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"Just under 500k"
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More importantly, does it really matter? The people who don't like the game, don't play it, the few who do like it, let them enjoy it while it last's as the way the game is being run atm, I don't see it having a long life as do many others apart from the die hards.
Everyone knows how EA operates ie, you cannot trust them as far you can hurl a sumo wrestler, so what's the point in arguing over figures they throw out there.
You (and observer are correct, in that people can have fun in a game with a population of 200k subscribers; WoW is a bad example (wasn't 300k!); a game like DAoC would, I suggest, be a decent one.
As observer says though it come down to revenue (cost, profit).
And not just revenue but projected revenue. Are you more likely to borrow money to set up a café on a busy beach or on a deserted beach?
If the people who give the go ahead for SWTOR content see a history of stable subs then that will look good. Or constant cash shop revenue. If the level of subs / cash shop revenue is falling however - despite a blip for Makeb - then they will OK less development.
Less development = less upcoming content = unhappy subscribers (see the reaction on the main forums to the 2.2 announcement, unhappy) = less subscribers = less revenue = less development = ....
Star Trek Online - Best Free MMORPG of 2012
Hmm more content? Well 1 1/2 years in I think along with about 500,000 others think they have done great at adding content. Since your the expert answer these question for the audience. How many New Flashpoints have they added? Please include the 55hm due to there being new mechanics and bonus bosses. How many new ops? How many new daily areas? Did they add a legacy feature? Did they add achievements? Did they add reputation? Did the add warzones? Are there events? Is there a new world? Is there a new race? Are there new crafting recipes? Is there new customization to your character? Are there now guild banks? New world bosses? New datacrons? Updates to each class? No speeders? [mod edit]So this new content is equivalent to what you would get if you bought Skyrim + Mass Effect 3 + Assassin's Creed + Dragon Age and, lets say, Battlefield 3.
That's about the equivalent for someone who has subbed since day 1 over and above the original box price. Allowing for the 30 days included and the 30 days free last May that's c. 15 x $15 + $10 for Makeb + $5 for the Cathar = $240.
I am not surprised that a lot of posters on the forums are unhappy and talking about leaving / taking some months off / just moving over to F2P.
EA haven't, imo, lived up to what it promised subscribers just after launch - when they were questioned about why they had made SWTOR a sub based game. I think subscribers are getting a poor deal. Someone who was a subscriber in May should, say, have gotten the Cathar free. Yes I know all about cartel coins etc. but something like the Cathar is exactly why some people prefer to subscribe.
So this new content is equivalent to what you would get if you bought Skyrim + Mass Effect 3 + Assassin's Creed + Dragon Age and, lets say, Battlefield 3.
That's about the equivalent for someone who has subbed since day 1 over and above the original box price. Allowing for the 30 days included and the 30 days free last May that's c. 15 x $15 + $10 for Makeb + $5 for the Cathar = $240.
I am not surprised that a lot of posters on the forums are unhappy and talking about leaving / taking some months off / just moving over to F2P.
EA haven't, imo, lived up to what it promised subscribers just after launch - when they were questioned about why they had made SWTOR a sub based game. I think subscribers are getting a poor deal. Someone who was a subscriber in May should, say, have gotten the Cathar free. Yes I know all about cartel coins etc. but something like the Cathar is exactly why some people prefer to subscribe.
You've described an issue with P2P MMOs in general, not SWToR in particular.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
They have added content, but that content didn't bring back all those players lost, and that's the real issue at hand. Hovering around 500k is terrible, compared to how many digital accounts/boxes they sold before/after launch. Take Rift for example, they've added more content to the game than swtor, but in the end, they still merged servers, one of their top guys left the company (scott hartsman), and now it's going f2p. The bottom line is, that the game will suffer because there won't be a stable population to enjoy all this content.
just to put it out there.
how many players can a server hold at a time?
there's what? maybe 8 servers. if it's 400,000; then, that's 50,000 per server, if there's 8 servers. if they're down to 6, then it's more like 66,666 players per server. 25% more on either number if it's "close to" half a million.
that is, IF everyone played at the same time, and they do need to take that into account.
the little that my guildmates and i have played lately - there is quite a bit of lag, no matter which state we are in, nor which coast server we play on.
i just don't see them having a f2p/cash shop operation going on, anticipating over 80,000 folks at HEAVY times (according to server status?)...
just saying. how many concurrent players (and everything they bring to the server), do you believe swtor can handle per server?
There are just under 500k sub'ers and "Since it was induced in November, [they've] added more than 1.7 million new players on the free model to the service,"
Just say'n
I only hope they get their money back. Their stake was very high, and their passion even higher. They didn't risk creating a new kind of mmo, but they did their best. They deserve goodness. Next time, I hope they leave EA out their business, and create a better kind of video-game. Something more playable and enjoyable.
May the force be with you, young padawans.
These are misguided platitudes. Bioware is responsible for everything wrong with SWTOR, EA just funded them and failed to provide oversight.
I think they left their passion in the employee bathroom, it sure didn't make it into the game. Nearly every system was incomplete and ill-conceived at launch.
The people who made this game deserve to be fired (and some were). Apologize for them some more, your fate will be more shit games.
Survivor of the great MMORPG Famine of 2011
I dont contest the validity of the games claim that they actually have just under 500k in subbers but I do highly doubt you can tell the actual numbers of subbers just from your playing the game.
i don't really care if people are subed or not or if EA is making tons of money or not.
the servers are indeed still packed like they were after F2P first launched and i think the cartel market is a good indication how many people sub (since F2P players generally are hell bent on playing a free game and not spending money) and spend money on the game, which is a lot.
people always want to talk about subs as if they are so worried about how much money EA is making, yet ignore the cartel market.
do people realize how much cash they are raking in with the cartel market?
i would bet this mmo is easily making more money than any other mmo in the west not named wow.
but again, i couldn't care less, i play it off and on because i enjoy it, not because EA is making money off it lol
I think they left their passion in the employee bathroom, it sure didn't make it into the game. Nearly every system was incomplete and ill-conceived at launch.
