wow clones don't fail because they are like wow, they fail because they don't grasp what makes wow popular in the first place (rift with it's focus on end game, war with it's focus on pvp)
War was a victim of its creator's success. the 300,000 or so DAOC vets latched on to WAR thinking it was going to be DAOC 2. even with repeated screamings from Mythic that WAR =/= DAOC. Despite this, you still ended up with a chunk of the playerbase pissed because they didnt get DAOC 2. (people even made absurd calls for a 3rd realm, totally ignoring the fact that Warhammer does not work that way.)
So i would say WAR fell victim more to players who expected a totally different game (even thought they were told ad nauseum otherwise) as opposed to WAR wanting to be WoW.
wow clones don't fail because they are like wow, they fail because they don't grasp what makes wow popular in the first place (rift with it's focus on end game, war with it's focus on pvp)
War was a victim of its creator's success. the 300,000 or so DAOC vets latched on to WAR thinking it was going to be DAOC 2. even with repeated screamings from Mythic that WAR =/= DAOC. Despite this, you still ended up with a chunk of the playerbase pissed because they didnt get DAOC 2. (people even made absurd calls for a 3rd realm, totally ignoring the fact that Warhammer does not work that way.)
So i would say WAR fell victim more to players who expected a totally different game (even thought they were told ad nauseum otherwise) as opposed to WAR wanting to be WoW.
Same can be said for Everquest 2. People wanted EQ 1 with better graphics all they got was an instanced dumbed down EQ 1 and rushed out game.
We need a MMORPG Cataclysm asap, finish the dark age of MMORPGS now!
"Everything you're bitching about is wrong. People don't have the time to invest in corpse runs, impossible zones, or long winded quests. Sometimes, they just want to pop on and play." "Then maybe MMORPGs aren't for you."
there is a reason why wow became so popular and it sure as fuck isn't the graphics or sound
it's the game play, the way quest work, the great dungeons along the way, the crafting etc, people like what's familiar and will be more interested into it if it is something they know and understand
call of duty didn't kill medal of honor by being nothing like it, UT didn't beat quake by being nothing like it, it's the reason we are at cod number 8 with minimal changes, it's the reason nintendo can release mario and know it will succed, it's the reason people screamed bloody murder for every thing SC2 changed from SC1 etc etc
While gameplay did help WoW achieve the success it now has, a bigger factor was the time and enviroment in which WoW released. While sharring many of the features of EQ1, WoW made the game more casual friendly and accesible to a larger audience and more importantly, WoW was the first to do so. The MMO enviroemnt is no longer like this. The field is crowded with WoW like games and people have had their share of the WoW "formula". To again capture the kind of "magic" WoW created, you are going to have to create something that feels different from WoW.
A man is his own easiest dupe, for what he wishes to be true he generally believes to be true...
I have friends that still play WoW and beleive it or not, the reason is because of investment. People just need to come to terms that it's a..............wait for it............GAME. As for the phrase "WoW killer", we will never see it. Thats not to say WoW wont some day die as all things do. I suspect WoW will someday loss its sub base to multiple games both MMOs and the like. I beleive the genre is large enough for all three types (Theampark, Sandbox and Hybrids). Devs just need to make them right and by that I meane make then for their respective player base. Theamparker are happy with hand holding, good graphics but not so good that they hinder their PCs. Sandboxers like realism, content, etc and of course Hybrid enjoy a mix.
For me it's a Hybrid. I played WoW for four years and because it was my first MMO, I'm a bit drawn to the hand holding of quests giving me something to do. Now however, I no longer play WoW (simply because, well - it's become a numbers game now and I no longer enjoy it. I raid to get better gear and I need better gear so I can raid...lol).
Anyway, A game that has both Theampark qualities like quest(s), large player base, etc (WoW). Sandbox qualities like no phasing/instancing (I really dislike this), open world(s), able to change the world (WURM). Other: open pvp (but in specific lands) or against specific factions (EVE, FE), Combat like Vindicus but with more than two abilities..lol. And of course the big one Crafting.
