Howdy, Stranger!
It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!
Quick Links
Star Citizen
strawhat0981
Member RarePosts: 1,198
in Star Citizen
Will this game really be the sci-fi mmo game everyone wants? I so want a great sci-fi "mmo" but i feel this might fall short.
Originally posted by laokoko
"if you want to be a game designer, you should sell your house and fund your game. Since if you won't even fund your own game, no one will".
Comments
He probably just couldn't find the game-specific forum. Here, I'll give you the link:
http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/883/view/forums/forum/1416/General-Discussion.html
Where do you get the "arcade" part from?
I did not mean it in a bad way. By arcade i mean that it will not be a simulated space combat with full physically correct zero gravity. Meaning you can turn and steer more like a plane than a space ship. At least that is what i understood. Correct me if i am wrong.
It is my understanding that they are trying to make it as realistic as possible. Here's a video that goes into the physics a little bit. If the ship flies like a plane, it is because it has the thrusters to accommodate that in zero G.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=VhsgiliheP0#t=424
I get the impression that "Realism" is very much on Chris Roberts mind.
http://www.straightdope.com/
I did not mean it in a bad way. By arcade i mean that it will not be a simulated space combat with full physically correct zero gravity. Meaning you can turn and steer more like a plane than a space ship. At least that is what i understood. Correct me if i am wrong.
I think its quite "realistic" if you turn to fast with your ship, your char can black out or even die due to the G force. That's what's going to happen in the game. You can get special race suit, so your char can handle 1-2 G more before they suffer from the fast turning effects. So thats not very arcad like in my book.
This will be a lot like Freelancer with a separate farely open ended online part of the game.
While i do think Robert will make this into a great game( he has vision, talent, experience and money), i highly doubt it will be anything close to what the hype is making it out to be. There will be a lot of disappointed fan boys.
Also, i have a very bad feeling that this game will be one of the most pervasive cash shops ever. You're gonna need a huge wallet to play this game in any competitive sort of way.
I always have to laugh when I hear this argument because it's so stupid.
You basically imply that making the game mechanics more like not in space is somewhat making space physics more realistic.
There is no reason why you would want to fly space ship like a submarine. None. It's ridiculous premise. There is nothing "realistic" about pew-pew submarines in space.
I have no objections against "arcade" controls but for the love of god stop pretending it is realistic. Game designers create drag in space ship games so the movement and controls are more familiar for the player as well as it makes the combat somewhat more "action" and fast paced. No more, no less.
This could give you the answer: MadSci Network: Astronomy
"The idea of gravitational acceleration on the ground, is that the Earth is pulling on you, trying to make you accelerate downwards at 9.8 meters per second per second. (When you step off of a ladder, you speed increases by 9.8 m/s every second. If you were in the air for a second, you'd be traveling downward at 9.8 m/s by the end.) Your feet, however, exert forces on the ground - enough force to try to accelerate you upwards at 9.8 meters per second per second. That's what you feel as "weight" on the ground: your feet, or your bottom, or or your back, resisting the gravitational acceleration of the earth. Sometimes it's easier to think about these forces if you imagine yourself standing on a big spring; the force of gravity on your body is counteracted by the upward force of the spring.
But anything that tries to accelerate you (or decelerate, same thing) requires it to push on your feet or bottom or whatver. When you're in a car that's accelerating hard, the back of the seat has to push on you to make you accelerate with it. If the car is turning hard, the seat or door or whatever has to push on you sideways to make your body move in the same way the car moves - remember that in the absence of these forces, "an object in motion tends to stay in motion in a straight line". These are what we sometimes call G-forces; there's a G-force acting on you from behind when the car accelerates, and from the side when it turns, and from the front when it brakes. And there's always the chair pushing up on your bottom to counteract gravity itself. Very different phenomena, but from your perspective they all feel like different strengths of gravity acting in all different directions.
Put the car in space; now, there's no acceleration due to gravity pulling you down into your seat. But if your car (with rockets on the back!) accelerates or turns, it still has to push on your body so that you keep up. Those pushing forces are the G-forces. So in a rocket moving in a straight line in space (and by Einstein's theory, any "gravitational orbit" counts as a straight line!), yeah, you could float forever in the middle of the cockpit. But the rocket turns suddenly - your body "doesn't notice" and keeps going in a straight line - oof! and the wall crashes into you and pushes you wherever it wants. That feels like a G-force. If the acceleration due to the wall was 9.8 m/s^2, you could "stand" on the wall and it would feel like you were standing on the Earth, since the force on your feet would be the same!"
My you certainly are a bit "up-tight" aren't ya?
Believe me when I say I'm laughing right a long with you. Be it for a different reason. but, laughing none the less. Lets laugh together .... eh?
Let's first establish realistic and then go from there. Realistic would be that the engine simulates Newtonian Physics. Really is that simple. Any deviation from that would be "Not Realistic" ..... right?
Your analogy of the pew-pew submarines in space due to an artificial drag coefficient being added to the physics engine is really cute. That would deviate from Newtonian Physics and ruin the whole "REALISTIC" thing I spoke of now wouldn't it.
