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Dungeon Finder
azmundai
Member UncommonPosts: 1,419
Ive been thinking about this, and remembering some of the fun I had with it initially .. and maybe rethinking it a little bit.
I still think it is bad as a blanket system to apply to an MMO. It emphasizes the lobby based aspect, and neutralizes the community or server, or overall population, even the guild aspects of an MMO.
That being said, it is great for leveling alts.
I think, if it was relegated to lower levels, and kept on the server (meaning you could not queue for x-server groups) .. it would actually be a good system. It would actually help to grow the community.
Of course the trend seems to be the opposite. You can now pug raids in wow with an LFD tool if I understand what I read correctly ..
but anyway .. just a thought.
LFD tools are great for cramming people into content, but quality > quantity.
I am, usually on the sandbox .. more "hardcore" side of things, but I also do just want to have fun. So lighten up already 
Comments
I think you're wrong.
There is no evidence what you claim is true. Communities were bad before LFDs. If you don't like it don't use it. Pretty simple stuff.
I love dungeon finder's and think they're highly beneficial. I've been on the receiving end of the "looking for group" in many games and pretty much always have a hard time finding groups.. be it because the server is empty at the time or not a lot of people are wanting that specific dungeon. Not to mention in small man dungeons the damage dealers are a dime a dozen.
I also don't think it would really affect guilds or anything. The dungeon finder (at least in the cases I know) are used for last resorts, people in a hurry or those not heavily into the game (i.e. don't participate in guilds). Everyone knows that it would be a lot more beneficial to do it with a familiar group/guild.
Though if it's for end-game content I don't think people should just be able to hop in and go. Though that's not because of the dungeon finder, rather, because a dungeon like that shouldn't be easy enough to the point where a group of randoms can beat it.
Currently Playing:
Nothing.
If they were bad before, they are worse since. You say that's just my opinion. I can't argue with that, but to me it is very true.
Are you saying the community has always been bad?
Maybe if pvp hadn't gone x-server .. if world pvp had evolved into the "e-sport" that lobby pvp has .. communities would be what they were?
LFD tools are great for cramming people into content, but quality > quantity.
I am, usually on the sandbox .. more "hardcore" side of things, but I also do just want to have fun. So lighten up already
The advent of dungeon finders definitly did not help the social aspects of MMO's. But it's hard to lay the decline of community solely at the feet of dungeon finders. Community started to decline long before dungeon finders came into play, the whole need for a dungeon finder is based off the steady decline of community.
My personal opinion on the decline of community is that MMO's have gone from depending on others to do everything in the game, to single player games with the option to play with others (which people rarely use). When you don't need other people, you start to turn hermit. Your social skills start to decline as you find yourself depending on and interacting with other players less and less.
I don't see DF as hurting the community, just as eliminating part of the need for it as it used to be.
There were always antagonists in MMOs. That's part of what a guild did was establish a group of players in a community and weed out the antagonists. Building a PUG was a pain, and many times the groups would fall apart quickly. A great PUG was an enjoyable experience, but very rare. We needed guilds to get dungeon runs other than PUGs. From personal experience, I knew many players who would only group with guildies because of how bad PUGs were at the time.
Dungeon Finders, especially cross-server, make building PUGs easier. Even if the group does drop a DPSer or two, it's only seconds to find replacements. From personal experience, the DF tools are handy. However, in taking away one aspect of the need for guilds they've eliminated part of what used to be a strong social aspect of MMOs.
Just like instancing, Dungeon Finders are part of the evolution (or decay depending on perspective) of MMORPGs.
This debate hits hard for most. Honestly, I think LFD's only removed 5% of social interaction. Here's why.
You say: "LFG <Dungeon> Heals"
<Player has sent you a party invite>
/end of social interaction.
The only thing LFD tools have removed social-wise is the trade chat spam of /2 UBERLEETGUY LFG!!!!!!!!!!!!
Now, honestly, I understand the other aspect of people who 'ninja'. The sense of anonymity that random groups bring can cause people to lower their IQ and super-steal items. While this was a problem light-years ago, 'main-stream' MMO's have class-restricted rolls so a light-armor wearer can't roll need for a heavy armor set.
Second complaint, the fact you won't know who is good or not. You wouldn't have known this anyway, it's not like you or your server (Some do on forums) keep detailed histories of 'baddie' players and people who you should avoid grouping with. I personally think this is an absolutely stupid mindset, but if you really need this. Add a thumbs up or thumbs down feature, allowing you to rate other players in your party anonymously. Opinion: you should only add a thumbs up. Makes everyone feel better knowing they aren't going to have negatives on their records. Won't hurt anyone if they don't recieve a thumbs up. Kinda like facebook's like button.
Played - M59, EQOA, EQ, EQ2, PS, SWG[Favorite], DAoC, UO, RS, MXO, CoH/CoV, TR, FFXI, FoM, WoW, Eve, Rift, SWTOR, TSW.
Playing - PS2, AoW, GW2