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Everquest Next ............ NOT World of Everquest

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  • CalmOceansCalmOceans Member UncommonPosts: 2,437

    EQ is somewhere between a sandbox and a themepark I think.

    It's certainly not a themepark by today's standards, EverQuest had surprisingly few quests and the few quests there were weren't even easy to understand at time, the quest itself gave you very little direction and you relied on the community to give you pointers on drops and locations.

    It's also not 100% sandbox I feel, there was some direction on where to hunt I guess, later on there were some better armor quests and more quests.

    But early EQ is pretty close to a sandbox to me, it had very few themepark elements.

  • NildenNilden Member EpicPosts: 3,517

    Everquest was a world, not a sandbox or themepark.Velious was the peek for me. You could ally yourself with factions, giants, dragons, dwarfs. Western Wastes an entire zone full of dragons. Open world uninstanced dungeons, corpse retrevial, and camping rare spawns are what EQ was about. Raiding in EQ was a full time job these people played 8 hours a day min. It was a huge grind.

    There are things in EQ that are forever left in the past and you could only have done while being there to play it. Printing off a book with all the maps in it from Alakazam. Waiting 5 minutes for it to load up on my pentium. Going from a 14k modem to a 56k!!

    The core design of Everquest needs to live on and designers need to make a world. Not quests hubs, not instanced hallway syndrome dungeons. Explore it, fear it, defeat it! Lord Nagafen and Lady Vox! A vast selection of races not just human body 1-3. Home towns for every race, oceans, continents, world bosses. The epic quest for your class weapon. Todays tech should be shooting for an open seemless world.

     

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  • AmarantharAmaranthar Member EpicPosts: 4,937

    Originally posted by endeavors

    I'm a little scared to see what Everquest Next is going to be.  EQ was my first MMO and  I have some pretty good memories.  If you ask what set it apart from a modern MMO, you'll get a list that looks like this:


    • XP received from grinding mobs and not from quests(except in very specific cases)

    • Chatbox based "quest system"

    • Non-linear dungeon designs / camping a spot instead of moving beginning to end

    • Downtime between combat

    • Trains

    • Limited spell slots / choosing spells depending on situation

    • Autoattack with (arguably optional) cooldown skills on the side

    • Determining mob difficulty with /con

    • Itemization (being proud of a full set of armor with no stats besides AC and high weight)

    • Travel / waiting for boats / depending on other players to teleport

    • Binding / depending on other players to bind

    • No auction house or mass trading system

    • No maps

    • Class balance issues

    • Risk vs reward tuning (death penalties or failing to craft your reward at the end of a long quest)

    You won't find these in a modern MMO and if EQ was released a generation or two later, it wouldn't have these differences, either.  EQ was like this because the developers didn't have anything similar to look back on.  Everybody can claim the game is hardcore and original, but it's this way because it was one of the first of its kind.  It wasn't designed to be hardcore -- it was designed to be an online RPG game and this is just how those features turned out.

    In fact, if EQ was released a generation or two later (with the generation-appropriate features and graphics, etc) it may not have survived.

    What will make EQNext the experience that calls back to EQ?  Things on this list?  (I never understood exactly what "the vision" was...)  What does it mean when all the things listed are outdated designs or technologically obsolete?  It seems like picking a old NES game and asking why current Xbox 360 and PS3 games aren't as fun/hard/original.

     


    Originally posted by Amaranthar


    Originally posted by Ozivois

    EQ was sandbox because your were not lead down a path with a series of quests to perform.  What you did with yourself to level up, grind crafting skills, etc. was entirely up to you.  The was a wide range of zones you could go to for content within a certain level range so you bascially wrote your own story.

    How can you call it a Sandbox when you have this "wide range of zones you could go to for content within a certain level range" designed in?

    Yes, EQ is a linear design, it's just harder to recognize after playing a newer generation MMO.  Instead of moving to the next tier zone to get XP from quests, you move to a higher tier zone to get XP from grinding mobs.

