Howdy, Stranger!
It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!
Quick Links
The reason why Everquest players are so upset...
BearKnight
Member CommonPosts: 461
Is essentially due in part that SOE over time has tried to pull new people into EQ1 by implementing a LOT of WoW's features into EQ thereby destroying what it used to be.
Many of us don't feel like the current EQ is EQ at all, and has been slowly NGE'd from its original presentation. This is why "Time Locked Progression" servers were so hellishly popular (seriously, 1982 player queues for Fippy Darkpaw in its first month). Unfortunately once those progression servers went well past Luclin, the turning point for many, the population dropped like a literal rock. Those servers are almost ghost towns now because they're into expansions everyone from the original EQ HATES with a passion.
So why the fuss over EQ:Next? Well, to put it bluntly, we wanted a fresh start with a fresh mindset but within the EQ franchise. Some hoped SOE was simply going to do an EQ1 rehash, but this time being a true sandbox game.
The fuss about the "Graphics", or Art-Style, is all about the fact that being "Stylized" means having low-poly models that are meant for "Mainstream" audiences. When they go the Mainstream route for graphics it is almost a certainty that they are going to dumb everything else down as well. Everquest has never been an "easy" franchise, that's why it isn't mainstream. Everquest fans are used to working for what they have, and not being able to buy power or simply walk over encounters that should be hard.
What they're doing with Everquest:Next is absolutely no different than the developers for WoW coming in and saying they're changing the Warcraft franchise up to be a 100% open-world pvp sandbox game with hardcore death penalties and ruthless political warfare with hardcore demanding graphics. Quite frankly, WoW fans would go ABSOLUTELY nuts in the most negative way possible, just like EQ:N fans. Why so many of you are shocked by this is a surprise in and of itself.
When someone comes in to ruin something that is special to you, you get upset. That's what this is to MANY Everquest fans, a complete disrespect of the Everquest franchise just to get more money. SOE is abandoning the fans that have supported their paychecks for more than 10years for a different audience.
Say what you want, but it does hurt. That's all, and I know for a fact that if someone came in to change up everything about something you care about you'd be upset, too.
That's all, nothing more nothing less. Please understand where we are coming from 
!
-Bear
Comments
EQ2 is part of the everquest franchise and EQ2 is similar in ease to WOW
EQ2 fan sites
How is it flawed logic?
Lower polygon models means larger audiences can play on MUCH older PC's. When WoW released it was compatible with Pc's from 5years prior (into the 1990's).
The logic is that the more you mainstream a product the more mainstreamed other areas become due to that mindset driving your decisions. "How many people can we get to play this game?" is the problematic thought process instead of "How much fun can we make this game for our fans!". Easy mainstreamed gameplay does NOT = fun. It is a primary tactic to get more people into your product. That's what the NGE was for SWG, that's what cataclysm was for WoW (irony in naming), and that's what EQ:Next is for the EQ franchise.
The more advanced AI is ALSO not an acceptable copout for their combat system. You can STILL have a trinity system, and have an amazingly smart AI. They're just not willing to do innovation into how the Trinity system, or class system, works to cope with the more Advanced AI. They've already closed themselves in from the idea that they could do better so instead they decided to copy GW2's combat system to fill that hole in innovation.
It's a copout for more work, nothing else.
As for the comments about EQ2, it wasn't originally a WoW-clone. They did that post-release to compete with WoW, but at that time SOE hadn't realized that copying WoW == failure at best case. EQ2 was meant as, again, a spiritual successor, but then ended up changing it later to bring in a broader audience.
In other words EQ2's developers attempted to "Mainstream" it post-release, but ended in failure. You can't mainstream a product post-launch, it has proven time and time again to be a BAD idea. So this time they're doing it during developement with EQ:Next.
I dont think we see a game like eq1 in near future,a game where practicly nothing is soloable.
Devs want lots of people to play their games and if you need a group to kill a simple monster then people wont play the game.
Another thing we might expect in furure games is endgame content made for small groups and solo players.
The last few years most games has been so called solo and small group friendly but that did only count till max level, after reaching level cap and finished class quest only group-raid focused content was avaliable. This did result in people leaving the games only a month or two after release.
Therefore I beleve games will have more option in the future for those people who dont like raids and groups containing more than 2-3 players.
Dont get me wrong I like raids,well at least I did like raids,things change all the time,wonder why.
Based on SOE's EQ nostalgia video, I'd say you guys got more than your money's worth.
I mean, EQ cured illnesses, blindness, made babies, got people married, saved lives!
So carry on playing EQ then and don't play EQN , All developers will aim there game to appeal to the masses not a minority regardless of loyal fanbase.
Its about the money so I'm pretty sure they don't give a toss if a few are upset.
Probably because EQ fans want the new game to not be a shallow, console job like DCUO and PS2 are, and neither of those games are even MMORPGs.
But with "action combat" and "8 actions", console is exactly what SOE is doing with EQN.
