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Rift should get more Freemium players to play on the live shard
MMOExposed
Member RarePosts: 7,387
in Rift
Rift should get more Freemium players to play on the live shard.
the reason I say this, is because with the new Mentoring system in the game, and the Freemium players adding a sense of population to lower level zones,
the gameplay there can be really exciting and pull in more subs.
with Instant Adventure even in these zones, and more Zone Invasions everything should be awesome.
also since Freemium is locked to level 20, there is no need to power rush levels. you can just play what you like and just have fun, without the sense of need to fast progress.
Philosophy of MMO Game Design
Comments
Pretty sure Rift lite can't choose anything but the live shards.
There really isnt this massive pool of people who havent tried Rift yet, and Rift has crappy retention so until they fix the reasons why people dont stick around, getting more to try wont solve the population woes.
That's what I thought, as well. The problem is the cap stops before you ever leave the starter zone outside of the tutorial area. So the only zone that will have that feeling of being alive with the Freemiums are those zones. They would have to extend the level cap above 20 to be able to make that work.
Honestly, their best bet with1.9 going live would be to do a free-return for a new and old players. 3-7 days of free play. People would make it through the zones and see the improvements with Instant Adventures and whatnot.
My only problem with RIFT, and I still play it, is the fact that I can create a new character and level from 1-50 and get completely raid geared and ready for HK in under 2 weeks. And the guild I am currently in is 9/11 HK, and I just unsubscribed, so other than those last few HK bosses, there isn't much for me to see. And any regular player could get to that point in under a month starting from scratch.
This is the only game where in under a year I have one of every class on Guardian at max level and raid ready. I even have two Defiant 50s that are HK ready, as well. 6 completely leveled and geared 50s, that are all above prestige rank 20 in under a year. The progression just goes SO fast.
Yup, faster is not better. The super fast leveling speed is one of the major reasons for its crappy retention, and then throw on top of that it doesnt take long once you hit 50 to exhaust all the progression you can get at 50, mins the underwhelming PA. The journey happens to quick to get attached to your character.
Even the PA is wayyy too fast. I returned to RIFT about 4 months or so ago. When I got on my account, first thing I did was look up a new guild to join. First question they asked me was my Planar Attunement level. I told them it was zero because I had just came back. They wouldn't invite me.
Joined another guild, most people were anywhere between 20 PA-95PA and above. I got to over PA 100 in under a month of playing, and not hardcore, we're talking 3-4 hours a day. Instant Adventures is a ridiculous amount of PA, made it virtually a worthless system with how easy the levels come. And all the daily and weekly raid and rift quests are basically a PA level each turn-in.
They need to unlock more tiers for the PA, and really start branching the system out, and making the levels come slower the higher you get, instead of every PA level taking the same amount of experience.
agree with Teak, altho i have to point out that one of the things they need to fix as to why people don't stick around just happens to be the subscription model. Altho I'm a fan of Trion and a big supporter of their companies practices concerning the community and the efficiency at which they provide content and improvements for the gaming community, i have to say that the archaic sub model is just not that sustainable in this economic climate. They need a F2P shop model even if it had a level limit on it from expansions not being purchased. More options always = better gaming.
I recently have completely embraced F2P gaming, at least in the MMO genre. I've supported F2P gaming in other genres for quite a while because they don't nickle and dime nearly as much in my experience. However, with RIFT, they're making enough money with subscriptions obviously to keep pumping content out, I'm not sure they want to take that "F2P Dive" yet. I say that because of the response SWTOR's announcement has received.
Whether or not Trion would make it F2P because they're bleeding subscribers badly or not, the general public is going to look down upon it negatively.
As long as more companies embrace F2P like NCSoft did with Aion and Lineage 2 and go Truly Free, there is hope for me with AAA F2P titles. If RIFT announced a F2P conversion similar to Aion, my god, I don't think I could be a happier gamer.
Why not no leveling at all? TSW
has this idea right,, just not done well.
dont see the point of levels. so Leveling Speed doesnt matter really.
Philosophy of MMO Game Design
But now you're taking the conversation away from your original post, which was basically speaking solely on Freemium. Now you're talking about changing the entire structure of the game.
Themepark MMOs without levels just doesn't work. Not when they are built on the traditional model; quest hubs, linear zone progression, all culiminating to the majority of the game taking place at end-game/max level, and is comprised of raiding and the likes.
Levels are the carrot on the stick until you get to the real carrot on the stick. They are the entire backbone of character progression in a themepark MMO. Yes, TSW has a different take on levels, but the entire game is also structured as so. Ever quest repeatable, etc, etc. But there is still a level gating system, basically. There is no plausible or effective way you could remove levels from RIFT. The entire game is built upon them.
