do. There is stuff to do, you're just not willing to be flexible and adapt to their program. This is entirely not the developers problem. They dont care if you can do it or not.
It does hurt my gameplay if people are allowed to do anything in game by themselves. Because if this is the case, it means the game design sucks and this game will be FTP in a few months if that. Thats a pretty big gameplay affect your proposal has, on everyone.
So your saying a person who spends much more time then you in game should just not get rewarded for playing the game longer then you... that they should just log off because its not considered raiding so they shouldnt progress any further then 5 hours a week like you?
You should've spent all that excess game time making friends so that you could join them and do something relevant. Thats what MMO's are about. They are not about rewarding you for just BEING there, geez.
Its not about having a ton of friends. I know you cannot understand what its like to play 40+ hours a week in an MMORPG or your tune would be much differant. I'll leave it at that. Play for 40+ hours a week and after raiding for 5 hours a week and then having nothing to do 35+ hours a week to progress yourself end game and see if that doesnt make you want to wait for a new game after 3 months straight of that.
Another thing, what does it matter if a person who lets say is a solo player and loves only solo play, if they get end game rewards also for thier chosen playstyle? Maybe they like to hang out with friends casualy. How does it hurt your gameplay that they got a end game reward equal to yours?
Saying that the 38-40% of people who are starving for this kind of content and the 9% who say maybe which means with conditions, seems almost a bit like saying to them.....
Let them eat cake!
And knowing that others could get the same raid gear you earned though 12+ mans at a far slower pace then you sounds nothing more then a princess whos got a pea under the bed, as it does not affect your game exerpience in any way.
All of this arguing about group vs solo is pointless in ESO from what we know so far. All options at end game will earn you veteran points and the ability to buy/earn the best gear.
Solo players will have two factions to play through at level cap with all 50+ and 50++ mobs to battle. This will be ALL the other faction quests, caves, dungeons, story and so on. By the time you finish all 3 factions, there should be more content added.
You will earn skill points, veteran points, high level drops and so on with all options. Elite dungeon runs with 4 man groups, 50+/50++ solo/duo play (or grouping for the group content in each faction), Adventure zones for up to 12 players (if they are in at launch), and PvP. Plus crafting will be able to make the best gear and change end game drops to get what you want.
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So your saying a person who spends much more time then you in game should just not get rewarded for playing the game longer then you... that they should just log off because its not considered raiding so they shouldnt progress any further then 5 hours a week like you?
You should've spent all that excess game time making friends so that you could join them and do something relevant. Thats what MMO's are about. They are not about rewarding you for just BEING there, geez.
Its not about having a ton of friends. I know you cannot understand what its like to play 40+ hours a week in an MMORPG or your tune would be much differant. I'll leave it at that. Play for 40+ hours a week and after raiding for 5 hours a week and then having nothing to do 35+ hours a week to progress yourself end game and see if that doesnt make you want to wait for a new game after 3 months straight of that.
Another thing, what does it matter if a person who lets say is a solo player and loves only solo play, if they get end game rewards also for thier chosen playstyle? Maybe they like to hang out with friends casualy. How does it hurt your gameplay that they got a end game reward equal to yours?
Thats no small amount of assumption there. It's impossible for someone to have a similar experience and have a totally different opinion about it? Bullshit. Ive played plenty of games that many hours a week, its irrelevant. If you're not enjoying your time on the game, you shouldnt be there. You dont just log in and use up server resources and expect to be rewarded for it. You have an issue with game design, these games are designed the way they are for several reasons.
If we leave everything open for the solo player, and give them the ability to do every thing in game. Content will not last. Developers can only make content so fast, and MMO players already go through it at an alarming rate, suddenly take any need to group out of the equation, were not talking 3 months here, you'll be lucky if your game has a lasting appeal of 2 weeks. There needs to be barriers in place to prevent the locusts from swooping in and devouring everything. You cant hold them out forever, but you can put something in their way. Group content stops people like yourself from whinging that there is nothing to do. There is stuff to do, you're just not willing to be flexible and adapt to their program. This is entirely not the developers problem. They dont care if you can do it or not.