Theres a reason the game is not called EQ3. You need to get over it. The game isnt being made for EQ1 or EQ2 players. Its a new product going in a completely different direction. If they wanted to remake EQ1 with better graphics they very well might have made EQ3, but that just isnt what they wanted.
I played EQ1, i even played EQ2 since the early beta, and still have an EQ2 gold account, so I have over a decade playing in Norrath. And Im not disappointed or insulted in the direction EQN is going. Im smart enough to know when they told everyone years ago that it was a reimagining of the franchise and that they would be doing something different, that you should actually expect something different. To still keep your hopes up that it was going to be EQ3 after all these years of them telling EVERYONE that it wasnt, well you would have to be living under a rock, or be brain dead.
Im excited for EQN, i cant wait to see more of it, to learn what the other features and systems are, and of course to get my hands on EQN Landmark to try to make some of the things that will be used in EQN. Im also still keeping my EQ2 gold account. See how those are two different things and one has nothing to do with the other. Time to move on and stop QQing.
Are you nuts?
Low Poly model? Are you high or what? Really! This is a game with Voxels. Voxels is the absolute future of all videogames. In fact, John Carmack and Id Software makes id Tech 6 which will have only voxels in them with new C++ language. Models in EQN are made with absolutely incredible detail that offers fantastic and smooth animation. Besides that (!) the game has clothes-physics on them and at some point in the game you can change it and crafters will be involved in the process.
and the art-style actually is good compared to the past games in the series that looked bad from the artistical standpoint. They were bland and generic at best compared to competition. So your solution is to make the best graphics possible? Let me remind to you that if your MMO is trying to have the best graphics available prepare to be dissapointed because next year there will be a game with better graphics. With EQ2 they wanted to make the best visuals available and I remember that day when WoW and EQ2 launched. EQ2 required some serious PC graphics card and the result was not that big of a deal compared to WoW which looked stunning and alive for that day and it's still looks great. Mists Of Pandaria art-style is fantastic.
the point of cell-shaded visuals is that thegame is not going to get old so fast. That is the reason why WoW looks so good to this day and that is the reason why SOE devs went to this route and this is actually a very good strategy and it has nothing to do with mass market.
Mass Market is accessibility first of all. That's all depends on the content, lore and gameplay and so far EQN offers new ideas that can change MMO's for a better way. We still don't have a clear picture of what this MMO will be but I know for sure that this game has a potential to be the best MMO out there and have more subscribers then Blizzard ever imagined.
I'd say EQ2 is even easier than WoW. With the built in macro system you can literally just 1 button level your character to max level and then only use about 4 button regularly during raids; Single Target, AOE, Debuff, Self Buff/Heals (depending on class of course).. with the occasional situational skill slipping in here and there.
I consider myself to be a complete mmo cynic. Im as hardcore as it gets. Just like you. I want my old days back coupled with the true innovations of the future that unlock the ultimate hardcore sandbox experience. But i will say this: The stylized graphics of EQN have no bearing on why im upset about what is to come. Its more than anything an attempt to keep the game engine from aging too rapidly and as long as there is soul and personality in the art direction, i dont have a problem with it AT ALL.
That being said, what DOES upset me, Is the current trend for AAA mmo developers to literally abolish the genre. The overbearing need to combine genres and breed until its evolved so far away from its core that is no longer delivers the same experience in any way shape or form. This website was CREATED because MMORPGS were a specific type of game that appealed to a specific type of gamer. And now, what it seems is that those who helped forge the path for the future of this genre, cant seem to further themselves away from the player base they originally built it for. These games are not made for me anymore. They are made for the new generation of gamers. Young people who read less, grow up with internet porn and cell phones and all manner of entertainment and screens at their disposal. It seems like the world has gone mad, but the mmorpg scene is just a cross section of what is happening all across the world in every form of entertainment and media. Look at popular music from the 50's-80's and then now. Movies...etc etc. Its all the same. We are just another victim in a different form. Good luck sir, we will need it and i hope one day our desires will be answered and SOMEONE will be honest enough to deliver the goods.
Hm,how could EQ2 been a wow clone, it was released earlyer than wow.
Soe did several Changes in the game few months after release,those were made since people were leaving the game,I know I left the game only a month after release and came back few months later to find out the game had got lot better but not like wow at all.
It's not. First of all developers developing this game for the PC and then when it's done they will probably port a game for PS4.
Old Everquest titles could be for the Playstation too. The only reason why EQ1 and 2 were not on consoles is because Online infrastructure was bad or not at the same level as a PC.
But everything changed. Consoles right now are more or less has the functionality of the PC so you can see a trend where a lot of MMO's are moving to consoles too.
Why should a PC owner be forced to accept low tech console graphics ?
Should we all be forced to buy $15,000 cars instead of the $28,000 cars we may want ?
Should I be forced to buy a 3 bedroom house when I want 4 ?
Sony/Smedley can do anything they want. Customers who are asked to spend their discretionary dollars can do what they want as well.