I personally have no probelms with levels, at all. And I've played plenty of MMOs that had no character levels, just skill levels. Darkfall, Ryzom, Mortal, TSW (to an extent), Asheron's Call (levels, but they didn't matter nearly as much; was based on how high a skill on your character was, not your actual level), and so on.
The progression in those games feels basically the same. There's still areas I can't go in because my defense is too low, my magic attack isn't high enough, or whathave you. With a themepark, the only difference is a skill on your character isn't too low, your actual character level is.
Leveling speed does matter, because whether you see a point in leveling or not, it's there, so it matters. Your opinion doesn't change the design of the game. And if you were to not level your character at all, or skills on your character (which is exactly the same thing, different wrapping paper), then you don't want to play an RPG. You want a 3rd person persistent action game, which there are more and more coming out.
RPGs are about progression, and leveling. There are other forms and ways to go about leveling without removing it. Because once you remove it, you no longer have an RPG.
I disagree. Free to Play model like GW2 would put a end to the constant content updates of Rift's quality.
the problem is, that the game doesnt hold an attachment early on.
the characters dont "Feel" as good as in WoW,
and they dont Look cool (especially if you are a player coming from WoW which has many interesting models).
the Races you play arent interesting on the two factions, and they both have poor melee animations. Far less interesting than WoW in this area.
this was my first turn off when I first quit.
also the performance of the game using Intel Graphics cards of my original laptop shows this game cant run on it, and if other players also using that kind of hardware, they are forced to pay more money to upgrade. even the Low Quality mode doesnt fix this issue.
also another point to make about what turned me off about Rift.
its the Quest Hub model. Trion nerfed the Event/Rift exp rewards from this so people would be FORCED to GRIND HUBS to decent EXP.
The truth is, with the Calling/8 Tree system, most players want to gain as many points as fast as possible to maximize the builds they can make. this is why people speed level in games like this.
and speed leveling in boring Hubs isnt fun now days. Events should have been better speed leveling option than Tradtional Quest Hubs. (look at GW2)
Leveling is not important. Since most people will make it to max level at some point. this isnt Vanilla WoW ehn most MMO gamers were new. these gamers grew out of the awe from leveling long time ago, which is why you see complaints now days about asian level grinders. its not as popular anymore.
I am sure, most new accounts quit before reaching max level, just like WoW is suffering from which forced Blizzard to revamp old world to add new interesting gameplay features to it to keep levelers interested, which also failed, because like I said before,,, The Current Generation of MMO gamers dont like Quest Grind anymore.
also another issue. the PvP.
the PvP in Current Rift is far less interesting than even WoW's PvP.
Old AV (yes its old and no longer in WoW) is still in many of our heads when we moved from WoW to Rift. and playing Port Scion and other Warfronts, just doesnt hold up as much epicness and fun as Old AV, which lingers in the back of our mind when playing theses PvPvE instanced games.
if PvPvE was more interesting I could see old AV fans coming over, since WoW at the same time is killing what ever life is left in AV in order to make their new Battlegrounds seem more interesting so people are forced to buy the new expansions for the crap.
Also notice how in Rift, rarely does anybody do City Raids. almost never when compared to how much WoW players City raid even on PvE servers.
there is simple little connection to Telara and Rift for most new players and old players.
Trion need to make the game FUN AT ALL LEVELS, and understand, that RIFT IS A MMO IN A NEW GENERATION OF MMO GAMERS THAT DONT LIKE QUESTING AND LEVEL GRINDING ANYMORE!!
you need gameplay elements that are fun and long lasting to replace the Quest/level grind.
like more interesting PvPvE
more interesting crafting mechanics
more sandbox like features that allow players to create things for their own enjoyment between major patches.
more events to replace questing.
less level restricted world and gameplay. allow more gameplay features to lower levels like IA are coming down to low levels as well.
How about low level chronicles with interesting gameplay mechanics different from standard Rift gameplay. Like taking control of a giant robot to fight, or racing somebody on a mount in the chronicle. Or even use my idea I posted on the official forum before, and thats to allow players to PLAY AS THE LORE CHARACTERS IN CHRONICLES to tell their story from the player gameplay point of view. This is similar to how Warcraft 3 told the story of Warcraft IP, with the players in the WoW lore figure's shoes, controlling them.
This lets players get more attached to lore figures, like WoW has Arthas and Thrall fan armies.
I have so many ideas for this game. If only I were lead developer, or if Trion would listen to my ideas.
stuff like that
Philosophy of MMO Game Design
this is simple not true.
Levels arent the carrot.
the Class Skill points are. I could care less about what level I am as long as I have maximum amount of Skill Points to spend freely. Level Mechanics being tied into the Skill/Calling point system is what forces leveling to be a carrot.
