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All "exclusive" content disgust me

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  • Cephus404Cephus404 Member CommonPosts: 3,675
    Originally posted by Flyte27
    Originally posted by Neo_Liberty
    Originally posted by Flyte27
     

    As I said in the previous point I don't buy items in game.  I feel I have some valid points against this type of transaction in games.  It's not whining to say something against that which you believe is wrong.  Regardless of if other people are too stupid to care.

    Just because ppl don't agree with you, it doesn't make them stupid.... Are you stupid for not understanding people have differing opinions?

    People are stupid.  It's why they go and buy McDonalds even though they know it's bad for them.  Yes I am also stupid because I do stupid things all the time.  Probably my stupidest thing is playing games at all and yet I still love it.  Probably like a smoker loves to smoke.  Some things are pretty obviously just a money suck.

    So you think it's your job to protect people from their own "stupidity"?  Seriously?

    Played: UO, EQ, WoW, DDO, SWG, AO, CoH, EvE, TR, AoC, GW, GA, Aion, Allods, lots more
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  • nariusseldonnariusseldon Member EpicPosts: 27,775
    Originally posted by Flyte27
    The main problem is the intrusion of real life in the game and trying to nickle and dime people.  It seems today that people feel it's OK to try and milk every penny they can get out of other people.  To me trying to get people to spend their money in a cash shop should be illegal. 

    Why isn't it ok? If some whales want to spend money to subsidize my game, what is not ok about it? It is not like the devs are holding a gun to their heads.

    And i don't see how devs can milk me when i am playing MMOs for free.

     

  • CazNeergCazNeerg Member Posts: 2,198

    Originally posted by Flyte27

    I still think it's a bad mechanic.  It's good for the developers, but it's not good for the consumer.  Games are a form of escapism like other entertainment.  Eating food is not. 

    Eating something is a necessity.  Eating a peppered bison steak with gruyere mashed potatoes cooked in truffle oil, with a dessert of imported gelato and a fifty year old bottle of scotch is all entertainment expense.  In pretty much any category of product or service, people who are willing to pay more are able to obtain a superior experience.  Why should gaming be an exception?

    Originally posted by gobla

    But to take your restaurant example,

    I don't get mad when someone else pops a 100 dollar bottle of wine, heck I'll order one myself. Fine wine is something you should pay for.

    I do get mad when the restaurant charges me for tap water, I consider that basic hospitality, which should be part of the meal I'm already paying for, and if a restaurant is incapable of giving me that I'll take my patronage elsewhere.

    I'm not against all exclusive content, but in subscription MMOs I am very much against a lot of it, especially things like races. I consider that part of the subscription I'm already paying and basic hospitality of the company towards their customers. If they're incapable of providing that then I'll also take my patronage elsewhere.

    It's not charging for tap water, everybody gets that free with the price of the meal, and it's equivalent in games.  But restaurants do charge for Perrier or San Pellegrino, if you want high falutin' water, so why shouldn't games do the same?

    Originally posted by Flyte27

     I'm trying to stick up for people and make them realize micro transactions are bad for everyone and is wasting their money.  I guess I should just be silent and let them all do what they want with their money. 

    A given use of money is only a waste if the person who spent it feels like it is a waste.  Value is relative, not absolute.  The only people you are "sticking up for" are people who think that everything in a game should be included in the subscription fee, or the box fee, or the free experience, whichever the base option in a game is, *even if* that means there ends up being less total content offered than there is if the developer is allowed to charge extra for some of it.  

    A lot of us prefer a system where the developer can charge however they want, because we understand that that means we will have the option of getting lots of different things which otherwise might never make it into the games at all.  And we will also have the option of not getting them. I have yet to see something offered as a pre-order bonus, collector's edition bonus, or cash shop item that has ever been in any way *necessary* to progress through or enjoy a game.

    Peace is a lie, there is only passion.
    Through passion, I gain strength.
    Through strength, I gain power.
    Through power, I gain victory.
    Through victory, my chains are broken.
    The Force shall free me.

