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F2P. Why is no one concerned

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  • WraithoneWraithone Member RarePosts: 3,802

    Originally posted by Quandri

    Originally posted by ANDRIOD

    They are not going to make their game pay to play because they know it does not stand a chance as a sub based AAA game.

    please elaborate as to how firefall will not be able to stack up against a sub based game. i'm curious. 

    I'd be quite interested in that myself.  It looks like its going to be a hell of a lot of fun. The only direct competition(time frame wise) might be Tribes Universe.  But TU looks like its going to be mainly PvP focused. Firefall looks a mix of PvP and PvE.  I hope they have PvE servers for CareBears, as I've had more than my fill of gankfest games over the years.

    "If you can't kill it, don't make it mad."
  • FolbyOrbFolbyOrb Member UncommonPosts: 357

    F2P no longer immediately equates to murderous grind alieved only by cash shop items. It also no longer means, "pay to win is only way to win."

    There are new and improved F2P models these days.

    Playing | GW2
    Wanting | Pantheon
    Watching | Crowfall
    Retired | WAR, Cabal, MO, CO, SHK, WoW, FFXIV: ARR

  • IncomparableIncomparable Member UncommonPosts: 1,114

    Originally posted by FolbyOrb

    F2P no longer immediately equates to murderous grind alieved only by cash shop items. It also no longer means, "pay to win is only way to win."

    There are new and improved F2P models these days.

    Through taxing advertising or clown shop fluff. Other than that, what are the new and improved F2P models?

    “Write bad things that are done to you in sand, but write the good things that happen to you on a piece of marble”

  • DatarinDatarin Member CommonPosts: 164

    Originally posted by Incomparable

    Originally posted by FolbyOrb

    F2P no longer immediately equates to murderous grind alieved only by cash shop items. It also no longer means, "pay to win is only way to win."

    There are new and improved F2P models these days.

    Through taxing advertising or clown shop fluff. Other than that, what are the new and improved F2P models?

    Freemium: where you are given a cash shop but not for items - it's for expansion packs/quest packs/etc. Also, an optional subscription for the whole lot. A lot of P2P turned F2P games are using this model, and it's much more balanced then tossing in stuff that greatly unbalance the cash shop =! free player stats.

    basically, the old F2P model was all about character stats; the new model is about the game's actual content.

    Forums: The best real-time interactive MMORPG you'll ever be in.

  • UnlightUnlight Member Posts: 2,540

    Originally posted by Comaf

    Originally posted by theinvader

    No one's concerned because:

    a) We've heard nothing that should make us concerned.

    b) Everyone's got over the fact that F2P is a viable and popular business model and there are plenty of good F2P games.

     

     

    F2P means the company does not have the confidence to assume they can create a monthly subscription model.  F2P means that the one barrier to reduce a lot of needless in game traffic is removed - this means anyone can cross the border at will and crap on your environment.  While this still occurs in p2p games - the statistical reality is that if you have to pay to play you will more likely than not try to invest in the game's community as well.  So while every pay to play has a small percentage of terrible community, EVERY Free to Play lets anyone in the door - greatly exacerbating the potential for a terrible online experience.

     

    Finally -F2P means you pay real life currency from a cash shop in order to compete which in turn means you will get ENDLESS gold spamming on your general chat or otherwise.  That just stinks - period.  Yeah it's becoming a popular model - thank you Korean online games that have literally saturated and dummed down the genre.

    And these stats will of course be forthcoming?

    I've got news for you:  this payment model is here to stay.  You'd better get used to it because you're going to find it harder and harder to find games that will demand monthly tribute when their competitors are letting people play pro bono.  Learn to support developers that implement it properly and shun those that don't if you want any say in how the model evolves.  And it will evolve.  You can rant and rave until you're blue in the face but you won't get rid of it.

    By the way, Guild Wars has a cash shop and there is zero gold spam.  You know where you see gold spam?  WoW -- a subscription title.  How can this be?!

  • DarthMajinDarthMajin Member Posts: 92

    Originally posted by Delmai

    Would have preferred to see the game with a subscription system.

    It will be determined there better weapons and armor to buy. With with anything they must earn money.