    Thus the old saying, which has died off in recent years, that "they" are giving us less and less. But to the point, EQ was every bit the Themepark, what with going from zoned to level content to the next. But it did try to maintain that world feel. While it wasn't a Sandbox, it had a more Sandboxy feel in that respect. But that brought on issues with waiting to get to your level's content for other players to use it and move on, and that's why WoW went to the purely quest driven style of Themepark (which was innevitable in the genre of Themepark MMORPGs).

    In a sense, Themepark is like a cancer. You still want to live but you have to go through the Chemo and/or there's going to be some surgury involved.

    Once upon a time....

  • erictlewiserictlewis Member UncommonPosts: 3,021

    All one has to do is look at eq2, and see the stunts that soe has pulled this past year.  Yep that's right.  What your going to get is a free to play game, with a huge store and game breaking items.  You will have dungeon finder, dungeon decorator, and a spin off of a norath alternate universe.

    Just who they will market this too.    The free realms/cross over eq2 type player.

    One thing for sure it will not be your dad's everquest, or my eq2 in any shape or form.

    What gets me is they expect the already dying player base of both eq, and eq2 to swap over. I got a feeling they might get the free to play crowd, but the days of serous raiding in eq, and eq2 is done with eq next.

     

  • FrostWyrmFrostWyrm Member Posts: 1,036

    Originally posted by sirphobos

    Originally posted by FrostWyrm



    To call WoW a seamless world is a gross misstatement. Instances =/= seamless. WoW's environments dont mesh well from one zone to the next either. You don't walk across a line and suddenly go from forest to snow.  The sky shouldn't suddenly change colors because you step across a border. The obcene use of mountains to block areas off from one another save for a single small opening is just shamefull.

    I would say Everquest's world wasn't entirely seemless either.  Its zones were basically rectangular maps surrounded by impassable terrain with a small road/bridge leading to an adjacent zone.  A true seemless world in my opinion would be Asheron's Call, huge world, no instances, and no zoning or artificial barriers.

    I haven't played AC so I cant comment on it. As for EQ, it was by no means seamless, but then it never really claimed to be. The zones were massive enough, though, that (at least in my opinion) it didn't really matter. I'd rather have wide borders with loading screens inbetween them than a "fence" of mountains corralling me in save for one or two narrow pathways leading to the next tiny fenced-in area a'la WoW.

  • victorv1968victorv1968 Member Posts: 24

    Originally posted by erictlewis

    All one has to do is look at eq2, and see the stunts that soe has pulled this past year.  Yep that's right.  What your going to get is a free to play game, with a huge store and game breaking items.  You will have dungeon finder, dungeon decorator, and a spin off of a norath alternate universe.

    Just who they will market this too.    The free realms/cross over eq2 type player.

    One thing for sure it will not be your dad's everquest, or my eq2 in any shape or form.

    What gets me is they expect the already dying player base of both eq, and eq2 to swap over. I got a feeling they might get the free to play crowd, but the days of serous raiding in eq, and eq2 is done with eq next.

     

     

    Sure would like to know where you are getting your Information on what is going in EQ:NEXT.  Last time I looked into the station cash store (last night) I did not see 1 game breaking item.  have you even played recently?  When the game went F2P the took out buying rares, mastercrafted items and most consumables (that you could buy in EQ2X)...you can still get xp potions but any long time player already has those anyway from vet rewards and there are Vitality restoration potions but neither of those items are game breaking.  List one game breaking item in the Station Cash Store.

  • erictlewiserictlewis Member UncommonPosts: 3,021

    Originally posted by victorv1968

    Originally posted by erictlewis

    All one has to do is look at eq2, and see the stunts that soe has pulled this past year.  Yep that's right.  What your going to get is a free to play game, with a huge store and game breaking items.  You will have dungeon finder, dungeon decorator, and a spin off of a norath alternate universe.

    Just who they will market this too.    The free realms/cross over eq2 type player.

    One thing for sure it will not be your dad's everquest, or my eq2 in any shape or form.

    What gets me is they expect the already dying player base of both eq, and eq2 to swap over. I got a feeling they might get the free to play crowd, but the days of serous raiding in eq, and eq2 is done with eq next.