It does hurt my gameplay if people are allowed to do anything in game by themselves. Because if this is the case, it means the game design sucks and this game will be FTP in a few months if that. Thats a pretty big gameplay affect your proposal has, on everyone.
You say, "If your not enojying your time on game, you shouldnt be there."
Isnt that what this post is about? Putting a feature in game so that it is enjoyable for more pople to have enjoyment in THIER OWN PLAYSTYLES?
You also say, "If we leave everything open for the solo player, and give them the ability to do every thing in game. Content will not last. Developers can only make content so fast, and MMO players already go through it at an alarming rate"
The whole point of having a solo system like this is so players can timesync into content that is fun and keep them wanting to do this content beause of how rewarding it is.
You say, " Developers can only make content so fast, and MMO players already go through it at an alarming rate, suddenly take any need to group out of the equation, were not talking 3 months here, you'll be lucky if your game has a lasting appeal of 2 weeks"
What good is the need to group if it has no rewards towards end game? Wheres the carrot at the end of the stick to do solo/group dungeons, the system I propose fixes this problem by making solo/group raid instances keep players end game progressing in a more enjoyable atmosphere then grinding mobs and quests or sitting around down nothing. If we dont have systems for every gameplay style, we ultimatly give these types of players reasons to walk away from the game, which ultimatly takes away players to group with and raid with.
You say, " Group content stops people like yourself from whinging that there is nothing to do. There is stuff to do, you're just not willing to be flexible and adapt to their program."
What your saying is people who are not willing to conform to other playstyles then the one they want to use at end game should be FORCED to play other ways? That seems like the opposite of enjoyment, and is a good reason for someone to walk froma game. If you could keep those people in game by allowing end game progression to thier gameplay style, then wouldnt you have actually kept subscribers that basicly would have quite otherwise?
You say, "It does hurt my gameplay if people are allowed to do anything in game by themselves. Because if this is the case, it means the game design sucks and this game will be FTP in a few months if that. Thats a pretty big gameplay affect your proposal has, on everyone."
I think this is more of a personal problem and feeling rather then something that is real hard evidence that it hurts your gameplay that others get the same kind of rewards you do for choosing alternative gameplay styles then you.
I dont know mate, you talk a lot about designing games enjoyable by everyone, this simply isnt possible. It doesnt matter if your gameplay infringes on mine or not, if the game is not already designed to be "enjoyable" by you, then why bother at all? You do have to be flexible when playing any game, theres no such thing as a game designed specifically to anyones will, unless you payed and had it designed yourself.
To me raiders are one playstyle, and they are signifigant enough in MMOs that it behooves a company to cater to them, as well as the solo player (which I am). As one raider has pointed out, you can not scale content that was designed to be difficult for a group of 12-24 people and suddenly have it be as difficult, but still possible, for a singe person. It will never happen because its ridiculous. If the level of difficulty is not there, or it is not feasible, then no a solo player should not get the same rewards. You're assuming two things with your whole "log in for 5 hours and get paid" logic. You're assuming that entering a raid automatically guarantees success, it does not. And you're assuming if it is successful, you are guaranteed suitable reward, which is often not the case. It may be profitable for only one member of that raid and no more.
You cant compare the amount of effort and risk with their time that a raider takes to a safe night of grinding solo mobs or questing which in most games has almost no possibility of failure. Its all risk vs reward. The raider is risking their time that they may get the job done, and that they may get a roll at suitable loot. If you are not willing to throw your hat into that mix and gamble with your time for the possibility of getting said loot, I see no reason why you should get some equivalent. Solo play=no risk. Not all time spent is worth the same, thats just logic.
Originally posted by Stizzled The amount of people who voted 'yes' blows my mind.
MMOs struggle with the concept of difficulty. It is contrary to the freedom typically offered (if I want to be a giant rogue, then why can't I be? this encounter is technically impossible for a dwarven priest... I've got an axe of dragon slaying +24, lol onyxia).
In some ways the thread could be seen as an appeal to the 'MMO gods' to look at how to make something truly difficult rather than to actually create a 1 player raid.
One idea might be to 'borrow' the draft format from card games...
- you are in a dream - you get to pick a class, and get placed as a level 1 in a randomly generated dungeon with a choice of 8 random armour/weapons. Killing a mob gives you a level up - dying ends the crawl.
