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community desperately seeking satisfying mmo experience.

MAUL0rMAUL0r Member Posts: 16

I'm talking to you, game designers, and you developers, and you too artists.

 

Seeking the following:

 

- gigantic, open environments with lots of room to stretch our legs and explore.

- comprehensive crafting system.

- player-driven economy.

- pvp that has a purpose.

- if you must have factions, MORE THAN 2 PLEASE. Good vs. Evil is not only cliche'd, it's terrible for an mmo experience.

- freedom to make mistakes... we're not babies, let us die, let us spec completely weird ways and regret it.

- classic art style. We don't need to have a giant rotating chain-saw-sword-guitar to feel good about ourselves... 

- a questing system that does not insult our intelligence. Make questing difficult, but worth the effort. We want to feel like our character has had a personal goal in life, and it is the driving force in his "story". We don't want  to murder innocent flora and fauna for the amusement of some random npc... we want there to be a real purpose to every quest we undertake.

- dynamic world events, dynamic loot... you know what? just try to be more dynamic wherever possible. Nothing we do should feel spoon-fed or repetitive.

- give us new content at least once every 6months. I don't mean a full-on expansion, but give us a new dungeon, a new explorable zone, SOMETHING to add diversity to the world over time.

- we want housing. I shouldn't have to explain why, but I will because so many games ignore this feature. We want a place to call home within our world, it makes the world seem more like an actual world... are we to believe that there are 1000s of people running around homeless? We want to be able to decorate our house, store stuff in our house, and display trophies of our adventures.

- we want an intuitive, and customizable interface. Not just the look, but custom layouts and addons as well.

- we want a fluid control system, that makes us feel free to jump and run and climb in the world.

- we want gameplay that requires skills, not luck, or bugging out to succeed. Don't just make something impossible because it's the last piece of content in the game and you don't want people to finish it.

------------------------

 

 

Now, I know there have been games that have met some or almost all of these requirements, but there seems to be less and less choices out there for people who want a really in-depth experience, and more games that cater to the "casual player" which is game-design-speak for "so easy a caveman could do it". This is a call to action for game devs to get back to the wild wild west approach to mmos that really made us fall in love with a game.

 

What other features would you say game devs need to be focusing on for future games? Add to the discussion! Let's see if we can't make those designers' ears perk up a little.

Comments

  • HYPERI0NHYPERI0N Member Posts: 3,515

    Originally posted by MAUL0r

    I'm talking to you, game designers, and you developers, and you too artists.

     

    Seeking the following:

     

    - gigantic, open environments with lots of room to stretch our legs and explore. EVE Online

    - comprehensive crafting system. EvE Online

    - player-driven economy. EVE ONLINE

    - pvp that has a purpose. EVE ONLINE

    - if you must have factions, MORE THAN 2 PLEASE. Good vs. Evil is not only cliche'd, it's terrible for an mmo experience. EVE ONLINE

    - freedom to make mistakes... we're not babies, let us die, let us spec completely weird ways and regret it. eVe

    - classic art style. We don't need to have a giant rotating chain-saw-sword-guitar to feel good about ourselves...EVE SORT OFF

    - a questing system that does not insult our intelligence. Make questing difficult, but worth the effort. We want to feel like our character has had a personal goal in life, and it is the driving force in his "story". We don't want  to murder innocent flora and fauna for the amusement of some random npc... we want there to be a real purpose to every quest we undertake.

    - dynamic world events, dynamic loot... you know what? just try to be more dynamic wherever possible. Nothing we do should feel spoon-fed or repetitive. EVE

    - give us new content at least once every 6months. I don't mean a full-on expansion, but give us a new dungeon, a new explorable zone, SOMETHING to add diversity to the world over time. EVE

    - we want housing. I shouldn't have to explain why, but I will because so many games ignore this feature. We want a place to call home within our world, it makes the world seem more like an actual world... are we to believe that there are 1000s of people running around homeless? We want to be able to decorate our house, store stuff in our house, and display trophies of our adventures. IN A FEW MONTHS EVE

    - we want an intuitive, and customizable interface. Not just the look, but custom layouts and addons as well. No addons but yes for the rest in eve

    - we want a fluid control system, that makes us feel free to jump and run and climb in the world. Hard to say here eve's very different movement wise. you are however free to go anywhere.

    - we want gameplay that requires skills, not luck, or bugging out to succeed. Don't just make something impossible because it's the last piece of content in the game and you don't want people to finish it. EvE

    ------------------------

     

     

    Now, I know there have been games that have met some or almost all of these requirements, but there seems to be less and less choices out there for people who want a really in-depth experience, and more games that cater to the "casual player" which is game-design-speak for "so easy a caveman could do it". This is a call to action for game devs to get back to the wild wild west approach to mmos that really made us fall in love with a game.

     

    What other features would you say game devs need to be focusing on for future games? Add to the discussion! Let's see if we can't make those designers' ears perk up a little.

