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Battlegrounds / Instanced PvP: How much do you think they would SUFFER if rewards were REMOVED?

depaindepain Member Posts: 263

Personally, as an avid PvP player, I feel forced into Battlegrounds / Warzones / Arenas. Normally, I'd have nothing to with 'em. However, there is always gear incentive. Such gear is almost always aesthetically pleasing and extremely powerful. Thus, I feel compelled to commit to the redundant grind of Battlegrounds - the same 5 or so maps... over and over again.

 

Let's imagine that the Developers decided to remove PvP Rewards from Battleground-like PvP. This means that folks would be participating in Battlegrounds for the love of Instanced PvP - no rewards or titles... just the experience.

 

If rewards were removed from BGs, what percentage of decline would you expect to see?

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Comments

  • AxehiltAxehilt Member RarePosts: 10,504

    Maybe 80% or so.

    ...are we trying to pretend that "If you remove the RPG from RPGs, players stop playing" is a trait specific to the PVP side of things?  It's not.

    Progression is an intrinsic part of videogame RPGs.  (Rewards are progression.)

    "What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver

  • MeowheadMeowhead Member UncommonPosts: 3,716

    ... I'm a little confused.  Are you advocating removing all rewards from gameplay, so people will only do gameplay they enjoy for the sake of gameplay?  Interesting experiment.  My bet is that the whole game would collapse.

  • depaindepain Member Posts: 263

    Originally posted by Axehilt

    Maybe 80% or so.

    ...are we trying to pretend that "If you remove the RPG from RPGs, players stop playing" is a trait specific to the PVP side of things?  It's not.

    Progression is an intrinsic part of videogame RPGs.  (Rewards are progression.)

     I'm trying to say, "Battlegrounds & Instanced PvP is boring. Stop making me do it through gear incentive".

     

    It's time for something more in-depth. I can experience 5v5 or 7v7 instanced battle in any online game. It's a joke to the MMO realm.

  • godzilr1godzilr1 Member UncommonPosts: 550

    if you take away rewards then people will simply stop showing up to get their asses kicked but the upper 10% of number crunching, corpse camping, cookie cutter building elitist's.  Most poeple can only stand to be in the BG's because the gear rewards allow them to be there long enough to enjoy it

  • Bishop200Bishop200 Member Posts: 68

    I voted 80 %, cause most game have awfull  pvp.

  • inBOILinBOIL Member Posts: 669

    good post. 99%

    Generation P

  • bunnyhopperbunnyhopper Member CommonPosts: 2,751

    Probably 80%, the current crop of players is all about 'teh shinies' after all. If you took them away people would realise just how god damn awful most mmos actually are.

    "Come and have a look at what you could have won."

  • EnerzealEnerzeal Member Posts: 326

    Tonight I am going to log into Lineage 2 and fight in a castle siege,

    or I could..

    Log into Rift and grind Black Garden 20 or so times to get pvp gear.

     

     

    I play every other type of game for every other reason than what I aquire..

    BFBC2, I log in with my guild Kindred Rising to do totally batshit lethal things, sweet gun fights, biblical moments of blinding awesomeness.

    I load up mass effect 2 to progress story and again enjoy pimpin gun fights and really coordinated moments of rpg goodness.

    I play a game of Magic the gathering against another player or four for some real tactical gameplay.

     

    In a themepark we grind the same instance for the 14th time to grab a piece of gear, we dont do it because we enjoy the instance, anyone that says they do is lying through their ass.

    Same with a battleground, we don't do it cause its fun. Its less tedius than instances, but the 100th warsong gulch is sickeningly boring and we are only doing it to get gear to enter arena.

     

    Arena is the only piece of warcraft pvp I find fun, I do it to get a high rating to be better, the gear is also an insentive but being better trumps it.

  • MardyMardy Member Posts: 2,213

    People won't do it if there are no rewards at all.  However, subtle rewards such as DAOC's persistent battlegrounds where players could still accumulate realm points, it gave people a sense of accomplishment still.  Since DAOC's BG's were level & realm point capped, you couldn't go above a threshold.  So often people did stay in them for fun and not for rewards.

