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The "Ask the Devs a question" thread! (Not suggestions)

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  • Sive0nSive0n Member UncommonPosts: 28

    I agree with the hypothesis that k/d changes players and the community behavior, but i like to see a way to see/show how decent a player is. So I propose to have a score or combat rating that should take all actions things a player does into consideration, this would be a mathematical formula that would include kills, deaths, revives, heals, captured objectives, attacked objectives, etc...

    an Example:

    A player could have two internal hidden variables, "positiveScore" and "negativeScore". Each time they do something positive(kill an enemy, revive, capture an objective,etc..) it gets added to the positiveScore, each time the player does something negative(death, losing an objective, friendly fire, team kill) it gets added to the negativeScore.

    Combat Rating = positiveScore / negativeScore

    This way you get all the advantages from having a score without the disadvantages of detrimental things like k/d, it just shows your general effectiveness.

    It also allows for interesting things like having hidden multipliers to add a little extra(bonus points) when you do things in a certain way, like "capturing an objective without dieing", etc...

     

    PS: really looking forward the the official forum... it needs a suggestion area that allows players to vote for the ideas.

  • NonderyonNonderyon Member UncommonPosts: 188

    Still, there are bunch of people who would say: "your rank is too low" and dont get invite or just kick out from party...

    So, my option is "don't need any score what show how good anyone is" unless something about leadership or commanding

  • DecisiveRaindropDecisiveRaindrop Member Posts: 17
    There will always be people who are the elitists who will continually put down people due to skill, but what if we did a ranking system for the guilds, listing awesome feats of awesomeness. This way, there will be recognition in the community. There will always be the elite guilds that are very over the top pro, but there will also be aspiring guilds out there doing great things too. This also has the benefit of bringing the guild together to achieve the impossible, so they might get some recognition. There will also be those guilds who would not be so successful, but unfortunately not everyone will get fair chances for becoming a more respected player, but that is life. It may sound a bit cruel, but not everyone wins.
  • SavijSavij Member Posts: 341
    Originally posted by Sive0n

    I agree with the hypothesis that k/d changes players and the community behavior, but i like to see a way to see/show how decent a player is. So I propose to have a score or combat rating that should take all actions things a player does into consideration, this would be a mathematical formula that would include kills, deaths, revives, heals, captured objectives, attacked objectives, etc...

    an Example:

    A player could have two internal hidden variables, "positiveScore" and "negativeScore". Each time they do something positive(kill an enemy, revive, capture an objective,etc..) it gets added to the positiveScore, each time the player does something negative(death, losing an objective, friendly fire, team kill) it gets added to the negativeScore.

    Combat Rating = positiveScore / negativeScore

    This way you get all the advantages from having a score without the disadvantages of detrimental things like k/d, it just shows your general effectiveness.

    It also allows for interesting things like having hidden multipliers to add a little extra(bonus points) when you do things in a certain way, like "capturing an objective without dieing", etc...

     

    PS: really looking forward the the official forum... it needs a suggestion area that allows players to vote for the ideas.

    but that would feed what quotheraving said

    they would try to avoid everything what pulls down your score

    losing an objective pulls your score down > oh then i dont go defend something

    dieing pulls your score down > oh then i just wait here and put my sniperrifle on

     

     

    be always up to date about Eternal Crusade
    WH40k:EC dev Tracker

    Other EC Sites i'm in:
    Dakkadakka Savij
    Reddit EC Savij1337
    EternalCrusader.com Savij

  • BatpimpBatpimp Member UncommonPosts: 29
    Originally posted by Sive0n

    I agree with the hypothesis that k/d changes players and the community behavior, but i like to see a way to see/show how decent a player is. So I propose to have a score or combat rating that should take all actions things a player does into consideration, this would be a mathematical formula that would include kills, deaths, revives, heals, captured objectives, attacked objectives, etc...

    an Example:

    A player could have two internal hidden variables, "positiveScore" and "negativeScore". Each time they do something positive(kill an enemy, revive, capture an objective,etc..) it gets added to the positiveScore, each time the player does something negative(death, losing an objective, friendly fire, team kill) it gets added to the negativeScore.

    Combat Rating = positiveScore / negativeScore

    This way you get all the advantages from having a score without the disadvantages of detrimental things like k/d, it just shows your general effectiveness.

    It also allows for interesting things like having hidden multipliers to add a little extra(bonus points) when you do things in a certain way, like "capturing an objective without dieing", etc...

     

    PS: really looking forward the the official forum... it needs a suggestion area that allows players to vote for the ideas.

