I'm happy with the dynamic events / PQ's as long as they fill the two main criteria I expect from them.
1. Bringing life into the game world.
2. Bringing people together without LFG.
GW2 DE's supposedly succeeds just fine on both of my personal DE/PQ requirements so I'm happy, I'd like all of the events to be very complex with 20 different outcomes, but that's just not realistic thinking. Anet can always add up, and after one year and a couple of alts I enter a zone and an event, something else is going on for a change!
I love love LOVE dynamic events, but that they change the world to me is a nice bonus, not one of their most important features.
With quests, the big problems are with their wall of text presentation, lack of immediacy, and isolating nature (among others). If you go to the corner of the zone and do a bunch of quests, then it really doesn't matter that the world hasn't changed if you never go back there. In your mind, you've saved the day.
Another thing is you can't have the main focus be on changing the world, because you can't "win." It's like with Rift's invasions. You can't permanently save the town (or even save it for more than 10 minutes) so it doesn't take long to just ignore them if changing the world is your only motivation.
To me, if the world is big enough that you can just move on after a DE chain, then you don't really need more chain options. You can only see one option at a time, either pass or fail. It's just from a practical standpoint, development time is limited. I'd rather see many event chains with straightforward outcomes than few event chains with complex outcomes. It would mean you're more likely to see entirely different chains when you do come back to the area and they're more likely to interact when running at the same time.
If they do develop a technology that can automatically generate pseudorandom outcomes, that would be pretty awesome, but as long as they have to be hard coded this is just how I see it.
"Gamers will no longer buy the argument that every MMO requires a subscription fee to offset server and bandwidth costs. It's not true you know it, and they know it."-Jeff Strain, co-founder of ArenaNet, 2007
The problem with what you're suggesting is the amount of work it takes. If a DE has multiple outcomes, then the amount of work is increased for no real payoff, as you can only see one of those outcomes at a time. For example, if ArenaNet codes up 9 dynamic events and puts them into three chains of A->B->C and D->E->F, and G->H->I, then you can wander around the zone to three places and take part in possibly all 9 events if they're running. If instead they code up multiple outcomes like A->(B, C, or D)->(E, F, G, H, I), then you're only seeing three of them.
Or they could lay all three chains overtop of the same area, and either have them running at different times or interacting with each other. It's a lot more flexible a system than always starting with the same event and having it branch multiple possible ways.
People have to remember that this is a game with a huge world and plenty of zones and different regions for each race. You're not going to be constantly running over the same ground. You can level one of each race, then make a 2nd human and then you might be in the same area to see that DE again, 500 hours later.
Yes, but this is going to be the appearance of dynamic rather than use something like GA or CA to be dynamic.
I hope that these Dynamic events don't only work like a linear table..... there are stages and if you win you jump up a stage and if you loose you jump down a stage...
I hope there will be side branches... like
You are fighting off an Invasion Barbarians (excample) and if you win those barbarians will retreat and make camp and you need to take that camp.... So imagine you don't conquer their camp inside a set time, then the barbarians could start their invasion again... but this would be rather Linear... But it could also be that if you don't take that camp in time the barbarians will send out patrolls and start raiding near by farms and poisoning water wells.. and if they succeed at that they would raid another village...
The 2nd excample would feel much less linear then the first one
What would work even better, is dynamic events with 2 goals... and depending on what goal the players reach first, something different happens...
I truely hope dynamic events won't be just jumping up and down the line... i hope they will have several branches........
The only thing we know so far is that there will be dynamic events that influence eachother... so that is very hopegiving.. But no word or proof of different branches in event chains (thats really the wrong word) yet
im sure they have stated these things at pax panels and things
GW2 DE's supposedly succeeds just fine on both of my personal DE/PQ requirements so I'm happy, I'd like all of the events to be very complex with 20 different outcomes, but that's just not realistic thinking. Anet can always add up, and after one year and a couple of alts I enter a zone and an event, something else is going on for a change!
