I would love for everyone of you people who are bashing F2P MMOs to name me 1 single P2P that has been worth more then garbage since WoW. War, AoC, Aion, D&D, LotRO, Champions, Star Trek, all have been garbage. Though you people are more then willing to throw your money away for games like that but a game that doesn't force you to pay then it's a scam? Most of you people need your heads examined.
eve, lotr, and city of heroes were all pretty far from garbage.
I would att l2 in there too, but i'm not sure if it's older, or younger than wow.
RIP Ribbitribbitt you are missed, kid.
Currently Playing EVE, ESO
Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and not clothed.
Agree that we need to open Anti-F2P movement too, or those f2p-fanboys just crying over the world loudly and gaming companies show their mind then - ya all wanna this, ya all vry for f2p. Damn it be, burn in hell, f2p and it's movement.
If ya look founder, he working in some gaming co., so ot's web is payed by f2p companies to spend lies and lies. fact.
If they say that devs need more money for content then I agree to pay not USD 15, but 20 or 25 or even 30 if it IS really good old-school real MMO not some wow-clone I never touched and never be. In last LOTRO started as good and nice game, tho there were so many instances and goods for everyone. But at end of 2009 it changed to crappy grind-fest and I'm glad I left it before that f2p move. That is really death to Middle Earth, R.I.P.
And all those lies even here - ya can play LOTRO for free too - NO, I can't. I am never interested in sitting in starting area and be some nerd noob. I wanna end-game but there ya must pay in f2p and pay very big dimes and nickls. Some pro-gamers-raiders in DDO have sayd to be on top level one must pay about 50 or more USD per WEEK! At minimum. And ya call it free???
What is my wish for f2p? - Buy Shell's giftbox (can of gas and matches), pour over ya co and light it!
F2P is a marketting strategy taken up by gaming companies. There are many who oppose this strategy, those who see the reality of the situation in the long run, but obviously the number of people who do not see this reality far outnumber those who see it. The game companies take the vast mass majority who fall for this gimmick and give them way higher priority than the minority who have grasped the truth: thus more and more game companies are switching to F2P. They have all done their homework, statistics and math, and F2P is more profitable for them in the long haul. Its here to stay unless, the majority of gamers somehow wake up and smell the flowers with regards to F2P. The gaming community of players itself is what makes a company decide which marketting strategy to implement. So in an ironical sense , "WE" ourselves have brought about this trend.
I don't get why so many are so aggressively against F2P - no one is forcing you to play. And I agree with what's been said. It is free to "play" - as a gamer from the 70's, when gaming was done P&P (pen & paper style) todays games are graphically amazing. I was a player of Might & Magic - with it's early graphics it's laughable in comparison to what's currently available. Yet many still like & play the "retro style" games. (SNES, Nintendo & Gameboy + early pc games.)
Gamers play because it's our passion, to escape things for a short time. To recharge, reduce stress & to take a mini vacation in a world we've far more control over than our own - or so it often seems. How we do this is a personal choice - no one has the right to tell us what we can or can't play. It's called free will & the right to choose - if you don't like it find something else - no one is forcing you to like any MMO or stopping you from playing in the way you wish.
I've played B2P - Guild Wars which I've had for years & still enjoy playing. I've all the expansions & eagerly await the GW2 which promises a very interesting gaming style. I love the detail & quality of the graphics within it although the intensity can often be exhausting - lol. But it's just MHO.
I've played P2P - EQ, EQII, WoW, Shadowbane, DoC, as well as others. But with the economy, life changes & for other reasons I've cut out all P2P gaming. Even as a gamer, other priorities were more important than paying to play. To pay for several memberships was just too costly, so for me I chose another way to get my "gamers fix" without the cost. For those that only pay for one, the cost is relatively fair for a month of entertainment. But for a family that likes to play together, or group of friends - those costs can be too much over multiple game accts. & subscriptions. The station pass from Sony does offer a good bargain for the multiple game accts. but for some it's still out of reach.