  • goblagobla Member UncommonPosts: 1,412
    Originally posted by CazNeerg

    Originally posted by gobla

    But to take your restaurant example,

    I don't get mad when someone else pops a 100 dollar bottle of wine, heck I'll order one myself. Fine wine is something you should pay for.

    I do get mad when the restaurant charges me for tap water, I consider that basic hospitality, which should be part of the meal I'm already paying for, and if a restaurant is incapable of giving me that I'll take my patronage elsewhere.

    I'm not against all exclusive content, but in subscription MMOs I am very much against a lot of it, especially things like races. I consider that part of the subscription I'm already paying and basic hospitality of the company towards their customers. If they're incapable of providing that then I'll also take my patronage elsewhere.

    It's not charging for tap water, everybody gets that free with the price of the meal, and it's equivalent in games.  But restaurants do charge for Perrier or San Pellegrino, if you want high falutin' water, so why shouldn't games do the same?

    Except the Imperial race isn't any more or less special than the other races. It's been a standard race that's always been present in the series. If the other races are included in the base price then the Imperials should be too, because they're not a special 'mineral' race that's somehow exclusive and different than the rest.

    It's a standard Elder Scrolls race. That should be part of the standard Elder Scrolls fare, the monthly sub I'd be paying.

    Hell, if it was a Dremora race that's not been traditionally part of the series I might consider that argument to have some weight. That would be special. But the Imperials simply aren't.

    Now taking them away for lore reasons I didn't like but I can accept, just like I might get that say a Turkish restaurant might not serve all the sauces I'm used to because they don't fit into the style.

    But putting it behind a paywall? I simply consider that rude and I've no desire to spend my money on a company that treats it's customers like that if it's easily avoidable, which in this case it luckily is.

    We are the bunny.
    Resistance is futile.
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  • SirPKsAlotSirPKsAlot Member Posts: 224
    I don't get it. It cost money to create the "exclusive content" so they are getting a return on their investment. It's a business not a charity. What am I missing here? Get a job and pay for it :D

    image
    Currently playing: Eldevin Online as a Deadly Assassin

  • timidobservertimidobserver Member UncommonPosts: 246
    Originally posted by night_gamer

    I understand that gaming is a business, but I am so tired of exclusive content, and really drives me back from MMO's especially ones what maybe i will like to play.

    - WoW - exclusive collectors stuff and events like blizzcon and all no more unbtinable items, mounts, pets, tittle.

    - SWTOR - huge amount of exclusive items

    - GW2 - i guess they got some including "digital collectors" ha

    - the list can continue, i am to disgusted to research or write more

    and now I've seen ESO exclusive imperials??? Ahaha.. 

     

    Now, if some one want to say, "this don't matter, just play the game", I will ask him nicely to STFU, because, we (MMO or not) - RPG player play for those things, we like to collect stuff, that one of the reason why we play RPG games in general.

     

    State of current mmo gaming = big failure, and running after money only. Disgusting.

    You say that you understand that gaming is a business, but you don't seem to mean that. I do believe that gamebreaking/balance impacting exclusive content should be avoided. However, I can't blame game developers for rewarding the people that financially support them.

    I do not buy cash shop garage and I do not buy collectors additions, but I don't have an issue with those that do being rewarded for it. Nobody is making a game for you to play for free. The ultimate goal is always profit. 

  • RawasaRawasa Member UncommonPosts: 37

    there are 2 commodities when it comes to games... 1. Real Life Money>in which you can buy items that would require some length of  time to acquire in-game therefore getting items in a shorter time frame.

    2.Time>in which you can spend time in-game (grinding or progression wise) getting the same items as above.

    games nowadays you have the ability to buy exclusive items in which you can spend a million hours in-game and you would never be able to acquire the said items. NEVER that's what it means. This is where there is an issue....if its not acquirable in-game then it should not be sold for Money. Doesn't matter if the items take 1000 hours to obtain, its still obtainable.

     

    Time or Money: either way you get the item. Your choice. Fair.

    Not the Bullshit you get nowadays.

