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Character Progression: Be Who You Want to Be

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  • asrlohzasrlohz Member Posts: 645
    Originally posted by emperorwings
    No blacksmith leveling?

    Actually, crafting in TES:O will be much deeper than what it was in any of the previous TES titles. You will learn to craft different (racially) kinds of armours. So you could craft an Orcish Iron Armour and an Altmeri Iron Armour if you have enough skill and have discovered the required recipes. This means that all Iron Armours do not look alike, and you can mix and match Iron sets.

     

    You can also add rare properties to the weapons you craft without having to enchant them. These are done by adding additives that can be found in dungeons, out in the world and bought. I believe the higher level your weaponsmithing skill is, the better more additives you can add up to a maximum of 3. Each of which additive will add a certain property. And there are many of these additives so you'll have a very indepth crafting system.

     

    You can also improve non-crafted armour and weapons (such as dungeon loot) if you're a crafter. Essentially, the best equipment is crafted or improved.

    image
  • AratakiArataki Member UncommonPosts: 239

    About the comment that non-Templar classes only get healing abilities from the Restoration Staff.

    Wrong.

    I know the Nightblade Siphon class line that you can see on the Foundry can morph to heals for other players. So no, it isn't nearly as cut and paste as some people seem to think. Wait on details first.

  • PigglesworthPigglesworth Member UncommonPosts: 260

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  • CelusiosCelusios Member UncommonPosts: 337
    Originally posted by asrlohz
    Originally posted by Celusios
    Originally posted by Lord.Bachus
    Originally posted by Celusios

    The only complaint I have ever had about this game for an Elder Scrolls game is the inability for what this video says you can do. You can't be the character you want to be. Much like a plethora of other MMO's you are forced into a class, sure this one is a "soft" class... but none the less a class.

     

    Elder Scrolls was always fun because you had the ability to truly chose what you wanted to be. In this one, you pick between a rogue, a mage, a paladin, or a warrior.

    You are not forced intoo a class, but for ed intoo a build..

     

    there will be no switching around builds, as you cant respec your choices, you can tune your build by switching weapons and skills, however you will allways have the same passives and  stats..  

    It is a class. What do you mean bro? Literally you have four selection choices.

    Paladin, Warrior, Rogue, Mage. You pick one and from there can select the weapons, armor, and some other general skills they pick. The only difference this character progression has from every other MMO of the past generation is the ability to use any weapon as well as any armor.

    A true character progression is what Mortal Online has. You literally pick everything your character does and is. That is what Elder Scrolls has always been. You can become anything you want, but they have killed this in this game. 

    I don't remember being able to pick the Argonians racial as a Bosmer in Elder Scrolls. Do you?

     

    Point is, you can pick EVERYTHING except for the 3 starter skill lines you get from your class that are unique to your class. And if you think that you will absolutely need all of those skills you are silly. You can't even them in your hotbar. This isn't WoW.

     

    So, pick what class you are most inclined to play between the Sorcerer, the Templar, the Dragonknight and the Nightblade. Do you really think that you will need those other 9 starter skill lines? Because you can't even fit all of those into your hotbar. And most passives will be useless to you. Chances are that most people just want a single skill line from a single class. The rest of the skill lines in the game are available to everyone.

    I would go into specifics but that would breach NDA. Just going off public information you should still be capable of selecting which skills you want to use.. just like every other elder scrolls game. You have to make a decision that personalizes your character. All you have right now is a glorified class system. 

    Part of the fun of an Elder Scrolls game was going out and actually spending the time, effort, etc to obtain new skills. Now, we're all the same. The diversity (again I won't go into non public details cause I don't wanna breach) is very limited from this video. 

    What if I want to be a healer who can use that cool pull technique they have showed in past videos for Dragonknights? I can't. That is a problem is it not in an Elder Scrolls game?

