Please devs, NO MORE OTS GAMES...

AtmaDarkwolf · July 2013

Or at least give us the option to move the camera where WE want.

I don't know about other gamers, but the OTS (Over the shoulder) third person view in games gives me a hellish headache, and even if its 'tolerable' it feels unnatural and 'wrong' when playing. If you MUST include this crappy lazy format, at least let us move the camera where WE want it(Above the head aka typical 3rd person)

Anyways sorry for the rant, just spent a week reviewing 2 games, thinking both (From gameplay videos and screenshots) had proper 3rd person controls, only to find that during combat both were 'forced' into a horrible 3rd person OTS mode that gave me a headache. (Find many mmo's doing this now too) - Feel like I wasted 70 bucks on two 'discounted' games I will never be able to play.

So please, stop excluding the classic third person view from your games, which honestly don't take anything from your game, isn't a great deal of 'extra' work to include, and don't feel like I'm some midget sitting on the hero's shoulder (Or running along behind him)

Squeak69 · July 2013

I don't know of many MMOs that are over the shoulder instead of over head or FP, I do agree however that the games I do know off that are like this are annoying to play, although I have only ran into one or two SP games that do this.

what MMOs are like this, out of curiosity.

Kaijin2k3 · July 2013

Well, while you hate OTS games, there are people that can not stand FP cameras for one reason or another. Those that really do not like over head (or "proper 3rd person," as you put it), and even those that really do not like isometric. And on the flip side, you have the groups that love them.

So if the devs did as you wished, and stripped OTS cams, you'd be a happy camper along with others who feel the same way. But then you'd have those that loved OTS unhappy, and you'll have a new group that is unhappy because they'd probably switch to a camera that they like a whole lot less than OTS.

Heh heh. I do like your suggestion of being able to set your camera in the options, although I'm sure that ends up being easier said than done.

BTW, your suggestions are far more neutral than your title. Are you allowed to say what 2 games were the straw that broke the back?

Dreamo84 · July 2013

The whole argument fell apart when you called it "lazy" how is it any easier than a "proper"(as you put it) third person view?

Isn't it usually just shooters that use the OTS view anyways? It makes sense for those, you don't want the character's body to be in the way of your reticle. Not sure what other genres would use it or have.

Sovrath · July 2013

Originally posted by Fendel84M
The whole argument fell apart when you called it "lazy" how is it any easier than a "proper"(as you put it) third person view?

Isn't it usually just shooters that use the OTS view anyways? It makes sense for those, you don't want the character's body to be in the way of your reticle. Not sure what other genres would use it or have.

yeah I agree with you.

There is nothing lazy about having the camera in one place over another place. Just a way for the OP to disparage a certain design decision.

Still, if a game developer can allow for a change in camera type I don't see why not.

AtmaDarkwolf · July 2013

Let me just drop one example, just to both illistrate the laziness and the 'can go both ways' arguments.

Skyrim.

It had that annoying(Although not as bad as SOME games) OTS mode when in combat, that was fixed not even 20 min after the game was released. I am not even kidding, I got a call that my pre-order was in, I did a quick search and found a mod for it to fix the camera.

It took modders litterly a few seconds after they got the game that they were able to 'modify' it so that those who WANTED the 3rd/over the head camera could have it.

THATS what i mean both by laziness and 'excluding' something just... beacause.

azzamasin · July 2013

I agree with you that OTS sucks but I wouldn't call it lazy design. I prefer the over the head proper 3rd person view myself but at least OTS view isn;t as bad as Isometric top down view or first person. Those are 2 views I detest heavily.

Whjat 2 MMO's are we talking about? Defiance? TESO? Any others that use a OTS view?

azzamasin · July 2013

Originally posted by AtmaDarkwolf
Let me just drop one example, just to both illistrate the laziness and the 'can go both ways' arguments.

Skyrim.

It had that annoying(Although not as bad as SOME games) OTS mode when in combat, that was fixed not even 20 min after the game was released. I am not even kidding, I got a call that my pre-order was in, I did a quick search and found a mod for it to fix the camera.

