If it get's harder to replace ships due to increased mineral-requirements, then the numbers of big fleetbattles will decrease.
A decrease of fleetbattles is not what the playerbase wants. The players want easy replacements to have big fleetbattles on a daily basis. The players don't want to grind just to get a new ship they can throw away in a fleetbattle.
CCP obviously had the plan to increase the amount of easy minerals, when they introduced the drone-regions...
cheaper minerals -> less grind -> more battles -> more fun -> more subscribers -> win/win
In addition, T1 ships would be far more heavily affected than T2/T3; minerals are only a small part of he cost of these ships. So the nubs and poor players would be hit much harder than the high skilled and rich players.
I'd be quite happy with an increase in the mineral requirements for capital ships though.
Stockpiles do not matter, there will always be stock piles regardless nor your paragraph about T2 which makes no sense.
As said, flat increase in mineral requirements for all ships or caps only would not have lasting effect if any.
PVP as mineral sink isn't simply sufficient.
Tough. PvP is what there is and what there should be. At the moment we have too many guys looking to produce minerals and not enough guys willing to sink them by destroying ships. In the past, ship insurance effectively subsidised miners at the expense of a unbelievably vast ISK fountain. Now that insurance has been nerfed, mineral prices have fallen to their supply/demand equilibrium. To raise mining rewards you need to significantly reduce supply. And I mean a lot. At the moment there is far more ore of all types easily available (W-space has fantastic quantities of ABCs) even without the massive influx from the drone regions.
We also need a lot more people ready to man up and accept losing a ship now and then. Too many EVE players fail to realise that the economy revolves around ship destruction and think they should be immune from taking their turn - and this definitely includes miners.
Asteroids should get turrets based on size/ore and defend themselves. Beware the Tech3 rocks.
Supply goes down. Prices go up. Mining becomes more rewarding and interesting. Victory!
I think the T2 crystals only being a slight upgrade follows a pattern with most things in the game. Huge training times for level 5 skills that only give marginal improvements compared to the time invested, etc. Just food for thought.
Yay, the mining debate. Mining back in 2006, with my corp then...was a team building/socializing event. We did it in Kor-Azor, discussed everything from why American's suck at soccor to why there's a abnormally large amount of EvE pop from Belgium. Oh, we made a little money at it. I got wanderlust quickly,(prior to knowing anything about PvP), quickly left..moved to 0.0 for the "high-ends."
Halada's mining guide in hand..I was ready to pillage some rocks. I then found out why Tyrrax and all the monkeys from IAC were well known pvp monkeys...and there was no looking back.
To fully address this...making non capital ship building as a mineral sink...is a bad idea. I FULLY endorse making the cap ship min requirements anywhere from 3 to even 10 times the amount it is now. Capital Ships Online is a well known detriment to many small group pvp'ers I know, and it does allow for large amounts of 0.0 to be held easier.
I lived in the Drone Lands for about 2 years, and no, I'm not russian. I was in the Alliance the whole region is now named for. I can tell you from personal experience, that I made BILLIONS on zydrine and megacyte. I have never seen so many minerals in my life prior.
To give you an example, a fellow corpmate did a test. Using myself for a perfect refine rate, he ratted for 2 hours a night to see how long it would take him to get enough minerals for a Mothership..now a Supercarrier. He did it in 23 days. I will say that again. 23 DAYS.
I wouldn't have believed him, but I know he wasn't buying alloys, b/c I bought and sold all the corps building mats, and he didn't have and alt I didn't know of..and he damn sure wasn't shipping them out to Etherium Reach.
So, how do you fix it? Well, CCP made a big move by reducing mission loot drop. I would be in favor of increasing min requirments for T3 as well..b/c if you're flying T3....you can afford more mins.
No one ever mentions increasing the cycle times for Hulks or even giving them specific mineral bonuses aside from the T2 crystals and ship bonii. I personally think they had it right with the Procurer, even though that ship is fairly useless now. If you added a few mining barges to give bonii for different mins, that's more ships being built/destroyed.