Also Themeparks are guided. No where does the rules say that it has to be guided by levels. you are looking at things from a traditional standpoint, and seting this to be the one and only way to do things.
in FPS like Halo, I follow story from Mission to Mission. Doesnt mean I have to level up to do so.
I can follow a story without levels. Levels has always been a time sink. and current gen players are starting to see pass the what was once a interesting part of the genre when it was new to them.
there can be other ways players could gain skill points other than simply leveling. Hey even GW2 has a interesting way to give skill points. you could discover them in the world by playing different events all over the place, rather than grinding levels.
or you can remove all level restrictions on instanced content so a low level player can join Port Scion from start if they love PvPvE rather than boring Quest/Level grind.
man thats what I loved about the Scroll of Res in WoW. I could use it to skip all that boring useless leveling junk. Doesnt take a masters degree to learn how to play Rift, nor does it take a player 50 levels to figure it out, since most people use a different spec than their leveling spec anyway. the arguments for level/quest grind are lost.
Philosophy of MMO Game Design
Spoken like someone that has never played one of the major F2P games before. The only people that still believe that an MMO requires a sub to receive content updates are those with very limited MMO experience because history, has proven its not true.
I know themeparks are guided. But they are guided by levels, absolutely, how can you say they aren't? You name me one themepark that I can make a character in, and move two/three zones in the map and not have an aggro range that pulls the entire zone to my lowly-level-self.
Levels ARE the carrot, tho. Because you get skill points from levels. It's like that with virtually EVERY game that you unlocked skills with. There has to be a level system somewhere, because that gagues your experience, how much you get, and what you can in term spend that with. Whether it's called experience, credits, or whathave you. Even MOBA titles have a level system that you use to unlock gear. Thus furthering the point, the levels are the carrot, because levels provide you with upgrades.
If they unlocked Port Scion right now and anyone could go in, have fun being level 25 in there with PR 30+ level 50 toons. And it's not just that. You CAN level up via PVP if that's what you want to do. You can level multiple ways in RIFT. But you have to do it with people in your level range. Want to do Port Scion? Carrot on a stick. Level up high enough to participate. Oh that got you motivated? Carrot on a stick.
Like I said, I see where you're coming from, I do. But MMORPGs, whether people want to admit it or not, are just as much about the journey as the destination. In other words, just as much about the leveling process as the end-game. If you want to be able to jump into the end-game, or have a full world that as a level 1 you can jump in and do whatever you want with whoever you want, you're looking for more of a lobby game or action game.
Themepark MMOs are doing everything they can to accomodate people like you. That's what the mentor system is for.
My point with my last post was you made this thread discussing how to get population into the lower levels of RIFT with patch 1.9 coming out. I figured we were speaking realistically. Realistically, RIFT can't remove levels from the game. The entire game is built around them. It wouldn't be RIFT anymore. They would have to rebuild the entire game from scratch and replace virtually every system inplace.
I get what you're saying, I just didn't know it was a hypothetical conversation. I thought we were discussing realistic solutions for RIFT, not pipe-dreams about how the game should of been designed and conceived from the very beginning.
Also, I don't think of MMOs from any "traditional" sense -- I've just had 13 years of playing them on a daily basis. The ability to say I've played most AAA western MMO to max level, not just a 2 week try of the game. I've dumped in 100+ hours into virtually every MMO I've tried, because I enjoy this genre, I like seeing where it can grow and where it needs to scale back. I think of this genre with a very open mind, which is why I posted what I did. Scroll back up and read it. I'm giving you perspectives from someone who has spent years playing sandboxes, years playing themeparks, years playing subscriptions, and now years playing F2P titles. I'm not tooting my own horn, just making you realize I'm not close-minded when discussing things of this nature.
Also, switching RIFT to F2P wouldn't stop the updates, lol. You're under the assumption the majority of their income comes strictly from RIFT profits. Go take a look at their investor portfolio and some of their information as a company. They have two major releases in development, RIFT alone isn't funding that. And wait to read about the positive effects of AION and Lineage 2's F2P model. It's a thing of beauty, and is incredibly effective.
yes please show me.
Philosophy of MMO Game Design
you're 9/11 in HK and you haven't even touched ID yet from whe i get from your post. HK came out like 10 or 11 months ago. gearing up for HK isn't hard at all as it's the old tier and that's what almost all themeparks do anyways. gearing up for ID and pulling solid numbers to assist in a kill and not get carried is a whole other story. murdantix/sicaron or even Aky dps requirements aren't the same as what's needed for any boss inside ID minus 1st.
one month of regular gameplay can get you geared up to get 9/11 in a 10 month old raid zone/old tier raiding doesn't sound like a problem to me. also, in 5 days the new 10 man is coming out and it's the same tier as ID. i wouldn't say, "there isn't much for me to see" when you aren't even on the current tier of raiding.
this is just my opinion though.