  • AlBQuirkyAlBQuirky Member EpicPosts: 7,387

    I'm with you, OP. Exclusive Items will have me "excluding" that game from my playtime.

    Who cares where you purchase the game (GameStop, EBB, whatever), MY money is the same as everyone else's. Why do THEY get extra content that I don't get?

    Exclusivity is a cancer on the gaming community. It feeds egos and divides players that should be grouping together in a fun, common, entertainment activity.

    - Al

    Personally the only modern MMORPG trend that annoys me is the idea that MMOs need to be designed in a way to attract people who don't actually like MMOs. Which to me makes about as much sense as someone trying to figure out a way to get vegetarians to eat at their steakhouse.
    - FARGIN_WAR


  • GestankfaustGestankfaust Member UncommonPosts: 1,989

    All I see is that most posting don't remember the day when this stuff wasn't offered. In the beginning, we got what we killed for. No shop to be extra stuff.

     

    So I see why some hate it. Even if it's cosmetic...most don't offer a way to get it except for real money. GW2 can say they get away with it because they have no sub. Then the gold to gem ratio tanks early on...and it only real money that can afford it. Just seems anti economy to me.

     

    That's the problem...seems like two economies to me. The "earn it in game" economy, and the "buy it outright" economy.

     

    Makes gaming feel different to me. Less immersive to me

    "This may hurt a little, but it's something you'll get used to. Relax....."

  • AlBQuirkyAlBQuirky Member EpicPosts: 7,387


    Originally posted by Sk1ppeR
    Gw2's collector edition contained a CD with handpicked soundtracks (not all of them), a book, a map and a figure of Rytlock. As in in-game goods you get heroic band (which is weaker than a level 20 ring fair and square) and some useless skill that nobody is using. Idk about exclusivity ^^ EDIT: Just checked the pack. They also give you 3 armor skins to choose from which you can obtain in 4 other different ways. The armors themselves are not all that great
    Out of game items, I could not care less about. That is acceptable in my opinion. In game items are a whole other story.

    Collector's Editions should have statues, CDs, posters, and other cool items that a consumer can display in real life. It should NEVER contain exclusive in game content. Never.

    With the ever present cash shops, though, I guess this is to be expected...

    - Al

    Personally the only modern MMORPG trend that annoys me is the idea that MMOs need to be designed in a way to attract people who don't actually like MMOs. Which to me makes about as much sense as someone trying to figure out a way to get vegetarians to eat at their steakhouse.
    - FARGIN_WAR


  • timidobservertimidobserver Member UncommonPosts: 246
    I don't get why people think that those that financial support a game should get nothing for it. I can understand the mindset that no significant/insurmountable in-game advantage should be given, but I am all for rewarding those that shovel money over to greedy gaming companies with in-game and out-of-game rewards. I know that I certainly am not giving them any more of my money than I certainly have to.
  • maplestonemaplestone Member UncommonPosts: 3,099
    Originally posted by timidobserver
    I don't get why people think that those that financial support a game should get nothing for it. I can understand the mindset that no significant/insurmountable in-game advantage should be given, but I am all for rewarding those that shovel money over to greedy gaming companies with in-game and out-of-game rewards. I know that I certainly am not giving them any more of my money than I certainly have to.

    It's a game, a fantasy disconnected from reality.   A player trying to play with real money makes as much sense to me as a player trying to play using real weapons.

     

  • timidobservertimidobserver Member UncommonPosts: 246
    Originally posted by maplestone
    Originally posted by timidobserver
    I don't get why people think that those that financial support a game should get nothing for it. I can understand the mindset that no significant/insurmountable in-game advantage should be given, but I am all for rewarding those that shovel money over to greedy gaming companies with in-game and out-of-game rewards. I know that I certainly am not giving them any more of my money than I certainly have to.

    It's a game, a fantasy disconnected from reality.   A player trying to play with real money makes as much sense to me as a player trying to play using real weapons.

     

    Whether it makes sense to give these people extra money is irrelevant. I personally think it is insane to buy collectors editions or burn money in cash shops, but I don't have an issue with rewarding those that do. A game that doesn't make money shuts down. My only sticking point is that significant in-game advantage should not be available for purchase, but other than that, I don't care.