What can I say about crafting? It seem to alway make or break a game because not many want to admit they want crafting; yet, most do it. Crafting has to be a major aspec of a long term mmo. Anything else will fail. Just look around, every game with less than great crafting has either failed or is going F2P (P2W) - (with the exception of WoW which like I said, people just hang out because of investment). Figure out a way to combine Wurm Online (craft EVERYTHING, somewhat realistic), FE (again craft everthing but with modern items), EVE (make items discoverable, research), Vangaurd (being able to creat various qualities of items based on mats, skills).
And of course the dev has to make it so that the person not wanting to craft can get these items with level of ease.
Honestly I am pretty sure WOW is currently on it's way to seeing more subscription cancelations. Not because of better games but because WOW has made a few big mistakes almost all based on trying to be everything to everybody. They have tried too hard lately to cater to what they see as the mass market. They try to make it easier for other gamers to come try an MMO. I think this was a huge mistake. WOW has been a leader in the MMO market for a long time now what they should have done is try to keep the original soul of the game and bring new players to MMOs instead of trying to bring their MMO to new players.
That being said no one should hate wow instead every developer should be thankful to wow for building a game that brought millions of new people to the genre, the cost..... Well just like hamburgers it is getting harder and harder to find a good mom and pop joint to get a real burger. Instead we have mcdonalds on every corner, so basically wow is Mcdonalds.
Originally posted by Quizzical The way to make a WoW killer is to make a Stuxnet-style virus that targets Blizzard's servers. Because nothing else except Blizzard itself can kill WoW in the near future. < sarcasm>
ROTFLMAO
Originally posted by Quizzical More seriously, games don't kill other games.
"People do!"
To the thread: Over 10 million players think WoW is just fine. They aren't going to be leaving anytime soon, I think. As someone else stated, WoW was a one-time deal being at the right place at the right time. I don't foresee that happening again anytime soon. Then again, my "future-sight" has been on the fritz for, oh... forever!
"WoW-killer" is a pipedream. Just a wish and a hope.
- Al
Personally the only modern MMORPG trend that annoys me is the idea that MMOs need to be designed in a way to attract people who don't actually like MMOs. Which to me makes about as much sense as someone trying to figure out a way to get vegetarians to eat at their steakhouse. - FARGIN_WAR
Sure you could have it migrate characters -- BUT its a different world -- in essence I could really see them migrating characters from WoW 1.0 to WoW 2.0 by having the name move, the old titles move, achievements etc, some mild bonuses for being from WoW 1.0 varying by what was done there and then start at somewhere around level 20 with translated over equipment -- maybe some of which would grow with the character.
In essence some small advantages and some continuity -- but nothing huge.
Comments
War was a victim of its creator's success. the 300,000 or so DAOC vets latched on to WAR thinking it was going to be DAOC 2. even with repeated screamings from Mythic that WAR =/= DAOC. Despite this, you still ended up with a chunk of the playerbase pissed because they didnt get DAOC 2. (people even made absurd calls for a 3rd realm, totally ignoring the fact that Warhammer does not work that way.)
So i would say WAR fell victim more to players who expected a totally different game (even thought they were told ad nauseum otherwise) as opposed to WAR wanting to be WoW.
Same can be said for Everquest 2. People wanted EQ 1 with better graphics all they got was an instanced dumbed down EQ 1 and rushed out game.
We need a MMORPG Cataclysm asap, finish the dark age of MMORPGS now!
"Everything you're bitching about is wrong. People don't have the time to invest in corpse runs, impossible zones, or long winded quests. Sometimes, they just want to pop on and play."
"Then maybe MMORPGs aren't for you."
