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so much potential

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  • TibernicuspaTibernicuspa Member UncommonPosts: 1,199
    This game would have been better off as a singleplayer game with COOP. Which was its original design.
  • Pekish79Pekish79 Member Posts: 91

    Agreed the world is absolutely not an open world and yes it's a pitty because i like open world

    but even if i love open world (wow style) my favorite game end up beeing always very instanced

    DDO super instanced AOC instanced and now TSW instanced

     

     

    I guess when you do mostly PVP it doesn't matter that much if is open or not (too open you end up meeting too few people to fight)

    i remember in AOC i was in kashetta (was that the name of the desert area lvl80?) hunting for player to fight near the gate or near the city and it was kind of slow already.

     

     

    Open world are really challenging to do "right" for many reason once you need a lot of people to make them entrataining you really have to give people a reason to move around and don't use teleport without bore them to death... because walking around is boring we all want super duper sprint or teleport!

     

    Other problem is that technically having 20?30?40 player on the screen is still a challenge for many pc, no matter what you think that devs are lazy that they dont know how to code true is it's very challenging or they would have already done it right turst me they dont enjoy to make it wrong.

     

    So as much as i love open world i dont think it works right now and yes i know DAOC had 80/160 player on screen but if some game come out with DAOC graphic i am sorry to say but i wont get it i am a graphic whore and i like pretty things.

    I tryed Darkfall and Mortal and i couldn't stand the graphic (personally i hate the graphic of FFXIV and GW2 as well but that is a personal taste i kinda of dont like those fluffy comic looking thing... and i am hating already Wildstar... i just hope black desert or EQnext are not too flashy)

     

    for some weird reason i really loved DDO grapich and no it wasnt my first MMO i played DAOC+WOW+Ryzom+Eve way before then DDO

  • VenedVened Member UncommonPosts: 71
    Originally posted by Pekish79

     

    tsw 3th because healer are out of control too many bad player reroll healer because is the only class that even if u sux real bad u wont do terrible

    a dps that sux die in 1 second and everybody know he sux

    a tank that sux is useless and after 2 time u are aware that he sux

    It's tru at start, but leater healer is the hardest role. In the beggining heal is just spam of fist HoTs, and nice finishers. Easy. But leater healer should use leech heals, and watch for LoS for both defensive and offensive targets. And this is very hard time. 

    IMO easiest way is the tank way. Few passives,  few impairs and  good start for AoE farming. 

  • Pekish79Pekish79 Member Posts: 91

    so why nobody play tank easiest class if effective is always ALWAYS the most played (especially by new player trying to fit in but weird enough they all play healer or dps)

    like when Riposte was big u had match with 3 tanks (and tons of tank noobs) now u see 1 or zero tank and there is a reason

    so i dont agree with that

     

    Healer is "hard" to play if:

    a) you are 1 healer per group of 5 << very hard and fun/challenging

    b) you fight premade versus premade

     

    too bad this never happen

    premade always fight pug and people bring 2 healer per group that make healing absolutely lame (in fusang u even see group of 5 with 3 helaers!!!)

     

    so yeah per se Healing is not "too easy" but it becames to easy due to the fact that the game is VERY CASUAL (no premade nore ranked) and the fact that everybody and his dog play healer 

    with 2/3 healer u can cast 1 active heal elite (no range no los no target) every 15/22second very challenging yep yep

    my cat can play healer like that especially vs pug that doesnt even have enough DPS to kill 1 healer alone

     

    sorry but healer ruined TSW PVP not tank (tank was ruining it perhaps at riposte time...but it got fixed back in 1.4)

  • Another_FanAnother_Fan Member UncommonPosts: 48
    Originally posted by Pekish79

    best combat in MMO to date

    1) DDO (but is mostly pve so it's hard to really judge it)

    2) AOC

    3) TSW

     

    What made AoC work for you ? I tried that game and it felt like I was using a large fish as a weapon.

     

  • Crazy_StickCrazy_Stick Member Posts: 1,059
    Originally posted by stvnkrs10

    I bought this game before launch and wanted it so much to be what it could have been. Concept = awesome! I still am glued to walking dead. Graphics and world appeal = Awesome! Quests and interactivity = Awesome! 

     

    The problem is in the combat. It was so choppy and forced feeling it drove me out. Has it been improved? I wan't to play this game more than most out there, but the combat is so bad, I just can't. 

     

    Did anyone else get this feeling?

     

    If only a dev would read this and put some time in to revamping the feel of combat.

