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WvWvW woes.

WvWvW has been incredibly successful in GW2, however there are several changes I would very much appreciate, along with some additions I believe will make it better.

The Maps

The maps, while very good, get incredibly boring after a while. I would like to see new maps in the future, jungles, swamps, mountains, cities... The present maps I believe seem boring. You have some cliffs, then huge tracks of flat snowy land that is  boring to look at after a while. It is too easy to traverse, and makes traveling seem much longer than it really is. Have you ever been in a long car ride? It feels like that. I hate snow. I refuse to play norn now becuase of this. The lake in the center is just a giant hole filled with Krait. Where are thesunken ships? The Towers of slaves? The maps are just so flat and bland the only excitement is in a zerg, becuase there is color... not some giant expanse of lifeless snow..

Another issue I find is the lack of life in keeps, towers, etc. Why am I defending here exactly? Theres no people, no life, no real reason other than for some random points that pop up. I would like to see more npcs, they dont have to attack. They just need to be there to add to the immersion and "why am I even here?".

The Mechanics and Siege

So far, the basic functions have been great, with the exception of some balancing. It is confusing to get into WvWvW at first, and I would like to see a future tutorial for newer people. However there is one problem that kind of erks me: the simple knocking down of the door. I hate that. It is boring most of the time, and you often dont even face any real competition from the defenders. I have an idea to fix that: add more npc defense to the keeps (this would also help in the lfieless problem I said above), and give the attackers more siege.

Steps and Ladders

One type of siege I've thought up are ladders, or even wall siege.Basically, they allow for the transport of people over the wall. They would be very expensive, allow only a small amount of people in at a time, and would have to be placed right by the wall, where it is mrope easily created. These would help greatly in the siege of walled places, and add another layer of fun to the game, instead of everyone centering themselves around the door. The gate wouldn't have to be open to do this.

Walls

Another seige weapon for the offensive people can be walls. They would be relatively weak, cheap, but would take a small amount fo time to set up. This would help greatly in the event a group of people have set up 10000 arrow carts on the walls of a keep, the walls would "block" the siege and allow players to hide behind it. One limit however is that they can not be placed right next to each other, and can be passed though by anyone. This would allow for much more organized play, and add to the immersion of WvWvW sieging.

Server Pride

I don't know the name of my server. I don't care. I may be the onyl one, but I feel no server pride. Quite frankly this should be changed all together, and I propose something completely new to this:

Alliance and Guild pride Pride

This would be much better. Guild would be able to cap and "flag" as normal keeps and towers. However, "Allaince Flags" would be on the StoneMist Castle. The point of this is to feel proe for your community, whether or not your in a guild or not. Putting mroe focus on Guilds and Alliances would allow for more organized competition, and more pride for your sevrer overall. Adding some small "shows" would greatly increase pride, such as fireworks spelling out alliance names over Stonemist Castle, NPC conversations about the score at that moment... such as "It seems *insert server name here* isnt doing to good..." or "The Allince *insert name here* has captured the castle!". NPC parties within the castles would insue, opening up chances to buy crafting materials, holiday stuff, etc. to whoever controls the castle at that moment. All tese things would be rather small, simple implementations and woudl drastically affect how I (and I am sure other people) would feel about the thigns they fight for.

Edit: Also make the games longer for politics sake. Maybe up to a month. I have yet to play 2 weeks yet as we have not reached that point, but I expect it to be to short.

Please post your thoughts!

 

 

Comments

  • redman875redman875 Member Posts: 230
    Originally posted by KingJiggly

    WvWvW has been incredibly successful in GW2, however there are several changes I would very much appreciate, along with some additions I believe will make it better.

     

     

    I think a whole hell of a lot of people would disagree with this statement.

  • WolvardsWolvards Member Posts: 650
    Originally posted by redman875
    Originally posted by KingJiggly

    WvWvW has been incredibly successful in GW2, however there are several changes I would very much appreciate, along with some additions I believe will make it better.