Am I upset ? No. Disappointed..yes
The devs have some great ideas.(ideas do not = a game)
I simply won't accept a persona to represent me that looks like it should be on the front of a kids sugar cereal box.
<- EQ Player
Ok I got over the graphics a little bit because I think some things can be "fixed". If people want a bit darker and grittier atmosphere, just change a few things around.
My worry is the combat. The "no trinity" idea has never worked out well in any game I played.
I'm on the fence, I'm not really upset, but yah, this isn't how I imagined it would be.
Certainly, if EQ:N had been called Free Realms Next, there would have been far less outcry. The lore and memories generated in the EverQuest franchise are difficult to beat. The loyal fanbase loves the lore, the gameplay and even the dated graphics.
EverQuest: Next isn't being built for their existing customers. SOE already has those people under its corporate wing and is carefully extracting their money. Moving the existing customers from one game to a newer version doesn't garner SOE any new revenue, it just shuffles the money from the EQ1 or EQ2 pockets into the EQ:N pocket. It's the same revenue, just different pockets. And that's what they are aiming for -- more revenue.
They want money from the console market and the PC gamer who occasionally plays Call of Duty or other style games. By offering a new product, SOE hopes to increase their customer base. That this new experience contains role-playing elements is a comfortable shoe for SOE; they've built RPs before and they are familiar with that. They're just trying to leverage their history of building RP environments and market it to a new set of customers.
With no box sales to drive revenues (a byproduct of the f2p business model), there is little incentive for SOE to make a new game for its existing customers. So, they are looking outside of their core marketplace to find new customers. The sad part of this is the reality that those that actually went to SOELive and saw the great reveal in person, well, they aren't the primary customer for this new product.
And deep down, this hurts.
*sigh* Depressed myself again.
Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.
Please, explain to me how they are doing this? As far as I can tell, they have provided you a gaming experience on EQ1 since the day you started paying them to do so. They owe you nothing, as you paid for the value you received along the way. They could shut down the servers for good tomorrow, and they wouldn't owe you anything - but at least then you could claim they are abandoning you.
I don't get the feeling of abandonment that people are spouting about. SOE is pushing the envelope with their new games and progression the genre in a positive way for the MAJORITY, not the few that enjoy the same old thing over and over again. What is the point of making an updated game, visually, but keeping the same mechanics and features as the old game? Money would be better spent simply updating the models in the older game if at all possible. Players don't want to leave behind years of effort and work and relationships just for better graphics. Do you get how insane that is? You are in the minority here, I can assure you. As an EQ player from '99, I can honestly say I am glad they didn't go the safe route and make another Rift.
I think if you look past the features and the mechanics of the game, assuming the game goes in the direction it seems to be, you will have the same "feeling" that made you fall in love with EQ in the first place. If you have been playing EQ for as long as you claim to, and somehow still have the same amount of free time you had back then, then perhaps you need to re-evaluate where you are in your life and pay attention to what you are neglecting. I am sure many other veterans can relate to me: I simply don't have the time for another EQ Classic experience that I did back in '99-'01.
If you are so upset with the game, don't support it. Continue to play the original Everquest, or go ahead and play one of the other games that are going to be coming out that seem to capture the essence of what the original Everquest was in both feeling and playstyle.
This is silly, of course they owe EQ players something.
We supported the game, all you people who jumped to WoW or Guild Wars or played the game for 2 years and bailed did not.
If it wasn't for EQ players you would not even be on this forum right now.
Their funding for EQNext is coming from EQ player's pockets.
It is completely normal that EQ players feel like they should honor the franchise where possible.
I agree 100% x 2 with OP. These GEEDY BASTARDS OWE US AN UPDATED EQOA OR EQ1, SHAME ON SMEDLY! SHAME ON YOU SOE!!! Make your eq next, but you owe us eq players a new updated version of our EQ1 and EQOA, we paid for your new games you create and that's the thanks we get in return, SHAMMMMMEEEE!!!!!!!!
If they don't announce a new updated game for EQOA or EQ1 its over when ESO comes out, they wont see another $75 bucks a month from me ever again, its going to someone who can create the old school MMORPG games we want!
So what is the issue with Holy Trinity? There is none.
That's why Sony Online Entertainment hired "STORY BRICKS" www.storybricks.com developer that will create the AI system for mobs. Holy trinity is an old idea that worked well for only one game "World Of Warcraft" and Blizzard did everything with it what possible and impossible with it. you can't do something more with that system because it is limited. AI in this system does not exist.
If you can create good AI the possibilities are endless and battles in the end will have more depth, strategy and tactics. In the end you can also upgrade scripts and AI with patches and that is what Story Bricks are going to do with EQN.
I played it, it is really fun but I had issues with the low population. Especially when I needed to collect enough arena points for my weapon.
But I like it regardless, Vexal Exchange (am I spelling this right)...and the cave dungeon behind it were such a blast! Good game.