     

    I agree OP, that's what killed it for me. I hated the character development system and combat while just loving the writing and story, overall concepts etc. I also credit them for having some of the best dungeons in the business but that combat was too grindy and choppy while character development was too tool box rather than RPG identity for me. Crafting was another low. But while it wasn't for me the quality of the work they did in writing, story, everything else is awesome. I still want them to succeed as their was real potential and talent there that so many games lack today and I admire that.

  • VincerKadenVincerKaden Member UncommonPosts: 457

    I have absolutely no problem with the combat. I can build exactly the type of character I want and then turn around and change it entirely when I want to try something else. There are plenty of stats and gear to satisfy my need to tinker and squeeze out extra numbers in the combat logs. Why I like that level of detail is that it forces me to make decisions: stack stats up, distribute evenly, focus on survivability or try to reduce the time to kill. The animations aren't the best quality as modern games go, but I hardly notice once I get going.

     

    I'm of the opinion that most people who trash the animations are just looking for an excuse to slam the game. It's beautiful otherwise. I can't remember too many MMOs where the animations were that great anyway. Some of the action-oriented ones are alright (Tera and DCUO), but it's the same deal: once you get going in combat, none of that matters.

    image

  • VincerKadenVincerKaden Member UncommonPosts: 457
    Originally posted by Another_Fan
    Originally posted by Pekish79

    best combat in MMO to date

    1) DDO (but is mostly pve so it's hard to really judge it)

    2) AOC

    3) TSW

     

    What made AoC work for you ? I tried that game and it felt like I was using a large fish as a weapon.

     

    I'll answer that from my perspective. AoC's combat was in my face. I had to make decisions quickly and be prepared. I couldn't just follow a rotation per se. I'd have a methodology in mind but the defensive aspects to combat would change that in real time. In short, AoC combat prevented me from just mailing it in. I found it to be the complete opposite of a game like SWTOR (for the trooper anyway) where the combat was extremely linear and predictable.

    image

  • Pekish79Pekish79 Member Posts: 91

    Except combo skipping that proved once again how player are always lame and try to cheat everytime they can... and blaming the devs that cannot fix a bug... (but not blaming themselves for use it)

     

    the combat in AOC was very mobile and directional , hit from back always max damage

    (it gave you a reason to try to go on the back of the enemy quite realistic trying to find a opening in their defense)

    not only as melee u didn't really have a target your swing was hitting everything on the way 

    (again quite realistic when i swing a sword vs 3 enemy i just don't hit the enemy i intend to (target) but whoever in on  the path of the blade)

    I didn't particuarly love the combo i find them interesting but i think they were better developed in DDO 

     

    but i like how some combo had big finisher left some other big finisher up some other right so if u knew u could have tried to have big finisher left being on the left side of the enemy in order to emulate a hit on the back and do full damage not mitigated

    because the protection was  left-up(front)-right so if u were on the left side of the enemy his shield were only up(left) right(front) as left(back) was un-shielded

     

    AOC had the best combat so far of PVP mmorpg (DDO was only pve) TSW is good but lack positioning (even if very very mobile) u are in front you are left you are right you are back of the enemy your hit is exactly the same no point in trying to see an opening to go on the back other then avoid cone attack or single target attack

     

  • GrummusGrummus Member UncommonPosts: 136

    Combat

    Graphics

    Questing

    Environment

    Writing

     

    Were all top notch, it just didn't have enough to keep me there after I did, saw, killed almost everything in a week. The idea of just going back to the newbie area and starting the same quest I'd just done over again turned me off entirely. I felt it was worth it for the good week of top notch story and overall gameplay though.

  • Pekish79Pekish79 Member Posts: 91

    one week?????!?!?!?!?

    dear lord how much do you play?

     

    i done all quest and i mean all and the side quest too and they are at least 400+ quest including side quest

    i doubt a human being can do that in 1 week but hey if u skip 70% of the quest only do the main story and once u get to the end u said why is so short... i doubt we can blame devs for that

  • dylan32dylan32 Member Posts: 15

    I'm thinking of coming back over the Christmas period.  My character is still in the early stages of the third campaign.

     

    Combat never bothered me, but I was playing a caster, so there were no attacks which simulated physical contact.  But, I can see why it bothers many.

    The character development was the nail for me.  There was just no sense of progression or development.  Just buy skills to complete the wheel, even though I'll never use them because I stick with the same few skill setups throughout the whole game (one with DD/leach heal, one for AoE, and one for pure healing/support).

