It's something that a lot of people in this genre won't admit, but a LOT of us are simply bored with the format. We keep getting excited and we keep getting bored again. Hell, i'm not even mad at GW2, i'm just bored with every single game now. I've gone back to playing single player games again. I broke out my snes and went through Chrono Trigger again and also switching between Morrowind and Skyrim.
I don't speak for everyone, obviously, but i do feel that alot of others think like myself, if not silently, that this genre may have run its course. The only problem is...I don't want to be done with it yet. I want one last ride. One last real, spectacular ride before i'm done.
very much agreed as someone who has been playing online games since they were all text based burnout is bound to happen.. already completely burned out on arpgs like diablo 3 and TL2 and completely burned out on FPS games.. and standard trinity themeparks as well.. i found GW2 differnt enough for me for now that I'm still having a lot of fun but yes i agree many are just burnt out
I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg
Also, you should be suspicious of people that spend more time on the forums cheerleading a game then actually playing it.
Yeah, the post per day ratios by some members here are simply amazing. Makes one wonder if some of them even play the game, perhaps just paid shills?
Wouldn't surprise me one bit.
try working a 12 hour com duty watch with nothing to do but sit at a desk monitoring radios that never have any traffic on them..gotta do something to fill out that time:)
Just started my 12 hour shift :-) Not doing the same thing but yeah I bascally get paid to sit here and screw around for 99% of my shift. I go back and forth between gaming, watching movies / shows, and posting on here throughout my shift. Sometimes all 3 at once since I have 3 monitors including my new 40" so not exactly hard to multi-task and post on the forums while playing / watching stuff too.
From the moment I logged in, GW2 had this odd feeling of aimlessness to it. I stuck with it, and got past that, to an extent.. but still, it does feel oddly pointless or something, and TBH, I can't explain it, either.
I dont think its just the lack of traditional questing, but more of something about the design philosophy that pervades every aspect of it. It is both unrewarding and uncompelling, in its lack of anything to strive for. It's all about cosmetics and achievements, with the levelling process just kinda there to slow things down. Maybe?
When I want a single-player story, I'll play a single-player game. When I play an MMO, I want a massively multiplayer world.
Strangely enough, getting this off my chest makes me feel better. Least I don't have to hold back as much when I finally decide to get my review for this game up.
Originally posted by Enigmatus Strangely enough, getting this off my chest makes me feel better. Least I don't have to hold back as much when I finally decide to get my review for this game up.
I am confused. This thread has enabled you to get up enough courage to write a review , presumably less than positive? Why didn't you just write the review and add your OP 'explanation' to it?
Everything does in time. I love GW2 and yet I didn't play it since I got into Planetside 2 beta. But I still want to play it. After I get bored with P2 (I got beta invitation and after playing for few days I still bought Alpha Squad for 40$ - rorth it !).
Before I continue, let me say this:
I never thought GW2 would be some kind of MMO revolution. I didn't think it was innovative or anything like that. I knew dynamic events weren't really dynamic.
I knew what I was getting, and I feel I did get my money's worth.
Now that that's out of the way...
I'm not 100% sure WHY I've gotten bored of it. It's become like WoW for me; I sorta wanna log in, but I'm not able to bring myself to do so.
Let me gues. You played a lot before right ? If not then probably it's not to your liking. If you did you probably burned out. Don't force yourself - it's pointless. Play something else, do something else - before you know it you will want to play it again. I often have something like that.
I play for few weeks one game, then I switch, then I switch again, then I come back and it's like that over and over again. GW2 have no subscription so there is no hurry :-) I don't understand for example people that FORCE themselves to play game BECAUSE of subscription just to get their money worth.
It definitely wasn't community, since I generally almost NEVER talk to anyone unless I was really bored. I doubt it was SPvP or WvWvW, because I had never bothered to go in there in the first place.
I eventually came up with only one major reason I could think of that could have contributed to my feeling of ennui towards GW2.