     

    But for quick 15min instanced BG/Arena we see today, no, nobody would do them if you removed rewards from them.  I know nobody is a huge generalization but 80-90% of the people not playing them anymore would be just like nobody played them heh.

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  • CefkaCefka Member Posts: 92

    Originally posted by godzilr1

    if you take away rewards then people will simply stop showing up to get their asses kicked but the upper 10% of number crunching, corpse camping, cookie cutter building elitist's.  Most poeple can only stand to be in the BG's because the gear rewards allow them to be there long enough to enjoy it

    This where you're wrong. Tons of people PvP In DFO and yet there's no reward for it, they do it because it's fun and challenging and they do it with their own unique builds.

    I'd say about 50% but that would depend on the MMO.

  • QuirhidQuirhid Member UncommonPosts: 6,230

    I leveled through scenarios in WAR because they were tons of fun compared to RvR or PvE. A lot faster too.

    I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky

  • GolelornGolelorn Member RarePosts: 1,389

    If the BG is fun I don't think it would matter.

  • TorikTorik Member UncommonPosts: 2,342

    Originally posted by Cefka

    Originally posted by godzilr1

    if you take away rewards then people will simply stop showing up to get their asses kicked but the upper 10% of number crunching, corpse camping, cookie cutter building elitist's.  Most poeple can only stand to be in the BG's because the gear rewards allow them to be there long enough to enjoy it

    This where you're wrong. Tons of people PvP In DFO and yet there's no reward for it, they do it because it's fun and challenging and they do it with their own unique builds.

    I'd say about 50% but that would depend on the MMO.

    How many people would keep PvPing in DFO if player loot was disabled?

  • waynejr2waynejr2 Member EpicPosts: 7,768

    At least 80%.

    http://www.youhaventlived.com/qblog/2010/QBlog190810A.html  

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  • Jackal-79Jackal-79 Member UncommonPosts: 55

    I dont really see what your trying to do with this poll, but if MMO developers took away Rewards for PvP instanced or world than what would be the point of having PvP at all ? at the end of the day its a game! , Poeple need  something to aim for in a game  and rewards does exactly what it says on the tin " If you PvP you get rewards".

    Plus its not the only way to get  good gear there is always end game so no-one is  Forcing you to PvP at all!

    If you feel pressured into having do PvP you have to remember that it is a game and you need to enjoy a game, now if i felt like you do then i would quit imo

  • DengarDengar Member UncommonPosts: 34

    Originally posted by Jackal-79

    I dont really see what your trying to do with this poll, but if MMO developers took away Rewards for PvP instanced or world than what would be the point of having PvP at all ? at the end of the day its a game! , Poeple need  something to aim for in a game  and rewards does exactly what it says on the tin " If you PvP you get rewards".

    Plus its not the only way to get  good gear there is always end game so no-one is  Forcing you to PvP at all!

    If you feel pressured into having do PvP you have to remember that it is a game and you need to enjoy a game, now if i felt like you do then i would quit imo

    Asheron's Call. No pvp rewards, no instances, and the FFA server was full of action. It was the most popular server they had. The reason to pvp? Bragging rights. Controlling towns. Building epic stories (ask any Darkfall player about "World War 1" and "Hyperion" and you'll hear a non-RP epic tale that non-gamers can enjoy. Ask a raider about their first Ragnaros kill, and you usually get nap time).

  • MajinashMajinash Member Posts: 1,320

    Originally posted by Jackal-79

     If MMO developers took away Rewards for PvP instanced or world than what would be the point of having PvP at all?

     

    Poeple need  something to aim for in a game  and rewards does exactly what it says on the tin " If you PvP you get rewards".

     

    Years ago I used to spend my time during recess playing things like kickball, soccer and football.  never once did i get a reward at the end of the game.  It was a game we played because we had fun.

     

    The point of the post is asking is if instaned PvP is actually "fun" or do people do it only for the rewards.  you seem to mix the 2 and say 1 is dependant on the other.  that may be true for you, but I never got into games because I needed to be rewarded to have fun.

     

    It is obvious from your post that if they took away rewards from PvP that you would no longer do it.  Logic would dictate you do not find PvP itself to be fun, or you would do it regardless.