  • DibdabsDibdabs Member RarePosts: 3,104
    Originally posted by night_gamer

    ...i am to disgusted to research or write more

    You're obviously very young.  Save your disgust for important things, when you're a bit older.

  • maplestonemaplestone Member UncommonPosts: 3,099
    Originally posted by timidobserver
    Originally posted by maplestone
    Originally posted by timidobserver
    I don't get why people think that those that financial support a game should get nothing for it. I can understand the mindset that no significant/insurmountable in-game advantage should be given, but I am all for rewarding those that shovel money over to greedy gaming companies with in-game and out-of-game rewards. I know that I certainly am not giving them any more of my money than I certainly have to.

    It's a game, a fantasy disconnected from reality.   A player trying to play with real money makes as much sense to me as a player trying to play using real weapons.

     

    Whether it makes sense to give these people extra money is irrelevant. I personally think it is insane to buy collectors editions or burn money in cash shops, but I don't have an issue with rewarding those that do. A game that doesn't make money shuts down. My only sticking point is that significant in-game advantage should not be available for purchase, but other than that, I don't care.

    That's a perfectly opinion to have, unless you're trying to attract me as a customer. 

  • Kevyne-ShandrisKevyne-Shandris Member UncommonPosts: 2,077
    Originally posted by night_gamer

    I understand that gaming is a business, but I am so tired of exclusive content, and really drives me back from MMO's especially ones what maybe i will like to play.

    - WoW - exclusive collectors stuff and events like blizzcon and all no more unbtinable items, mounts, pets, tittle.

    After reading how Blizzard the company operates -- http://www.glassdoor.com/Reviews/Blizzard-Entertainment-Reviews-E24858.htm -- that's how they compensate within the company itself.

     

    I'm glad MMORPG.com had Mark Kern as a commentator, as his firing from Red 5 let me to that site, and my suspicions about Blizzard's operations were confirmed, but in a whole different light. :/

     

    Wow.

  • timidobservertimidobserver Member UncommonPosts: 246
    Originally posted by maplestone
    Originally posted by timidobserver
    Originally posted by maplestone
    Originally posted by timidobserver
    I don't get why people think that those that financial support a game should get nothing for it. I can understand the mindset that no significant/insurmountable in-game advantage should be given, but I am all for rewarding those that shovel money over to greedy gaming companies with in-game and out-of-game rewards. I know that I certainly am not giving them any more of my money than I certainly have to.

    It's a game, a fantasy disconnected from reality.   A player trying to play with real money makes as much sense to me as a player trying to play using real weapons.

     

    Whether it makes sense to give these people extra money is irrelevant. I personally think it is insane to buy collectors editions or burn money in cash shops, but I don't have an issue with rewarding those that do. A game that doesn't make money shuts down. My only sticking point is that significant in-game advantage should not be available for purchase, but other than that, I don't care.

    That's a perfectly opinion to have, unless you're trying to attract me as a customer. 

    Makes sense, people are extremely entitled these days.  I guess I am realistic, so the idea that a business would try to make money doesn't surprise me. I don't really care what kind of incentives they put out there to give them money as long as they don't go the Pay2Win route with the game.

    I like regular content updates, and those occur when the game is making money. 

  • Kevyne-ShandrisKevyne-Shandris Member UncommonPosts: 2,077
    Originally posted by timidobserver
    Makes sense, people are extremely entitled these days.

    As they should be -- it's called shopping. Looking for the best deals, on the best products.

     

    IT companies never had to do business like brick and mortar stores do, and it's a rude awakening.

  • timidobservertimidobserver Member UncommonPosts: 246
    Originally posted by Kevyne-Shandris
    Originally posted by timidobserver
    Makes sense, people are extremely entitled these days.

    As they should be -- it's called shopping. Looking for the best deals, on the best products.

     

    IT companies never had to do business like brick and mortar stores do, and it's a rude awakening.

