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Gaming Companies Have Gone Too Far

stealthbrstealthbr Member UncommonPosts: 1,054

With the recent announcement made by ZeniMax regarding its upcoming title, The Elder Scrolls Online, it has become evident that companies are making use of methods that I personally believe to be entirely disrespectful to the gaming populace that invests money into this form of entertainment. I simply can't fathom how they believe charging $80 is fair in order to experience all the game has to offer, especially considering it charges $15 monthly with its subscription model, and will most likely have future expansions that cost $40. In fact, if they are charging an additional $20 for a new race, what then becomes the point of charging a subscription fee? Not only is this setting a precedent for others to begin charging more for a complete game, it is confirming that content, like additional races, will be present in The Elder Scrolls Online cash-shop instead of being provided as updates for paying a subscription.

Am I advocating simply not purchasing the game? No, The Elder Scrolls Online has its flaws and merits just like any other title and every factor must be considered when deciding whether or not to purchase it. However, I do believe that unless gamers want $80 (this is merely a symbolic value) for a complete game to become the norm, then at least some form of complaint from the media and from the customers themselves must be made regarding the absurdity of this.

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Comments

  • HelleriHelleri Member UncommonPosts: 930

    That doesn't seem really outrageous to me. I mean titles releasing for $60.00-$70.00 USD that don't have the expansiveness that this game seems to are not uncommon. And, a lot of monthly subs are well over $15.00 USD a month (and are only $15.00 USD or less on entry level or discounted subscription, limited offers).

     

    If  the game is going to actually give us all of Tamriel, that will make it significantly larger then the worlds of most MMORPG to date (I haven't stayed very caught up on TESO info since it's e3 announcement). And, if we have the level of content per game space that oblivion or skyrim has. It doesn't really seem like an unfair price. Also, anything regarding future expansions (especially the supposed price of them) seems highly speculative at this point.

     

    Could the OP provide a link to the announcement referenced  please?

     

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  • NildenNilden Member EpicPosts: 2,899
    I think the real absurdity here is people lapping this up like kittens at a saucer of warm milk.

    "You CAN'T buy ships for RL money." - MaxBacon

    "classification of games into MMOs is not by rational reasoning" - nariusseldon

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  • Homuhomu69Homuhomu69 Member UncommonPosts: 151

    get a job, ya hippies :)

    but seriously, I have never heard enthusiasts of any other activity (gaming) complain so much about the costs. In relation to JUST ABOUT EVERY OTHER HOBBY, gaming is pretty damn cheap. Let's say, for example, you pay $80 for ESO and play it for 3 months. The first month is included, so that's $110 for 3 months, or $1.22/day. You can't even buy a cup of coffee for that. MMO gamers are very jaded. And I'm not trying to troll here, I just think we need to put things into perspective. They spent 200 million dollars making this game, that's not chump change. 

  • HelleriHelleri Member UncommonPosts: 930
    Originally posted by nilden
    I think the real absurdity here is people lapping this up like kittens at a saucer of warm milk.

    If w'ere being honest, than TESO is a fan service, lol...it's there to be lapped at. but online I am seeing locked in pre-orders as low as $60.00. Personally I am looking at the PC The Elder Scrolls Online Imperial Edition, that comes with the statue, the book, nice case and a map ($99.00)....actually I think ima go ahead and pre-order on that lol. I wantz da shiniez

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  • stealthbrstealthbr Member UncommonPosts: 1,054
    Originally posted by discord235

    get a job, ya hippies :)

    but seriously, I have never heard enthusiasts of any other activity (gaming) complain so much about the costs. In relation to JUST ABOUT EVERY OTHER HOBBY, gaming is pretty damn cheap. Let's say, for example, you pay $80 for ESO and play it for 3 months. The first month is included, so that's $110 for 3 months, or $1.22/day. You can't even buy a cup of coffee for that. MMO gamers are very jaded. And I'm not trying to troll here, I just think we need to put things into perspective. They spent 200 million dollars making this game, that's not chump change. 