     

     

    Sure would like to know where you are getting your Information on what is going in EQ:NEXT.  Last time I looked into the station cash store (last night) I did not see 1 game breaking item.  have you even played recently?  When the game went F2P the took out buying rares, mastercrafted items and most consumables (that you could buy in EQ2X)...you can still get xp potions but any long time player already has those anyway from vet rewards and there are Vitality restoration potions but neither of those items are game breaking.  List one game breaking item in the Station Cash Store.

    There were game breaking items in eq2x.  Those were removed when the merged eq2x with eq2.  Smokejumper has already made comments that he would like to see those armor and weapons come back.    You can bet those will be in eqnext.  it will be a full rmt fest.

     

  • MeltdownMeltdown Member UncommonPosts: 1,183

    I hope the direction they take is a unique one. While I enjoyed EQ considerably when I was in high school, that type of game would no longer work in my current life working 40-50 hours a week, spending time with my wife and owning a house. Nostalgia for EQ is strong, and the game still to this day has a lot of charm, however what it no longer has is a hook. People need new things to bring them into a new world and keep them there. SoE has had a few recent flubs, lets hope that keeps them on their A-game for the next EQ and brings back nostalgia hand-in-hand with new systems, new content, and a new look on MMOs.

    "They essentially want to say 'Correlation proves Causation' when it's just not true." - Sovrath

  • victorv1968victorv1968 Member Posts: 24

    Originally posted by erictlewis

    Originally posted by victorv1968


    Originally posted by erictlewis

    All one has to do is look at eq2, and see the stunts that soe has pulled this past year.  Yep that's right.  What your going to get is a free to play game, with a huge store and game breaking items.  You will have dungeon finder, dungeon decorator, and a spin off of a norath alternate universe.

    Just who they will market this too.    The free realms/cross over eq2 type player.

    One thing for sure it will not be your dad's everquest, or my eq2 in any shape or form.

    What gets me is they expect the already dying player base of both eq, and eq2 to swap over. I got a feeling they might get the free to play crowd, but the days of serous raiding in eq, and eq2 is done with eq next.

     

     

    Sure would like to know where you are getting your Information on what is going in EQ:NEXT.  Last time I looked into the station cash store (last night) I did not see 1 game breaking item.  have you even played recently?  When the game went F2P the took out buying rares, mastercrafted items and most consumables (that you could buy in EQ2X)...you can still get xp potions but any long time player already has those anyway from vet rewards and there are Vitality restoration potions but neither of those items are game breaking.  List one game breaking item in the Station Cash Store.

    There were game breaking items in eq2x.  Those were removed when the merged eq2x with eq2.  Smokejumper has already made comments that he would like to see those armor and weapons come back.    You can bet those will be in eqnext.  it will be a full rmt fest.

     

    Actually I think what Smokejumper said was that they would leave it up to the community on whether any of those items would be brought back...now what he means by that I do not know.  I personally would like to see it be a poll that you must answer before you log into the game that way it is a true poll of active players.  But even if they brought back in the armor and weapons it wasn't like they were top of the line, or not in game for everyone to aquire. The only people that could really complain about them doing that would be the crafters.  Bringing back in the Mastercrafted armor and weapons is NOT game breaking.   Sorry to say but most treasured drops off normal mobs are better then the mastercrafted stuff.  GAME BREAKING would be Armor and Weapons that you cannot get in game and that would be better then anything you can get in game. I think I read they had a wand of Obliteration on EQ2X if that is like the GM sticks then that would be game breaking also. 

  • ThorbrandThorbrand Member Posts: 1,198

    I agree completely with this post. If the rebooted EQ and tonned it down a bit. Not much just a little it would be a great game. I still feel that EQ was one of the best MMOs ever created. Oh to have the different races, factions, cities, class race politics....It was such a great game.

    I am hoping and waiting. Not playing anything anymore just can't play modern MMOs, I fill my need with Pathfinder right now. EQ was designed to take the place of PnP in a online world and they did it almost perfect in my book.