Everything has a feeling of telling you what to do, but at the same time, it feels like there is no definite goal to work towards. The result is a feeling of pointlessness.
Then again what IS the point of ANY MMO ? You play for weeks, months or years just to play something else without gaining ANYTHING from time you invested in that game. You have virtual character that is 100% useless.
So ? Point of MMO is to play with others. To play with others you must interact with them. Now you are telling us that you DON'T play with others while playing MULTIPLAYER game. So why don't you pick singleplayer RPG instead ?
GW2 is group oriented multiplayer game. It's design this way so you should do stuff in groups. If you don't then only problem is YOU.
Unfortunately, I cannot figure out how to really explain this, and I really need to log off right now, so I'll add more stuff later.
Simple. You are bored and you need a break OR you are not MMO person. That you must figure out yourself.
Because it more closely resembles first-gen games than it does modern themeparks. Games lacking sufficient (or any) quest content, you are on your own for creating motivators.
Not much goal-focusing from the game itself. "Herding", if you want the cynically accepted term.
Regardless of how you feel about themeparks 'herding' players, it works pretty well. Break up that, long term, get-the-next-level goal into a series of small, easily achievable short-term goals.
But the games just can't win with quests. Too many, 'hold holding, clone'. Too few, 'omg grind',
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
Originally posted by stealthbr What if I told you a game's fun factor is directly tied to many things.
But those things depend on the person. Personally, I never cared about gear grind / massive amounts of progression in an MMO, in fact it usually takes away from my version of "fun". I find the interaction with others, especially competing vs others in PvP, fun and it is my main reason for playing any form of online games. Gear progression just hinders your being able to compete on an equal level, which means it takes longer for people like me to start having fun. For people like this, GW2 works out great.
For people who consider extensive gear grind and months / years of progression fun.... wtf are you even playing GW2 for? Its been known for a couple years that it wasnt going to be part of the game. Just makes no sense to see people complaining about lack of those things when anyone with like 2nd grade reading skills could have figured out it wasnt going to be there and it shouldnt be expected.
Originally posted by Enigmatus Strangely enough, getting this off my chest makes me feel better. Least I don't have to hold back as much when I finally decide to get my review for this game up.
I am confused. This thread has enabled you to get up enough courage to write a review , presumably less than positive? Why didn't you just write the review and add your OP 'explanation' to it?
Uh, no it didn't actually. I haven't even started on the review yet XP.
Personally, I never cared about gear grind / massive amounts of progression in an MMO.
It's more like an aspect of RPG's. You are taking up the role of another being. Unless that being is flat (which would make absolutely no sense whatsoever), it will develop. Therefore, progression systems are essential to RPG's, and it is something GW2 is lacking sorely, consequentially affecting its overall longevity.
Originally posted by stealthbr What if I told you a game's fun factor is directly tied to many things.
But those things depend on the person. Personally, I never cared about gear grind / massive amounts of progression in an MMO, in fact it usually takes away from my version of "fun". I find the interaction with others, especially competing vs others in PvP, fun and it is my main reason for playing any form of online games. Gear progression just hinders your being able to compete on an equal level, which means it takes longer for people like me to start having fun. For people like this, GW2 works out great.
For people who consider extensive gear grind and months / years of progression fun.... wtf are you even playing GW2 for? Its been known for a couple years that it wasnt going to be part of the game. Just makes no sense to see people complaining about lack of those things when anyone with like 2nd grade reading skills could have figured out it wasnt going to be there and it shouldnt be expected.
I like having goals to work towards. I prefer a sandbox, with all sorts of lateral goals to choose from.. but still, having goals, that are about more than just cosmetics and achievements. Course this varies from person to person, but IMHO, its not really a good genre to try emphasising raw gameplay fun, without rewards or goals. Goals have been a huge part of RPGs, for as long as they've existed..
GW2 is a bit of a hybrid, but I don't think its close enough to its action side to succeed longterm, without giving players more to strive for. As much as I love the combat, it just doesn't carry the game that entirely.