    First of all, it is not about the specific value: $80. I can easily afford it. My headphones alone cost over $1000. It is about the fact that they are withholding actual content, unless you pay a premium. It's like when Mass Effect charged for a DLC when the game wasn't even released yet. Furthermore, other hobbies and the costs associated with them have absolutely nothing to do with the topic at hand. Are you trying to say that because having a boat costs thousands of dollars that gamers shouldn't complain that prices are evidently rising? I hope you see the flaw in your reasoning. Also, the whole argument about it costing 200 million is pointless, considering most of that is offered in the Standard Edition. What is alarming is the fact that a game that charges a box price, a subscription, will probably have paid expansions, is also charging for new races which are not simply cosmetic. How can they justify maintaining the subscription model when they charge even more for additional content?

  • MalltrakMalltrak Member UncommonPosts: 17

    Yes! Oh and every car should include all the same features all at one price so that it's  fare to everyone who wants that car!

    Computer/cellphone all technology needs to stop selling devices with different storage amounts! It should all always be the exact same amount!

    You know what every taco should only ever come WITH cheese because we are paying for a taco I dont want to pay extra to have the full taco experience!

  • HelleriHelleri Member UncommonPosts: 930
    What would be unfair is if the The Elder Scrolls Online Imperial Edition, with all that commemorative stuff was the only option and it cost $99.00 USD. Because that would cut out people who can't afford it. At least they are giving several options and coming out on virtually all relative platforms (being available to you no matter what device you play on in itself costs a ton of money and is rarely a wise decision for an MMORPG that wants to actually make a buck). I think this is the kind of thing you only get to rant about if they go F2P after raking it in on box sales.

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  • stealthbrstealthbr Member UncommonPosts: 1,054
    Originally posted by Malltrak

    Yes! Oh and every car should include all the same features all at one price so that it's  fare to everyone who wants that car!

    Computer/cellphone all technology needs to stop selling devices with different storage amounts! It should all always be the exact same amount!

    You know what every taco should only ever come WITH cheese because we are paying for a taco I dont want to pay extra to have the full taco experience!

    With this logic, Rockstar should have priced GTA V at over $100.

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon Member EpicPosts: 27,771
    Originally posted by Helleri
    What would be unfair is if the The Elder Scrolls Online Imperial Edition, with all that commemorative stuff was the only option and it cost $99.00 USD. Because that would cut out people who can't afford it. I think this is the kind of thing you only get to rant about if they go F2P after raking it in on box sales.

    What is so unfair? It is their product. You don't have to buy it. It is just a computer game, it is not a necessity of life. If you can't afford it, don't play it .. watch a movie, or watch tv instead.

    They are under no obligation to make computer games affordable to everyone.

     

  • DalanonDalanon Member UncommonPosts: 126

    I don't mind the cosmetic stuff offered in upgrade packages, but I'm not sure what some of the digital stuff being offered here is so hard to say.  Don't know if the maps, mount, or crafting stuff would really give you an overpowering edge or not.

    Not all who wander are lost...

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  • HelleriHelleri Member UncommonPosts: 930
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by Helleri
    What would be unfair is if the The Elder Scrolls Online Imperial Edition, with all that commemorative stuff was the only option and it cost $99.00 USD. Because that would cut out people who can't afford it. I think this is the kind of thing you only get to rant about if they go F2P after raking it in on box sales.

    What is so unfair? It is their product. You don't have to buy it. It is just a computer game, it is not a necessity of life. If you can't afford it, don't play it .. watch a movie, or watch tv instead.

    They are under no obligation to make computer games affordable to everyone.

     

    You misread me entirely; or you are agreeing with everything I said, in a way that seems like it's something somehow opposite of what I said. I don't understand your reply.

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  • stealthbrstealthbr Member UncommonPosts: 1,054
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by Helleri
    What would be unfair is if the The Elder Scrolls Online Imperial Edition, with all that commemorative stuff was the only option and it cost $99.00 USD. Because that would cut out people who can't afford it. I think this is the kind of thing you only get to rant about if they go F2P after raking it in on box sales.

    What is so unfair? It is their product. You don't have to buy it. It is just a computer game, it is not a necessity of life. If you can't afford it, don't play it .. watch a movie, or watch tv instead.

    They are under no obligation to make computer games affordable to everyone.

     

    Yea! Screw the customers! Who needs them anyway? Narrius, you should be appointed CEO with your enormous brilliance and administrative skills!