    I wish the higher level skills would improve upon the previous so there would be a reason to use them.  It would make progressing your skill wheel mean something rather than just colouring in the segments...

     

    Story, campaigns, graphics, voice acting, music, character visual customisation...  All fantastic though.

  • Po_ggPo_gg Member EpicPosts: 5,358
    Originally posted by dylan32

    Just buy skills to complete the wheel, even though I'll never use them because I stick with the same few skill setups throughout the whole game (one with DD/leach heal, one for AoE, and one for pure healing/support).

    ...

    Story, campaigns, graphics, voice acting, music, character visual customisation...  All fantastic though.

    If everything you mention is fantastic, then you definitely should give it a try - because the first part is totally incorrect. :)

    As you go deeper in the game, you'll face a lot of different mobs, and you have to build a lot of decks. That  is one of the main strength in the game (at least for someone like me who like to dive into systems), you can't, as you say stick with the same few skill setups throughout the whole game.

  • GrummusGrummus Member UncommonPosts: 136
    Originally posted by Pekish79

    one week?????!?!?!?!?

    dear lord how much do you play?

     

    i done all quest and i mean all and the side quest too and they are at least 400+ quest including side quest

    i doubt a human being can do that in 1 week but hey if u skip 70% of the quest only do the main story and once u get to the end u said why is so short... i doubt we can blame devs for that

     

    I'm used to grinding/camping/playing for long periods of time from the EQ days.

  • Pekish79Pekish79 Member Posts: 91

    well then right there is your problem not the game problem...

    with freedom come responsability even the one of ruining your own experience you.

     

    yes u are free to rush/farm the content but that is certainly not the way to play this game nobody force you to do it like that right? but if you cannot play with some self-restrain you cannot blame the game.

     

    Your playstyle is very restrict to a small number of player (and actually very boring) so not only aiming to people like you is more expensive as they have to produce much more content but even less entretaining as the quality of "grind" "farming" is low quality content 

     

    the time of nerding 10 hour a day is over MMORPG now day shouldn't use those people as primary public, or  at least not all mmorpg and fortunately TSW doesn't 

  • udonudon Member UncommonPosts: 1,803
    Originally posted by stvnkrs10

    I bought this game before launch and wanted it so much to be what it could have been. Concept = awesome! I still am glued to walking dead. Graphics and world appeal = Awesome! Quests and interactivity = Awesome! 

     

    The problem is in the combat. It was so choppy and forced feeling it drove me out. Has it been improved? I wan't to play this game more than most out there, but the combat is so bad, I just can't. 

     

    Did anyone else get this feeling?

     

    If only a dev would read this and put some time in to revamping the feel of combat.

    Combat is by far the weakest part of that game IMO.  However the strong parts really do make up for it.  I find that as long as I'm working to a goal I don't even notice the combat issues but as soon as I stop having a specific goal I'm working towards it's really hard to get motivated to play.  The nice thing is especially if you have not played from day 1 there are a ton of goals you can focus on regardless of your play style.  I never feel like I am having to log in to do my dailies like many other games do end game.  The game really does have a lot of progression after you finish the main story line and even more is coming.

  • ElikalElikal Member UncommonPosts: 7,912

    TSW has the WORST combat system in a MMO EVER. Period, Paragraph. It is a pain in the ass, and not the cool way! And they did NOTHING to to work on it. NADA. RIEN!

    I don't believe it, that they didn't improve the combat system. Funcom made a pretty cool combat in AoC, but this... horrible. Just horrible.

    People don't ask questions to get answers - they ask questions to show how smart they are. - Dogbert

  • MindTriggerMindTrigger Member Posts: 2,596
    Originally posted by stvnkrs10

    I bought this game before launch and wanted it so much to be what it could have been. Concept = awesome! I still am glued to walking dead. Graphics and world appeal = Awesome! Quests and interactivity = Awesome! 

     

    The problem is in the combat. It was so choppy and forced feeling it drove me out. Has it been improved? I wan't to play this game more than most out there, but the combat is so bad, I just can't. 

     

    Did anyone else get this feeling?

     

    If only a dev would read this and put some time in to revamping the feel of combat.

    Combat is a big one, including that there is no world PvP, which would be amazing.  It's also that they chose to take this amazingly rich idea in the direction of a themepark dungeon gear grinder instead of something more open world and social.  Most of the current players weren't hanging around the old DarkDemonsCryGaia forums when the game was still in concept/design.  The community was so rich and interesting, and dying to live in an RPG game.  It's a shame really, because you can see so much potential in what they have done, but there's no depth.