When I want a single-player story, I'll play a single-player game. When I play an MMO, I want a massively multiplayer world.
Originally posted by kaiser3282 Originally posted by stealthbr What if I told you a game's fun factor is directly tied to many things.
But those things depend on the person. Personally, I never cared about gear grind / massive amounts of progression in an MMO, in fact it usually takes away from my version of "fun". I find the interaction with others, especially competing vs others in PvP, fun and it is my main reason for playing any form of online games. Gear progression just hinders your being able to compete on an equal level, which means it takes longer for people like me to start having fun. For people like this, GW2 works out great.
For people who consider extensive gear grind and months / years of progression fun.... wtf are you even playing GW2 for? Its been known for a couple years that it wasnt going to be part of the game. Just makes no sense to see people complaining about lack of those things when anyone with like 2nd grade reading skills could have figured out it wasnt going to be there and it shouldnt be expected.
I like having goals to work towards. I prefer a sandbox, with all sorts of lateral goals to choose from.. but still, having goals, that are about more than just cosmetics and achievements. Course this varies from person to person, but IMHO, its not really a good genre to try emphasising raw gameplay fun, without rewards or goals. Goals have been a huge part of RPGs, for as long as they've existed..
GW2 is a bit of a hybrid, but I don't think its close enough to its action side to succeed longterm, without giving players more to strive for. As much as I love the combat, it just doesn't carry the game that entirely.
GW2 isnt an hybrid it's a themepark through and through, ArcheAge is an hybrid EQ is a hybrid and EQNext will be a hybrid.
I like having goals to work towards. I prefer a sandbox, with all sorts of lateral goals to choose from.. but still, having goals, that are about more than just cosmetics and achievements. Course this varies from person to person, but IMHO, its not really a good genre to try emphasising raw gameplay fun, without rewards or goals. Goals have been a huge part of RPGs, for as long as they've existed..
GW2 is a bit of a hybrid, but I don't think its close enough to its action side to succeed longterm, without giving players more to strive for. As much as I love the combat, it just doesn't carry the game that entirely.
GW2 isnt an hybrid it's a themepark through and through, ArcheAge is an hybrid EQ is a hybrid and EQNext will be a hybrid.
Sorry for being unclear. I didn't mean hybrid sandbox / themepark. I meant hybrid action / RPG.
When I want a single-player story, I'll play a single-player game. When I play an MMO, I want a massively multiplayer world.
Originally posted by drakaena Fans of this game keep pointing out that there are carrots to chase for those that want them. True, enough. I don't disagree. Problem is, those carrots are inferrior to other themepark games. GW2 dungeons don't even come close to comparing to raids in WoW or Rift. GW2 sPvP is an esport without any incentive whatsoever. WTF? WvW is a giant circle jerk of castle swapping for fast rep. So PvP is lacking incentive and easily exploited and instance PvE is underwhelming at best. What am I missing here? It's not that there isn't carrots to gnaw, it's that they taste rotten.
lol umm have you even been playing WvW ? this isn't fusang.. also what is the purpose of you getting that top raid gear in wow or Rift or that top PVP gear?
Have you? Because I share a vent with guilds that coordinate point swapping. Doh. Who said anything about purpose, THEY ARENT AS GOOD. It's an inferrior design. Are you going to sit here and tell me with a straight face you think GW2 instance PvE is done as well as the other two Themepark games I mentioned? No.
i hate trinity dungeons so i can say yes.. also again why are those carrots so much better? what do you get to do with all that best gear you spent all that time raiding for or PVPing for in those other games.. its inferior to you maybe but not an inferior design overall imho bot at all... maybe people actually like it a lot better.. i know it's impossible to think others differ in opinions but it's true
It's quite simple.
WoW's appeal endgame comes from progressive loot accquired in tiered encounters. Their are two elements to why this is interesting for people:
1. Your character in increases in power with new gear, thus giving you a sense of progression
2. The amount of teamwork need to down an encounter calls for good communication and coordination. Thus when successful players find a sense of achievement and exhiliration for being part of a successful team.