I've played F2P - I discovered a whole world of F2P games when I went looking, from Shaiya, Mega10, Silkroad, Rohan, Fly4Fun, Luna, Perfect World to Pirates of the Carribean, DDO, Wizard 101 & SotNW - with dozens of others inbetween. Some are fun to play, others can be frustrating to learn at first, while others are just social games to meet up in with friends & family. Something to do together when you live far apart & want to stay connected. (But then I'm from a large family of gamer types - what better way to spend some time together online.)
I'm still a big bejeweled, bookworm & word search fan - playing online or off when the urge hits me. Many of the "web only" games offer the games free to play, but you would need to buy them to play anytime offline. I've been called strange by my sister cause I play bookworm to clear my head & help me think. When a word game goes hours & has me in the 30's level - it's good mental exercise, plus it gives me a place to use all those big & small words in my head that don't get used much.
So this site wants to promote some balancing changes in the F2P market. It's still free to dream & create, to make a website about a hobby or passion (preferably PG for myself, I'm not interested in the more violent & darkside obsessions out there. Even though those can most likely be found on the web too.) If others of like mind wish to join up - it's their right to be free to do so. If others aren't in agreement, they can ignore it or put up a site offering their own opinion. It's up to everyone to choose what they wish to promote. (even in comments and opinion posts)
We all have a choice how we express ourselves - how we wish to communicate & be heard. We're all responsible for what we say, do, think & share.
IMHO I wish more posters would stop to think, before sharing their thoughts to temper them to the audience that is viewing them. It would be nice if we would listen to our better selves & avoid harsh words or condemnation. But the societies of the world hold many views - which is why so many seek out alternate worlds to "live" in, even if it's just in short visits.
F2P Group? Yeah, consumer groups really only have power when they can take their business elsewhere.
In most cases business = money... but in this case it is possible that simply by being there they offer something? What i mean is that no-one likes playing in an empty MMO world. In Spellborn for example - many people complainedthat the world was 'empty'. Maybe a few thousand F2P players could have helped populate it and encourage the P2Pers? In DDO the world certainly feels more alive with a lot of people running about... and of course the more people that are there the more potential customers there are?
Cash Shops and F2P
How exactly do people think these companies should make their money to stay in business?
I play DDO (have for a year) and have never spent a single cent on it (Yes! I am a cheapskate!) But I have a quality many people seem to lack? I have self control. I also have patience. I don't mind waiting to build up enough Favor to earn Turbine Points... in fact, as a Perma Deathplayer it is something that isn't really even a grind, it's a part of gameplay.
Simply as a result of playing I have built up enough Turbine Points to buy 4 Modules and if I ever complete all the content in those (tough to do as a Perma death player) I will have earnt enough Favor/TP to buy at least one more...and so on.
But, I don't begrudge Turbine making money off some kid who jumps into the game and wants to prove how 133t he is by zerging all the content and buying a +3 Greataxe and purple hair. Good on them. It really doesn't concern me - I found my +3 Greataxe in game and I don't need purple hair (although one of my characters did win a lottery and won.... purple hair!)
I think the thing that has turned many off F2P models is that many companies were greedy. You needed a +3 Greataxe to complete a certain dungeon and the only way to get it was in the shop. Well, don't support those games. I support the 'non greed' model that Turbine run.
Remember that at the end of the day they cannot actually make you enter your Credit Card details... that is entirely up to you.
F2P game quality
Please. Be serious.
Lack of quality in MMOs is not restricted to F2P games. I am sure that many of you can remember more than a couple of sub based MMOs that were more than lacking? Again, not really an issue for F2P customers alone. An issue for everyone.
The fact is... make a judgement for yourself on whether a game is 'worth' the money you are paying for it. If not - move on. In the case of F2P games - if you choose not to pay then the only cost involved is your time. Is the game worth your time?