I'm pretty much happy with them as well as they're described and presented. Saying they are a success is like saying TOR's story is a success though. Especially in regard to the "brings players together" part of your criteria. I'm just speaking from present habits in the genre, most players guild, those who don't solo, there's very little middle ground here. The soloers will most likely solo through DE's because they can, just like in WAR. Guilded players hardly socialize outside of their guilds anymore, as overall communities have deteriorated over the years, mostly since the WOW influx. I just see these two factors as being very dificult to overcome.
It's really not even a matter of the games being at fault, it's just the way players are. That doesn't mean DE's will fail at your other must though, as I can see where they could easily succeed there. Especially speaking in terms of being better than a lot of alternatives.
How I personally see DE's playing out on a player level, after the intial wow factor wears off, is many groups of guilded players converging on a single event. The soloers will serve as filler of course. Overall though I see it being as dog eat dog as any other MMO content today. Main difference being everyone gets something. Players will find some manner of pitting themselves against one another, even if it's not in any form but seeing who downs the most MOBS.
To SB fans, please stop making our demographic look bad.Stop invading threads that have nothing to do with sandboxes.
GW2 DE's supposedly succeeds just fine on both of my personal DE/PQ requirements so I'm happy, I'd like all of the events to be very complex with 20 different outcomes, but that's just not realistic thinking. Anet can always add up, and after one year and a couple of alts I enter a zone and an event, something else is going on for a change!
I'm pretty much happy with them as well as they're described and presented. Saying they are a success is like saying TOR's story is a success though. Especially in regard to the "brings players together" part of your criteria. I'm just speaking from present habits in the genre, most players guild, those who don't solo, there's very little middle ground here. The soloers will most likely solo through DE's because they can, just like in WAR. Guilded players hardly socialize outside of their guilds anymore, as overall communities have deteriorated over the years, mostly since the WOW influx. I just see these two factors as being very dificult to overcome.
It's really not even a matter of the games being at fault, it's just the way players are. That doesn't mean DE's will fail at your other must though, as I can see where they could easily succeed there. Especially speaking in terms of being better than a lot of alternatives.
How I personally see DE's playing out on a player level, after the intial wow factor wears off, is many groups of guilded players converging on a single event. The soloers will serve as filler of course. Overall though I see it being as dog eat dog as any other MMO content today. Main difference being everyone gets something. Players will find some manner of pitting themselves against one another, even if it's not in any form but seeing who downs the most MOBS.
There's very little that players can do to cause problems for others in PVE. Events scale up as more people participate and the rewards scale up when that happens. You always want more players to show up. Scaling is based on active participants and that updates continually, so a group can't interact with an event to scale up the difficulty, then stop helping so everyone else gets killed.
Groups are for organization and communication, not for limiting which allies your healing and support skills effect. If a group enters your current DE, you can fight right along with them, utilize any heals they drop, make use of skill synergies and you all, grouped or not, get full rewards.
I really do think that other games have almost trained players to be anti-social, so hopefully GW2 will help untrain some bad habits and actually encourage a better commuity.
I'm just speaking from present habits in the genre, most players guild, those who don't solo, there's very little middle ground here. The soloers will most likely solo through DE's because they can, just like in WAR. Guilded players hardly socialize outside of their guilds anymore, as overall communities have deteriorated over the years, mostly since the WOW influx. I just see these two factors as being very dificult to overcome.
It's really not even a matter of the games being at fault, it's just the way players are.
I pretty strongly disagree with this. This player behaviour doesn't come out of nowhere, and it's certainly not "just the way they are". Social interactions in games are very much determined by the games rules. If we see people be unsocial in MMOs, it's because despite their multiplayer aspects, they are actually designed to reward unsocial behaviour.
Well Epic Dynamic Events branches out into multiple big events in the area, which then branches out into smaller events, it was mentioned in one of the visits to ANet.
How much WoW could a WoWhater hate, if a WoWhater could hate WoW? As much WoW as a WoWhater would, if a WoWhater could hate WoW.
Comments
I'm happy with the dynamic events / PQ's as long as they fill the two main criteria I expect from them.