Now that's the ideal situation, not everyone has that experience and it can be very difficult poltically in a raiding gear. Some people are very much turned off with the raiding scene and having been involved in it I can see why.
However I would hazard to say that this system appeals much more to average players then GW2's, as really there's no incintive power wise or social wise to put the time in for the content. Simply put people like getting more powerful stuff for their characters and seeing new bosses and murdering them makes them new friends. GW2 fails at this because there really isn't anything to work towards, you can buy the best gear and trying this stuff for looks just won't have the same pull.
WoW's appeal endgame comes from progressive loot accquired in tiered encounters. Their are two elements to why this is interesting for people:
1. Your character in increases in power with new gear, thus giving you a sense of progression
2. The amount of teamwork need to down an encounter calls for good communication and coordination. Thus when successful players find a sense of achievement and exhiliration for being part of a successful team.
Now that's the ideal situation, not everyone has that experience and it can be very difficult poltically in a raiding gear. Some people are very much turned off with the raiding scene and having been involved in it I can see why.
However I would hazard to say that this system appeals much more to average players then GW2's, as really there's no incintive power wise or social wise to put the time in for the content. Simply put people like getting more powerful stuff for their characters and seeing new bosses and murdering them makes them new friends. GW2 fails at this because there really isn't anything to work towards, you can buy the best gear and trying this stuff for looks just won't have the same pull.
you got max level with best stat gear in GW1 well before the end of the first campaign and lots still play that game 7 years later... you do not need that constant power progression to enjoy a mmorpg(although GW1 wasn't technically a MMO).. sure many do but many do not.
I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg
Comments
very much agreed as someone who has been playing online games since they were all text based burnout is bound to happen.. already completely burned out on arpgs like diablo 3 and TL2 and completely burned out on FPS games.. and standard trinity themeparks as well.. i found GW2 differnt enough for me for now that I'm still having a lot of fun but yes i agree many are just burnt out
I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg
Just started my 12 hour shift :-) Not doing the same thing but yeah I bascally get paid to sit here and screw around for 99% of my shift. I go back and forth between gaming, watching movies / shows, and posting on here throughout my shift. Sometimes all 3 at once since I have 3 monitors including my new 40" so not exactly hard to multi-task and post on the forums while playing / watching stuff too.
From the moment I logged in, GW2 had this odd feeling of aimlessness to it. I stuck with it, and got past that, to an extent.. but still, it does feel oddly pointless or something, and TBH, I can't explain it, either.
I dont think its just the lack of traditional questing, but more of something about the design philosophy that pervades every aspect of it. It is both unrewarding and uncompelling, in its lack of anything to strive for. It's all about cosmetics and achievements, with the levelling process just kinda there to slow things down. Maybe?
When I want a single-player story, I'll play a single-player game. When I play an MMO, I want a massively multiplayer world.
I am confused. This thread has enabled you to get up enough courage to write a review , presumably less than positive? Why didn't you just write the review and add your OP 'explanation' to it?
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D
Because it more closely resembles first-gen games than it does modern themeparks. Games lacking sufficient (or any) quest content, you are on your own for creating motivators.
Not much goal-focusing from the game itself. "Herding", if you want the cynically accepted term.
Regardless of how you feel about themeparks 'herding' players, it works pretty well. Break up that, long term, get-the-next-level goal into a series of small, easily achievable short-term goals.
But the games just can't win with quests. Too many, 'hold holding, clone'. Too few, 'omg grind',
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
Not gear.
Guild Wars 2 Youtube Croatian Maniacs
My Guild Wars titles
But those things depend on the person. Personally, I never cared about gear grind / massive amounts of progression in an MMO, in fact it usually takes away from my version of "fun". I find the interaction with others, especially competing vs others in PvP, fun and it is my main reason for playing any form of online games. Gear progression just hinders your being able to compete on an equal level, which means it takes longer for people like me to start having fun. For people like this, GW2 works out great.