I lament the days when T1 ships/mods were useful. It would be great to see more uses for them than just invention and mission running.
OP you asked if you should use a survey scanner...do you like wasted cycles? I hate mining, and I know that. It is well worth the money to equip a survey scanner..but it will cost you a mid...hahaha. Mining is fine now, even though the Orca and drone regions has somewhat busted it.
Playing: BF4/BF:Hardline, Subnautica 7 days to die Hiatus: EvE Waiting on: World of Darkness(sigh) Interested in: better games in general
You now have a new fan Teala. I have been an avid miner in Eve online since I started in my Catalyst in 2005. Back then the roids in a .5 were bigger than a .....
Anyway, preaching to the choir sister, but having said that I completely agree with you.
I've recently been on a trip down "tradeskill" lane in Eve.
I happen to think its the low ends that are getting all the loving while the highers continue to press down. The reasons are obvious.
You can not escape the fact that mining could be made into something far cooler that rewards people who are at the keyboards. Miners who step outside high sec zones continue to be offereed nothing more than the chance to be one pop'd by just about everything out there. Although this might add up in a board room it generally leaves for a less then optimial experience when you just want to burn some roids.
I'm not saying take no risk but the current rock paper scissors config is loose loose for the miner.
I do not understand the comments of some of the responders. Nobody is asking for mining to be the end-be-all of EVE. Nobody is asking that CCP raise the price of ore. I for one just wish that some of the ongoing issues with mining be addressed. If you have ever gotten mining to max levll before, you would see what some of us miners are talking about in terms of return for the amount of time we spend skilling up. It's almost not worth it. There are a lot of little annoying things that get in the way of mining actually being fun. Things I mentioned in my blog about mining in EVE.
Mining in EVE is not fun any more. Yet mining is an important factor in the game. Mining is as much a part of EVE as territorial control. All I am saying is that CCP should dedicate a little time to fixing what is wrong with mining. When you make a game, it is important that all the pieces you put in your game work as well as the next, or are as fun. Don't just slap something in it, call it good, and then neglect it. Look at Blizzard and how they handled WoW's archeology. There is a prime example of a poorly implemented game mechanic. That is what CCP has done with mining. I'm not asking for a complete overhaul of mining, I am asking that CCP takes a look at the current system and rework it to make it a fun aspect of the game again.
That's a sort of weird analogy. I mean, Archeology was added with Cata right? Whereas mining has been in, well...quite some time now. Archeology doesn't really have much importance overall except that you migth get some gear or pets/mounts whereas mining is important in Eve (as you point out). Additionally, aside from being a rinse/repeat mechanic (like fishing for example), how has it been neglected? New items have been patched in since Cata which wasn't released all that long ago anyhow. Seems they are keeping up with it. Don't get me wrong, Archeology can be marginally more exicting then fishing, but generally more boring then.....anything else, but that just seems like apples/oranges comparison that doesn't really do your case much justice.
I'll agree mining could be more engaging or otherwise, could use some love. This opinion is just going by the last time I participated in mining which has been some time ago. It's not that I hated it or anything, I just didn't really feel like I was really engaged while doing it and that didn't suit my play style I suppose. The people I speak to who mine now would probably be best served by a mechanic that helped reduce bots, but that opinion is really just based off their anecdotes.
-mklinic
"Do something right, no one remembers. Do something wrong, no one forgets" -from No One Remembers by In Strict Confidence
Here's some more so you can choose to ignore them too:
The bot problem can be dealt with if you organize with other local miners against them - do you know how long it takes to make a suicide destroyer alt? A group of them will take down anything bot miners use before concord can do anything about it. If you don't want to do it - pay people to do it for you, but I think you'll find it cheaper and more fun to do it yourselves.
The market can be manipulated to suit your needs, infact, someone is doing that right now in my region and I'm doing great. Minerals are twice what they cost a few months ago... Also, it doesn't hurt that my region's local bot miner disappeared around the same time as the last hulkageddon and hasn't come back since. Besides, the market is not one big market it is made up of local markets so you can control your local market or find a market that better suits you.