  • SpellforgedSpellforged Member UncommonPosts: 458
    I'm really looking forward to this game.  They've made many improvements since it was originally announced.

    image
  • jdnycjdnyc Member UncommonPosts: 1,643
    Originally posted by Celusios
     

    What if I want to be a healer who can use that cool pull technique they have showed in past videos for Dragonknights? I can't. That is a problem is it not in an Elder Scrolls game?

    Your example would require picking Dragonknight as a class with some healing option in its skill line and the restoration staff. 

    There's also other ways to gain active abilities outside of Class/Weapon/Armor.  There's the guilds, becoming a werewolf or a vampire as examples as well.  It is unknown whether those options will give you any healing.  Well I don't think that info is public knowledge yet at least.

     

  • CelusiosCelusios Member UncommonPosts: 337
    Originally posted by jdnyc
    Originally posted by Celusios
     

    What if I want to be a healer who can use that cool pull technique they have showed in past videos for Dragonknights? I can't. That is a problem is it not in an Elder Scrolls game?

    Your example would require picking Dragonknight as a class with some healing option in its skill line and the restoration staff. 

    There's also other ways to gain active abilities outside of Class/Weapon/Armor.  There's the guilds, becoming a werewolf or a vampire as examples as well.  It is unknown whether those options will give you any healing.  Well I don't think that info is public knowledge yet at least.

     

    Which is no doubt cool and all but I still think you're missing my point. This isn't like an Elder Scrolls game. You should of just picked your race then had to gain skills just like other Elder Scrolls games. This class system isn't needed.

  • DrelkagDrelkag Member UncommonPosts: 56

    Seems a lot of people haven't played the first two TES games where the items you can equip and whether you can learn spells were determined by class. That or forgetting the racial abilities in every game after.

    You were always limited depending on class/race in a TES game. Not to this degree, yes, but we can't say you'll be limited to one class if you want to tank well, to heal well, etc. until we get some hands on time with the game and its later levels.

    IMO this class system is a mix of Arena, being that the class you pick determined at least some of your abilities (though not nearly as harsh in Arena) and the later games in the series where you can pick up and use anything.


  • jdnycjdnyc Member UncommonPosts: 1,643
    Originally posted by Celusios
    Originally posted by jdnyc
    Originally posted by Celusios
     

    What if I want to be a healer who can use that cool pull technique they have showed in past videos for Dragonknights? I can't. That is a problem is it not in an Elder Scrolls game?

    Your example would require picking Dragonknight as a class with some healing option in its skill line and the restoration staff. 

    There's also other ways to gain active abilities outside of Class/Weapon/Armor.  There's the guilds, becoming a werewolf or a vampire as examples as well.  It is unknown whether those options will give you any healing.  Well I don't think that info is public knowledge yet at least.

     

    Which is no doubt cool and all but I still think you're missing my point. This isn't like an Elder Scrolls game. You should of just picked your race then had to gain skills just like other Elder Scrolls games. This class system isn't needed.

    This isn't Skyrim Online and Skyrim does not equal everything Elder Scrolls.

    Class system is needed to avoid cookie cutter builds and PVP.  Everyone would be using the same weapon, same powers, same race...everything to min/max.  For PvE and PvP.  The very fact that this is a Multiplayer game forces that issue.

    They could of gone Lobby CO-OP like GW, but they didn't.  That doesn't discount the game from being an Elder Scrolls game.

     

  • azarhalazarhal Member RarePosts: 1,402
    Originally posted by jdnyc
    Originally posted by Celusios
    Originally posted by jdnyc
    Originally posted by Celusios
     

    What if I want to be a healer who can use that cool pull technique they have showed in past videos for Dragonknights? I can't. That is a problem is it not in an Elder Scrolls game?

    Your example would require picking Dragonknight as a class with some healing option in its skill line and the restoration staff. 

    There's also other ways to gain active abilities outside of Class/Weapon/Armor.  There's the guilds, becoming a werewolf or a vampire as examples as well.  It is unknown whether those options will give you any healing.  Well I don't think that info is public knowledge yet at least.