PS I do currently have a sub for an MMO running - so I don't mind paying subs. It's just that at the moment I don't see the need. In future I may sub to other MMOs - but sadly I cannot see anything coming on the horizon that looks like it might be worth it. Until a great MMO arrives - I will continue to spend my time in 'quality' F2P games. And I might sub to EvE too - we'll see.
Thjere is no quality cuz if there would, company would set the price and ppl would pay.
They need not tricky ppl in promising free and then starting to milk them,
Is LOTRO now quality? far from this, I left it at sub time due no quality content but mindless repeated grind. Same was with DDO - if turbine wpuldn't change it f2p that gameserver must be turned off. LOTRO which had at good times maybe like 300K players lost big part and ended up nearly only lifers in it. Again after throwing away real Tolkien's IP loving devs and buying in truck full of cheapo asian programmists to copy-paste they lost all, and f2p crap was last saviour.
If there will born "Really Quality" game, P2P - OK, I'm ready to pay double to that unwritten 15$. If it good, nice modern graphics and animation, no stupid manga-emo faces, normal content (not copy from WoW I personallu hate too) which will be added to game so that there is allways something to do even when ya play 5 hrs per day. If there is economy mostly player driven, if there is open world with adventure and dangers, with no instances, where some achivements are such - only few per server and even then very hard to find, if there be challenge - I would pay even more.
But f2p model is such due lieing to customers. Ppl woudn't pay for lame gameplay 100$ / week. But as f2p they pay 10$ todaay, 25$ tomorrow and when not counting end up with 100-200$ per week. That is all glory of f2p -ya, player, are cow whom to milk.
And yes... people do use this option. In other words - you can play this game as a subscription MMO if you chose to do so.
Personally I don't, because as a casual player I might play all week and then not play again for a month - so a monthly sub is not usually good value for me.
They need not tricky ppl in promising free and then starting to milk them,
They can only milk you if you let them. Just say 'no'.
Is LOTRO now quality? far from this, I left it at sub time due no quality content but mindless repeated grind. Same was with DDO - if turbine wpuldn't change it f2p that gameserver must be turned off. LOTRO which had at good times maybe like 300K players lost big part and ended up nearly only lifers in it. Again after throwing away real Tolkien's IP loving devs and buying in truck full of cheapo asian programmists to copy-paste they lost all, and f2p crap was last saviour.
So you don't like the game. That's fine. People have the same complaints about P2P games though. I seem to remeber that when AoC came out that lacked content. So did PotBS. How about CO and STO? Aion? And I bet people could easily name dozens more. I think you are confused saying F2P is the culprit here. Lack of content is due to many things including lack of Dev Time. P2P games suffer just as badly. Not saying that is acceptable - just that F2P is not the cause.
If there will born "Really Quality" game, P2P - OK, I'm ready to pay double to that unwritten 15$. If it good, nice modern graphics and animation, no stupid manga-emo faces, normal content (not copy from WoW I personallu hate too) which will be added to game so that there is allways something to do even when ya play 5 hrs per day. If there is economy mostly player driven, if there is open world with adventure and dangers, with no instances, where some achivements are such - only few per server and even then very hard to find, if there be challenge - I would pay even more.
Okay... what's your point? That there are no really good MMOs on the market? That the current trend is to produce shallow, instanced games with little to no end game? Well, hard to disagree with that in most cases... but that isn't just limited to F2P games.
But f2p model is such due lieing to customers. Ppl woudn't pay for lame gameplay 100$ / week. But as f2p they pay 10$ todaay, 25$ tomorrow and when not counting end up with 100-200$ per week. That is all glory of f2p -ya, player, are cow whom to milk.
Again... self control is your friend. I really think that you should look at games like DDO and Wizard 101 again. These games are pretty straight forward telling you how much stuff costs and are upfront about telling you about the merits of each option (https://www.wizard101.com/game/helpmechoose) When Wizard 101 first suggested a hybrid billing model the Beta Testers were horrified... after they showed the initial plan we were very clear with KingsIsle that they should be very honest about exacly what people were buying. They listened and the pricing is (I think) very fair. There are no 'traps' there.