The tools are all there and you just need to exploit them for your own advantage. Eve is a game about power and greed and the last thing it needs is a nanny to wipe our asses. You keep your nanny and don't play the game and I'll use a little bit of player initiative and continue to play.
I liked the idea that some people popped up about some buttefly effect (haha) where higher end and t2 ships become more expensive. A rise in t1 ships and modules would be nice for a change, instead of a t2 or go home mentality most people have now.
Did they ever address mining crystals and their meager differences when it comes to actual numbers regarding yield? For instance. Look at the yield of a Veldspar Mining Crystal 1 and a Veldspar Mining Crystal 2. How much difference in yield is there between the two? Did you know there is only .125 difference. Now I dunno about anyone else, but that is truly sad.
T2 offers roughly 10% increase compared to t1, all skills needed for t2 are the same skills you need to refine so its not like you
train for T2 crysals specially. Considering the prize (200k) its fair and 10% is a lot in the long run.
Trouble is, CCP doesn't believe that putting the effort into improving mining would gain them a significant amount of subs therefore their likely to conclude that it's pretty much fine as it is.
They have a decided bias against carebear activities, they reluctantly tolerate them but never cease to try and encourage people to step into the "real' focus of EVE, 0.0 living.
Yeah yeah, I know all about how most people live in Empire, doesn't make CCP stop trying to get more folks to head out into the Great Wildlands.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
This comes up a lot internally and we're narrowing in on a direction. I like to use fishing and golfing analogies for how player skill and knowledge of the task is a large portion of the experience but socializing or relaxing is another aspect. You pick the proper club or lure, swing or cast, then wait or walk. It gives you time to reflect in between times of intense concentration. We're not there with our current mining. Reynir (EVE's creator) also uses a fishing analogy but he talks about Icelandic fishing trollers that comb the ocean in groups because there is more chance of finding a big school of fish when there are many boats and one boat couldn't catch them all once found. This is how we would like ring mining to be. Small pockets of valuable stuff you need to be lucky to find. Obviously all these changes would also be done in such a way it would deter macros.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Another thing that needs to be adressed to make mining more worth it is to reduce the amount of items being dropped by NPCs. NPCs should only drop named modules in low amounts and ammo in higher amounts. All in all CCP should cut item-drops by half to heavily reduce the amount of minerals coming from that source. Salvage should be the primary stuff for killing NPCs now that they've introduced this system years ago.
This. I'm still kinda confused why it hasn't happened yet. I can understand why they might not want to make sweeping changes because of the effect on the economy, but they should have been slowly removing T1 drops from NPCs over the last couple years.
I guess they are just unable to ween the game from it because of the mining botters.
Another thing that needs to be adressed to make mining more worth it is to reduce the amount of items being dropped by NPCs. NPCs should only drop named modules in low amounts and ammo in higher amounts. All in all CCP should cut item-drops by half to heavily reduce the amount of minerals coming from that source. Salvage should be the primary stuff for killing NPCs now that they've introduced this system years ago.
This. I'm still kinda confused why it hasn't happened yet. I can understand why they might not want to make sweeping changes because of the effect on the economy, but they should have been slowly removing T1 drops from NPCs over the last couple years.
I guess they are just unable to ween the game from it because of the mining botters.
It has happened. CCP hugely reduced the mineral component of rat loot in (if memory serves) Tyrannis. They also rebalanced the mineral content of drone alloys. They did it about the same time as the insurance nerf IIRC, which is ironic, because it was the insurance nerf that actually reduced mining income (by removing a gigantic subsidy).
As said above, mining wont become profitable until it becomes difficult, dangerous or ore becomes scarce. (Or some combination thereof). While it is easy, relatively safe and there is a huge overabundance of ore, mining will only ever pay "minimum wage" in EVE.
Another thing that needs to be adressed to make mining more worth it is to reduce the amount of items being dropped by NPCs. NPCs should only drop named modules in low amounts and ammo in higher amounts. All in all CCP should cut item-drops by half to heavily reduce the amount of minerals coming from that source. Salvage should be the primary stuff for killing NPCs now that they've introduced this system years ago.