     

    Which is no doubt cool and all but I still think you're missing my point. This isn't like an Elder Scrolls game. You should of just picked your race then had to gain skills just like other Elder Scrolls games. This class system isn't needed.

    This isn't Skyrim Online and Skyrim does not equal everything Elder Scrolls.

    Class system is needed to avoid cookie cutter builds and PVP.  Everyone would be using the same weapon, same powers, same race...everything to min/max.  For PvE and PvP.  The very fact that this is a Multiplayer game forces that issue.

    They could of gone Lobby CO-OP like GW, but they didn't.  That doesn't discount the game from being an Elder Scrolls game.

    Class system doesn't stop the cookie cutter builds from existing, it just means that you will get 4 of them, but only if the class skills are worth something compared to the hundred of shared ones. Otherwise, you'll get one build with Sorcerers, Nightblades, Dragonknights and Templars all running around with the same flavor of the month for their specific task.

    Also, the only TES games with restrictive classes was Arena, since Daggerfall you only select a named skill template that affect how fast you level up, it doesn't restrict what skill you can use or how powerful they can get. The TES games are effectively classless since Daggerfall, anyone saying otherwise just show he/she haven't played any of them.

  • IselinIselin Member LegendaryPosts: 18,719
    Originally posted by azarhal
    Originally posted by jdnyc
    Originally posted by Celusios
    Originally posted by jdnyc
    Originally posted by Celusios
     

    What if I want to be a healer who can use that cool pull technique they have showed in past videos for Dragonknights? I can't. That is a problem is it not in an Elder Scrolls game?

    Your example would require picking Dragonknight as a class with some healing option in its skill line and the restoration staff. 

    There's also other ways to gain active abilities outside of Class/Weapon/Armor.  There's the guilds, becoming a werewolf or a vampire as examples as well.  It is unknown whether those options will give you any healing.  Well I don't think that info is public knowledge yet at least.

     

    Which is no doubt cool and all but I still think you're missing my point. This isn't like an Elder Scrolls game. You should of just picked your race then had to gain skills just like other Elder Scrolls games. This class system isn't needed.

    This isn't Skyrim Online and Skyrim does not equal everything Elder Scrolls.

    Class system is needed to avoid cookie cutter builds and PVP.  Everyone would be using the same weapon, same powers, same race...everything to min/max.  For PvE and PvP.  The very fact that this is a Multiplayer game forces that issue.

    They could of gone Lobby CO-OP like GW, but they didn't.  That doesn't discount the game from being an Elder Scrolls game.

    Class system doesn't stop the cookie cutter builds from existing, it just means that you will get 4 of them, but only if the class skills are worth something compared to the hundred of shared ones. Otherwise, you'll get one build with Sorcerers, Nightblades, Dragonknights and Templars all running around with the same flavor of the month for their specific task.

    Also, the only TES games with restrictive classes was Arena, since Daggerfall you only select a named skill template that affect how fast you level up, it doesn't restrict what skill you can use or how powerful they can get. The TES games are effectively classless since Daggerfall, anyone saying otherwise just show he/she haven't played any of them.

    They're not classless. Classless means you can train everything and do everything. TSW is classless, TES games aren't because you have a finite number of skill points you use to choose what to train...and when you make those choices you thereby create your own half-baked (or good) class. And no, the infinite skill point mod hacks don't count.

    The only real difference between make your own vs. ESO's pre-made + make your own hybrid is that with the later you have a safety-valve ready to use if you totally suck at making your own class. In a sense this whole debate is just a variant of 1337s vs. noobs.

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  • mmoguy43mmoguy43 Member UncommonPosts: 2,770
    Can't play my pacifist character from Skyrim image. I suppose murder is a requirement to play a MMORPG.
  • DistopiaDistopia Member EpicPosts: 21,183
    Originally posted by Celusios
    Originally posted by jdnyc
    Originally posted by Celusios
     

    What if I want to be a healer who can use that cool pull technique they have showed in past videos for Dragonknights? I can't. That is a problem is it not in an Elder Scrolls game?