    Eve can be very indepth. The tutorial is a long oe tho but its also essential as there is a lot to this game.

    Another great example of Moore's Law. Give people access to that much space (developers and users alike) and they'll find uses for it that you can never imagine. "640K ought to be enough for anybody" - Bill Gates 1981

  • MAUL0rMAUL0r Member Posts: 16

    As my paragraph states below the list, I am aware that many mmos have gotten close to meeting these requirements, but I can honestly say that while EVE meets a few of them, it certainly does not meet ALL of them. I could do the same thing you did using DAOC, and probably even hit more of the areas than EVE does... but that doesn't illustrate my point. There has yet to be a game envisioned from the beginning that meets the requirements of this list. Why? It could be a cost issue, it could be that designers are short-sighted and more focused on shiny bling elements that will attract players in the short term... there are many possibilities.

    This thread was not meant to be a place to talk about 5yr old mmos that kinda sorta match some of these areas... I'm hoping that people will voice features that they genuinely wish for in a game, so we can help future designers better understand how to please us as a community.

  • CrazedBeaverCrazedBeaver Member Posts: 73

    Originally posted by HYPERI0N

    Originally posted by MAUL0r

    ... and display trophies of our adventures. IN A FEW MONTHS EVE

    Eve can be very indepth. The tutorial is a long oe tho but its also essential as there is a lot to this game.

    Everything with CCP is "In a few months".  They never follow through with any of their grand plans.  They made one game many years ago and since then nothing but empty promises. 

    - The infamous 'walking around the station' update that will never come.

    - Dust, which will never be anything more than screeshots.

    - A vampire MMO that will never happen

     

    Get over it, CCP is never going to do anything but sell PLEX's and make up stories about how they are woking on something new.

  • IsaneIsane Member UncommonPosts: 2,630

    Originally posted by MAUL0r

    As my paragraph states below the list, I am aware that many mmos have gotten close to meeting these requirements, but I can honestly say that while EVE meets a few of them, it certainly does not meet ALL of them. I could do the same thing you did using DAOC, and probably even hit more of the areas than EVE does... but that doesn't illustrate my point. There has yet to be a game envisioned from the beginning that meets the requirements of this list. Why? It could be a cost issue, it could be that designers are short-sighted and more focused on shiny bling elements that will attract players in the short term... there are many possibilities.

    This thread was not meant to be a place to talk about 5yr old mmos that kinda sorta match some of these areas... I'm hoping that people will voice features that they genuinely wish for in a game, so we can help future designers better understand how to please us as a community.

    So lets just forget what you wrote above, as we all know the line(Agreeing with almost all of what you have stated.

    Lets look at the issues thatare ausing the genre to be seriously off track.

    You will never get what you want due to the lack of a decent player base.

    The majority of players have a pretty low IQ in fact the majority of the population does, for any of the games to work where the developers do not make it paint by numbers you need players who want to play the game not just repeatedly beat it beat it beat it .

    Three concepts need to be reintroduced:


    • Community  (Requires the removal of guilds and introduction of structures that exist in world whatever these may be to promote people wanting to beat down on the enemy  evil vs good or vice versa)

    • Longevity ( Removal of Endgame and raiding, this is an excuse for poor design humdreds of level caps or exponential skills to be learnt using either time or experience or a combo of both)

    • Smaller Server Sizes( People wise) not world sizes and removal of instancing

    • Removal of paint by numbers quest systems , yes thats right you have to go talk to the NPCs too much like having to play a game...

     


    And I could add many more elements that have been ruined by soft features that are currently being used in games some of the main ones, insta mail, insta travel, insta craft, insta sell (Auction Houses). All of these features should be part of the core game experience sadly now all of this has been removed.


     


    Untill someone tales a step back , and develops a real working functional world that has to be played you have no chance the genre is dead. Remove insta gratification and add back gameplay.


     


    And sorry but it is the current set of lame features as stated above that are stopping you getting a decent game.... All the  auto generating game content has been removed. And don't give me the oh but its a grind rubbish , any activity in game is a grind if you spin it right.

    ________________________________________________________
    Sorcery must persist, the future is the Citadel 

  • CecropiaCecropia Member RarePosts: 3,972

    Originally posted by CrazedBeaver

    Everything with CCP is "In a few months".  They never follow through with any of their grand plans.  They made one game many years ago and since then nothing but empty promises. 

    - The infamous 'walking around the station' update that will never come.

    - Dust, which will never be anything more than screeshots.

    - A vampire MMO that will never happen

     

    Get over it, CCP is never going to do anything but sell PLEX's and make up stories about how they are woking on something new.

    Right, CCP hasn't done shit since they made the game.

    The game has changed sooooo much since it launched, I wouldn't even know where to begin. CCP deserves respect for what they've done in the genre whether you like EVE or not.