This. I'm still kinda confused why it hasn't happened yet. I can understand why they might not want to make sweeping changes because of the effect on the economy, but they should have been slowly removing T1 drops from NPCs over the last couple years.
I guess they are just unable to ween the game from it because of the mining botters.
It has happened. CCP hugely reduced the mineral component of rat loot in (if memory serves) Tyrannis. They also rebalanced the mineral content of drone alloys. They did it about the same time as the insurance nerf IIRC, which is ironic, because it was the insurance nerf that actually reduced mining income (by removing a gigantic subsidy).
As said above, mining wont become profitable until it becomes difficult, dangerous or ore becomes scarce. (Or some combination thereof). While it is easy, relatively safe and there is a huge overabundance of ore, mining will only ever pay "minimum wage" in EVE.
It should be gone completely by now, that was my point if I was unclear.
I have been an active member of EvE Online for over 8 years now. I always wanted to be a miner and I still mine to this day. My corp knows me as the maniac miner as I have mined entire Wormhole and Null Sec Asteroid Belts by myself on numerous occasions. With the loss of a few Hulks here and there of course!
There are many problems I have with mining which has pretty much been covered by myself and others numerous times. I haven't trained a mining related skill in over 4 years now.
Which brings me to my point; I am leaving EvE and canceling my subs. I am voting with my wallet. CCP has wavered on this topic for longer than I can remember. Remember when they talked about removing static asteroid belts? Remember when they talked about making asteroids single objects where all ores were rolled into a single ball (depending on security of course) and skills and equipment allowed you to target what ores you wanted? The list goes on and on with no changes on the horizon. It’s a bad joke at this point, like the POS overhaul. I have come to realize it's not happen and nothing is going to change anytime soon.
So, CCP has lost my subs. If EvE is more successful with the current way it’s being handled, I couldn’t be happier. However, EvE is longer a game I enjoy. It’s a dead end, no upgrade path, no future.
Sorry, I don’t mean to come off as disheartening, but if you want a path as a miner in EvE, be prepared to one day be disappointed that after a certain level of awesomeness, the game abruptly stops. Not to mention, the Hulk and belts get really hard to look at after all these years.
I have been an active member of EvE Online for over 8 years now. I always wanted to be a miner and I still mine to this day. My corp knows me as the maniac miner as I have mined entire Wormhole and Null Sec Asteroid Belts by myself on numerous occasions. With the loss of a few Hulks here and there of course!
There are many problems I have with mining which has pretty much been covered by myself and others numerous times. I haven't trained a mining related skill in over 4 years now.
Which brings me to my point; I am leaving EvE and canceling my subs. I am voting with my wallet. CCP has wavered on this topic for longer than I can remember. Remember when they talked about removing static asteroid belts? Remember when they talked about making asteroids single objects where all ores were rolled into a single ball (depending on security of course) and skills and equipment allowed you to target what ores you wanted? The list goes on and on with no changes on the horizon. It’s a bad joke at this point, like the POS overhaul. I have come to realize it's not happen and nothing is going to change anytime soon.
So, CCP has lost my subs. If EvE is more successful with the current way it’s being handled, I couldn’t be happier. However, EvE is longer a game I enjoy. It’s a dead end, no upgrade path, no future.
Sorry, I don’t mean to come off as disheartening, but if you want a path as a miner in EvE, be prepared to one day be disappointed that after a certain level of awesomeness, the game abruptly stops. Not to mention, the Hulk and belts get really hard to look at after all these years.
Surely CCP must realize that mining is still a part of their game and people still do it legally and not bot it. Some of us think mining could be a vibrant and vital part of the game and could be fun and enjoyable aspect of game play. It really saddens me that an aspect of their game that they advertise is neglected the way it is. It really wouldn't take much time and effort on their part to rework some aspect of mining.
Comments
If it get's harder to replace ships due to increased mineral-requirements, then the numbers of big fleetbattles will decrease.