  • Kieren2Kieren2 Member UncommonPosts: 7

    I hope they make it with the same "spirit" as EQ (before EQ2 & WoW)!! image

     

    WoW, EQ2, Conan, D&D etc are nice/fun games for a while, but much easier & probably for a younger crowd...

     

     

     

  • evilastroevilastro Member Posts: 4,270

    It will be World of Everquest. SoE has been doing everything possible to remake its existing games into WoW. Everquest Next gives it the perfect opertunity to reskin WoW perfectly with the Everquest lore, and thats exactly what I expect from them.

    The designers that made EQ1 so awesome are no longer with SoE, and the new crowd dont respect the original vision. They just want some of the WoW money.

  • Loke666Loke666 Member EpicPosts: 21,441

    Originally posted by Meltdown

    I hope the direction they take is a unique one. While I enjoyed EQ considerably when I was in high school, that type of game would no longer work in my current life working 40-50 hours a week, spending time with my wife and owning a house. Nostalgia for EQ is strong, and the game still to this day has a lot of charm, however what it no longer has is a hook. People need new things to bring them into a new world and keep them there. SoE has had a few recent flubs, lets hope that keeps them on their A-game for the next EQ and brings back nostalgia hand-in-hand with new systems, new content, and a new look on MMOs.

    Agreed, just remaking a 13 year old game is not better than making a new Wow. The game must be a game for the future that looks back on the past.

    SOE need to do what they did with Verant all those years back and create something new and exciting. EQ was not just a new version of M59 but set it's own standards and if EQ Next want to be more than just another MMO it will have to do the same.

    But I fear that Smed and the rest long ago lost what made them into great devs, EQ was not made into the game it was because they wanted profits (even though that of course was a welcome bonus) but to create a game that was what the devs themselves wanted to play.

  • NadiaNadia Member UncommonPosts: 11,798

    Originally posted by Valkaern

      Sony must know deep down inside they are not going to compete with Swtor, Rift or WoW if they chase the exact same market, and surely they don't want to cannibalise what's left of their EQ2 player base.

    if EQNext is crossplatform and launches on consoles too  (as has been hinted)

    there wont be much to cannabalise

  • WizardryWizardry Member LegendaryPosts: 19,332

    I feel the author of that post is way off on his criteira/breakdown or prediction.

    Anyone that has followed SOE over the last couple years,knows EXACTLY what is in store for EQ NExt.Smedley has made it perefectly clear and is already showing it's faqce in EQ2,he is making a game designed around RMT.It has absolutely NOTHING to d owit hwhat Wow has done or is doing,SOE has always been the leader with other following,Wow was a result of EQ not the other way around.

    This means people might finally get some of the quality and things they EXPECT from games but you will be forced to pay extra to get it.This will most likely mean tihngs like housing [extra cost]plot and house all extra.Furnishings will be made but only cheap ones, the BEST furnishings will be via cash shop/RMT.They already have different cash shop items to buy to change looks/attire ,i am sure this will continue maybe even worse.

    I am extremely sure Next will be a great game,but at what cost?The extra 15 bucks a month devs were charging us was literally hundreds of millions EXTRA cash flow,yet we did not see the game qaulity to show it.Going the RMT route allows devs such as SOE to go beyond the 15 a month limit,this means a LOT more cash flow and with the low bandwidth use means not much more overhead.

    This is where i HOPE players/gamers use their heads and weigh in on the VALUE.If it costs 50 bucks a month to fully enjoy the game the way it is meant to be enjoyed,that is not a fair shake and shoudl not be supported.The beginning of the game release is the BEST time to let SOE know how you feel,that is when they hope to recover the millions invested.Once they have thier investment back,the effort tends to dwindle or become generic [example more maps not much else].

    I am a fair person,i believe since their will be a slight operating cost increase,the charge should reflect it.Yes we as paying customers we have to carry the freeloaders,but that shouldn't be more than a couple bucks.A better quality game takes more production time and we will need the bandwidth to increase to be able to handle it.So i feel a cost that amounts to around 20 a month would be fair,however if the RMT value goes above that ,it will be considered pure GREED and nothing more and i will not support it.

    Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.

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