- the PvP variant. You do that in an arena, each opponent is chosen based on their win/loss ratio. 3 losses and you are out.
(the idea is to test a player's skill/knowledge rather than following 'chapter 4 of IGN's guide' or 'farming for the axe of dragon slaying')
Most games should have Solo Raiding. When content runs dry and you sit in cities for hours on end doing nothing towards end game progression until the next raid, it really sucks. We should have some form of raid for single/solo players that take 1-2 hours to complete and give a reward like a Legendary Upgrade crafting item or something comparable towards end game progression. What do you all think? Should there be solo raiding?
Just to clarify:
I'm refering to the difficulty level rather then number of players in raiding. Like a one person Titan Extreme mode, or as challenging as raiding is in other games, but lasts for 1-2 hours each solo raid.
and
Not a reward comparable to a 12 man raid, but a partial reward towards a 12 man raid item drop. Like 1 legendary upgrade crafting item, or a 1/10th currency towards 1 piece of gear from a 12 man raid.
I think we should take a vote to see if people like you should even be allowed to make nonsense post like this of course it only goes to show you since you only been on this site for about 20 days. Yet in that short of time you seem to have 172 post and judging by this post I think it is safe to say the rest are probably a bunch of nonsense too. Here's some advice think before you go and create such a wacky post like this. Lol
Originally posted by KnotwoodThis time around its a TES MMORPG, so yes you will have single player rpg fans coming to this game by the millions, we should atleast consider this aspect of the game. Like they added first person view for this game, adding solo raiding would be nice for all the single players coming to the game and mmo solo/group players who have waited a long time to have this.
Why a TES fan would want to pay 15/month to play SOLO raid when he could just choose one of the hundred (thousand?) FREE mods for Skyrim instead ?
Originally posted by Knotwood Most games should have Solo Raiding. When content runs dry and you sit in cities for hours on end doing nothing towards end game progression until the next raid, it really sucks. We should have some form of raid for single/solo players that take 1-2 hours to complete and give a reward like a Legendary Upgrade crafting item or something comparable towards end game progression. What do you all think? Should there be solo raiding? Just to clarify:I'm refering to the difficulty level rather then number of players in raiding. Like a one person Titan Extreme mode, or as challenging as raiding is in other games, but lasts for 1-2 hours each solo raid.andNot a reward comparable to a 12 man raid, but a partial reward towards a 12 man raid item drop. Like 1 legendary upgrade crafting item, or a 1/10th currency towards 1 piece of gear from a 12 man raid.
Some people cant see past the end of their noses. If you had this system then "whats the point"? You go to these solo raids to get shinies for what?, To stand in cities and look cool?
What's the point of doing it in a group? To go stand in cities and look cool? Why does being in a group and doing it "social" justify the activity? Why is progression the purview of groups only? That doesn't seem logical to me at all.
Because these "Raid level" items are used as a power leverage to get through and push team based content.
Whats a solo player that farms a solo raid @ 1/12 item efficiency per week going to use them for? killing pigs on maggies farm?
If they started to make solo raid progression i think you should really start evaluating why you are playing mmorpgs especially considering usually you are farming a lackluster interior level for $15 a month.
No ofcourse not hes going to use it in AvA just like you but he dont want to get it doing group content and dont mind not getting it right away instead spending more time to aquire it
I cant help it but everytime i read soloraiding, it turns a smile on my face... I am sorry, but just had to share this with you... Asuming others allready explained the OP the true meaning of a raid..
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This is one of the more idiotic things I have read. Solo raiding? What's next? Group solo content? Sorry but this just makes no sense. One person can't be a raid. It's a contradiction of terms. Besides, there is 50+ and 50++ content for solo play which will be very challenging so that should satiate whatever desires you have for solo content.
Raid 1.sudden attack: a sudden attack made by soldiers, aircraft, police, bandits, or any other force in an attempt to seize or destroy something
I think the OP understands what it means. it's others who think that the word Raid was invented by gamers that don't have a clue.
I think you made my point exactly...notice the PLURAL in your own quoted definition...there is no such thing as "solo" in that...thank you for making my point!