     

    I guess I shop differently. A high quality F2P game is always good, but  overall, I have had a much better experience with subscription MMOs than I have with F2P. GW2, for example, has devolved into bi-weekly cash shop scams. A new crappy story, cut and paste updates every day weeks along with new rare cash shop items. They go away in 2 weeks, so you better get them now! They turned Lion's Arch into a War Zone, and are now charging people 12 bucks to get into a ship with the same stuff that Lion's Arch had. Basically, I guess I am doing well enough financially, that I don't mind paying for a decent product. That way, the game can focus on content as opposed to figure out new ways to try to get money out of me. 

    Anyway, back to the topic at hand, I only care about the degree of in-game advantages that can be bought. If someone gets some stupid skin or some stupid race with minimal functional advantages that I don't for paying 70 bucks, good for them. 

     

    EDIT: I understand that the subscription model is more or less dead. With the devaluing of the dollar and the fluctuating economy and poor job market, people just aren't willing to pay a set fee for a game monthly anymore. I am just stating that I have had a more enjoyable experience when paying a sub. I enjoyed SWTOR significantly more when it was sub. Their F2P, nickel and dime you to death system isn't fun. 

  • Kevyne-ShandrisKevyne-Shandris Member UncommonPosts: 2,077
    Originally posted by timidobserver
    Originally posted by Kevyne-Shandris
    Originally posted by timidobserver
    Makes sense, people are extremely entitled these days.

    As they should be -- it's called shopping. Looking for the best deals, on the best products.

     

    IT companies never had to do business like brick and mortar stores do, and it's a rude awakening.

     

    I guess I shop differently. A high quality F2P game is always good, but  overall, I have had a much better experience with subscription MMOs than I have with F2P. GW2, for example, has devolved into bi-weekly cash shop scams. A new crappy story, cut and paste updates every day weeks along with new rare cash shop items. They go away in 2 weeks, so you better get them now! They turned Lion's Arch into a War Zone, and are now charging people 12 bucks to get into a ship with the same stuff that Lion's Arch had. Basically, I guess I am doing well enough financially, that I don't mind paying for a decent product. That way, the game can focus on content as opposed to figure out new ways to try to get money out of me. 

    Anyway, back to the topic at hand, I only care about the degree of in-game advantages that can be bought. If someone gets some stupid skin or some stupid race with minimal functional advantages that I don't for paying 70 bucks, good for them. 

     

    EDIT: I understand that the subscription model is more or less dead. With the devaluing of the dollar and the fluctuating economy and poor job market, people just aren't willing to pay a set fee for a game monthly anymore. I am just stating that I have had a more enjoyable experience when paying a sub. I enjoyed SWTOR significantly more when it was sub. Their F2P, nickel and dime you to death system isn't fun. 

    Shopping is about perceived value.

     

    Some buyers have A preference (e.g., variety of items); other buyers B preference of quality (e.g., items are made well); then yet another group of buyers it's all about prices itself (e.g., the dollar shoppers).

     

    There's no "right" preference, but it IS still a preference to be reckon with, though.

  • AlBQuirkyAlBQuirky Member EpicPosts: 7,387


    Originally posted by timidobserver
    I don't get why people think that those that financial support a game should get nothing for it. I can understand the mindset that no significant/insurmountable in-game advantage should be given, but I am all for rewarding those that shovel money over to greedy gaming companies with in-game and out-of-game rewards. I know that I certainly am not giving them any more of my money than I certainly have to.
    I have backed 2 games through Kickstarter. I don't "expect" anything but the games when they release (I pledged 70 and 75 to them). I don't need, want, or even EXPECT little pixelated pieces of data to "reward" me for supporting them.

    Unlike many players today, I do not live on my PC, so data is NOT a reward in my eyes. This fascination with data has gotten way out of hand, in my opinion. There are LOTS of other ways to spend money that could help homeless, hungry, or otherwise needy people that actually NEED a hand. Look there if you just HAVE to spend your cash. Data is a waste of money.