    Your example would require picking Dragonknight as a class with some healing option in its skill line and the restoration staff. 

    There's also other ways to gain active abilities outside of Class/Weapon/Armor.  There's the guilds, becoming a werewolf or a vampire as examples as well.  It is unknown whether those options will give you any healing.  Well I don't think that info is public knowledge yet at least.

     

    Which is no doubt cool and all but I still think you're missing my point. This isn't like an Elder Scrolls game. You should of just picked your race then had to gain skills just like other Elder Scrolls games. This class system isn't needed.

    I really didn't expect it to be a like a TES game, as the inner workings of that system are a lot different than your typical skill based MMO. Especially if we're talking a game built around PVP. TES's system is balanced around some very simple combat mechanics. That works for it's type of game there's a lot less to account for.

    They could have gone more like SWG with a profession system yet that still wouldn't net much of a TES style system. You'd still be locked into certain types of abilities based on your build limitations.

    People have to keep in mind TES's system isn't really based on active skills it's based on stats, there are few abilities outside of the lines of magica. IF this were a true TES game there would be very little in the way active abilities for combat characters. I doubt that would sit well with MMO fans. Could you imagine, I don't even need a hotbar for combat, all I can do is lunge by pressing forward, spin by pressing a or d with simple mouse clicks?!?! Dumbed DOWN!!!!!!!!!! Hell many are not even fans of the limited bar as it is, they call that dumbed down.

     

    For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson


  • baphametbaphamet Member RarePosts: 3,311


    Originally posted by mmoguy43
    Can't play my pacifist character from Skyrim . I suppose murder is a requirement to play a MMORPG.

    there are mmo's where you don't have to fight and can just be a crafter or diplomat, i don't think ESO is one of them however.

  • baphametbaphamet Member RarePosts: 3,311


    Originally posted by Distopia
    Originally posted by Celusios Originally posted by jdnyc Originally posted by Celusios  
    What if I want to be a healer who can use that cool pull technique they have showed in past videos for Dragonknights? I can't. That is a problem is it not in an Elder Scrolls game?
    Your example would require picking Dragonknight as a class with some healing option in its skill line and the restoration staff.  There's also other ways to gain active abilities outside of Class/Weapon/Armor.  There's the guilds, becoming a werewolf or a vampire as examples as well.  It is unknown whether those options will give you any healing.  Well I don't think that info is public knowledge yet at least.  
    Which is no doubt cool and all but I still think you're missing my point. This isn't like an Elder Scrolls game. You should of just picked your race then had to gain skills just like other Elder Scrolls games. This class system isn't needed.
    I really didn't expect it to be a like a TES game, as the inner workings of that system are a lot different than your typical skill based MMO. Especially if we're talking a game built around PVP. TES's system is balanced around some very simple combat mechanics. That works for it's type of game there's a lot less to account for.

    They could have gone more like SWG with a profession system yet that still wouldn't net much of a TES style system. You'd still be locked into certain types of abilities based on your build limitations.

    People have to keep in mind TES's system isn't really based on active skills it's based on stats, there are few abilities outside of the lines of magica. IF this were a true TES game there would be very little in the way active abilities for combat characters. I doubt that would sit well with MMO fans. Could you imagine, I don't even need a hotbar for combat, all I can do is lunge by pressing forward, spin by pressing a or d with simple mouse clicks?!?! Dumbed DOWN!!!!!!!!!! Hell many are not even fans of the limited bar as it is, they call that dumbed down.

     


    exactly, TESO seems a lot more detailed and in depth than a ES single player game with much more content too.

    it's gonna have some mmo mechanics that the ES purists wont like and to them i will just say you are better off waiting for the next single player ES game that hopefully features a multiplayer option.

  • CelusiosCelusios Member UncommonPosts: 337
    Originally posted by jdnyc
    Originally posted by Celusios
    Originally posted by jdnyc
    Originally posted by Celusios
     

    What if I want to be a healer who can use that cool pull technique they have showed in past videos for Dragonknights? I can't. That is a problem is it not in an Elder Scrolls game?