Most games should have Solo Raiding. When content runs dry and you sit in cities for hours on end doing nothing towards end game progression until the next raid, it really sucks. We should have some form of raid for single/solo players that take 1-2 hours to complete and give a reward like a Legendary Upgrade crafting item or something comparable towards end game progression. What do you all think? Should there be solo raiding?
Just to clarify:
I'm refering to the difficulty level rather then number of players in raiding. Like a one person Titan Extreme mode, or as challenging as raiding is in other games, but lasts for 1-2 hours each solo raid.
and
Not a reward comparable to a 12 man raid, but a partial reward towards a 12 man raid item drop. Like 1 legendary upgrade crafting item, or a 1/10th currency towards 1 piece of gear from a 12 man raid.
A mode that is similar to World of Warcrafts Proving Grounds just as an entire solo experience which is / gets very tough? Any time of the day. Since I can not (yet) clone and form a whole elitist army of myself that functions the way I do, I take that option anytime of the day!
After they get done inventing solo raiding, i'd like them to also add solo Cyrodil PvP - ya know, where i can participate in massive sieges with other players, only without the other players.
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Raid 1.sudden attack: a sudden attack made by soldiers, aircraft, police, bandits, or any other force in an attempt to seize or destroy something
I think the OP understands what it means. it's others who think that the word Raid was invented by gamers that don't have a clue.
I think you made my point exactly...notice the PLURAL in your own quoted definition...there is no such thing as "solo" in that...thank you for making my point!
I would say rambo is a perfect solo-raider, any other force could be a single person and only plural in that is soldiers and bandits if a cop can do it solo why cant a magic wielding teso char?
That doesn't even make sense. The entire challenge of a raid is coordinating a number of people to do a number of complicated things. How can you make a raid challenging for one person in a modern MMO? There is only so much one character can do.
Not to mention that further removing the MM from MMO is idiotic.
Comments
I was talking the guy I quoted. You don't speak for him.
The problem is that it is bullshit. What are asking for is the loot. The risk is easier. You don't have to put up with other people. TO MAKE THIS SIMPLE FOR YOU, IT WILL BE A SIMPLE MATTER OF DPS WHEN YOU SOLO. YOU DON'T HAVE TO WORRY SOME SOMEONE ELSE NOT WORKING AS HARD AS YOU. Very control freaky imo.
Also, you will have the luxury of doing it whenever. You don't have to be on the guild schedule of 8pm raids mon/tue/wed only to wait for 4 or 5 guys to travel to get there.
You want it easy no matter how much you try to sell it as hard. It won't be hard if you have the DPS to beat the mobs.
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Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"
Because if content was scaleable then it would be essentially a moving goal post.
You would never get a head and the illusion of you being a mouse on a wheel would be unveiled.
I still question why you would pay for an mmorpg when you play by yourself. and im not talking about solo vs group here, I'm talking about gear that never reaches its full potential or in your case gear that is negligible because content will always have a static difficulty.
If its for fun, Then there are cheaper and more engaging single player options like say...Diablo that fit the bill much better.
TSW - AoC - Aion - WOW - EVE - Fallen Earth - Co - Rift - || XNA C# Java Development
You should've spent all that excess game time making friends so that you could join them and do something relevant. Thats what MMO's are about. They are not about rewarding you for just BEING there, geez.
Its not about having a ton of friends. I know you cannot understand what its like to play 40+ hours a week in an MMORPG or your tune would be much differant. I'll leave it at that. Play for 40+ hours a week and after raiding for 5 hours a week and then having nothing to do 35+ hours a week to progress yourself end game and see if that doesnt make you want to wait for a new game after 3 months straight of that.
Another thing, what does it matter if a person who lets say is a solo player and loves only solo play, if they get end game rewards also for thier chosen playstyle? Maybe they like to hang out with friends casualy. How does it hurt your gameplay that they got a end game reward equal to yours?
Saying that the 38-40% of people who are starving for this kind of content and the 9% who say maybe which means with conditions, seems almost a bit like saying to them.....
Let them eat cake!
And knowing that others could get the same raid gear you earned though 12+ mans at a far slower pace then you sounds nothing more then a princess whos got a pea under the bed, as it does not affect your game exerpience in any way.