    While I think an idea like this is useful, I think it would detract from the developers time to balance the game. For instance, I would MUCH rather have them have a simple idea implemented. Your checks and balances is great in theory but I would much rather have a snapshot in 2 seconds of whom has done what. As in captured points, rezzed other players. In clear writing i just want an absolute amount.

    Problems i see with making it TOO in depth i see is :Time wasted for developers working numbers and checks and balances instead of worrying about if people are having fun, if they are immersed, and if team play is being incentivized.

    Or another problem could be is:  what is more important rezzing players or killing players? Following orders or going rogue and causing mayhem? I think thats up to opinion. In this way i think its better to have a simple layout with a snapshot of whats going on and LET YOU decide whats important. I imagine more things going wrong and adding more details like this could only end up  making things worse....sometimes LESS is better and more is worse.

  • BatpimpBatpimp Member UncommonPosts: 29
    Originally posted by Savij
    Originally posted by Sive0n

    I agree with the hypothesis that k/d changes players and the community behavior, but i like to see a way to see/show how decent a player is. So I propose to have a score or combat rating that should take all actions things a player does into consideration, this would be a mathematical formula that would include kills, deaths, revives, heals, captured objectives, attacked objectives, etc...

    an Example:

    A player could have two internal hidden variables, "positiveScore" and "negativeScore". Each time they do something positive(kill an enemy, revive, capture an objective,etc..) it gets added to the positiveScore, each time the player does something negative(death, losing an objective, friendly fire, team kill) it gets added to the negativeScore.

    Combat Rating = positiveScore / negativeScore

    This way you get all the advantages from having a score without the disadvantages of detrimental things like k/d, it just shows your general effectiveness.

    It also allows for interesting things like having hidden multipliers to add a little extra(bonus points) when you do things in a certain way, like "capturing an objective without dieing", etc...

     

    PS: really looking forward the the official forum... it needs a suggestion area that allows players to vote for the ideas.

    but that would feed what quotheraving said

    they would try to avoid everything what pulls down your score

    losing an objective pulls your score down > oh then i dont go defend something

    dieing pulls your score down > oh then i just wait here and put my sniperrifle on

     

     

    Exactly. In all my years of gaming i have learned a few things. PEOPLE WILL ALWAYS ALWAYS GAME THE SYSTEM. It is better to give them NO OPTIONS than to give them too many, especially when the game is brand new.

     

    I do however that Squads and GUILDS/CLANs should be rewarded with team work..individual players whom do good a battle field could just get maybe a title after their name like in guildwars or aesthetic changes. In the match though just give me the gist and the important things...Strategic points..squad leaders names..and troop movement. I dont need to know you got 43 headshots.

  • patrickbalthazarpatrickbalthazar Member UncommonPosts: 133
    Originally posted by Batpimp
    Originally posted by Savij
    Originally posted by Sive0n

    I agree with the hypothesis that k/d changes players and the community behavior, but i like to see a way to see/show how decent a player is. So I propose to have a score or combat rating that should take all actions things a player does into consideration, this would be a mathematical formula that would include kills, deaths, revives, heals, captured objectives, attacked objectives, etc...

    an Example:

    A player could have two internal hidden variables, "positiveScore" and "negativeScore". Each time they do something positive(kill an enemy, revive, capture an objective,etc..) it gets added to the positiveScore, each time the player does something negative(death, losing an objective, friendly fire, team kill) it gets added to the negativeScore.

    Combat Rating = positiveScore / negativeScore

    This way you get all the advantages from having a score without the disadvantages of detrimental things like k/d, it just shows your general effectiveness.

    It also allows for interesting things like having hidden multipliers to add a little extra(bonus points) when you do things in a certain way, like "capturing an objective without dieing", etc...

     

    PS: really looking forward the the official forum... it needs a suggestion area that allows players to vote for the ideas.

    but that would feed what quotheraving said

    they would try to avoid everything what pulls down your score

    losing an objective pulls your score down > oh then i dont go defend something

    dieing pulls your score down > oh then i just wait here and put my sniperrifle on

     

     

    Exactly. In all my years of gaming i have learned a few things. PEOPLE WILL ALWAYS ALWAYS GAME THE SYSTEM. It is better to give them NO OPTIONS than to give them too many, especially when the game is brand new.

     

    I do however that Squads and GUILDS/CLANs should be rewarded with team work..individual players whom do good a battle field could just get maybe a title after their name like in guildwars or aesthetic changes. In the match though just give me the gist and the important things...Strategic points..squad leaders names..and troop movement. I dont need to know you got 43 headshots.