The people who made this game deserve to be fired (and some were). Apologize for them some more, your fate will be more shit games.
nearly every system was incomplete? people making shit up to bash SWTOR now.
not that it surprises me at all on this website.
there are 8 US servers, 9 EU servers, and 3 Asia servers. you might want to do your math again since there are actually 20 total servers and not 8, even though the 3 Asia serves are pretty dead from what i hear.
500 000
400 000
300 000
200 000
Yup, Looks like 200 000 does fit the condition of "Just under 500 000". Sure it could be another number, but why not use 200 000 just because it fits the condition. I, personally would like to use 250 001, just because it is just under 500 000. Do you have any proof that shows otherwise? That what they mean by their statement is another number? If not, just make up a number that fits the condition and use it. Don't ask for proof of something you do not have proof for yourself.
A 300 000 difference isnt that big a number to them considering the CEO salary.
Boycotting EA. Why? They suck, even moreso since 2008.
If we ignore WOW and the crazy numbers Asian games get then most good MMOs don't get more than 500k stable subs and as this is not exactly a good MMO why would anyone be shocked about the numbers.
This:
The President of EA Labels Frank Gibeau said the Star Wars game would still break even so long as it maintained 500,000 subscribers, but admitted that its current performance was "not good enough".
That was stated on 1st Aug 2012 when F2P was announced, and was stated well before, even before launch. The fact they set themselves up for that requirement spelled doom for the game
Also SWTOR did have at least 1.7 million subs, so they got the subs they just did not know what to do to keep them.
Now, because of the huge financial commitment, the content is coming in very very slowly and too far apart, and even MMOs that cost less to play (ie to get the most out of the game) get content added virtually every week. eg STO
With that the subs will continue to decline, more so than any other MMO.
It may have had "just under" 500K when the call was made, but it probably does have about 200K now, as I reckon most who were subbed at that time, subbed to get Makeb for $10, as I did.
Star Trek Online - Best Free MMORPG of 2012
Yup a lot of games on release will sell quite a bit.. especially if they are as hyped up as SWTOR.. but will nearly always drop back down to below 500k..
I can only think of 1 western MMO that has held over 1 million subs for any decent amount of time and that was WOW and thats why i think its really a 1 off.. Devs need to stop trying to compete with it.
except that there are a lot of people in the game still, which kind of puts a big hole in your reasoning, and without any real data to back up your 'guesses' you can't really even make an educated guess as to how many are actually subbing to the game, or even what proportion of the playerbase currently is F2P or P2P, its laughable though that you use a game like STO as a comparison, as the game has been an utter failure since launch, laughably so. SW;TOR hasnt exactly been a raving success, but at least now they appear to have gained ground again, which admittedly, surprised me, as i thought Bioware/EA had lost the plot when they went with the hybrid F2P/P2P model, but its worked, and yes, i am currently subscribed to the game, as are many in the guild i am in, barely more than half of the members perhaps, but there is rarely a week goes by without another member changing to a paid sub. But, i would be a bit surprised even so, if the number of paid subs to SW;TOR exceeded 500k by very much by the end of the year. As for STO's so called weekly additions to the content of the game, i don't think adding more items to the cash shop really counts
For SWTOR to have lots of people it needs to be in the millions as EA keeps stating. The amount it has is not enough, as the lack in content shows that. If F2P brought in enough revenue the expansion would not have happened, and Makeb would have been put in as the "biggest free update of any MMO" which was stated by EA when Makeb was first mentioned.
Adding to the cash shop, is all that SWTOR seems to be getting, as there was a recent uproar on the forums where subbers are feeling undervalued, the thread is here and Bioware responded here If Bioware keep making people feel that way then people will just keep unsubbing (maybe still play via F2P but spend less) and content will keep coming even slower. They did say they will look at not making people feel that way, so it could turn around, but that was only a week or so ago now, and have not had a chance to prove it yet. Also if people did quit it may not show yet, if people are just playing until the end of their sub.
STO has had plenty of proper non cash content over the year, compared to SWTOR. SWTOR announced Makeb last year, and took 10 months to get in, but STO has had Season 7, a free update, which added a planet with quests (like Makeb), it had a Winter event which you can play to get rewards (SWTOR just added life day items into the Cash Shop), for its 3rd Anniversary it got a unique mission which got you rewards and not only that but Denise Crosby from the TNG show helped create it by adding voice support to her in game character (For SWTORs anniversary it just added fireworks to the cash shop), plus recently had a FREE expansion, and is still getting Season 8 and Season 9 to come. So that is 3 major content updates and 1 expansion vs SWTORs Makeb expansion. To get all this done PWE had to hire more devs too, with some coming from City of Heroes after its closure.
STO is crappy but it is because it is cheap - STO has substance over quality = keeps people playing. SWTOR is quality over substance = enjoyable to play but only for a short while
Star Trek Online - Best Free MMORPG of 2012
The amount of angst that some posters feel in this thread is really funny (and sad) now that SWTOR is profitable for EA.
Meh, I'm enjoying the content it offers so whatever.
Gdemami -
Informing people about your thoughts and impressions is not a review, it's a blog.
there never has been a WoW killer tbh, pretty much all 'successful' MMO's since WoW have either ended up being niche games. WoW will eventually die, but, pretty much from old age rather than from competition from other MMO's, even the loss of over 1m subs from WoW doesnt seem to have helped other MMO's out, its quite possible that the loss of players has been a loss to the genre as a whole.