Yes, I know they switched over to F2P, but somehow Sony managed to do that with EQ2 and still worked on another full XP due out in Feb 2011.
I have to admit, I was completely wrong about the F2P switch. I really thought Turbine would be pushing out stuff in the cash shop to buy, be it boosters or a new mount or outfit every months.
But instead, their strategy (besides selling the stat tomes) is to sell re-cycled content available in the game to the new people for insanely high prices.
I mean, look at SoA + Moria. It was a little more than a year (like what, 16 months? Maybe a year and a half). It was a full expansion pack and in between we got what 3 areas? (Evendim, Forochel, and Eregion)
If you had a head on your shoulders you would have read that they are deploying the features listed on the isengard expansion over a period of time, not all at once at the date listed.
Funniest thing I have seen in this thread was that they “fixed LI and radiance crap the raiders have whined about… Released new endgame content…” first part of the post was spot on but the last pure comic gold.
First, raiders had no issue with the radiance gating it was the casuals who fancied them selves’ raiders that had the issues. They did not want to have to grind previous content to be able to do current high-end content and there wish was granted. Now you can have some really good gear on par with top raid gear that is from cake walk 3 man instances where people have been known to cycle allts threw to pick up free marks that makes the old exploits on first ages from the turtle to look like they where earned.
The only significant change to LI is that they drop more often and can now be purchased with marks in vary little way fixes the conundrum that is spinning the wheel on creating crappie items. Perhaps it that we can now grind away on marks to buy your way to better tears on that LI that could be seen as a fix. At best LI had a bandage tossed at them but are not fixed. That players will destroy hundreds of them and then out grow them means that the only thing legendary about them is the headache involved in playing needle in the hay stack to find a good one.
New endgame content really, did I blink and miss it? Well killing the LT hard mode has become so passé that it is being done with a single group I guess that might count. We where given revamped old content that is scalable to higher levels but that’s not really new high-end or endgame content.
Don’t get me wrong I am still playing the game but lets not pretend that the OP is wrong when they are correct. Lets also not over look that they have no vested interest in keeping people like me happy since they got my money along time ago and they make more from there micro transactions then they do from substantially advancing the story.
I thought it was amply clear that what i was posting about was "the plan", and not the current status. In other words we are still in the middle of that plan as it spans a timeline of about 1-2 years and we just got the F2P part behind us.
Edit: Strange enough that all that the news of Radiance going the way of the dodo was met with such a enthusiastic reaction considering the raiders where so happy with it. And before you mention them being all casuals, i saw several members of successful raiding kins just on the first 2 pages. And there wasn't a single "raider" speaking against it, only some concerned about having no gating at all which won't come to pass.
Ahh, I am sorry I thought the discussion was manly focused on and around the OP saying that 2 years between substantial expansions was fail. I still say that is an obviously correct statement especially if it is and was your position that they have only formulated a plain and have not yet put it all into effect to bring us the wonderfully changes you talked about.
There are times I hate the English language because it can be ambiguous and the same words can be taken in different ways. I did not think your post was clear that by using the word plain after the list you where talking about what is coming since in the first part of the post you are talking about the last years accomplishments. To me it looked more like you where enumerating the accomplishments and thus stating that those actions have moved us to a better game.
On radiance to me this is because radiance had been so substantially nerfed to simply being a gating mechanic. Whatever the new gating mechanic that is put in place will still garner the same calls. It is and was the casuals who have squeaked the loudest that they did not want such gating. Most raiders in my experience realy did not care as getting the rad gear gave us something to do. By removing radiance, those of us in raiding kins can more readily and easily bring alts to runs. For the longest time the largest limiting factor for how many LT runs we would or could do in a week was having enough LM’s with the high enough radiance if we where going to do a tank and spank for a hard mode for a raid.
Funniest thing I have seen in this thread was that they “fixed LI and radiance crap the raiders have whined about… Released new endgame content…” first part of the post was spot on but the last pure comic gold.
First, raiders had no issue with the radiance gating it was the casuals who fancied them selves’ raiders that had the issues. They did not want to have to grind previous content to be able to do current high-end content and there wish was granted. Now you can have some really good gear on par with top raid gear that is from cake walk 3 man instances where people have been known to cycle allts threw to pick up free marks that makes the old exploits on first ages from the turtle to look like they where earned.
The only significant change to LI is that they drop more often and can now be purchased with marks in vary little way fixes the conundrum that is spinning the wheel on creating crappie items. Perhaps it that we can now grind away on marks to buy your way to better tears on that LI that could be seen as a fix. At best LI had a bandage tossed at them but are not fixed. That players will destroy hundreds of them and then out grow them means that the only thing legendary about them is the headache involved in playing needle in the hay stack to find a good one.
New endgame content really, did I blink and miss it? Well killing the LT hard mode has become so passé that it is being done with a single group I guess that might count. We where given revamped old content that is scalable to higher levels but that’s not really new high-end or endgame content.