    "Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb

  • dirtyjoe78dirtyjoe78 Member Posts: 400

    Originally posted by Isane

    Originally posted by MAUL0r

    As my paragraph states below the list, I am aware that many mmos have gotten close to meeting these requirements, but I can honestly say that while EVE meets a few of them, it certainly does not meet ALL of them. I could do the same thing you did using DAOC, and probably even hit more of the areas than EVE does... but that doesn't illustrate my point. There has yet to be a game envisioned from the beginning that meets the requirements of this list. Why? It could be a cost issue, it could be that designers are short-sighted and more focused on shiny bling elements that will attract players in the short term... there are many possibilities.

    This thread was not meant to be a place to talk about 5yr old mmos that kinda sorta match some of these areas... I'm hoping that people will voice features that they genuinely wish for in a game, so we can help future designers better understand how to please us as a community.

    So lets just forget what you wrote above, as we all know the line(Agreeing with almost all of what you have stated.

    Lets look at the issues thatare ausing the genre to be seriously off track.

    You will never get what you want due to the lack of a decent player base.

    The majority of players have a pretty low IQ in fact the majority of the population does, for any of the games to work where the developers do not make it paint by numbers you need players who want to play the game not just repeatedly beat it beat it beat it .

    Three concepts need to be reintroduced:


    • Community  (Requires the removal of guilds and introduction of structures that exist in world whatever these may be to promote people wanting to beat down on the enemy  evil vs good or vice versa)

    • Longevity ( Removal of Endgame and raiding, this is an excuse for poor design humdreds of level caps or exponential skills to be learnt using either time or experience or a combo of both)

    • Smaller Server Sizes( People wise) not world sizes and removal of instancing

    • Removal of paint by numbers quest systems , yes thats right you have to go talk to the NPCs too much like having to play a game...

     


    And I could add many more elements that have been ruined by soft features that are currently being used in games some of the main ones, insta mail, insta travel, insta craft, insta sell (Auction Houses). All of these features should be part of the core game experience sadly now all of this has been removed.


     


    Untill someone tales a step back , and develops a real working functional world that has to be played you have no chance the genre is dead. Remove insta gratification and add back gameplay.


     


    And sorry but it is the current set of lame features as stated above that are stopping you getting a decent game.... All the  auto generating game content has been removed. And don't give me the oh but its a grind rubbish , any activity in game is a grind if you spin it right.

     You almost had a valid arguement until you started making sweeping generalizations about the player base, proof or dont post crap like this.

  • CrazedBeaverCrazedBeaver Member Posts: 73

    Originally posted by Cecropia

    Originally posted by CrazedBeaver

    Everything with CCP is "In a few months".  They never follow through with any of their grand plans.  They made one game many years ago and since then nothing but empty promises. 

    - The infamous 'walking around the station' update that will never come.

    - Dust, which will never be anything more than screeshots.

    - A vampire MMO that will never happen

     

    Get over it, CCP is never going to do anything but sell PLEX's and make up stories about how they are woking on something new.

    Right, CCP hasn't done shit since they made the game.

    The game has changed sooooo much since it launched, I wouldn't even know where to begin. CCP deserves respect for what they've done in the genre whether you like EVE or not.

    Oh yes of course, allow me to bow before our lord and savior CCP.  After all, they have made the most successful cash shop game ever.  Quite a miraculous feat!

    But seriously, what did they do but make confused people believe a cash shop gank fest is adding so much to the genre?  And my point stands.  Every couple months they have a new marketing ploy about what right around he corner, and then it never happens. The changes they've made to the game ammount to a lot of boring cash sinks to fuel their cash shop. 

    EVE isn't a game, its a lifestyle.  If EVE isn;t the sum total of your life, then you won't enjoy playing it.

  • sfly2000sfly2000 Member Posts: 168

    So far still Neverwinter Nights 1 is the only multiplayer online game that really catches me.

  • comcicomcacomcicomca Member Posts: 46

    Original post is old but the poster visited this forum approximately one and a half month ago so I am gonna post a reply.

    "- gigantic, open environments with lots of room to stretch our legs and explore.

    - comprehensive crafting system.

    - player-driven economy.

    - pvp that has a purpose.

    - if you must have factions, MORE THAN 2 PLEASE. Good vs. Evil is not only cliche'd, it's terrible for an mmo experience.

    - freedom to make mistakes... we're not babies, let us die, let us spec completely weird ways and regret it.

    - classic art style. We don't need to have a giant rotating chain-saw-sword-guitar to feel good about ourselves... 

    - a questing system that does not insult our intelligence. Make questing difficult, but worth the effort. We want to feel like our character has had a personal goal in life, and it is the driving force in his "story". We don't want  to murder innocent flora and fauna for the amusement of some random npc... we want there to be a real purpose to every quest we undertake."

    For everything here try Ryzom. You just described tha game. It just has very tiny community. There is nothing wrong about it other than it's tiny community.

    If you want to fullfill all your requirements, EVE is your game. There is no other. There is Darkfall but it's community is too much dog eat dog minded.

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