A decrease of fleetbattles is not what the playerbase wants. The players want easy replacements to have big fleetbattles on a daily basis. The players don't want to grind just to get a new ship they can throw away in a fleetbattle.
CCP obviously had the plan to increase the amount of easy minerals, when they introduced the drone-regions...
cheaper minerals -> less grind -> more battles -> more fun -> more subscribers -> win/win
Tough. PvP is what there is and what there should be. At the moment we have too many guys looking to produce minerals and not enough guys willing to sink them by destroying ships. In the past, ship insurance effectively subsidised miners at the expense of a unbelievably vast ISK fountain. Now that insurance has been nerfed, mineral prices have fallen to their supply/demand equilibrium. To raise mining rewards you need to significantly reduce supply. And I mean a lot. At the moment there is far more ore of all types easily available (W-space has fantastic quantities of ABCs) even without the massive influx from the drone regions.
We also need a lot more people ready to man up and accept losing a ship now and then. Too many EVE players fail to realise that the economy revolves around ship destruction and think they should be immune from taking their turn - and this definitely includes miners.
Give me liberty or give me lasers
Asteroids should get turrets based on size/ore and defend themselves. Beware the Tech3 rocks.
Supply goes down. Prices go up. Mining becomes more rewarding and interesting. Victory!
I think the T2 crystals only being a slight upgrade follows a pattern with most things in the game. Huge training times for level 5 skills that only give marginal improvements compared to the time invested, etc. Just food for thought.
Yay, the mining debate. Mining back in 2006, with my corp then...was a team building/socializing event. We did it in Kor-Azor, discussed everything from why American's suck at soccor to why there's a abnormally large amount of EvE pop from Belgium. Oh, we made a little money at it. I got wanderlust quickly,(prior to knowing anything about PvP), quickly left..moved to 0.0 for the "high-ends."
Halada's mining guide in hand..I was ready to pillage some rocks. I then found out why Tyrrax and all the monkeys from IAC were well known pvp monkeys...and there was no looking back.
To fully address this...making non capital ship building as a mineral sink...is a bad idea. I FULLY endorse making the cap ship min requirements anywhere from 3 to even 10 times the amount it is now. Capital Ships Online is a well known detriment to many small group pvp'ers I know, and it does allow for large amounts of 0.0 to be held easier.
I lived in the Drone Lands for about 2 years, and no, I'm not russian. I was in the Alliance the whole region is now named for. I can tell you from personal experience, that I made BILLIONS on zydrine and megacyte. I have never seen so many minerals in my life prior.
To give you an example, a fellow corpmate did a test. Using myself for a perfect refine rate, he ratted for 2 hours a night to see how long it would take him to get enough minerals for a Mothership..now a Supercarrier. He did it in 23 days. I will say that again. 23 DAYS.
I wouldn't have believed him, but I know he wasn't buying alloys, b/c I bought and sold all the corps building mats, and he didn't have and alt I didn't know of..and he damn sure wasn't shipping them out to Etherium Reach.
So, how do you fix it? Well, CCP made a big move by reducing mission loot drop. I would be in favor of increasing min requirments for T3 as well..b/c if you're flying T3....you can afford more mins.
No one ever mentions increasing the cycle times for Hulks or even giving them specific mineral bonuses aside from the T2 crystals and ship bonii. I personally think they had it right with the Procurer, even though that ship is fairly useless now. If you added a few mining barges to give bonii for different mins, that's more ships being built/destroyed.
I lament the days when T1 ships/mods were useful. It would be great to see more uses for them than just invention and mission running.
OP you asked if you should use a survey scanner...do you like wasted cycles? I hate mining, and I know that. It is well worth the money to equip a survey scanner..but it will cost you a mid...hahaha. Mining is fine now, even though the Orca and drone regions has somewhat busted it.
Playing: BF4/BF:Hardline, Subnautica 7 days to die
Hiatus: EvE
Waiting on: World of Darkness(sigh)
Interested in: better games in general
You now have a new fan Teala. I have been an avid miner in Eve online since I started in my Catalyst in 2005. Back then the roids in a .5 were bigger than a .....