    It's nice of you guys that you discuss these things, especially since I am very keen on getting a good system here, but I think the thread is more for questions, rather then suggestions and discussions.

    that said - I agree, the system we will make is not finished, we will invest more time in it for sure, but it's not the time yet to set them in stone. We are listening to all of you and we will make sure as many players as possible will be happy with the system in the end - that is for sure!

    And just as conclusion to this: thx all for the interest and the dedication you show, I am sure together we will make a great game everyone can be proud of!

    Patrick Balthazar
    Tech Lead - Behaviour Online
    Lead Programmer - Warhammer 40,000: Eternal Crusade
    www.EternalCrusade.com - #eternalcrusade - @lordpada

  • SavijSavij Member Posts: 341
    What are the actual things The devs are working in? :P

    Maybe something we can help with? :3

    Im so exited! I want to be a gear in your developer engine!

    be always up to date about Eternal Crusade
    WH40k:EC dev Tracker

    Other EC Sites i'm in:
    Dakkadakka Savij
    Reddit EC Savij1337
    EternalCrusader.com Savij

  • patrickbalthazarpatrickbalthazar Member UncommonPosts: 133
    Originally posted by Savij
    What are the actual things The devs are working in? :P

    Maybe something we can help with? :3

    Im so exited! I want to be a gear in your developer engine!

    we are currently focusing on the combat experience - so everything that makes the combat fun and smooth, good looking, etc.

    Patrick Balthazar
    Tech Lead - Behaviour Online
    Lead Programmer - Warhammer 40,000: Eternal Crusade
    www.EternalCrusade.com - #eternalcrusade - @lordpada

  • VassagoMaelVassagoMael Member Posts: 555
    Why did you pick all the inferior races? Tau or go home.

    Free to play = content updates for the cash shop. Buy to play = content updates for the cash shop.
    Subscription = Actual content updates!

  • Swedish_ChefSwedish_Chef Member Posts: 213
    Wuts da point a' payin' if yer gunna let folks play da BEST race fer nuffin'? Cuz e'ryone knows ORKS is DA BEST!
  • Sive0nSive0n Member UncommonPosts: 28
    Originally posted by patrickbalthazar
    Originally posted by Savij
    What are the actual things The devs are working in? :P

    Maybe something we can help with? :3

    Im so exited! I want to be a gear in your developer engine!

    we are currently focusing on the combat experience - so everything that makes the combat fun and smooth, good looking, etc.

     Unfortunately as much as we would like to help in that specific area, that's something we can't give opinions or advices until we gain experience on the subject, unless you give some of us alpha access(yes please!) so we get some hands-on experience. image

  • SavijSavij Member Posts: 341
    do you want to have or thinking about a "weapon jam" mechanic ingame like other WH40k games have?

    be always up to date about Eternal Crusade
    WH40k:EC dev Tracker

    Other EC Sites i'm in:
    Dakkadakka Savij
    Reddit EC Savij1337
    EternalCrusader.com Savij

  • patrickbalthazarpatrickbalthazar Member UncommonPosts: 133
    Originally posted by Sive0n
    Originally posted by patrickbalthazar
    Originally posted by Savij
    What are the actual things The devs are working in? :P

    Maybe something we can help with? :3

    Im so exited! I want to be a gear in your developer engine!

    we are currently focusing on the combat experience - so everything that makes the combat fun and smooth, good looking, etc.

     Unfortunately as much as we would like to help in that specific area, that's something we can't give opinions or advices until we gain experience on the subject, unless you give some of us alpha access(yes please!) so we get some hands-on experience. image

    haha, yes believe me, I wish we would be ready for that, but way too early ...

    Patrick Balthazar
    Tech Lead - Behaviour Online
    Lead Programmer - Warhammer 40,000: Eternal Crusade
    www.EternalCrusade.com - #eternalcrusade - @lordpada

  • patrickbalthazarpatrickbalthazar Member UncommonPosts: 133
    Originally posted by Savij
    do you want to have or thinking about a "weapon jam" mechanic ingame like other WH40k games have?

    we probably won't have any random jamming like e.g. in space hulk. at this point it's just to early to say we won't have any weapon jamming.

    Patrick Balthazar
    Tech Lead - Behaviour Online
    Lead Programmer - Warhammer 40,000: Eternal Crusade
    www.EternalCrusade.com - #eternalcrusade - @lordpada

  • OdolusasOdolusas Member Posts: 30

     

    Savij - weapon jam ,now that is a good question and i think it should work like in all Stalker games where every weapon that shoots SOLID ammo has the small chance to jam. But as you use weapon more it degrades so if you dont repair it, it will jam more and more the more damaged it is from usage. This connects nicely whit durability on equipment that i have presented in my tread.