    Your example would require picking Dragonknight as a class with some healing option in its skill line and the restoration staff. 

    There's also other ways to gain active abilities outside of Class/Weapon/Armor.  There's the guilds, becoming a werewolf or a vampire as examples as well.  It is unknown whether those options will give you any healing.  Well I don't think that info is public knowledge yet at least.

     

    Which is no doubt cool and all but I still think you're missing my point. This isn't like an Elder Scrolls game. You should of just picked your race then had to gain skills just like other Elder Scrolls games. This class system isn't needed.

    This isn't Skyrim Online and Skyrim does not equal everything Elder Scrolls.

    Class system is needed to avoid cookie cutter builds and PVP.  Everyone would be using the same weapon, same powers, same race...everything to min/max.  For PvE and PvP.  The very fact that this is a Multiplayer game forces that issue.

    They could of gone Lobby CO-OP like GW, but they didn't.  That doesn't discount the game from being an Elder Scrolls game.

     

     

    It should. You can't take an Elder Scrolls game (literally this is even named Elder Scrolls Online!) and take out everything that made Elder Scrolls games Elder Scrolls. This class system is poorly implemented and has no business in an Elder Scrolls game. 

    Cookie cutter builds? No, this class system has promoted that very thing. One class with a specific choice of weapons will dominate the rest.. just like every other MMO. It'll take longer to find it, but when they do you watch EVERYONE will run it. And lets not even go into these racial abilities... I truthfully hate those.

    I refuse to play a specific race just to be better at a certain style I want to run, again not very Elder Scrolls. This game should of just been named "Elder Guild Scroll Wars 3".

  • CelusiosCelusios Member UncommonPosts: 337
    Originally posted by baphamet

     


    Originally posted by Distopia

    Originally posted by Celusios

    Originally posted by jdnyc

    Originally posted by Celusios

     
    What if I want to be a healer who can use that cool pull technique they have showed in past videos for Dragonknights? I can't. That is a problem is it not in an Elder Scrolls game?
    Your example would require picking Dragonknight as a class with some healing option in its skill line and the restoration staff.  There's also other ways to gain active abilities outside of Class/Weapon/Armor.  There's the guilds, becoming a werewolf or a vampire as examples as well.  It is unknown whether those options will give you any healing.  Well I don't think that info is public knowledge yet at least.  
    Which is no doubt cool and all but I still think you're missing my point. This isn't like an Elder Scrolls game. You should of just picked your race then had to gain skills just like other Elder Scrolls games. This class system isn't needed.
    I really didn't expect it to be a like a TES game, as the inner workings of that system are a lot different than your typical skill based MMO. Especially if we're talking a game built around PVP. TES's system is balanced around some very simple combat mechanics. That works for it's type of game there's a lot less to account for.

     

    They could have gone more like SWG with a profession system yet that still wouldn't net much of a TES style system. You'd still be locked into certain types of abilities based on your build limitations.

    People have to keep in mind TES's system isn't really based on active skills it's based on stats, there are few abilities outside of the lines of magica. IF this were a true TES game there would be very little in the way active abilities for combat characters. I doubt that would sit well with MMO fans. Could you imagine, I don't even need a hotbar for combat, all I can do is lunge by pressing forward, spin by pressing a or d with simple mouse clicks?!?! Dumbed DOWN!!!!!!!!!! Hell many are not even fans of the limited bar as it is, they call that dumbed down.

     


     

    exactly, TESO seems a lot more detailed and in depth than a ES single player game with much more content too.

    it's gonna have some mmo mechanics that the ES purists wont like and to them i will just say you are better off waiting for the next single player ES game that hopefully features a multiplayer option.

     

     

    You missed the point as well. The opportunity they had to truly make something unique is being tarnished by traditional MMO boundaries. In modern MMO's it's seen as a "good" thing to have classes. Elder Scrolls was fun (despite not being online) for the freedom you had to learn everything with the work put in.