And like I say - they cannot force you to pay for anything. You always have the option not to pay.
*I should note here that Wizard 101 is a restricted F2P game (or more correctly a subscription game with a cash shop option). You can only play free to about level 10. At the time that was the best model out there. DDO actually took the model further and did a better job allowing F2P players to buy all content (eventually) without paying a cent - just by playing lots.
The only problem I have is with some publishing exec or developer more with a mind to making a buck than producing a good game trying to bring traditional F2P elements, such as being able to buy levels or gear that effect play with real money rather than earn them in to the kinds of game I like to play. If Blizzard decides to make a F2P version of WoW, that could even help the kind of player and developer that prefers the game that requires more effort by moving the population that prefers less effort to different servers.
However, WoW devs have been reluctant to make different play characteristics in cases where it would benefit different types of players such as PvP and PvE, so I am very skeptical that this would be a good idea. The same is true of any other publisher or game: if the effort isn't there to make the difference, then please don't make aF2P version.
Have played: Everquest, Asheron's Call, Horizons, Everquest2, World of Warcraft, Lord of the Rings Online, Warhammer, Age of Conan, Darkfall
From a marketing standpoint, this is a brilliant project. I wouldn't be surprised if those that are vehemently against it do more to generate awareness of the site than those who actually support it.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
And yes... people do use this option. In other words - you can play this game as a subscription MMO if you chose to do so.
Personally I don't, because as a casual player I might play all week and then not play again for a month - so a monthly sub is not usually good value for me.
They need not tricky ppl in promising free and then starting to milk them,
They can only milk you if you let them. Just say 'no'.
YES! Just so I do - I say big NO to EACH & EVERY f2p in MMO-world.
Is LOTRO now quality? far from this, I left it at sub time due no quality content but mindless repeated grind. Same was with DDO - if turbine wpuldn't change it f2p that gameserver must be turned off. LOTRO which had at good times maybe like 300K players lost big part and ended up nearly only lifers in it. Again after throwing away real Tolkien's IP loving devs and buying in truck full of cheapo asian programmists to copy-paste they lost all, and f2p crap was last saviour.
So you don't like the game. That's fine. People have the same complaints about P2P games though. I seem to remeber that when AoC came out that lacked content. So did PotBS. How about CO and STO? Aion? And I bet people could easily name dozens more. I think you are confused saying F2P is the culprit here. Lack of content is due to many things including lack of Dev Time. P2P games suffer just as badly. Not saying that is acceptable - just that F2P is not the cause.
If there will born "Really Quality" game, P2P - OK, I'm ready to pay double to that unwritten 15$. If it good, nice modern graphics and animation, no stupid manga-emo faces, normal content (not copy from WoW I personallu hate too) which will be added to game so that there is allways something to do even when ya play 5 hrs per day. If there is economy mostly player driven, if there is open world with adventure and dangers, with no instances, where some achivements are such - only few per server and even then very hard to find, if there be challenge - I would pay even more.
Okay... what's your point? That there are no really good MMOs on the market? That the current trend is to produce shallow, instanced games with little to no end game? Well, hard to disagree with that in most cases... but that isn't just limited to F2P games.
But f2p model is such due lieing to customers. Ppl woudn't pay for lame gameplay 100$ / week. But as f2p they pay 10$ todaay, 25$ tomorrow and when not counting end up with 100-200$ per week. That is all glory of f2p -ya, player, are cow whom to milk.
Again... self control is your friend. I really think that you should look at games like DDO and Wizard 101 again. These games are pretty straight forward telling you how much stuff costs and are upfront about telling you about the merits of each option (https://www.wizard101.com/game/helpmechoose) When Wizard 101 first suggested a hybrid billing model the Beta Testers were horrified... after they showed the initial plan we were very clear with KingsIsle that they should be very honest about exacly what people were buying. They listened and the pricing is (I think) very fair. There are no 'traps' there.