While gameplay did help WoW achieve the success it now has, a bigger factor was the time and enviroment in which WoW released. While sharring many of the features of EQ1, WoW made the game more casual friendly and accesible to a larger audience and more importantly, WoW was the first to do so. The MMO enviroemnt is no longer like this. The field is crowded with WoW like games and people have had their share of the WoW "formula". To again capture the kind of "magic" WoW created, you are going to have to create something that feels different from WoW.
A man is his own easiest dupe, for what he wishes to be true he generally believes to be true...
I have friends that still play WoW and beleive it or not, the reason is because of investment. People just need to come to terms that it's a..............wait for it............GAME. As for the phrase "WoW killer", we will never see it. Thats not to say WoW wont some day die as all things do. I suspect WoW will someday loss its sub base to multiple games both MMOs and the like. I beleive the genre is large enough for all three types (Theampark, Sandbox and Hybrids). Devs just need to make them right and by that I meane make then for their respective player base. Theamparker are happy with hand holding, good graphics but not so good that they hinder their PCs. Sandboxers like realism, content, etc and of course Hybrid enjoy a mix.
For me it's a Hybrid. I played WoW for four years and because it was my first MMO, I'm a bit drawn to the hand holding of quests giving me something to do. Now however, I no longer play WoW (simply because, well - it's become a numbers game now and I no longer enjoy it. I raid to get better gear and I need better gear so I can raid...lol).
Anyway, A game that has both Theampark qualities like quest(s), large player base, etc (WoW). Sandbox qualities like no phasing/instancing (I really dislike this), open world(s), able to change the world (WURM). Other: open pvp (but in specific lands) or against specific factions (EVE, FE), Combat like Vindicus but with more than two abilities..lol. And of course the big one Crafting.
What can I say about crafting? It seem to alway make or break a game because not many want to admit they want crafting; yet, most do it. Crafting has to be a major aspec of a long term mmo. Anything else will fail. Just look around, every game with less than great crafting has either failed or is going F2P (P2W) - (with the exception of WoW which like I said, people just hang out because of investment). Figure out a way to combine Wurm Online (craft EVERYTHING, somewhat realistic), FE (again craft everthing but with modern items), EVE (make items discoverable, research), Vangaurd (being able to creat various qualities of items based on mats, skills).
And of course the dev has to make it so that the person not wanting to craft can get these items with level of ease.
That being said no one should hate wow instead every developer should be thankful to wow for building a game that brought millions of new people to the genre, the cost..... Well just like hamburgers it is getting harder and harder to find a good mom and pop joint to get a real burger. Instead we have mcdonalds on every corner, so basically wow is Mcdonalds.
To the thread:
Over 10 million players think WoW is just fine. They aren't going to be leaving anytime soon, I think. As someone else stated, WoW was a one-time deal being at the right place at the right time. I don't foresee that happening again anytime soon. Then again, my "future-sight" has been on the fritz for, oh... forever!
"WoW-killer" is a pipedream. Just a wish and a hope.
- Al
Personally the only modern MMORPG trend that annoys me is the idea that MMOs need to be designed in a way to attract people who don't actually like MMOs. Which to me makes about as much sense as someone trying to figure out a way to get vegetarians to eat at their steakhouse.- FARGIN_WAR
Pretty sure this thread proves people do not actually read anything the OP writes lol
Why do people want to kill WoW?
Did it do something wrong, other than give people satisfaction and fun?
...is it suddenly 'wrong' to make a shitload of money from your own ideas?
I smell socialism.
Wow ruined the genre for one...just like LOL killed mobas and cod killed fps games.
socialist!
If you hate Wow, then you obviously hate the American way of life, Democracy, babies, voting and freedom!
Sure you could have it migrate characters -- BUT its a different world -- in essence I could really see them migrating characters from WoW 1.0 to WoW 2.0 by having the name move, the old titles move, achievements etc, some mild bonuses for being from WoW 1.0 varying by what was done there and then start at somewhere around level 20 with translated over equipment -- maybe some of which would grow with the character.
In essence some small advantages and some continuity -- but nothing huge.