    They could of easily implemented that and kept this smaller hotbar and had far more diversity than you have now. Now, I know what each person at the most will be capable of. His class skills will still dictate how he can fight me, sure he'll have throw off skills he obtained elsewhere... but he's still classified a certain way given his class choice.

  • iridescenceiridescence Member UncommonPosts: 1,552
    Originally posted by Celusios
     

    You missed the point as well. The opportunity they had to truly make something unique is being tarnished by traditional MMO boundaries. In modern MMO's it's seen as a "good" thing to have classes. Elder Scrolls was fun (despite not being online) for the freedom you had to learn everything with the work put in.

    They could of easily implemented that and kept this smaller hotbar and had far more diversity than you have now. Now, I know what each person at the most will be capable of. His class skills will still dictate how he can fight me, sure he'll have throw off skills he obtained elsewhere... but he's still classified a certain way given his class choice.

    Classes are a good thing in a fantasy game. The Elder Scrolls system of progression isn't very balanced or good. You do abilities over and over just to level them up and then most people end up as some kind of "batle mage" because if you can both fight well and use magic, why wouldn't you want to do that? I'm all for being able to customize your class but limits actually make games more fun because they force people to make different tradeoffs so not everyone ends up with the same min-maxed build.

     

  • jdnycjdnyc Member UncommonPosts: 1,643
    Originally posted by Celusios

    It should. You can't take an Elder Scrolls game (literally this is even named Elder Scrolls Online!) and take out everything that made Elder Scrolls games Elder Scrolls. 

    Please list the vast experience you have with all 5 Elder Scrolls games that are missing from ESO.

    Cause you know according to you ESO is missing EVERYTHING that made Elder Scrolls games Elder Scrolls.

    So list it.  Tells us EVERYTHING that is missing.  You won't be able to and you and I know it.

    lol talk about blowing things out of proportion.  Like I said, the game isn't Skyrim Online.  Get over it.

  • baphametbaphamet Member RarePosts: 3,311


    Originally posted by Celusios
    Originally posted by baphamet   Originally posted by Distopia Originally posted by Celusios Originally posted by jdnyc Originally posted by Celusios  
    What if I want to be a healer who can use that cool pull technique they have showed in past videos for Dragonknights? I can't. That is a problem is it not in an Elder Scrolls game?
    Your example would require picking Dragonknight as a class with some healing option in its skill line and the restoration staff.  There's also other ways to gain active abilities outside of Class/Weapon/Armor.  There's the guilds, becoming a werewolf or a vampire as examples as well.  It is unknown whether those options will give you any healing.  Well I don't think that info is public knowledge yet at least.  
    Which is no doubt cool and all but I still think you're missing my point. This isn't like an Elder Scrolls game. You should of just picked your race then had to gain skills just like other Elder Scrolls games. This class system isn't needed.
    I really didn't expect it to be a like a TES game, as the inner workings of that system are a lot different than your typical skill based MMO. Especially if we're talking a game built around PVP. TES's system is balanced around some very simple combat mechanics. That works for it's type of game there's a lot less to account for.   They could have gone more like SWG with a profession system yet that still wouldn't net much of a TES style system. You'd still be locked into certain types of abilities based on your build limitations. People have to keep in mind TES's system isn't really based on active skills it's based on stats, there are few abilities outside of the lines of magica. IF this were a true TES game there would be very little in the way active abilities for combat characters. I doubt that would sit well with MMO fans. Could you imagine, I don't even need a hotbar for combat, all I can do is lunge by pressing forward, spin by pressing a or d with simple mouse clicks?!?! Dumbed DOWN!!!!!!!!!! Hell many are not even fans of the limited bar as it is, they call that dumbed down.  
      exactly, TESO seems a lot more detailed and in depth than a ES single player game with much more content too. it's gonna have some mmo mechanics that the ES purists wont like and to them i will just say you are better off waiting for the next single player ES game that hopefully features a multiplayer option.    
    You missed the point as well. The opportunity they had to truly make something unique is being tarnished by traditional MMO boundaries. In modern MMO's it's seen as a "good" thing to have classes. Elder Scrolls was fun (despite not being online) for the freedom you had to learn everything with the work put in.