1. Bringing life into the game world.
2. Bringing people together without LFG.
GW2 DE's supposedly succeeds just fine on both of my personal DE/PQ requirements so I'm happy, I'd like all of the events to be very complex with 20 different outcomes, but that's just not realistic thinking. Anet can always add up, and after one year and a couple of alts I enter a zone and an event, something else is going on for a change!
I love love LOVE dynamic events, but that they change the world to me is a nice bonus, not one of their most important features.
With quests, the big problems are with their wall of text presentation, lack of immediacy, and isolating nature (among others). If you go to the corner of the zone and do a bunch of quests, then it really doesn't matter that the world hasn't changed if you never go back there. In your mind, you've saved the day.
Another thing is you can't have the main focus be on changing the world, because you can't "win." It's like with Rift's invasions. You can't permanently save the town (or even save it for more than 10 minutes) so it doesn't take long to just ignore them if changing the world is your only motivation.
To me, if the world is big enough that you can just move on after a DE chain, then you don't really need more chain options. You can only see one option at a time, either pass or fail. It's just from a practical standpoint, development time is limited. I'd rather see many event chains with straightforward outcomes than few event chains with complex outcomes. It would mean you're more likely to see entirely different chains when you do come back to the area and they're more likely to interact when running at the same time.
If they do develop a technology that can automatically generate pseudorandom outcomes, that would be pretty awesome, but as long as they have to be hard coded this is just how I see it.
"Gamers will no longer buy the argument that every MMO requires a subscription fee to offset server and bandwidth costs. It's not true you know it, and they know it." -Jeff Strain, co-founder of ArenaNet, 2007
I just cried because I'm bystander ignorant.
im sure they have stated these things at pax panels and things
I'm pretty much happy with them as well as they're described and presented. Saying they are a success is like saying TOR's story is a success though. Especially in regard to the "brings players together" part of your criteria. I'm just speaking from present habits in the genre, most players guild, those who don't solo, there's very little middle ground here. The soloers will most likely solo through DE's because they can, just like in WAR. Guilded players hardly socialize outside of their guilds anymore, as overall communities have deteriorated over the years, mostly since the WOW influx. I just see these two factors as being very dificult to overcome.
It's really not even a matter of the games being at fault, it's just the way players are. That doesn't mean DE's will fail at your other must though, as I can see where they could easily succeed there. Especially speaking in terms of being better than a lot of alternatives.
How I personally see DE's playing out on a player level, after the intial wow factor wears off, is many groups of guilded players converging on a single event. The soloers will serve as filler of course. Overall though I see it being as dog eat dog as any other MMO content today. Main difference being everyone gets something. Players will find some manner of pitting themselves against one another, even if it's not in any form but seeing who downs the most MOBS.
To SB fans, please stop making our demographic look bad.Stop invading threads that have nothing to do with sandboxes.
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There's very little that players can do to cause problems for others in PVE. Events scale up as more people participate and the rewards scale up when that happens. You always want more players to show up. Scaling is based on active participants and that updates continually, so a group can't interact with an event to scale up the difficulty, then stop helping so everyone else gets killed.
Groups are for organization and communication, not for limiting which allies your healing and support skills effect. If a group enters your current DE, you can fight right along with them, utilize any heals they drop, make use of skill synergies and you all, grouped or not, get full rewards.
I really do think that other games have almost trained players to be anti-social, so hopefully GW2 will help untrain some bad habits and actually encourage a better commuity.
Want to know more about GW2 and why there is so much buzz? Start here: Guild Wars 2 Mass Info for the Uninitiated
I hope someone figures out how to grief because ArenaNets ban mechanism is funny as hell.
In game support is bad @$$.
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I pretty strongly disagree with this. This player behaviour doesn't come out of nowhere, and it's certainly not "just the way they are". Social interactions in games are very much determined by the games rules. If we see people be unsocial in MMOs, it's because despite their multiplayer aspects, they are actually designed to reward unsocial behaviour.
Change the game, and you change the players.
Well Epic Dynamic Events branches out into multiple big events in the area, which then branches out into smaller events, it was mentioned in one of the visits to ANet.
How much WoW could a WoWhater hate, if a WoWhater could hate WoW?
As much WoW as a WoWhater would, if a WoWhater could hate WoW.