    Honestly most MMOs these days use a combination of subscription and cash shop. I personally would like to see a company choose one or the other. Both just bleed my wallet dry when there are things I really want for a game that I have to pay a monthly fee for as well.

    image

  • RagnarokWarRagnarokWar Member UncommonPosts: 35

    Anyone remember Battleswarm? Anyone think this game looks a lot like Battleswarm? Anyone remember Battleswarm had that terrible system where you "rented" equipment? Yeah... hopefully this game finds a way to do it right. Personally, I'd rather they just box the game or throw it up on Steam for $20 - $30 than go Free to Play. F2P usually = terrible, unless it's a P2P gone F2P. But even that doesn't guarantee a good game (see Champions Online).

  • DarkVagabondDarkVagabond Member UncommonPosts: 328

    I like to think the new era of cash shops we have in big name games does it pretty well.

    Purchase points.

    Purchase fancy hair and premium dungeon access.

     

    Grind Gold.

    Purchase fancy hair from the guy with points.

     

    Grind obscure trinket.

    Unlock premium dungeon access.

     

    The guys who feel the need to play with their wallets get the convenience they pay for, and the guys who pinch pennies are still perfectly capable of reaching the highest peaks.

     

    Also entirely noteworthy : The high quality free to play publishers are now allowing the completion of tacky web surveys and things similar to them to earn virtual currencies. You arent entirely boned if you really really need 500 interwebpoints to get a backpack expansion.

  • WraithoneWraithone Member RarePosts: 3,802

    Originally posted by RagnarokWar

    Anyone remember Battleswarm? Anyone think this game looks a lot like Battleswarm? Anyone remember Battleswarm had that terrible system where you "rented" equipment? Yeah... hopefully this game finds a way to do it right. Personally, I'd rather they just box the game or throw it up on Steam for $20 - $30 than go Free to Play. F2P usually = terrible, unless it's a P2P gone F2P. But even that doesn't guarantee a good game (see Champions Online).

     Oh yes... I remember it.  I liked aspects of the FPS game(never did care for the bug RTS side).  But "renting" weapons and armor was annoying as hell. I understand the business model(and it seems to work in Asia), but its just not one I'm happy with.

    "If you can't kill it, don't make it mad."
  • EmoqqboyEmoqqboy Member UncommonPosts: 194

    Originally posted by Arquiteto

    I like everyone else am excited for the game, but how is the cash shop going to work. What will be sold. Will armor and weapons be sold. If so like the EA F2P games it will be Pay2win.

    This is not a troll. It is simply a fan wondering how they are going to make it work.

    Lets be realistic here, all f2p games will be pay2win to a certain extent, and if they arent yet, they will be when they decide the player population is stable enough, how else do u think the company is gonna recoup costs and pay their staff and maintain servers?  I've seen the reality of the f2p concept right when it started, i have no idea why such a large majority of the player community fails to realise this or rather see "through" this concept. Whole idea of f2p is to pull in the initial crowd under the free context bonus, and by the time you're serious enough about the game and see the pay2win part usually evident by endgame, you're in too deep to want to consider pulling out, this is the f2p marketting concept. Get with the program!

    <QQ moar plz. kkthxbai.>

  • xenex413xenex413 Member UncommonPosts: 35

    Originally posted by Arquiteto

    I like everyone else am excited for the game, but how is the cash shop going to work. What will be sold. Will armor and weapons be sold. If so like the EA F2P games it will be Pay2win.

    This is not a troll. It is simply a fan wondering how they are going to make it work.

    Published by Webzen, the company who made Archlord all about who had and spent the most money on item mall after they took the game from Codemasters, in recap, yes you should be concerned.

  • Shredder420Shredder420 Member Posts: 4

     

    I'd be less worried about Webzen ane more worried about The9...the company that pretty much owns Red 5 Studios. The9 was the company that stole WoW assets and decided to make thier own MMO out of them called "World of Fight". Yeah...lol. doesn't exactly give me much confidence. 


  • RemyVorenderRemyVorender Member RarePosts: 3,823

    I played it. There's more reason for concern than simply its pay model.

    Played: AA, AC1, AC2, Aion, AO, AoC, BDO, CO, CoX, DAoC, DCUO, EVE, EQ1, EQ2,
    ESO, Fallen Earth, FFXI, FFXIV, GW1, GW2, Istaria, L2, LoTRO, MxO, Neverwinter, Rift, RoE,
    Ryzom, Shadowbane, SWG, SWTOR, TERA, TSW, WAR, WoW, WURM...and a bunch of others not worth mentioning.