     

     

    To answer the main post... it depends on the game.  I put hundreds of hours into 4v4 arenas in Guild Wars because it was just fun.  I even played before they added Balthazaar faction so there was pretty much zero reward from PvP (not that the faction is much of a reward either) and it was a blast.  It really depends on the PvP itself, it can be so diverse.

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  • CefkaCefka Member Posts: 92

    Originally posted by Torik

    Originally posted by Cefka


    Originally posted by godzilr1

    if you take away rewards then people will simply stop showing up to get their asses kicked but the upper 10% of number crunching, corpse camping, cookie cutter building elitist's.  Most poeple can only stand to be in the BG's because the gear rewards allow them to be there long enough to enjoy it

    This where you're wrong. Tons of people PvP In DFO and yet there's no reward for it, they do it because it's fun and challenging and they do it with their own unique builds.

    I'd say about 50% but that would depend on the MMO.

    How many people would keep PvPing in DFO if player loot was disabled?

    Woops guess I shouldn't just say DFO anymore since 2 games fit that name.

    I meant dungeon fighter online.

  • laokokolaokoko Member UncommonPosts: 2,004

    kill trade is one of the problem i see with good reward in world pvp.  And I think that's the main reason world pvp dont' get alot of developer love in many games.

    Beside many pve people dont' like to get bother when they do their pve stuff.

  • Bishop200Bishop200 Member Posts: 68

    Originally posted by Majinash

    To answer the main post... it depends on the game.  I put hundreds of hours into 4v4 arenas in Guild Wars because it was just fun.  I even played before they added Balthazaar faction so there was pretty much zero reward from PvP (not that the faction is much of a reward either) and it was a blast.  It really depends on the PvP itself, it can be so diverse.

     

    Guild Wars his cheating, a lot easier to have great pvp when the gear does'nt count for half your strengh. Still the only game where i have like the pvp and for almost no reward.

  • ShamorauShamorau Member UncommonPosts: 181

    I put it at 80%. most people only do pvp for the gear. if this was removed there is not incentive for pvp so why do it.  i think this is shown by the fact that people will do the same crappy maps time and time again, for sake of an item. this is for the most part boring, the combat depending on the game might not be, but there is no challenge if you know where to go by when.  And if an objective is not reached in the first couple of minutes, then peeps just drop out of the battleground. so whats the point of it if there is no kit or reward.

  • skeaserskeaser Member UncommonPosts: 3,949

    I hate to say it but I would've stuck with WAR if it weren't for Scenarios.

    I have no interest in capture the flag/king of the hill type PvP but WAR made it the main leveling activity leaving PQs and keeps deserted. If you want to put PvP in a game put PvP in, controllable areas/keeps with buffs for the faction/guild that controls it.

  • MurashuMurashu Member UncommonPosts: 1,385

    At least 80% drop if they removed the reward system. Very few people I know run instanced PvP because it's fun.

     

    I used to make fun of some of my long time friends and guildmates who would logon every Tuesday night just to queue up for arenas. They would be at each others throats after the first match and would do nothing but whine and complain about every match, but they felt they had to do them each week or they wouldn't have enough arena points to buy the new shinies.

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  • kegtapkegtap Member Posts: 261

    Old school AV was more about quests with a few rewards. It was always full but thats when WoW was young and you had to PvP all the time to gain rank. I think that was the only battleground I really enjoyed. Lots of NPCs you had to kill and it could take a long time to finish. The battleground  PvP system had to change to keep it interesting. If you are max level doing the same battleground over and over players will eventually not want to play without rewards.

    Can a non-reward system work yes for a short time but it will have to change to keep player interst and that will probably have to be done with rewards in a BAttleground.

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  • EvasiaEvasia Member Posts: 2,827

    Im more hoping of removing them all together from all games there disgrace to whole pvp as a gamestyle. Bringback the world open pvp in all mmo's lets get some ganking/corpsecamp a pk paradise going and no mercy with all who dont like it that would be best move:)

    Games played:AC1-Darktide'99-2000-AC2-Darktide/dawnsong2003-2005,Lineage2-2005-2006 and now Darkfall-2009.....
    In between WoW few months AoC few months and some f2p also all very short few weeks.

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