This quote is from the Star Citizen Admirer's Manual.
"All spacecraft present in space are governed by a physics engine that is programmed to reflect realistic, Newtonian physics. In a vacuum environment, there is no artificially induced drag. Ship movement in Star Citizen will take place solely based on forces applied to the ship."
I think that pretty much covers the entire premise of your whole post. For the love of god do a little research before you post.
~Hairysun
http://www.straightdope.com/
Personally seen these projects come and go two dozen times over.
Here's the unfortunate reality with most of these projects:
1) Promise the world and rake in the money.
2) The company has a furious passion for developing the game and gets 2-3 years down a development cycle.
3) They realise they've bitten off an entire whale and have no chance of moving further.
4) They now either attempt to continue moving by throwing more money at it and hiring new people or simply stop developing the game and slide it into vaporland.
Sadly even when companies do throw more money at it - the game ends up mediocre as hell because of mismanagement relating to the above points.
You never know though - there's a first time for everything.
I'm excited and always hope a company pulls it off but honestly it's the little dudes who don't promise ANYTHING that often pull it off - see: CCP games or Trion.
Newton's 3 laws of motion ?
The only thing bothering me about the game now, is the new stretch goals are offering role specific ships. Which essentially makes them better/best ships.
One of the original design principles highly touted by CIG was no better ships. You outfit hulls to fit your playstyle, but if they add role specific ships, than you won't do that. You will get that "one" ship that is the best at what you like to do in the game.
For those that are sucked in by the whole "pick a class" that best fits your holy trinity model, this is acceptable. For those like me, that like games that let you do whatever the hell you want it's a bit of a hit.
I liked SWG before professions.
I liked freelancer before the Eagle lol.
Not saying this is a major turn off, or has kililed the game for me, but I'm drawn back by it. I wanted to get a ship that feels right, and use the equipment to fully get the best that I wanted it out of it, now I'll merely buy the ship that is the best at what I want to do. Kind of a disappointment.
The assumption that there weren't going to be role specific ships seems strange and unfounded. Star Citizen has always been touted as a 'successor' to the great space games of yesteryear. If you've played any space game, ever, then you would be familiar with role specific ships, thus it seems natural that Star Citizen would follow suit.
In regards to Star Citizen, I am of the opinion that they will create a good game for space game fans, but the level of hype for this is just so ridiculously high, that no matter what they are able to put out, it cannot possibly satisfy everyone's expectations, and thus be met with disappointment everywhere. Honestly, I think a lot of people don't really even know that many details about the game, they are just thinking, 'It will be the greatest game ever'. Just reading threads about Star Citizen in various forums,it is painful seeing different people describe completely different games.
I can safely say, maybe
I like CCP but every year since what, 2008, they show vaporware trailes or talk about stuff that never happens, like hey what was it, WALKING OUT THAT FREAKIN CAPTAINS QUARTER's DOOR?
WALKING ON SHIPS?
..
...
...
Honestly dude...I get what you are wanting as far as the next sci-fi...and lots of small companies have trield, just hasn't happened. A big company needs to put the efforts in and make that happen. As far as SC...it's space so...guess you could call it sci-fi, but tbh, I'd classify it more as a space flight sim. If that sounds sci-fi to you...great, but I don't consider this the next sci-fi game...more the next great space flight sim. Just my opinion.
Incognito
www.incognito-gaming.us
"You're either with us or against us"
Arcade?
Incognito
www.incognito-gaming.us
"You're either with us or against us"
There are only 2 options:
1) You do not understand what newtonian space flight is.
2) You have not seen any game video how the ships move.
Star citizen in no way represents a newtonian space flight.
I do not know much about Star Citizen but i may be of help with this physics fight.
if your 'space ship' has a maximum velocity then it's not following newtonian physics. If your spaceship has a maximum which ranges around .1C (C = 3.0x10^8m/s) then it may have some relativity in that physics engine.
and yes, any artificial drag on a ship would mean that it's not following newtonian physics
It is still a game thus some restrictions and adjustments could/should be made, so despite it won't be simulating space flight 100%, it would still keep enough resemblance to provide the feel of newtonian flight mechanics.
There is no resemblance with space flight in SC tho. The game even renders wake trails on wing-tips. Ridiculous.
Yet, you still see people defending it with "quotes from manual", they rather believe what they are fed then their own judgement. No wonder they gathered so much funding.
True newtonian spacefight in a game would've been something similar to Elite: Frontier and and Frontier 2: First Encounters, where your ship is still moving relative to the direction of your motion towards a planet (as can be seen by the movement of the stars in the background) however you can also move relative to the ship that you are engaging and not significantly alter your overall course.
However I think that will be to terribly confusing to a lot of players (Hence why Elite: Frontier was a cult classic but never really popular, in addition to the fact that the game had quite a bit of bugs).
Even if not that at least it will be something like how Starfury works in Babylon 5 in the TV series, that's at least closer to what newtonian space flight looks like.
G force is created by acceleration (as well as mass).
Physics 101.