     

     

    I think a whole hell of a lot of people would disagree with this statement.

    I think a whole hell of a lot of people would disagree with this statement.

    The "Youtube Pro": Someone who watches video's on said subject, and obviously has a full understanding of what is being said about such subject.

  • MelkrowMelkrow Member Posts: 278

    WvWvW failed before it was born, as soon as they decided to rotate servers. Rotating servers means NO POLITICS what so ever, no rivalry, it becomes pointless. Like you said, no server pride, you don't even care who you are fighting or how well your server is doing. W/out politics, this system will fail, and fail hard, and I don't see this changing unless they bring actual 'guilds' into the picture, or some other sort of permanence to people's accomplishments.



    image


    Playing: Darkfall Unholy Wars
    Played: Darkfall, EVE, AoC, Ryzom, Ragnarok Online, GW2, PS2, Secret World, WOW, City Of Heroes/Villains, Champion Online.
  • KingJigglyKingJiggly Member Posts: 777
    Originally posted by Wolvards
    Originally posted by redman875
    Originally posted by KingJiggly

    WvWvW has been incredibly successful in GW2, however there are several changes I would very much appreciate, along with some additions I believe will make it better.

     

     

    I think a whole hell of a lot of people would disagree with this statement.

    I think a whole hell of a lot of people would disagree with this statement.

    I agree with both of you :P Now please, comment on what I wrote, not on your simple opinions about how the game is going.

  • KingJigglyKingJiggly Member Posts: 777
    Originally posted by Drvanitus

    WvWvW failed before it was born, as soon as they decided to rotate servers. Rotating servers means NO POLITICS what so ever, no rivalry, it becomes pointless. Like you said, no server pride, you don't even care who you are fighting or how well your server is doing. W/out politics, this system will fail, and fail hard, and I don't see this changing unless they bring actual 'guilds' into the picture, or some other sort of permanence to people's accomplishments.

     

    Agreed. I would also make the games much longer, 3 weeks to a month. If you want to change, go ahead.

  • WolvardsWolvards Member Posts: 650
    Originally posted by KingJiggly

    WvWvW has been incredibly successful in GW2, however there are several changes I would very much appreciate, along with some additions I believe will make it better.

    The Maps

    The maps, while very good, get incredibly boring after a while. I would like to see new maps in the future, jungles, swamps, mountains, cities... The present maps I believe seem boring. You have some cliffs, then huge tracks of flat snowy land that is  boring to look at after a while. It is too easy to traverse, and makes traveling seem much longer than it really is. Have you ever been in a long car ride? It feels like that. I hate snow. I refuse to play norn now becuase of this. The lake in the center is just a giant hole filled with Krait. Where are thesunken ships? The Towers of slaves? The maps are just so flat and bland the only excitement is in a zerg, becuase there is color... not some giant expanse of lifeless snow..

    Another issue I find is the lack of life in keeps, towers, etc. Why am I defending here exactly? Theres no people, no life, no real reason other than for some random points that pop up. I would like to see more npcs, they dont have to attack. They just need to be there to add to the immersion and "why am I even here?".

    I'm fairly certain ANet has said that in given time, each server will have their own "borderlands". What this means exactly I don't know. Is it completely different? Just slight variations? Do they have 3-6 maps that get picked at random upon new matches? I don't know.

    My feeling on the map sizes is it lacks scale. It's tiny. Zergs move around to fast, and thus amke it much more difficult to get the small mans to do much of anything. Also, the towers have little to no meaning. The main reason behind a tower in DAoC (new forntiers) is for teleporting to that towers keep. So cut the tower, cut the teleport.

    The Mechanics and Siege

    So far, the basic functions have been great, with the exception of some balancing. It is confusing to get into WvWvW at first, and I would like to see a future tutorial for newer people. However there is one problem that kind of erks me: the simple knocking down of the door. I hate that. It is boring most of the time, and you often dont even face any real competition from the defenders. I have an idea to fix that: add more npc defense to the keeps (this would also help in the lfieless problem I said above), and give the attackers more siege. 

     That's already in the upgrade menu, I'm fairly certain there is more gaurds, and upgraded gaurds Yes there is, here is the clicky

    Steps and Ladders

    One type of siege I've thought up are ladders, or even wall siege.Basically, they allow for the transport of people over the wall. They would be very expensive, allow only a small amount of people in at a time, and would have to be placed right on the wall, where it is mrope easily created. These would help greatly in the siege of walled places, and add another layer of fun to the game, instead of everyone centering themselves around the door.

    Problem with this as I see it is balancing. They would have to be tremendously weak, fairly expensive, and very limited to how many epr wall/keep. It'd be a great idea but would make defending any castle 10x harder. And for those higher population zergs, it'd make steamrolling opponents that much easier.

    Walls

    Another seige weapon for the offensive people can be walls. They would be relatively weak, cheap, but would take a small amount fo time to set up. This would help greatly in the event a group of people have set up 10000 arrow carts on the walls of a keep, the walls would "block" the siege and allow players to hide behind it. One limit however is that they can not be placed right next to each other, and can be passed though by anyone. This would allow for much more organized play, and add to the immersion of WvWvW sieging.

    This would be fun and interesting, good implementation, maybe make them destroyable via ballista/cata/treb, but arrow carts do minimal to no dps. VERY large deploy radius (maybe 5 ft wall, 45 ft radius as to not stack these everywhere)

    Server Pride

    I don't know the name of my server. I don't care. I may be the onyl one, but I feel no server pride. Quite frankly this should be changed all together, and I propose something completely new to this:

    My biggest gripe right now with WvW

     

    The "Youtube Pro": Someone who watches video's on said subject, and obviously has a full understanding of what is being said about such subject.

  • XzenXzen Member UncommonPosts: 2,607
    Hmm could they make a map with enough zones that every server could go against eachother at the same time?
  • KingJigglyKingJiggly Member Posts: 777
    Originally posted by Wolvards
    Originally posted by KingJiggly

    WvWvW has been incredibly successful in GW2, however there are several changes I would very much appreciate, along with some additions I believe will make it better.

    The Maps

    The maps, while very good, get incredibly boring after a while. I would like to see new maps in the future, jungles, swamps, mountains, cities... The present maps I believe seem boring. You have some cliffs, then huge tracks of flat snowy land that is  boring to look at after a while. It is too easy to traverse, and makes traveling seem much longer than it really is. Have you ever been in a long car ride? It feels like that. I hate snow. I refuse to play norn now becuase of this. The lake in the center is just a giant hole filled with Krait. Where are thesunken ships? The Towers of slaves? The maps are just so flat and bland the only excitement is in a zerg, becuase there is color... not some giant expanse of lifeless snow..

    Another issue I find is the lack of life in keeps, towers, etc. Why am I defending here exactly? Theres no people, no life, no real reason other than for some random points that pop up. I would like to see more npcs, they dont have to attack. They just need to be there to add to the immersion and "why am I even here?".

    I'm fairly certain ANet has said that in given time, each server will have their own "borderlands". What this means exactly I don't know. Is it completely different? Just slight variations? Do they have 3-6 maps that get picked at random upon new matches? I don't know.

    My feeling on the map sizes is it lacks scale. It's tiny. Zergs move around to fast, and thus amke it much more difficult to get the small mans to do much of anything. Also, the towers have little to no meaning. The main reason behind a tower in DAoC (new forntiers) is for teleporting to that towers keep. So cut the tower, cut the teleport.

    The Mechanics and Siege

    So far, the basic functions have been great, with the exception of some balancing. It is confusing to get into WvWvW at first, and I would like to see a future tutorial for newer people. However there is one problem that kind of erks me: the simple knocking down of the door. I hate that. It is boring most of the time, and you often dont even face any real competition from the defenders. I have an idea to fix that: add more npc defense to the keeps (this would also help in the lfieless problem I said above), and give the attackers more siege. 

     That's already in the upgrade menu, I'm fairly certain there is more gaurds, and upgraded gaurds Yes there is, here is the clicky

    Steps and Ladders

    One type of siege I've thought up are ladders, or even wall siege.Basically, they allow for the transport of people over the wall. They would be very expensive, allow only a small amount of people in at a time, and would have to be placed right on the wall, where it is mrope easily created. These would help greatly in the siege of walled places, and add another layer of fun to the game, instead of everyone centering themselves around the door.

    Problem with this as I see it is balancing. They would have to be tremendously weak, fairly expensive, and very limited to how many epr wall/keep. It'd be a great idea but would make defending any castle 10x harder. And for those higher population zergs, it'd make steamrolling opponents that much easier.

    Walls

    Another seige weapon for the offensive people can be walls. They would be relatively weak, cheap, but would take a small amount fo time to set up. This would help greatly in the event a group of people have set up 10000 arrow carts on the walls of a keep, the walls would "block" the siege and allow players to hide behind it. One limit however is that they can not be placed right next to each other, and can be passed though by anyone. This would allow for much more organized play, and add to the immersion of WvWvW sieging.

    This would be fun and interesting, good implementation, maybe make them destroyable via ballista/cata/treb, but arrow carts do minimal to no dps. VERY large deploy radius (maybe 5 ft wall, 45 ft radius as to not stack these everywhere)

    Server Pride

    I don't know the name of my server. I don't care. I may be the onyl one, but I feel no server pride. Quite frankly this should be changed all together, and I propose something completely new to this:

    My biggest gripe right now with WvW

     Pretty Much my thoughts! The Siege Walls Would be very expensive, low to medium hp, and would be open to attack due to being right next to wall. I am just tired of having everyone on both teams zerg by door... And the wall idea I agree with. I was considering doing that, but wasn't sure how to implement it without them being completely useless due to being to hard to set up. I just want everything to be more immersive. Glad to see you read it all!

     

  • KingJigglyKingJiggly Member Posts: 777
    Originally posted by Xzen
    Hmm could they make a map with enough zones that every server could go against eachother at the same time?

    Nah. I would say make everyone at the beggining join 1 of 3 places, and have on giant sevrer battle. However, I ont know if theres technology for 100k vs 100k vs 100k at once lol.

  • FermiFermi Member Posts: 7
    Originally posted by KingJiggly

    Alliance and Guild pride Pride

    This would be much better. Guild would be able to cap and "flag" as normal keeps and towers. However, "Allaince Flags" would be on the StoneMist Castle. The point of this is to feel proe for your community, whether or not your in a guild or not. Putting mroe focus on Guilds and Alliances would allow for more organized competition, and more pride for your sevrer overall. Adding some small "shows" would greatly increase pride, such as fireworks spelling out alliance names over Stonemist Castle, NPC conversations about the score at that moment... such as "It seems *insert server name here* isnt doing to good..." or "The Allince *insert name here* has captured the castle!". NPC parties within the castles would insue, opening up chances to buy crafting materials, holiday stuff, etc. to whoever controls the castle at that moment. All tese things would be rather small, simple implementations and woudl drastically affect how I (and I am sure other people) would feel about the thigns they fight for.

     

    I really like this idea.  Something I enjoyed in Guild Wars: Factions was the fact that guilds would "control" or have special access to PvE towns through PvP.  Everyone could see these guilds names when  you moused over the towns on the world map.  I think it would be great if they could implement a system like this into W v W v W.  Guilds from the same server could build a reputation amongst each other by controlling keeps and towers, and I think it would be very likely you would see some guild rivalries develop across servers.

    A few things I would like to see are specific rewards for holding certain areas of the W v W v W map.  I know there are bonuses that you acquire for your server based on points acquired, however, giving a tangible location to some of these bonuses could be interesting.  Bonus locations could rotate when the server resets so that people aren't fighting over the same area everytime.

    Overall I've enjoyed my time in W v W v W and I look forward to watching it expand and evolve over time.

     

  • KingJigglyKingJiggly Member Posts: 777
    Originally posted by Fermi
    Originally posted by KingJiggly

    Alliance and Guild pride Pride

    This would be much better. Guild would be able to cap and "flag" as normal keeps and towers. However, "Allaince Flags" would be on the StoneMist Castle. The point of this is to feel proe for your community, whether or not your in a guild or not. Putting mroe focus on Guilds and Alliances would allow for more organized competition, and more pride for your sevrer overall. Adding some small "shows" would greatly increase pride, such as fireworks spelling out alliance names over Stonemist Castle, NPC conversations about the score at that moment... such as "It seems *insert server name here* isnt doing to good..." or "The Allince *insert name here* has captured the castle!". NPC parties within the castles would insue, opening up chances to buy crafting materials, holiday stuff, etc. to whoever controls the castle at that moment. All tese things would be rather small, simple implementations and woudl drastically affect how I (and I am sure other people) would feel about the thigns they fight for.

     

    I really like this idea.  Something I enjoyed in Guild Wars: Factions was the fact that guilds would "control" or have special access to PvE towns through PvP.  Everyone could see these guilds names when  you moused over the towns on the world map.  I think it would be great if they could implement a system like this into W v W v W.  Guilds from the same server could build a reputation amongst each other by controlling keeps and towers, and I think it would be very likely you would see some guild rivalries develop across servers.

    A few things I would like to see are specific rewards for holding certain areas of the W v W v W map.  I know there are bonuses that you acquire for your server based on points acquired, however, giving a tangible location to some of these bonuses could be interesting.  Bonus locations could rotate when the server resets so that people aren't fighting over the same area everytime.

    Overall I've enjoyed my time in W v W v W and I look forward to watching it expand and evolve over time.

     

    While I never directly participated in any guilds that capped one of those, I thought it was a great accomplishment. You won't even be in the guild/alliance to be proud of them, seeing giant flags bearing their symbol, npcs talking abou them, fireworks, etc will make you proud. Just because I don't work for apple doesn't make me not proud of them. I don't work for Walmart, but I still recogniz it. That's exactly what I am trying to do only in game. Also, if you do join, that will help stop unorganized zergs becuase you'll be in a guild. Focusing on server pride will not work, so instead focus on something more collective and community like: the guilds and alliances. 

  • SentimeSentime Member UncommonPosts: 270
    Originally posted by KingJiggly

    WvWvW has been incredibly successful in GW2, however there are several changes I would very much appreciate, along with some additions I believe will make it better.

     

    I'm on a Tier 2 ranked server and on Satruday at 8pm EST participation is so low that we had tne outmanned buff on 2 of the 4 maps, and team chat is nothing but people complaining and calling each other manes.

    I guess we have differen't definitions of what incredilby succesful is.  

  • ShadanwolfShadanwolf Member UncommonPosts: 2,377

    -Guilds don't mean anything.....you can join 4.....guild names not used over players heads

    -taking a location doesn't meaning anything...its just the points

    -taking a location doesn't mean anything since its so easy to get from one location to another and retake it

    -the server population has no idea whats happening in WvW or its impact on them

    -zerging  tends to minimize the accomplishment of an individual to develope their character

    -WvW emphasises getting to 80 fully decked out.Exactly the opposite of the PVE philosophy of casual exploration

    -crafting  has almost zero impact on the game

    -pve is fantastic..if you just want to pve

    -the WvW driven players have migrated to a few servers..where they dominate

    -low level players are meat on the table for most of the current WvW population

    -zerging dominates almost all WvW activity

    -micro size WvW maps emphasise/encourage  zerging

    -que's for WvW destroy WvW immersion....affect server selection

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