And like I say - they cannot force you to pay for anything. You always have the option not to pay.
*I should note here that Wizard 101 is a restricted F2P game (or more correctly a subscription game with a cash shop option). You can only play free to about level 10. At the time that was the best model out there. DDO actually took the model further and did a better job allowing F2P players to buy all content (eventually) without paying a cent - just by playing lots.
I've been on both sides of it, so i can understand why you are a sceptic, but LoL is one of those games where it is, infact, true, an example of where it isn't true, that i've played, is Allods.
wha??
It's a proven historical fact that beer saved humankind.
F2P is free to play to an extent. It has its limits. If you subscribe then you have full game access as well as all the little nice things like mounts, etc. However, if you don't subscribe then to be able to go over a certain level, have unlimited use of auction house, mail, and be able to have mounts, etc. then you have to purchase them from the store web site.
So it is F2P if you don't want all that. I haven't figured it up but I am guessing if someone was to figure it up you would probably find that you are spending more over all than you would if you just subscribe to the game and bought the expansions.
So in one aspect it is free but over the long haul it by far is not.
making world of warcraft f2p, wow seriously? does mmorpg staffs every kid now? maybe you should pay wages or tell them to get a real job, f2p is bane, there is nothing free nor should be, f2p games are worth playing while they are in beta, once beta over game is dead , no self respecting gamer will play f2p games
So it is F2P if you don't want all that. I haven't figured it up but I am guessing if someone was to figure it up you would probably find that you are spending more over all than you would if you just subscribe to the game and bought the expansions.
So in one aspect it is free but over the long haul it by far is not.
Actually, it's the other way around sometimes.
You see - if you buy the packs you own them forever - so you can take as long as you like to do them. But you don't have access to packs/modules/zones you never brought. So a year from now you can still log in and access the stuff you brought.
Whereas if you subscribe you have access to everything but only while you maintain your subscription. You drop your subscription and you get locked out. If you become a long term subscriber you reach a point where you have paid more than if you had just brought the modules.
So, if you are the sort of player that likes to play MMOs, complete them, and then move on very quickly then subscription is almost certainly cheaper. If you want to try new content you need to re-subscribe.
But, if you are the sort who plays infrequently, maybe doesn't want to complete everything - or you just want to 'cherry pick' the best content and perhaps you want to come back over an extended period then buying the modules you want might work out cheaper. But if new content comes out - you will have to buy it. And if you buy stuff and lose interest then you payed for something you will never use.
I would love for everyone of you people who are bashing F2P MMOs to name me 1 single P2P that has been worth more then garbage since WoW. War, AoC, Aion, D&D, LotRO, Champions, Star Trek, all have been garbage. Though you people are more then willing to throw your money away for games like that but a game that doesn't force you to pay then it's a scam? Most of you people need your heads examined.
If I considered $15 a month throwing my money away, well then I'd have MUCH MUCH bigger problems then worrying about gaming. Even someone who works for minimum wage can afford a p2p MMO subscription. It's been repeated on here a million times, it is cheaper to play an MMO then most other forms of entertainment out there.
If $15 is hurting your budget then you shouldn't be playing video games and should instead be working on finding a job.
Getting into a P2P game costs more then 15 a month. You have to buy the game first, genius. If the game isn't popular then it sucks, cause without a decent community an MMO fails. I hope you have enough sence to figure that one out. So instead of wasting 15, you wasted around 60 dollars since you have to actually buy the game. Also before you even bring up console games, I can get a console game used and take it back for a full refund if I don't like it. You can't refund an MMO, I got lucky one time I sold my Darkfall account to someone so I didn't waste that 60 bucks. At least learn the cost of an MMO before retorting to a statement about throwing money away.
They need not tricky ppl in promising free and then starting to milk them,
They can only milk you if you let them. Just say 'no'.
YES! Just so I do - I say big NO to EACH & EVERY f2p in MMO-world.