    A sure sign that you are in an old, dying paradigm/mindset, is when you are scared of new ideas and new technology. Don't feel bad. The world is moving on without you, and you are welcome to yell "Get Off My Lawn!" all you want while it happens. You cannot, however, stop an idea whose time has come.

  • OrtwigOrtwig Member UncommonPosts: 1,163
    Originally posted by Ender4

     


    Originally posted by Agent_Joseph
    what is wrong with combat ?.. am I miss something ?,I have spend  1600+ hours on game play

     


    It is dull and repetitive? I liked the game but the combat really did turn me off as well. I didn't end up finishing Egypt because I was just so bored of the combat. I found myself just trying to run past things so I didn't have to waste the time fighting it and that is never good.

    Did you ever create more than one deck?  Change up your abilities?  Look for ability combos/synergies?  Why do I have the sneaking suspicion you used the same deck the entire time you played (and that it wasn't a very good one)?

  • OrtwigOrtwig Member UncommonPosts: 1,163
    Originally posted by MindTrigger
    Originally posted by stvnkrs10

    I bought this game before launch and wanted it so much to be what it could have been. Concept = awesome! I still am glued to walking dead. Graphics and world appeal = Awesome! Quests and interactivity = Awesome! 

     

    The problem is in the combat. It was so choppy and forced feeling it drove me out. Has it been improved? I wan't to play this game more than most out there, but the combat is so bad, I just can't. 

     

    Did anyone else get this feeling?

     

    If only a dev would read this and put some time in to revamping the feel of combat.

    Combat is a big one, including that there is no world PvP, which would be amazing.  It's also that they chose to take this amazingly rich idea in the direction of a themepark dungeon gear grinder instead of something more open world and social.  Most of the current players weren't hanging around the old DarkDemonsCryGaia forums when the game was still in concept/design.  The community was so rich and interesting, and dying to live in an RPG game.  It's a shame really, because you can see so much potential in what they have done, but there's no depth.

    As much as I would like more sandbox elements in the game (for the record, Joel Bylos has said the same), the reality is that TSW has always been billed as a theme park.  There are some sandbox elements they are working on (Black Ops), but I think I've pretty much accepted things as they are, and still love the hell out of the game.  The storyline is very deep, and there are always new bits being added.  Agreed there could be more faction-specific content added though, but I would say there's more depth to the lore in TSW than there is in many MMOs.

  • TheRealDarkeusTheRealDarkeus Member UncommonPosts: 314

    I still don't get the problem with combat....  Choppy?  What is your definition.  I always kill things pretty smoothly.  I will admit that combat is not the game's strongest feature.  It is average except for the freedom of the Ability Wheel.  But bad?  I have been playing video games for decades, the combat in this game is nowhere NEAR bad. 

     

    Then again, I think we can all agree that combat was not supposed to be the selling point of this game.  The story, lore and themes of the games are the best in the business right now.

  • Pekish79Pekish79 Member Posts: 91

    unfortunately lot of people that now play MMO-RPG come form FPS and they come wanting the FPS type of combat when it was never suppose to be.

    I should go to a fps and start whining that tehy dont have a mmo-rpg combat style

     

     

    MMO-RPG are "popular" now so bunch of kids come and try to change the way they are to they way they want but they dont understand that the combat is only 1/3 of the experiece in a MMORPG and shouldn't be the only reason why you play one MMORPG or another.

     

    all player that come here to say "i tried the combat and i left" are not mean to play MMORPG and i think TSW is better without them they would ignore the lore/quest/story and keep whininy till they ruin everything that make TSW an awesome MMORPG to change it into a MMOFPS.

     

    I hate MMOFPS but at least i have the decency to avoid them i don't go in the forum of a MMOFPS and trash the combat system just because is not the way i like to combat.

  • WespWesp Member Posts: 8
    The combat can be repetitive if you only use one or two weapons for the entire game. When you take the time to read the abilities & passives within the wheel and experiment with builds it gets exciting. The majority of that excitement comes from the feeling that you created a truely awesome build that kicks ass. I'd imagine the people who think the combat is boring or dull base their opinion on it the same way they would judge a book by its cover. The combat is actually very complex with all its variables and it takes some serious effort to make builds that mesh abilities and maximizes its capabilities. You could say its a thinking man's combat system, behind the shallow vale of the visuals is some very complex math equations going on. If you can't appreciate that, then you won't get it. There are hundreds of games that cater to simplicity and remove any challenge -  thank god TSW isn't one of them.
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