Don’t get me wrong I am still playing the game but lets not pretend that the OP is wrong when they are correct. Lets also not over look that they have no vested interest in keeping people like me happy since they got my money along time ago and they make more from there micro transactions then they do from substantially advancing the story.
I thought it was amply clear that what i was posting about was "the plan", and not the current status. In other words we are still in the middle of that plan as it spans a timeline of about 1-2 years and we just got the F2P part behind us.
Edit: Strange enough that all that the news of Radiance going the way of the dodo was met with such a enthusiastic reaction considering the raiders where so happy with it. And before you mention them being all casuals, i saw several members of successful raiding kins just on the first 2 pages. And there wasn't a single "raider" speaking against it, only some concerned about having no gating at all which won't come to pass.
Ahh, I am sorry I thought the discussion was manly focused on and around the OP saying that 2 years between substantial expansions was fail. I still say that is an obviously correct statement especially if it is and was your position that they have only formulated a plain and have not yet put it all into effect to bring us the wonderfully changes you talked about.
If you discount mirkwood and the free updates after, which arguably was a shabby experience compared to MoM, then that can be argued. However even if you take the genre primus, WoW, it is just now going to release its 3 expansion in its 6th year, so clearly major expansions every 2 years can't be that bad. There are actually only very few games that have a faster release cycle for major expansions, EQ mainly i think, and many people do not agree with the quality of these expansions. Also there is the obvious problem of graphical quality. There is no question in my mind that creating a big zone for say LotRO or AoC just takes alot longer than an open zone for lets say EQ1. Especially with LotRO its easy to see that there is alot more going into the enviroment than just pixels and artificial grass, someone went to alot of pain to make those landscapes look beautiful, even natural.
There are times I hate the English language because it can be ambiguous and the same words can be taken in different ways. I did not think your post was clear that by using the word plain after the list you where talking about what is coming since in the first part of the post you are talking about the last years accomplishments. To me it looked more like you where enumerating the accomplishments and thus stating that those actions have moved us to a better game.
I know where you are coming from, english is also only my second language and im prone to falling into misunderstandings myself. I was trying to paint this imaginary "what-if" plan of a "could-be" meeting at Turbine sometime after mirkwood release. Obviously i can't know if it was just a chain of unrelated game changes or all part of a deeper plan, but i was trying to say that if it was a plan, and it gets executed along the lines that have been outlined to us further down the road, then it looks reasonable. Of course a faster execution while preserving quality would always be nice.
On radiance to me this is because radiance had been so substantially nerfed to simply being a gating mechanic. Whatever the new gating mechanic that is put in place will still garner the same calls. It is and was the casuals who have squeaked the loudest that they did not want such gating. Most raiders in my experience realy did not care as getting the rad gear gave us something to do. By removing radiance, those of us in raiding kins can more readily and easily bring alts to runs. For the longest time the largest limiting factor for how many LT runs we would or could do in a week was having enough LM’s with the high enough radiance if we where going to do a tank and spank for a hard mode for a raid.
And this is the problem of the Radiance system, it was a artificial limitation based on chance based drops without any skill involved. For a long time you could even exchange players after the bosskill to gear twinks, which showed how much of a farce the whole system really was.
Raids should be about skill, teamplay and the ability to develop strategies favorable to your particular groupsetup. Obviously there also needs to be a gear progression, but expecting new players to raid for months to catch up to where the current playerbase is doesn't work very well. Mostly because the current playerbase is not doing the old raids anymore(if there is a gear progression with the new raid being better), and yes it is a problem for casuals but even powergamers could have trouble catching up due to raid timers locking one to one raid per week or somesuch. There needs to be a middle way, not too easy to acquire "current raidlevel gear -1" but not so hard that it takes aslong as it did originally when it was the max raidlevel gear either.
To me the biggest issue I have with the 2 years is where we came from to get here. From release to Moria we were getting about every 2 months content equal to or greater than Mirkwood. Turbine on this vary site was recognized for expansion of the year and the as the best MMORPG studio. We were moving along at a vary brisk pace threw the story of the Ring probably too fast.
Incase no one notice each updates we had been getting where about the same as advancing the story arc forward by a month in the books. We have been sitting stagnate in a holding pattern now all but stuck in time not advancing the story and not truly exploring possible side line or tangent adventures. We are playing in a world that we know something about and participating in events that will come to a conclusion. This game is in some ways vary unique in that it has a true built in end. That is unless they are going to be allowed to create their own stories after the burring of the Shire and the fall or Sarumon.
It is in part because of this that to me comparing WoW and LotRO is like comparing McDonalds and let us say the Olive Garden they are both chain stores that feature food. At McDonalds, you get whatever you want you get it all at once and you go eat it. At the Garden, you will sit down pick out your food and eat it. However, they do not bring it all to you at once; you will start with an appetizer move on to soup or salad then on to a main corse possibly followed with a dessert. WoW is WoW it can make and brake its own world and story lines as it sees fit. LotRO has a story that its telling unfortunately it not really been telling that story lately nor is it planning on telling much more of it for another year.