For people who consider extensive gear grind and months / years of progression fun.... wtf are you even playing GW2 for? Its been known for a couple years that it wasnt going to be part of the game. Just makes no sense to see people complaining about lack of those things when anyone with like 2nd grade reading skills could have figured out it wasnt going to be there and it shouldnt be expected.
Uh, no it didn't actually. I haven't even started on the review yet XP.
It's more like an aspect of RPG's. You are taking up the role of another being. Unless that being is flat (which would make absolutely no sense whatsoever), it will develop. Therefore, progression systems are essential to RPG's, and it is something GW2 is lacking sorely, consequentially affecting its overall longevity.
I like having goals to work towards. I prefer a sandbox, with all sorts of lateral goals to choose from.. but still, having goals, that are about more than just cosmetics and achievements. Course this varies from person to person, but IMHO, its not really a good genre to try emphasising raw gameplay fun, without rewards or goals. Goals have been a huge part of RPGs, for as long as they've existed..
GW2 is a bit of a hybrid, but I don't think its close enough to its action side to succeed longterm, without giving players more to strive for. As much as I love the combat, it just doesn't carry the game that entirely.
When I want a single-player story, I'll play a single-player game. When I play an MMO, I want a massively multiplayer world.
But those things depend on the person. Personally, I never cared about gear grind / massive amounts of progression in an MMO, in fact it usually takes away from my version of "fun". I find the interaction with others, especially competing vs others in PvP, fun and it is my main reason for playing any form of online games. Gear progression just hinders your being able to compete on an equal level, which means it takes longer for people like me to start having fun. For people like this, GW2 works out great.
For people who consider extensive gear grind and months / years of progression fun.... wtf are you even playing GW2 for? Its been known for a couple years that it wasnt going to be part of the game. Just makes no sense to see people complaining about lack of those things when anyone with like 2nd grade reading skills could have figured out it wasnt going to be there and it shouldnt be expected.
I like having goals to work towards. I prefer a sandbox, with all sorts of lateral goals to choose from.. but still, having goals, that are about more than just cosmetics and achievements. Course this varies from person to person, but IMHO, its not really a good genre to try emphasising raw gameplay fun, without rewards or goals. Goals have been a huge part of RPGs, for as long as they've existed..
GW2 is a bit of a hybrid, but I don't think its close enough to its action side to succeed longterm, without giving players more to strive for. As much as I love the combat, it just doesn't carry the game that entirely.
GW2 isnt an hybrid it's a themepark through and through, ArcheAge is an hybrid EQ is a hybrid and EQNext will be a hybrid.Sorry for being unclear. I didn't mean hybrid sandbox / themepark. I meant hybrid action / RPG.
When I want a single-player story, I'll play a single-player game. When I play an MMO, I want a massively multiplayer world.
It's quite simple.
WoW's appeal endgame comes from progressive loot accquired in tiered encounters. Their are two elements to why this is interesting for people:
1. Your character in increases in power with new gear, thus giving you a sense of progression
2. The amount of teamwork need to down an encounter calls for good communication and coordination. Thus when successful players find a sense of achievement and exhiliration for being part of a successful team.
Now that's the ideal situation, not everyone has that experience and it can be very difficult poltically in a raiding gear. Some people are very much turned off with the raiding scene and having been involved in it I can see why.
However I would hazard to say that this system appeals much more to average players then GW2's, as really there's no incintive power wise or social wise to put the time in for the content. Simply put people like getting more powerful stuff for their characters and seeing new bosses and murdering them makes them new friends. GW2 fails at this because there really isn't anything to work towards, you can buy the best gear and trying this stuff for looks just won't have the same pull.
This looks like a job for....The Riviera Kid!
you got max level with best stat gear in GW1 well before the end of the first campaign and lots still play that game 7 years later... you do not need that constant power progression to enjoy a mmorpg(although GW1 wasn't technically a MMO).. sure many do but many do not.
I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg