Not to double post but the thing that always kept me going was the benefits of the relics and just the fun of keep takes. All the OP ToA stuff and the ML's, CL's and the RA's broke the DAoC PvP field into so much of the haves and have nots. I would hope GW2 avoids things that change the battle field.
Agreed. On top of some sort of realm rank system, GW2 needs better Relics and Darkness Falls. There needs to be more incentives to fight. More goals than just holding keeps.
I don't know anyone who thought keep takes were fun. People always took keeps for a reason. Either to attack/protect the relics(relics in DAoC were actually important, unlike GW2), open df, farm rps, or for the titles. Nobody ever, not even once, did it "for fun".
Anything that makes chracter power top heavy is a bad idea and Anet won't do.
Making people who kill others better than most people even better at killing others is a feedback relationship. You should always always always heavily regulate such things. If you don't you are an incompetent designer. I repeat if you do not heavily regulate this and your job is to design a game, do everyone a favor and resign.
Anet and even more NCSoft is very much a believer in cosmetic rewards. Both for progression and for selling. They learned this lesson in City of Heroes. Just how lucrative selling purely cosmetic stuff in CoH was quite surprising to NCsoft. They took that can ran with
I don't know anyone who thought keep takes were fun. People always took keeps for a reason. Either to attack/protect the relics(relics in DAoC were actually important, unlike GW2), open df, farm rps, or for the titles. Nobody ever, not even once, did it "for fun".
I can not figure out if you are that simple or simply a troll who should climb back under his bridge. Just because you did not enjoy the keep takes does not mean myself or other like myself did not find that the most enjoyable part of RvR. Everyone had their prefered aspect of RvR.
Want to know what is the most important thing to keep people playing?
Fun.
If people are having fun with WvWvW, they will keep playing it, no matter if it's rewarding or not. The treadmill is only there to keep people playing because what you are offering to people is inferior to similar things that can be found in other games. And so far, nothing in other games that can come close to WvWvW (DAoC is not attractive at all nowaday to the mainstream)
First let me say I was the worlds first lvl 50(Ranger Sneakshot-MLF server ) hit it in under 2 weeks after release before first major patch/nerfs. I was also the first RR2-5 player.
With that said I played DAoC during beta and into release for 4 years(this includes beta time), and I can say without a doubt, I played RvR because I enjoyed it NOT because I got realm abilities/ranks. I loved the fact that "The Best Gear"(Until ToA) was easily accessable from crafters and you could get right out there and start RvRing. I quit shortly after the PvE gear grind from ToA was introduced(like a vast number of players)
People also seem to forget RR's created elitism and constant fights among members of their own realms themselves as people would whine and cry if you attacked an opposing realm member that they were fighting as it cut down on their RP gain. People running 8 mans with a requirement of RR 6-8 ONLY leaving those who wanted to join into the fun to run out and get facerolled by multiple groups.
Attacking relic keeps was near impossible at time because the kiddies were more interested in "Fight Club"(for thos who don't know they would organize groups of players from all three realms to duel each other for max realm points or kill trade for them. Mythic even took messures to try and stop this)
Or elitist 8 mans would run off and get rolled(not all the timne I've seen 8 mans take out 3-4 groups) by the other relams zerg because they wanted more relam points.
TLDR; In short people wouldn't work together, primarily elitist 8 mans, for major objectives because of RR/RP as it was more important to maximize your RP gain and you couldn't do that with other realm members near as they might "steal" your kill.
I'm finally glad someone brought this forward, I actually played on the same server as the above poster and although DAoC has always held a spot in my heart, I was happy to move on to Shadowbane and never looked back. I’d like a few of these questions answered perhaps I’ve missed the entire point of playing GW2
WvW is supposed to be about your server winning isn't it?
I've understood the winning server moves on and the loosing servers fall back, so isn't the purpose of WvW to become the top rated server?
All I see here are the detractors looking for personal gain, am I missing something here?
In my mind it will take somewhere close to 12 weeks before one server can be crowned as #1 isn’t this the purpose of WvW?
If GW2 is all about having fun and not chasing the carrot, why in hell are posters here trying to change the rules to make WvW a carrot chase?
Have MMO players slipped so far down the slippery slope they can’t change the greedy selfish loot-whoring ways of past games?
Want to know what is the most important thing to keep people playing?
Fun.
If people are having fun with WvWvW, they will keep playing it, no matter if it's rewarding or not. The treadmill is only there to keep people playing because what you are offering to people is inferior to similar things that can be found in other games. And so far, nothing in other games that can come close to WvWvW (DAoC is not attractive at all nowaday to the mainstream)
Very well put.
Prob the only reason why WOW has remained at the top of the boards for so long. People have come to believe that treadmill progression is what makes mmos, but in fact, it is a tool that keeps players "chasing after the dragon" (south park reference) cause the gameplay itself is not sufficient to keep the playerbase.
I don't know anyone who thought keep takes were fun. People always took keeps for a reason. Either to attack/protect the relics(relics in DAoC were actually important, unlike GW2), open df, farm rps, or for the titles. Nobody ever, not even once, did it "for fun".
I can not figure out if you are that simple or simply a troll who should climb back under his bridge. Just because you did not enjoy the keep takes does not mean myself or other like myself did not find that the most enjoyable part of RvR. Everyone had their prefered aspect of RvR.
+1 Darkways
I played DAoC's RvR for the fun. I took part if keep battles because they were FUN. I didn't give a toss about the RR/RP, I was there to smash people in the face, coz it's FUN!
It was the exact same reason I played TFC or CS, I did it because it was entertaining.
I don't know anyone who thought keep takes were fun. People always took keeps for a reason. Either to attack/protect the relics(relics in DAoC were actually important, unlike GW2), open df, farm rps, or for the titles. Nobody ever, not even once, did it "for fun".
I can not figure out if you are that simple or simply a troll who should climb back under his bridge. Just because you did not enjoy the keep takes does not mean myself or other like myself did not find that the most enjoyable part of RvR. Everyone had their prefered aspect of RvR.
+1 Darkways
I played DAoC's RvR for the fun. I took part if keep battles because they were FUN. I didn't give a toss about the RR/RP, I was there to smash people in the face, coz it's FUN!
It was the exact same reason I played TFC or CS, I did it because it was entertaining.
I'm sure there are people like you but be honest: There is no way in hell it's more than 5% of MMO players.
Also you wouldn't have as much fun if there was no RR system.
I don't know anyone who thought keep takes were fun. People always took keeps for a reason. Either to attack/protect the relics(relics in DAoC were actually important, unlike GW2), open df, farm rps, or for the titles. Nobody ever, not even once, did it "for fun".
For the most part this is true. The only times I saw people doing keep takes just for the hell of it was when there were either no enemies out, or a guild wanted to put together a PvP training night for the newbies. Now, towers were often taken for fun. I spent a lot of afternoons running with 5-6 real life friends, taking towers and seeing how long we could hold it before we got zerged.
But the people who swear up and down that GW2 is perfect will of course ignore this information and scream that the game doesn't need incentives to do anything. They'll completely ignore the fact that the entire RvR system in GW2 is based on DAoC, and thus will run into the same issues DAoC did without putting in incentives.
I'm fairly certain Anet has plans to introduce some sort of realm rank system and maybe better relics/a Darkness Falls. It would be stupid not to.
Originally posted by Svarcanum ANets business model is weird to say they least. They rely on people to shell out rl money for rp items. Yet it's the first game I've played in a long time that doesn't provide an rp server.
State your source (and it better not be; there wasn't one during bwe1-3)
If you continue to make sweeping statements like you know what everyone everywhere thinks about a certain topic then I am going to shout at you. It easy to type 'I think this is the worst game ever' Rather than the 'This is the worst game ever'
Comments
Agreed. On top of some sort of realm rank system, GW2 needs better Relics and Darkness Falls. There needs to be more incentives to fight. More goals than just holding keeps.
I don't know anyone who thought keep takes were fun. People always took keeps for a reason. Either to attack/protect the relics(relics in DAoC were actually important, unlike GW2), open df, farm rps, or for the titles. Nobody ever, not even once, did it "for fun".
my review of GW2
Anything that makes chracter power top heavy is a bad idea and Anet won't do.
Making people who kill others better than most people even better at killing others is a feedback relationship. You should always always always heavily regulate such things. If you don't you are an incompetent designer. I repeat if you do not heavily regulate this and your job is to design a game, do everyone a favor and resign.
Anet and even more NCSoft is very much a believer in cosmetic rewards. Both for progression and for selling. They learned this lesson in City of Heroes. Just how lucrative selling purely cosmetic stuff in CoH was quite surprising to NCsoft. They took that can ran with
I can not figure out if you are that simple or simply a troll who should climb back under his bridge. Just because you did not enjoy the keep takes does not mean myself or other like myself did not find that the most enjoyable part of RvR. Everyone had their prefered aspect of RvR.
Want to know what is the most important thing to keep people playing?
Fun.
If people are having fun with WvWvW, they will keep playing it, no matter if it's rewarding or not. The treadmill is only there to keep people playing because what you are offering to people is inferior to similar things that can be found in other games. And so far, nothing in other games that can come close to WvWvW (DAoC is not attractive at all nowaday to the mainstream)
What happened to playing a game just because you enjoyed it?
Did you get new gear or ranks for playing C&C Renegade, or Quake, or Doom, or Duke Nukem 3D multiplayer?
Very well put.
Prob the only reason why WOW has remained at the top of the boards for so long. People have come to believe that treadmill progression is what makes mmos, but in fact, it is a tool that keeps players "chasing after the dragon" (south park reference) cause the gameplay itself is not sufficient to keep the playerbase.
+1 Darkways
I played DAoC's RvR for the fun. I took part if keep battles because they were FUN. I didn't give a toss about the RR/RP, I was there to smash people in the face, coz it's FUN!
It was the exact same reason I played TFC or CS, I did it because it was entertaining.
I'm sure there are people like you but be honest: There is no way in hell it's more than 5% of MMO players.
Also you wouldn't have as much fun if there was no RR system.
my review of GW2
For the most part this is true. The only times I saw people doing keep takes just for the hell of it was when there were either no enemies out, or a guild wanted to put together a PvP training night for the newbies. Now, towers were often taken for fun. I spent a lot of afternoons running with 5-6 real life friends, taking towers and seeing how long we could hold it before we got zerged.
But the people who swear up and down that GW2 is perfect will of course ignore this information and scream that the game doesn't need incentives to do anything. They'll completely ignore the fact that the entire RvR system in GW2 is based on DAoC, and thus will run into the same issues DAoC did without putting in incentives.
I'm fairly certain Anet has plans to introduce some sort of realm rank system and maybe better relics/a Darkness Falls. It would be stupid not to.
State your source (and it better not be; there wasn't one during bwe1-3)
If you continue to make sweeping statements like you know what everyone everywhere thinks about a certain topic then I am going to shout at you.
It easy to type 'I think this is the worst game ever'
Rather than the 'This is the worst game ever'