Anyway, preaching to the choir sister, but having said that I completely agree with you.
I've recently been on a trip down "tradeskill" lane in Eve.
I happen to think its the low ends that are getting all the loving while the highers continue to press down. The reasons are obvious.
You can not escape the fact that mining could be made into something far cooler that rewards people who are at the keyboards. Miners who step outside high sec zones continue to be offereed nothing more than the chance to be one pop'd by just about everything out there. Although this might add up in a board room it generally leaves for a less then optimial experience when you just want to burn some roids.
I'm not saying take no risk but the current rock paper scissors config is loose loose for the miner.
I do not understand the comments of some of the responders. Nobody is asking for mining to be the end-be-all of EVE. Nobody is asking that CCP raise the price of ore. I for one just wish that some of the ongoing issues with mining be addressed. If you have ever gotten mining to max levll before, you would see what some of us miners are talking about in terms of return for the amount of time we spend skilling up. It's almost not worth it. There are a lot of little annoying things that get in the way of mining actually being fun. Things I mentioned in my blog about mining in EVE.
Mining in EVE is not fun any more. Yet mining is an important factor in the game. Mining is as much a part of EVE as territorial control. All I am saying is that CCP should dedicate a little time to fixing what is wrong with mining. When you make a game, it is important that all the pieces you put in your game work as well as the next, or are as fun. Don't just slap something in it, call it good, and then neglect it. Look at Blizzard and how they handled WoW's archeology. There is a prime example of a poorly implemented game mechanic. That is what CCP has done with mining. I'm not asking for a complete overhaul of mining, I am asking that CCP takes a look at the current system and rework it to make it a fun aspect of the game again.
That's a sort of weird analogy. I mean, Archeology was added with Cata right? Whereas mining has been in, well...quite some time now. Archeology doesn't really have much importance overall except that you migth get some gear or pets/mounts whereas mining is important in Eve (as you point out). Additionally, aside from being a rinse/repeat mechanic (like fishing for example), how has it been neglected? New items have been patched in since Cata which wasn't released all that long ago anyhow. Seems they are keeping up with it. Don't get me wrong, Archeology can be marginally more exicting then fishing, but generally more boring then.....anything else, but that just seems like apples/oranges comparison that doesn't really do your case much justice.
I'll agree mining could be more engaging or otherwise, could use some love. This opinion is just going by the last time I participated in mining which has been some time ago. It's not that I hated it or anything, I just didn't really feel like I was really engaged while doing it and that didn't suit my play style I suppose. The people I speak to who mine now would probably be best served by a mechanic that helped reduce bots, but that opinion is really just based off their anecdotes.
-mklinic
"Do something right, no one remembers.
Do something wrong, no one forgets"
-from No One Remembers by In Strict Confidence
I addressed most of your problems above.
Here's some more so you can choose to ignore them too:
The bot problem can be dealt with if you organize with other local miners against them - do you know how long it takes to make a suicide destroyer alt? A group of them will take down anything bot miners use before concord can do anything about it. If you don't want to do it - pay people to do it for you, but I think you'll find it cheaper and more fun to do it yourselves.
The market can be manipulated to suit your needs, infact, someone is doing that right now in my region and I'm doing great. Minerals are twice what they cost a few months ago... Also, it doesn't hurt that my region's local bot miner disappeared around the same time as the last hulkageddon
and hasn't come back since. Besides, the market is not one big market it is made up of local markets so you can control your local market or find a market that better suits you.
The tools are all there and you just need to exploit them for your own advantage. Eve is a game about power and greed and the last thing it needs is a nanny to wipe our asses. You keep your nanny and don't play the game and I'll use a little bit of player initiative and continue to play.
I liked the idea that some people popped up about some buttefly effect (haha) where higher end and t2 ships become more expensive. A rise in t1 ships and modules would be nice for a change, instead of a t2 or go home mentality most people have now.