  • grigdushergrigdusher Member UncommonPosts: 139
    i imagine no "jam" but overheating, full auto weapon  and energy  weapon with an heat bar if you shoot and never stop the weapon wil overheating and need more time for recovering (or for plasma explode whi not? you waste a lot of ammo and take damage instead of losing the weapon )  

    war 40K Eternal Crusade: refferal 4$ bonus: EC-9Y7IAZJ8UZN6I http://www.eternalcrusade.com/account/sign-up/?ref_code=EC-9Y7IAZJ8UZN6I

  • BatpimpBatpimp Member UncommonPosts: 29
    Originally posted by Odolusas

     

    Savij - weapon jam ,now that is a good question and i think it should work like in all Stalker games where every weapon that shoots SOLID ammo has the small chance to jam. But as you use weapon more it degrades so if you dont repair it, it will jam more and more the more damaged it is from usage. This connects nicely whit durability on equipment that i have presented in my tread.

    PLEASE DO NOT DO THIS!

     

    As for questions,

     

    My last question, which I asked earlier but might have been overlooked, will you be including a mechanic that takes into consideration the ork Waaghhh?

    Will there be knockdown or knockback abilities. For example, If I am a terminator or a Knob will i be able to knockback/knockdown weaker units?

  • OdolusasOdolusas Member Posts: 30

     

    For non solid ammo weapons like melta,plasma and lascanon it would be like:

    -Plasma would get hot more often, and hurt the player more and more often the less it durability is(so like in the tabletop rules but it happens more often if in lower durability state).

    -Melta and Lascanon would use more and more ammo the more durability they lose if not repaired.

    But for example if any weapon would break down completely, you would have to replace its main mechanism like in my tread on durability on armor (ofc if you MAINTAIN the gun regularly it will never break down, but i think the last step in durability(breaking down) should exist in game so that it would give the GAME more realism).

    I know this is ask the Devs tread, but i like to give solutions more than to ask questions so...And Savij question on jamming weapons was something that must be answered and found SOLUTION for how to work, so i proposed this one.

     

    Batpimp - why not? I would like to take care of my armor and weapons. And i would not like of them to be just some invulnerable object that i put on and dont care for the rest of the game. Any man who served the army will tell you what happens to you dont  take care of it by hand of ENEMY and or SUPERIORS, as one will kill you on spot if your weapon jams, and other will punish you (for example clean toilet at BEST) if you neglect your duties as soldier. This game should be no different i think.

    Being punished by your superiors for breaking new toy they gave you to kill the enemy ,hmmm... can this be implemented in game also?Orks would not care i guess but other armies would.

  • patrickbalthazarpatrickbalthazar Member UncommonPosts: 133

    Originally posted by Batpimp

    Originally posted by Odolusas

     

    Savij - weapon jam ,now that is a good question and i think it should work like in all Stalker games where every weapon that shoots SOLID ammo has the small chance to jam. But as you use weapon more it degrades so if you dont repair it, it will jam more and more the more damaged it is from usage. This connects nicely whit durability on equipment that i have presented in my tread.

    PLEASE DO NOT DO THIS!

     

    As for questions,

     

    My last question, which I asked earlier but might have been overlooked, will you be including a mechanic that takes into consideration the ork Waaghhh?

    Will there be knockdown or knockback abilities. For example, If I am a terminator or a Knob will i be able to knockback/knockdown weaker units?

    Haha, way too early to decide ;) don't worry we don't want to make the gameplay difficult or frustrating in an way, but it's not the point in time to give definite answers.

    the mechanic - I am not sure what you want to know, do you mean a mechanic to be playable of some sort? or do you mean degeneration of equipment and someone to repair it?

    knockback/staggering/stunning stuff like this yes. limited to classes, probably, but for sure in some way.

    Originally posted by Odolusas

     

    For non solid ammo weapons like melta,plasma and lascanon it would be like:

    -Plasma would get hot more often, and hurt the player more and more often the less it durability is(so like in the tabletop rules but it happens more often if in lower durability state).

    -Melta and Lascanon would use more and more ammo the more durability they lose if not repaired.

    But for example if any weapon would break down completely, you would have to replace its main mechanism like in my tread on durability on armor (ofc if you MAINTAIN the gun regularly it will never break down, but i think the last step in durability(breaking down) should exist in game so that it would give the GAME more realism).

    I know this is ask the Devs tread, but i like to give solutions more than to ask questions so...And Savij question on jamming weapons was something that must be answered and found SOLUTION for how to work, so i proposed this one.