  • MalltrakMalltrak Member UncommonPosts: 17
    Originally posted by stealthbr
    Originally posted by Malltrak

    Yes! Oh and every car should include all the same features all at one price so that it's  fare to everyone who wants that car!

    Computer/cellphone all technology needs to stop selling devices with different storage amounts! It should all always be the exact same amount!

    You know what every taco should only ever come WITH cheese because we are paying for a taco I dont want to pay extra to have the full taco experience!

    With this logic, Rockstar should have priced GTA V at over $100.

    Obviously missed the point.....

    Most products come with more then 1 version, you can pay more for extras.

    How about 129.99?

    http://www.gamestop.com/xbox-360/games/grand-theft-auto-v-gamestop-exclusive-collectors-edition/109637

  • AzahothAzahoth Member Posts: 7


    Are you new mmorpgs or something? I have no interest in this game whatsoever  but I don't have  enough digits to count the number of times other games have done this... why single out this game in particular?

  • HelleriHelleri Member UncommonPosts: 930
    Originally posted by stealthbr
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by Helleri
    What would be unfair is if the The Elder Scrolls Online Imperial Edition, with all that commemorative stuff was the only option and it cost $99.00 USD. Because that would cut out people who can't afford it. I think this is the kind of thing you only get to rant about if they go F2P after raking it in on box sales.

    What is so unfair? It is their product. You don't have to buy it. It is just a computer game, it is not a necessity of life. If you can't afford it, don't play it .. watch a movie, or watch tv instead.

    They are under no obligation to make computer games affordable to everyone.

     

    Yea! Screw the customers! Who needs them anyway? Narrius, you should be appointed CEO with your enormous brilliance and administrative skills!

    Okay just to be clear. I was saying that if this: http://www.gamestop.com/pc/games/the-elder-scrolls-online-imperial-edition/113688 were the only option. That would be something to actually object to. because it would cut out a lot of people from playing. And I was also saying that I thinks it's admirable that they have so many options in price, level of content, and platform...Seems like they are actually going out of their way a bit, to make it more available to more people.

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  • nariusseldonnariusseldon Member EpicPosts: 27,771
    Originally posted by stealthbr
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by Helleri
    What would be unfair is if the The Elder Scrolls Online Imperial Edition, with all that commemorative stuff was the only option and it cost $99.00 USD. Because that would cut out people who can't afford it. I think this is the kind of thing you only get to rant about if they go F2P after raking it in on box sales.

    What is so unfair? It is their product. You don't have to buy it. It is just a computer game, it is not a necessity of life. If you can't afford it, don't play it .. watch a movie, or watch tv instead.

    They are under no obligation to make computer games affordable to everyone.

     

    Yea! Screw the customers! Who needs them anyway? Narrius, you should be appointed CEO with your enormous brilliance and administrative skills!

    nah .. i have no interests of producing video games with flicky demand, and uncertain costs. Plus, it is too much work.

    (and yeah, who needs the bad customers, you have not heard that Sprint has cut off bad customers?)

  • HelleriHelleri Member UncommonPosts: 930
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by stealthbr
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by Helleri
    What would be unfair is if the The Elder Scrolls Online Imperial Edition, with all that commemorative stuff was the only option and it cost $99.00 USD. Because that would cut out people who can't afford it. I think this is the kind of thing you only get to rant about if they go F2P after raking it in on box sales.

    What is so unfair? It is their product. You don't have to buy it. It is just a computer game, it is not a necessity of life. If you can't afford it, don't play it .. watch a movie, or watch tv instead.

    They are under no obligation to make computer games affordable to everyone.

     

    Yea! Screw the customers! Who needs them anyway? Narrius, you should be appointed CEO with your enormous brilliance and administrative skills!

    nah .. i have no interests of producing video games with flicky demand, and uncertain costs. Plus, it is too much work.

    (and yeah, who needs the bad customers, you have not heard that Sprint has cut off bad customers?)

    They wanted to actually hear pins drop?