    Joined - July 2004

  • WraithoneWraithone Member RarePosts: 3,802

    Originally posted by remyburke

    I played it. There's more reason for concern than simply its pay model.

    You've played Firefall?  Would you care to expand on your experience?

    "If you can't kill it, don't make it mad."
  • CastillleCastillle Member UncommonPosts: 2,679

    Originally posted by alexanys1982

    Nobody is concerned because its a FPS. It does not matter how many l33t weapons you buy in the cash shop, a fresh player in starter gear will still curbstomp you if he comes from a FPS background. This isnt WoW where all you need is gear and the abilty to run through opponents. FPS are very different animals.

    QFT!!

    The ones FPS players are worried about are aimbotters and through-the-wall shooters...I swear I ran into one of those in APB and itwas bad! I was clearly in the corner of a building with my back on the corner and something was shooting me from behind -.-

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  • michaelmnnmichaelmnn Member Posts: 39

    Originally posted by Castillle

    Originally posted by alexanys1982

    Nobody is concerned because its a FPS. It does not matter how many l33t weapons you buy in the cash shop, a fresh player in starter gear will still curbstomp you if he comes from a FPS background. This isnt WoW where all you need is gear and the abilty to run through opponents. FPS are very different animals.

    QFT!!

    The ones FPS players are worried about are aimbotters and through-the-wall shooters...I swear I ran into one of those in APB and itwas bad! I was clearly in the corner of a building with my back on the corner and something was shooting me from behind -.-

    What you've said is correct for FPS players.. but had nothing to do with what he put as far as the payment model of the game is concerned. 

    But i agree with the fact that those who are FPS players can care less what the payment model of the game is concerned, Its the play

  • CopenhagenCopenhagen Member UncommonPosts: 57

    I don't mind games that don't have a subscription on them.  If they are like Guild Wars, Global Agenda.  Where you buy the game then play it.  Global Agenda sells "Boosts" only.

     

    I don't like it when F2P games, make it to where you "Have" to spend money, or, they make it to where you can spend large amounts of money to Be Super Powerful...Allods Online...Runes...

     

    I don't think F2P games should sell Items, with stats, or any type of Super Duper Items period.   XP boosts are fine, Cosmetics are fine.   Pets are fine.  Mounts are fine.   But  I'd love to see a F2P game come out where it is free.

     

    I'm probably just going to stick with P2P games...Subscription Based ones.

     

     

    I do like to try out the F2P games, till I get to the point where I sort of need to drop some cash on them.   I'll tell you the best time to play a F2P game is in Closed Beta.   That way the Cash shop is not live yet.  You can really actually experience the "Real" game.

  • ZerogrifterZerogrifter Member Posts: 2

    I had a chance to speak to the CEO of Red5 at Pax East and his philosphy was

    1) Red5 is making the game that they ultimately want to play.

    2) They are doing what they love and they have the chance to follow their passion. They feel that if they produce an amazing product it will speak for itself and the money will follow.

    3) a F2P model now a days lets developers put thier game into the hands of as many gamers as possible. The more people that are exposed to it the more potential customers they will have.

    4) The more support the userbase provides to the dev company the more readily they will be able to produce new content making a win win scenario.

    I can keep the list going but in all honestly the F2P model has me stoked, not because I'm a cheap guy, but because it will allow for more people to get in on an awesome game. Not having that financial hurdle blocking them from partaking in a great game. (I got to play it at Pax East)

  • Asura12Asura12 Member Posts: 2

    Yeah there is a tonne of threads on the firefall forums about this topic the devs have ressaured us many times it wont turn to pay for power

  • leumasx7leumasx7 Member Posts: 218

    If the item shop only has weapons you can already earn in game as of same class. Dont care..

    (APB tho..I feel has some unfair weapons, due to style the weapons you carry is big factor... Scoped NTEC> , the scout (no slow down, same power as HVR). Big factor...

     

    As I could care less on weapons, if they sold something such as 'Armor' like giving the item shop person a huge advantage. Then we have problem...

     

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