    - Al

    Personally the only modern MMORPG trend that annoys me is the idea that MMOs need to be designed in a way to attract people who don't actually like MMOs. Which to me makes about as much sense as someone trying to figure out a way to get vegetarians to eat at their steakhouse.
    - FARGIN_WAR


  • timidobservertimidobserver Member UncommonPosts: 246
    Originally posted by AlBQuirky

     


    Originally posted by timidobserver
    I don't get why people think that those that financial support a game should get nothing for it. I can understand the mindset that no significant/insurmountable in-game advantage should be given, but I am all for rewarding those that shovel money over to greedy gaming companies with in-game and out-of-game rewards. I know that I certainly am not giving them any more of my money than I certainly have to.

    I have backed 2 games through Kickstarter. I don't "expect" anything but the games when they release (I pledged 70 and 75 to them). I don't need, want, or even EXPECT little pixelated pieces of data to "reward" me for supporting them.

     

    Unlike many players today, I do not live on my PC, so data is NOT a reward in my eyes. This fascination with data has gotten way out of hand, in my opinion. There are LOTS of other ways to spend money that could help homeless, hungry, or otherwise needy people that actually NEED a hand. Look there if you just HAVE to spend your cash. Data is a waste of money.

    I didn't say you should expect anything, so your whole post is beside my point. My point was that I don't see the issue with rewarding people that financially support a game, not that those people should expect a reward.

     

  • AlBQuirkyAlBQuirky Member EpicPosts: 7,387


    Originally posted by timidobserver

    Originally posted by AlBQuirky

    Originally posted by timidobserver
    I don't get why people think that those that financial support a game should get nothing for it. I can understand the mindset that no significant/insurmountable in-game advantage should be given, but I am all for rewarding those that shovel money over to greedy gaming companies with in-game and out-of-game rewards. I know that I certainly am not giving them any more of my money than I certainly have to.
    I have backed 2 games through Kickstarter. I don't "expect" anything but the games when they release (I pledged 70 and 75 to them). I don't need, want, or even EXPECT little pixelated pieces of data to "reward" me for supporting them.Unlike many players today, I do not live on my PC, so data is NOT a reward in my eyes. This fascination with data has gotten way out of hand, in my opinion. There are LOTS of other ways to spend money that could help homeless, hungry, or otherwise needy people that actually NEED a hand. Look there if you just HAVE to spend your cash. Data is a waste of money.
    I didn't say you should expect anything, so your whole post is beside my point. My point was that I don't see the issue with rewarding people that financially support a game, not that those people should expect a reward.
    You are correct. I apologize for that. I think I got some posts mixed up...

    - Al

    Personally the only modern MMORPG trend that annoys me is the idea that MMOs need to be designed in a way to attract people who don't actually like MMOs. Which to me makes about as much sense as someone trying to figure out a way to get vegetarians to eat at their steakhouse.
    - FARGIN_WAR


  • nariusseldonnariusseldon Member EpicPosts: 27,775
    Originally posted by maplestone
     

    It's a game, a fantasy disconnected from reality.   A player trying to play with real money makes as much sense to me as a player trying to play using real weapons.

     

    It makes perfect sense to the devs when they can fleece whales and make tons of money. It is also pretty good evidence that many don't really care about immersion that much, as long as the game is fun.

     

  • DauzqulDauzqul Member RarePosts: 1,982
    Originally posted by night_gamer

    I understand that gaming is a business, but I am so tired of exclusive content, and really drives me back from MMO's especially ones what maybe i will like to play.

    - WoW - exclusive collectors stuff and events like blizzcon and all no more unbtinable items, mounts, pets, tittle.

    - SWTOR - huge amount of exclusive items

    - GW2 - i guess they got some including "digital collectors" ha

    - the list can continue, i am to disgusted to research or write more

    and now I've seen ESO exclusive imperials??? Ahaha.. 

     

    Now, if some one want to say, "this don't matter, just play the game", I will ask him nicely to STFU, because, we (MMO or not) - RPG player play for those things, we like to collect stuff, that one of the reason why we play RPG games in general.

     

    State of current mmo gaming = big failure, and running after money only. Disgusting.

     

    I 100% agree.

     

    All items should be 100% obtainable through in-game effort.

     

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