Thats no small amount of assumption there. It's impossible for someone to have a similar experience and have a totally different opinion about it? Bullshit. Ive played plenty of games that many hours a week, its irrelevant. If you're not enjoying your time on the game, you shouldnt be there. You dont just log in and use up server resources and expect to be rewarded for it. You have an issue with game design, these games are designed the way they are for several reasons.
If we leave everything open for the solo player, and give them the ability to do every thing in game. Content will not last. Developers can only make content so fast, and MMO players already go through it at an alarming rate, suddenly take any need to group out of the equation, were not talking 3 months here, you'll be lucky if your game has a lasting appeal of 2 weeks. There needs to be barriers in place to prevent the locusts from swooping in and devouring everything. You cant hold them out forever, but you can put something in their way. Group content stops people like yourself from whinging that there is nothing to do. There is stuff to do, you're just not willing to be flexible and adapt to their program. This is entirely not the developers problem. They dont care if you can do it or not.
It does hurt my gameplay if people are allowed to do anything in game by themselves. Because if this is the case, it means the game design sucks and this game will be FTP in a few months if that. Thats a pretty big gameplay affect your proposal has, on everyone.
All of this arguing about group vs solo is pointless in ESO from what we know so far. All options at end game will earn you veteran points and the ability to buy/earn the best gear.
Solo players will have two factions to play through at level cap with all 50+ and 50++ mobs to battle. This will be ALL the other faction quests, caves, dungeons, story and so on. By the time you finish all 3 factions, there should be more content added.
You will earn skill points, veteran points, high level drops and so on with all options. Elite dungeon runs with 4 man groups, 50+/50++ solo/duo play (or grouping for the group content in each faction), Adventure zones for up to 12 players (if they are in at launch), and PvP. Plus crafting will be able to make the best gear and change end game drops to get what you want.
How many people long for that "past, simpler, and better world," I wonder, without ever recognizing the truth that perhaps it was they who were simpler and better, and not the world about them?
R.A.Salvatore
You say, "If your not enojying your time on game, you shouldnt be there."
Isnt that what this post is about? Putting a feature in game so that it is enjoyable for more pople to have enjoyment in THIER OWN PLAYSTYLES?
You also say, "If we leave everything open for the solo player, and give them the ability to do every thing in game. Content will not last. Developers can only make content so fast, and MMO players already go through it at an alarming rate"
The whole point of having a solo system like this is so players can timesync into content that is fun and keep them wanting to do this content beause of how rewarding it is.
You say, " Developers can only make content so fast, and MMO players already go through it at an alarming rate, suddenly take any need to group out of the equation, were not talking 3 months here, you'll be lucky if your game has a lasting appeal of 2 weeks"
What good is the need to group if it has no rewards towards end game? Wheres the carrot at the end of the stick to do solo/group dungeons, the system I propose fixes this problem by making solo/group raid instances keep players end game progressing in a more enjoyable atmosphere then grinding mobs and quests or sitting around down nothing. If we dont have systems for every gameplay style, we ultimatly give these types of players reasons to walk away from the game, which ultimatly takes away players to group with and raid with.
You say, " Group content stops people like yourself from whinging that there is nothing to do. There is stuff to do, you're just not willing to be flexible and adapt to their program."
What your saying is people who are not willing to conform to other playstyles then the one they want to use at end game should be FORCED to play other ways? That seems like the opposite of enjoyment, and is a good reason for someone to walk froma game. If you could keep those people in game by allowing end game progression to thier gameplay style, then wouldnt you have actually kept subscribers that basicly would have quite otherwise?
You say, "It does hurt my gameplay if people are allowed to do anything in game by themselves. Because if this is the case, it means the game design sucks and this game will be FTP in a few months if that. Thats a pretty big gameplay affect your proposal has, on everyone."
I think this is more of a personal problem and feeling rather then something that is real hard evidence that it hurts your gameplay that others get the same kind of rewards you do for choosing alternative gameplay styles then you.
On that note, have a good night. See you in beta!