Actually, I prefer increases of 5 levels to the level cap to increases of 10 levels. With a 10 level increase, the old content and gear are instantly outdated, with a 5 level increase, old gear and content will still be an option.
I'd probably prefer (somewhat) regular single level increases of the level cap even more, for the same reason.
To me the biggest issue I have with the 2 years is where we came from to get here. From release to Moria we were getting about every 2 months content equal to or greater than Mirkwood. Turbine on this vary site was recognized for expansion of the year and the as the best MMORPG studio. We were moving along at a vary brisk pace threw the story of the Ring probably too fast.
Personally i think the Mirkwood release with skirmishes and whatnot was huge, not MoM huge in landmass area, but still significant. Skirmishes firmly established themselves as an equal gamevariant to instances, raids, PvMP and questing. Not to mention that it laid the groundwork for scaling instances.
The draught came after that imho, we should have seen new skirmishes added every book release, new instances/raids every couple books, small incremental improvements to skirmishes and LIs etc. In other words wether you add 5 new zones to an expansion, or one new zone is insignificant. The only purpose of these zones is to hold enough quests to allow you to arrive at the new maxlevel, after you went through them with your char and reached the maxlevel it is the endgame content that is available thats the deciding factor. Or in other words, i rather have 1 zone, 3 interesting raids and new PvMP maps + skirmishes and a LI revamp, than 5 cool leveling zones and nothing to do at maxlevel but play a broken LI lottery.
Comments
If you had a head on your shoulders you would have read that they are deploying the features listed on the isengard expansion over a period of time, not all at once at the date listed.
Deep breaths.
Ahh, I am sorry I thought the discussion was manly focused on and around the OP saying that 2 years between substantial expansions was fail. I still say that is an obviously correct statement especially if it is and was your position that they have only formulated a plain and have not yet put it all into effect to bring us the wonderfully changes you talked about.
There are times I hate the English language because it can be ambiguous and the same words can be taken in different ways. I did not think your post was clear that by using the word plain after the list you where talking about what is coming since in the first part of the post you are talking about the last years accomplishments. To me it looked more like you where enumerating the accomplishments and thus stating that those actions have moved us to a better game.
On radiance to me this is because radiance had been so substantially nerfed to simply being a gating mechanic. Whatever the new gating mechanic that is put in place will still garner the same calls. It is and was the casuals who have squeaked the loudest that they did not want such gating. Most raiders in my experience realy did not care as getting the rad gear gave us something to do. By removing radiance, those of us in raiding kins can more readily and easily bring alts to runs. For the longest time the largest limiting factor for how many LT runs we would or could do in a week was having enough LM’s with the high enough radiance if we where going to do a tank and spank for a hard mode for a raid.
To me the biggest issue I have with the 2 years is where we came from to get here. From release to Moria we were getting about every 2 months content equal to or greater than Mirkwood. Turbine on this vary site was recognized for expansion of the year and the as the best MMORPG studio. We were moving along at a vary brisk pace threw the story of the Ring probably too fast.
Incase no one notice each updates we had been getting where about the same as advancing the story arc forward by a month in the books. We have been sitting stagnate in a holding pattern now all but stuck in time not advancing the story and not truly exploring possible side line or tangent adventures. We are playing in a world that we know something about and participating in events that will come to a conclusion. This game is in some ways vary unique in that it has a true built in end. That is unless they are going to be allowed to create their own stories after the burring of the Shire and the fall or Sarumon.
It is in part because of this that to me comparing WoW and LotRO is like comparing McDonalds and let us say the Olive Garden they are both chain stores that feature food. At McDonalds, you get whatever you want you get it all at once and you go eat it. At the Garden, you will sit down pick out your food and eat it. However, they do not bring it all to you at once; you will start with an appetizer move on to soup or salad then on to a main corse possibly followed with a dessert. WoW is WoW it can make and brake its own world and story lines as it sees fit. LotRO has a story that its telling unfortunately it not really been telling that story lately nor is it planning on telling much more of it for another year.
Actually, I prefer increases of 5 levels to the level cap to increases of 10 levels. With a 10 level increase, the old content and gear are instantly outdated, with a 5 level increase, old gear and content will still be an option.
I'd probably prefer (somewhat) regular single level increases of the level cap even more, for the same reason.
Personally i think the Mirkwood release with skirmishes and whatnot was huge, not MoM huge in landmass area, but still significant. Skirmishes firmly established themselves as an equal gamevariant to instances, raids, PvMP and questing. Not to mention that it laid the groundwork for scaling instances.
The draught came after that imho, we should have seen new skirmishes added every book release, new instances/raids every couple books, small incremental improvements to skirmishes and LIs etc. In other words wether you add 5 new zones to an expansion, or one new zone is insignificant. The only purpose of these zones is to hold enough quests to allow you to arrive at the new maxlevel, after you went through them with your char and reached the maxlevel it is the endgame content that is available thats the deciding factor. Or in other words, i rather have 1 zone, 3 interesting raids and new PvMP maps + skirmishes and a LI revamp, than 5 cool leveling zones and nothing to do at maxlevel but play a broken LI lottery.