T2 offers roughly 10% increase compared to t1, all skills needed for t2 are the same skills you need to refine so its not like you
train for T2 crysals specially. Considering the prize (200k) its fair and 10% is a lot in the long run.
Pi*1337/100 = 42
Trouble is, CCP doesn't believe that putting the effort into improving mining would gain them a significant amount of subs therefore their likely to conclude that it's pretty much fine as it is.
They have a decided bias against carebear activities, they reluctantly tolerate them but never cease to try and encourage people to step into the "real' focus of EVE, 0.0 living.
Yeah yeah, I know all about how most people live in Empire, doesn't make CCP stop trying to get more folks to head out into the Great Wildlands.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
This comes up a lot internally and we're narrowing in on a direction. I like to use fishing and golfing analogies for how player skill and knowledge of the task is a large portion of the experience but socializing or relaxing is another aspect. You pick the proper club or lure, swing or cast, then wait or walk. It gives you time to reflect in between times of intense concentration. We're not there with our current mining. Reynir (EVE's creator) also uses a fishing analogy but he talks about Icelandic fishing trollers that comb the ocean in groups because there is more chance of finding a big school of fish when there are many boats and one boat couldn't catch them all once found. This is how we would like ring mining to be. Small pockets of valuable stuff you need to be lucky to find. Obviously all these changes would also be done in such a way it would deter macros.
http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1508537&page=1#4
Ah ha...so they are thinking about giving Mining some love, though not necessarily in a direction that many would favor.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
i'm one of the few who enjoys some nice quiet owntime with mining . living in low sec we have enough issues :P
This. I'm still kinda confused why it hasn't happened yet. I can understand why they might not want to make sweeping changes because of the effect on the economy, but they should have been slowly removing T1 drops from NPCs over the last couple years.
I guess they are just unable to ween the game from it because of the mining botters.
It has happened. CCP hugely reduced the mineral component of rat loot in (if memory serves) Tyrannis. They also rebalanced the mineral content of drone alloys. They did it about the same time as the insurance nerf IIRC, which is ironic, because it was the insurance nerf that actually reduced mining income (by removing a gigantic subsidy).
As said above, mining wont become profitable until it becomes difficult, dangerous or ore becomes scarce. (Or some combination thereof). While it is easy, relatively safe and there is a huge overabundance of ore, mining will only ever pay "minimum wage" in EVE.
Give me liberty or give me lasers
It should be gone completely by now, that was my point if I was unclear.
I have been an active member of EvE Online for over 8 years now. I always wanted to be a miner and I still mine to this day. My corp knows me as the maniac miner as I have mined entire Wormhole and Null Sec Asteroid Belts by myself on numerous occasions. With the loss of a few Hulks here and there of course!
There are many problems I have with mining which has pretty much been covered by myself and others numerous times. I haven't trained a mining related skill in over 4 years now.
Which brings me to my point; I am leaving EvE and canceling my subs. I am voting with my wallet. CCP has wavered on this topic for longer than I can remember. Remember when they talked about removing static asteroid belts? Remember when they talked about making asteroids single objects where all ores were rolled into a single ball (depending on security of course) and skills and equipment allowed you to target what ores you wanted? The list goes on and on with no changes on the horizon. It’s a bad joke at this point, like the POS overhaul. I have come to realize it's not happen and nothing is going to change anytime soon.
So, CCP has lost my subs. If EvE is more successful with the current way it’s being handled, I couldn’t be happier. However, EvE is longer a game I enjoy. It’s a dead end, no upgrade path, no future.
Sorry, I don’t mean to come off as disheartening, but if you want a path as a miner in EvE, be prepared to one day be disappointed that after a certain level of awesomeness, the game abruptly stops. Not to mention, the Hulk and belts get really hard to look at after all these years.
Surely CCP must realize that mining is still a part of their game and people still do it legally and not bot it. Some of us think mining could be a vibrant and vital part of the game and could be fun and enjoyable aspect of game play. It really saddens me that an aspect of their game that they advertise is neglected the way it is. It really wouldn't take much time and effort on their part to rework some aspect of mining.