     

    Batpimp - why not? I would like to take care of my armor and weapons. And i would not like of them to be just some invulnerable object that i put on and dont care for the rest of the game. Any man who served the army will tell you what happens to you dont  take care of it by hand of ENEMY and or SUPERIORS, as one will kill you on spot if your weapon jams, and other will punish you (for example clean toilet at BEST) if you neglect your duties as soldier. This game should be no different i think.

    Being punished by your superiors for breaking new toy they gave you to kill the enemy ,hmmm... can this be implemented in game also?

    haha this looks interesting, but can't say for sure it will look anything like this. we will have ammo, and we will have overheating of plasma, maybe best to look at space marine for reference here. also this is early stage of how we do the stuff, this is not final.

     

    Patrick Balthazar
    Tech Lead - Behaviour Online
    Lead Programmer - Warhammer 40,000: Eternal Crusade
    www.EternalCrusade.com - #eternalcrusade - @lordpada

  • OdolusasOdolusas Member Posts: 30

     

    Glad you liked it Mister Patrick Balthazar if you would like to read more of it look at my thread that goes by the name of(if you have not all ready read it) :

                    Implementing simple but unique features in Wh40k Eternal Crusade - in there i have a lot of big posts, but each one supports one another, and have a lot of crazy stuff , and as you read more and more the stuff gets better as i improve each one in next post so reading them all, if you have time in one go is a must as each have new informations and updates on previous ones, and how it would work.

    Yes some stuff is outright crazy but it is toned down later :P , but it has some nice stuff too.

  • The user and all related content has been deleted.
  • OdolusasOdolusas Member Posts: 30

     

    Wait ,you mean having underwear under armor?And you can see it if you take off armor?

    Does anyone wear one in 41 millennium at all?

    Lore guys help!!!

    p.s

    Well i would definitely like to have this for my Eldar Howling Banshee .....wink  -_<.

  • NephaeriusNephaerius Member UncommonPosts: 1,671
    Originally posted by Nonderyon

    Still, there are bunch of people who would say: "your rank is too low" and dont get invite or just kick out from party...

    So, my option is "don't need any score what show how good anyone is" unless something about leadership or commanding

     Maybe some people just like statistics and see how their stats change/improve/worsen over time.  Maybe not everyone interested in numbers is an elitist monster out to call you a newb scrub and socially exclude you from a video game?

    Seriously?  Hide K/D cause some other player is going to be like lololol look how high mine is and how low yours is?  Is that really too much for your ego to handle?  Just ignore those fools and go about your gaming.  Whether there was K/D displayed or not you probably wouldn't want to play with those types of people (and they're still there whether you show K/D or not).  So who cares if they exclude you from a party?  If I let people like that get to me I would've quit multiplayer gaming altogether a long time ago and I sure as hell wouldn't play LoL daily.  If/when those folks actually do get under my skin I take a break and play another game or do something else I enjoy.  No big deal because I probably needed the break anyway based on my emotional reaction to those types of players.

    There are a lot of different types of people in the world.  Some people only want to game for fun but some people want to put effort into getting better and specific statistics (K/D/A/Healing/Dmgdone/Dmgtaken/objectives taken/etc.), not generic/obscure things like "Combat Score" or "Positive Contributions to the War Efforts,"allow them to examine their progress and more easily identify strengths and weaknesses.  Also, not to mention, I love baseball solely for the fact that there are so many statistics involved. 

    Final point, there's no reason your in game stats have to be viewable by anyone but yourself.  That avoids the issue altogether and satisfies both parties.  Although I do find that knowing stat info about my fellow players (especially opponents) is extremely useful.  Ex: LoLKing.

    TL;DR - There's probably a way larger number of people out there using stats reasonably and not acting like ass hats that you dick over by excluding stats like K/D.

    Steam: Neph

  • BatpimpBatpimp Member UncommonPosts: 29

    @odulusas

     

    I do not want ANY kind of repair maintenance of equipment in game. Cooldowns of weapons, reload times, firing rate. Those are all fine. But i dont want to log on and repair virtual items in a virtual lab in my virtual spacecraft.

    I want to log in and fight in a WAR! When you think of playing this game do you think to yourself..."MAN I CANT WAIT TO LOG ON AND CLEAN MY VIRTUAL FAKE WEAPONS!...?..or do you think "MAN I CANT WAIT TO LOG ON AND USE MY WEAPONS". When i see the weapons in the game i want to USE them not clean/fix them. This isnt WoW or diablo 3. This game is supposed to be like planetside.

     

    @patrick I think you mis understood my question.

    What i meant to ask is, is the Ork Waagh going to be a part of the game? If so how? Do i press a button and my ork will yell and make the other orks around me stronger?

     

    what i meant by the word "mechanic" is if its in the game and HOW do you plan to use it?

     

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