It took modders litterly a few seconds after they got the game that they were able to 'modify' it so that those who WANTED the 3rd/over the head camera could have it.

THATS what i mean both by laziness and 'excluding' something just... beacause.

Do you recall the mod that changes it to over the head view? I too found this one of the worst aspects in Skyrim.

AtmaDarkwolf · July 2013

Originally posted by azzamasin
Originally posted by AtmaDarkwolf
Let me just drop one example, just to both illistrate the laziness and the 'can go both ways' arguments.

Skyrim.

It had that annoying(Although not as bad as SOME games) OTS mode when in combat, that was fixed not even 20 min after the game was released. I am not even kidding, I got a call that my pre-order was in, I did a quick search and found a mod for it to fix the camera.

It took modders litterly a few seconds after they got the game that they were able to 'modify' it so that those who WANTED the 3rd/over the head camera could have it.

THATS what i mean both by laziness and 'excluding' something just... beacause.

Do you recall the mod that changes it to over the head view? I too found this one of the worst aspects in Skyrim.

Yes, but the point is, with a mod that took moments to create allowed people the choice. If the dev's had put it in themselves, it would have taken them seconds to 'code' it yet they left it out.

My point is, when you have 'action' combat, the choice of where the camera exists in the 3rd person prespective, should be left to the player, since the adjustment of the pov does not 'hinder' the game play. (Yet the lack of such a choice DOES hinder it)

For mmo's I can point to, to some extents, firefall, dragons nest, dragons prophet, etc. Almost EVERY SINGLE new 'action' mmo has the forced OTS view. Some less than others(like NW isn't so bad, nor is tera) but some are absolutly horrible and just make the player feel hes running sideways (And you can see this in gameplay vids because the player keeps 'adjusting' to the left or he runs into walls)

its a very, very small change I am requesting, and does not 'impact' anyone who prefers the OTS view in the least. Yet some games absolutley refuse to allow even player-made modding to 'fix' it.(Like give IP bans if you attempt to write your own)

azzamasin · July 2013

Originally posted by AtmaDarkwolf
Originally posted by azzamasin
Originally posted by AtmaDarkwolf
Let me just drop one example, just to both illistrate the laziness and the 'can go both ways' arguments.

Skyrim.

It had that annoying(Although not as bad as SOME games) OTS mode when in combat, that was fixed not even 20 min after the game was released. I am not even kidding, I got a call that my pre-order was in, I did a quick search and found a mod for it to fix the camera.

It took modders litterly a few seconds after they got the game that they were able to 'modify' it so that those who WANTED the 3rd/over the head camera could have it.

THATS what i mean both by laziness and 'excluding' something just... beacause.

Do you recall the mod that changes it to over the head view? I too found this one of the worst aspects in Skyrim.

Yes, but the point is, with a mod that took moments to create allowed people the choice. If the dev's had put it in themselves, it would have taken them seconds to 'code' it yet they left it out.

My point is, when you have 'action' combat, the choice of where the camera exists in the 3rd person prespective, should be left to the player, since the adjustment of the pov does not 'hinder' the game play. (Yet the lack of such a choice DOES hinder it)

For mmo's I can point to, to some extents, firefall, dragons nest, dragons prophet, etc. Almost EVERY SINGLE new 'action' mmo has the forced OTS view. Some less than others(like NW isn't so bad, nor is tera) but some are absolutly horrible and just make the player feel hes running sideways (And you can see this in gameplay vids because the player keeps 'adjusting' to the left or he runs into walls)

its a very, very small change I am requesting, and does not 'impact' anyone who prefers the OTS view in the least. Yet some games absolutley refuse to allow even player-made modding to 'fix' it.(Like give IP bans if you attempt to write your own)

Ok, what was the name of the mod?

AtmaDarkwolf · July 2013

quick google search found http://skyrim.nexusmods.com/mods/7430/?

Not sure if thats the original 3rd person centerd view mod or not, but there are plenty to choose from.

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Please devs, NO MORE OTS GAMES...

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Please devs, NO MORE OTS GAMES...

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