    They could of easily implemented that and kept this smaller hotbar and had far more diversity than you have now. Now, I know what each person at the most will be capable of. His class skills will still dictate how he can fight me, sure he'll have throw off skills he obtained elsewhere... but he's still classified a certain way given his class choice.


    the problem is actually you, what you expect it to be and it's a problem for you.

    what difference does it make if he chooses some class skills or decides to go a certain path in the game, he will still fight you the same way, the way he chooses to.

    you are also still going to be able to go out and learn everything (as you put it) you will just start out with a certain class and race with their skill lines.

    you will be doing that well after max level even so i am pretty confident this wont be a huge issue to most. but there are gonna be some ES purist (as i said before) that wont like it, you seem to fall in that category, no big deal though.

  • DistopiaDistopia Member EpicPosts: 21,183
    Originally posted by Celusios

     

    You missed the point as well. The opportunity they had to truly make something unique is being tarnished by traditional MMO boundaries. In modern MMO's it's seen as a "good" thing to have classes. Elder Scrolls was fun (despite not being online) for the freedom you had to learn everything with the work put in.

    They could of easily implemented that and kept this smaller hotbar and had far more diversity than you have now. Now, I know what each person at the most will be capable of. His class skills will still dictate how he can fight me, sure he'll have throw off skills he obtained elsewhere... but he's still classified a certain way given his class choice.

     The way in which you can build a combat toon in this game will be a lot deeper than TES's systems in that regard. A majority of TES's skills are based around non-combat activities, like dialogue, barter, alchemy, enchanting or crafting. It would take a lot less time to familiarize yourself with it's load-outs. You'd have a few slight variations of magic, weapons and armor and that's it. In ESO you can still use any weapon combination, any armor combination or any non-class skill combination, Skills will still be available in variety at endgame, from multiple sources. To state that doesn't leave room for unique builds and variations is a bit silly at this point. We haven't even seen a majority of this stuff yet.

    You're stuck on a single word and basing your entire theory around that word, classes, which every single NPC in SKyrim used just like every TES game before it.

    For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson


  • CelusiosCelusios Member UncommonPosts: 337
    Originally posted by iridescence
    Originally posted by Celusios
     

    You missed the point as well. The opportunity they had to truly make something unique is being tarnished by traditional MMO boundaries. In modern MMO's it's seen as a "good" thing to have classes. Elder Scrolls was fun (despite not being online) for the freedom you had to learn everything with the work put in.

    They could of easily implemented that and kept this smaller hotbar and had far more diversity than you have now. Now, I know what each person at the most will be capable of. His class skills will still dictate how he can fight me, sure he'll have throw off skills he obtained elsewhere... but he's still classified a certain way given his class choice.

    Classes are a good thing in a fantasy game. The Elder Scrolls system of progression isn't very balanced or good. You do abilities over and over just to level them up and then most people end up as some kind of "batle mage" because if you can both fight well and use magic, why wouldn't you want to do that? I'm all for being able to customize your class but limits actually make games more fun because they force people to make different tradeoffs so not everyone ends up with the same min-maxed build.

     

     

    There are ways as I said before to stop that. You can use a system like Mortal Online in which allows the learning of any ability. However, there is a pool of points you have to use among all of your abilities. I'm sure people will go "That still makes classes!" but it doesn't. I as the play still make EVERY selection of my character, I cut corners where I need too, drop some skills, etc. That is the correct system.

     

    Originally posted by jdnyc
    Originally posted by Celusios

    It should. You can't take an Elder Scrolls game (literally this is even named Elder Scrolls Online!) and take out everything that made Elder Scrolls games Elder Scrolls. 

    Please list the vast experience you have with all 5 Elder Scrolls games that are missing from ESO.