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  • MargulisMargulis Member CommonPosts: 1,614
    I agree with the OP - and it will continue down this path indefinitely as long as people support and defend business practices like this.  And it's clear plenty of people still do defend and support decisions like this from what I've seen around the net today.  In all honesty it's the consumers that are really to blame for this, because they keep buying into company rhetoric and supporting / defending this sort of practice - so businesses are going to keep pushing the boundaries.
  • MargulisMargulis Member CommonPosts: 1,614
    Originally posted by Azahoth


    Are you new mmorpgs or something? I have no interest in this game whatsoever  but I don't have  enough digits to count the number of times other games have done this... why single out this game in particular?

    Actually it seems you're pretty new if you think this is common practice for a P2P + SUB model mmo

  • stealthbrstealthbr Member UncommonPosts: 1,054
    Originally posted by greenreen

    I don't understand the outrage or the bother of this completely.

    Ok, so everyone can't be an Imperial and can't play in all factions but what these editions tell us is that they have thought about it. They thought that those things would be valuable to players. Perhaps they actually read what people were asking for -- then gave it to them. So the complaint is - you listened to me and boxed what I wanted for a price? Just the fact that people want these things adds value to the box price of an upgrade instead of the standard fare - a pet.

    Why exactly can't the Imperials be included in the original box price like every other race that people wanted and got then?

    There is no reason not to charge a larger amount for more perks at the start of the game. There is also nothing that says those changes can't become part of the game itself over-time. What you should learn from this is that they have coded it in to be possible. Naturally, after you can't pre-order either they will add it into an expansion setting or content updates. They expect to be on a 4-6 week release schedule for content. Something like this is perfect to add down the road. The early payers get it first, once new players come who can't purchase it, they have it grandfathered in. If they don't add it in then after a year there might be only 4 imperials left or something. It really depends on how important playing an imperial is to you and how long you stay in the game. The point is, if they have something already coded - it makes sense to open it up to all saying - here you go, new content in form of this new race (new to you) though you may have played alongside them.

    This is entirely speculative. There is no way to affirm that, down the road, the Imperial race will be made for free as an update.

    Having these "traitor" races in different factions will make them all the more useful. I'm calling them traitors for this but only because it's short and it implies difference. Imagine being only one of 50 or something of your race type in the entire faction. Now, everyone looks to you for grouping for your particular skills which are slightly different. It has the ability to make some people really stand out. Imagine if you are leading a group with a character that is a traitor in that faction, everyone can clearly see you as different on the screen.

    As for Imperial itself, what's the drama mama - Skyrim already lets my Argonian become sided with Imperials so I don't see the hubbub. It's not even a cooler or odd thing (that would make it a selling point). It's a boring human. I'm a human and so are you, big woop, 2 arms 2 legs etc. nothing spectacular.

    I would love to see your point of view if they were charging for Argonians then, instead of the Imperials.

    Then there is an XP bonus for you and a friend. Uh, ok, you want to rush to end-game and play alone. Go ahead and hurry. This is no different than people who will barely sleep the week of release and get an advantage I won't have. Let them do it if they like. They would also be the first to complain there isn't enough content for them in any game if they want to use it up at a rabbit's pace.

    They have a white mount. Cool but the increase speed thing I read to mean you won't be walking - not your mount will be the fastest in existence. There were already comments made that what you feed your mount will change the abilities of it. What do you bet that one of them is speed. There aren't a lot of other things the thing does for you other than movement.

    A bonus treasure map - small perk. Eventually anything static for all players (especially hidden) will be searchable in online databases so you might not have the knowledge day 1 but it will become available.

    Vanity mounts, xp boosts, and the like I see no problem with. Actual races with different skill lines, crafting, and more? That crosses the line.

     

  • stealthbrstealthbr Member UncommonPosts: 1,054
    Originally posted by Margulis
    I agree with the OP - and it will continue down this path indefinitely as long as people support and defend business practices like this.  And it's clear plenty of people still do defend and support decisions like this from what I've seen around the net today.  In all honesty it's the consumers that are really to blame for this, because they keep buying into company rhetoric and supporting / defending this sort of practice - so businesses are going to keep pushing the boundaries.

    Exactly. Before you know it, we will see MMO's that have a standard edition, and a premium edition that adds PvP or another major feature.

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  • HelleriHelleri Member UncommonPosts: 930
    I think I know why the Op is mad.

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  • KatillaKatilla Member UncommonPosts: 813
    not like not having the imperial race is going to affect your game experience, don't be so spoiled.
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