I dont know mate, you talk a lot about designing games enjoyable by everyone, this simply isnt possible. It doesnt matter if your gameplay infringes on mine or not, if the game is not already designed to be "enjoyable" by you, then why bother at all? You do have to be flexible when playing any game, theres no such thing as a game designed specifically to anyones will, unless you payed and had it designed yourself.
To me raiders are one playstyle, and they are signifigant enough in MMOs that it behooves a company to cater to them, as well as the solo player (which I am). As one raider has pointed out, you can not scale content that was designed to be difficult for a group of 12-24 people and suddenly have it be as difficult, but still possible, for a singe person. It will never happen because its ridiculous. If the level of difficulty is not there, or it is not feasible, then no a solo player should not get the same rewards. You're assuming two things with your whole "log in for 5 hours and get paid" logic. You're assuming that entering a raid automatically guarantees success, it does not. And you're assuming if it is successful, you are guaranteed suitable reward, which is often not the case. It may be profitable for only one member of that raid and no more.
You cant compare the amount of effort and risk with their time that a raider takes to a safe night of grinding solo mobs or questing which in most games has almost no possibility of failure. Its all risk vs reward. The raider is risking their time that they may get the job done, and that they may get a roll at suitable loot. If you are not willing to throw your hat into that mix and gamble with your time for the possibility of getting said loot, I see no reason why you should get some equivalent. Solo play=no risk. Not all time spent is worth the same, thats just logic.
MMOs struggle with the concept of difficulty. It is contrary to the freedom typically offered (if I want to be a giant rogue, then why can't I be? this encounter is technically impossible for a dwarven priest... I've got an axe of dragon slaying +24, lol onyxia).
In some ways the thread could be seen as an appeal to the 'MMO gods' to look at how to make something truly difficult rather than to actually create a 1 player raid.
One idea might be to 'borrow' the draft format from card games...- you are in a dream - you get to pick a class, and get placed as a level 1 in a randomly generated dungeon with a choice of 8 random armour/weapons. Killing a mob gives you a level up - dying ends the crawl.
- the PvP variant. You do that in an arena, each opponent is chosen based on their win/loss ratio. 3 losses and you are out.
(the idea is to test a player's skill/knowledge rather than following 'chapter 4 of IGN's guide' or 'farming for the axe of dragon slaying')
I think we should take a vote to see if people like you should even be allowed to make nonsense post like this of course it only goes to show you since you only been on this site for about 20 days. Yet in that short of time you seem to have 172 post and judging by this post I think it is safe to say the rest are probably a bunch of nonsense too. Here's some advice think before you go and create such a wacky post like this. Lol
Why a TES fan would want to pay 15/month to play SOLO raid when he could just choose one of the hundred (thousand?) FREE mods for Skyrim instead ?
This isn't a signature, you just think it is.
No ofcourse not hes going to use it in AvA just like you but he dont want to get it doing group content and dont mind not getting it right away instead spending more time to aquire it
Erm...arnt there things called quests?
Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)
I think you made my point exactly...notice the PLURAL in your own quoted definition...there is no such thing as "solo" in that...thank you for making my point!
A mode that is similar to World of Warcrafts Proving Grounds just as an entire solo experience which is / gets very tough? Any time of the day. Since I can not (yet) clone and form a whole elitist army of myself that functions the way I do, I take that option anytime of the day!
"Id rather work on something with great potential than on fulfilling a promise of mediocrity."
- Raph Koster
Tried: AO,EQ,EQ2,DAoC,SWG,AA,SB,HZ,CoX,PS,GA,TR,IV,GnH,EVE, PP,DnL,WAR,MxO,SWG,FE,VG,AoC,DDO,LoTRO,Rift,TOR,Aion,Tera,TSW,GW2,DCUO,CO,STO
Favourites: AO,SWG,EVE,TR,LoTRO,TSW,EQ2, Firefall
Currently Playing: ESO
I would say rambo is a perfect solo-raider, any other force could be a single person and only plural in that is soldiers and bandits if a cop can do it solo why cant a magic wielding teso char?
That doesn't even make sense. The entire challenge of a raid is coordinating a number of people to do a number of complicated things. How can you make a raid challenging for one person in a modern MMO? There is only so much one character can do.
Not to mention that further removing the MM from MMO is idiotic.