    Cause you know according to you ESO is missing EVERYTHING that made Elder Scrolls games Elder Scrolls.

    So list it.  Tells us EVERYTHING that is missing.  You won't be able to and you and I know it.

    lol talk about blowing things out of proportion.  Like I said, the game isn't Skyrim Online.  Get over it.

    You going to post something constructive or continue to express to us all how you have not hit puberty?

    Originally posted by Distopia
    Originally posted by Celusios

     

    You missed the point as well. The opportunity they had to truly make something unique is being tarnished by traditional MMO boundaries. In modern MMO's it's seen as a "good" thing to have classes. Elder Scrolls was fun (despite not being online) for the freedom you had to learn everything with the work put in.

    They could of easily implemented that and kept this smaller hotbar and had far more diversity than you have now. Now, I know what each person at the most will be capable of. His class skills will still dictate how he can fight me, sure he'll have throw off skills he obtained elsewhere... but he's still classified a certain way given his class choice.

     The way in which you can build a combat toon in this game will be a lot deeper than TES's systems in that regard. A majority of TES's skills are based around non-combat activities, like dialogue, barter, alchemy, enchanting or crafting. It would take a lot less time to familiarize yourself with it's load-outs. You'd have a few slight variations of magic, weapons and armor and that's it. In ESO you can still use any weapon combination, any armor combination or any non-class skill combination, Skills will still be available in variety at endgame, from multiple sources. To state that doesn't leave room for unique builds and variations is a bit silly at this point. We haven't even seen a majority of this stuff yet.

    You're stuck on a single word and basing your entire theory around that word, classes, which every single NPC in SKyrim used just like every TES game before it.

    Maybe I have over stepped and expressed my feelings towards the game from my experiences within it. No matter though, as I see many others have already passed that boundary. I guess with that said, all I can further say in this discussion (as now not saying with you but others its turning into a flamewar and i'm not trying to derail this thread) is wait until you try it out yourself. You'll see what you are defending is completely invalid and this is indeed a glorified class system as seen in 2902819021 other MMO's.

  • baphametbaphamet Member RarePosts: 3,311


    Originally posted by Celusios
    wait until you try it out yourself. You'll see what you are defending is completely invalid and this is indeed a glorified class system as seen in 2902819021 other MMO's.

    i don't need to play it to know that isn't true. other mmo's determine all of your skills and abilities based on the class you choose.

    in ESO you are just picking one skill line based on the class you choose (one for race as well i believe). i may not like this game for whatever reason but i know that wont be one of the issues for me.

    it's just one skill line, not even close to the same as a traditional class system, that's ridiculous to even suggest.

  • azarhalazarhal Member RarePosts: 1,402
    Originally posted by baphamet

     


    Originally posted by Celusios
    wait until you try it out yourself. You'll see what you are defending is completely invalid and this is indeed a glorified class system as seen in 2902819021 other MMO's.

     

    i don't need to play it to know that isn't true. other mmo's determine all of your skills and abilities based on the class you choose.

    in ESO you are just picking one skill line based on the class you choose (one for race as well i believe). i may not like this game for whatever reason but i know that wont be one of the issues for me.

    it's just one skill line, not even close to the same as a traditional class system, that's ridiculous to even suggest.

    It's 3 skills lines per classes actually (+ the racial one).

  • GrixxittGrixxitt Member UncommonPosts: 545
    Originally posted by asrlohz

    Personally I like that they have classes. Just like back in the good old days before Skyrim. It's nice to have unique abilities to your class. Not to mention that Nightblades for example could quite possibly be great tanks by following the Siphoning tree and Sword and Board tree.

    I agree. However I DO wish that, like earlier Elder Scrolls games, you also had the option to choose your own class skills piecemeal if you so wished.

    Bring back the Adventurer class!

    The above is my personal opinion. Anyone displaying a view contrary to my opinion is obviously WRONG and should STHU. (neener neener)

    -The MMO Forum Community

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