Is LOTRO now quality? far from this, I left it at sub time due no quality content but mindless repeated grind. Same was with DDO - if turbine wpuldn't change it f2p that gameserver must be turned off. LOTRO which had at good times maybe like 300K players lost big part and ended up nearly only lifers in it. Again after throwing away real Tolkien's IP loving devs and buying in truck full of cheapo asian programmists to copy-paste they lost all, and f2p crap was last saviour.
....
I would probably put more weight in what you say if your thinking was at least logical - but it isn't.
Here's why;
You say you would never touch a F2P game because of the poor quality - yet you admit that you played BOTH DDO and LotRO when they were subscription games?
They were subscription games yet they lacked 'quality'. So the F2P wasn't the issue was it?
Since then they have both gone F2P - so if anything they have had MORE dev time put into them than when you played them last?
So when they were subscription games - you had no problem trying them? Didn't you read any reviews? How is it you were so surprised that they were lacking? Why didn't you avoid them back then?
Yet now they are F2P you don't consider them worthy to even try?
How do you feel about games that offer 'Endless free trials' then? AoC and WAR for example?
I've spent more money on worthless subscription-based games than I have on F2P games. F2P hasn't cornered the market on digital garbage. At least with F2P, I'm not forced to put down a dime up front and can take as long as I want to decide whether or not I wish to continue with it.
As for the free part of the content, in DDO you can have a perfectly viable character and full access to months worth of content without visiting the item shop. If you want "DA BEST"(TM) or "DA COOLEST"(TM), which is generally reflected by the tiniest of percentages difference, then be prepared to pay out. I won't speak for all F2Ps out there since I haven't played them, but any item shop using a similar model is perfectly fine by me.
Bleh F2P is already damaging many decent software companies IMHO. I don't support the whole movement, cause in the end YOU SHOULD NOT EXPECT SOMETHING FOR NOTHING.
What the software companies SHOULD learn from this is that AT LEAST they should offer extended free trials AT RELEASE, so as to not damage their own reputation and force people not to trust them any more (when they buy unfinished garbage betas instead of polished products - think Age of Conan, or more recently Elemental: War of Magic).
I actually really like LOTRO's model. Granted I really wish they would bring the price down on points, as I personally feel they are too much for what you get. HOWEVER, I think this kind of gaming should be high quality and retain high customer service. Too many F2P games are asian grinders and no matter how hard I try to get into them I just cannot.
I love the thought of being able to go a couple months of not playing w/out thinking 'Geez im wasting this subscription'. I also like the a' la carte idea of the whole model. Granted, anyone with a braincell will just pay 14.99 a month sub, but i'd love to see a compnay come out of the woodwork without the rediculous prices for points, and more options for picking and choosing the content you want.
This is just the beginning. In the next 5 years I would bet 5 gold that all studios, including Blizzard, will have a F2P model.
I actually really like LOTRO's model. Granted I really wish they would bring the price down on points, as I personally feel they are too much for what you get. HOWEVER, I think this kind of gaming should be high quality and retain high customer service. Too many F2P games are asian grinders and no matter how hard I try to get into them I just cannot.
I love the thought of being able to go a couple months of not playing w/out thinking 'Geez im wasting this subscription'. I also like the a' la carte idea of the whole model. Granted, anyone with a braincell will just pay 14.99 a month sub, but i'd love to see a compnay come out of the woodwork without the rediculous prices for points, and more options for picking and choosing the content you want.
This is just the beginning. In the next 5 years I would bet 5 gold that all studios, including Blizzard, will have a F2P model.
That is thing, I even don't say against different models, be so that dumbasses will play f2p (like in EQ2) in different servers.
But I don't tolerate cheating with wallet in same server. If there will come somea.holes with their big fat wallets of their fathers, and then jumping into game like "big-doers" even don't knowing basics of their class or skill, forgive me, I don't tolerate that.
That is like buying rights of doping use in Olympics, like buying medals for money. Ya say - me cheap, havn't enough buskc, maybe, maybe not - but I wanna challnge at equal skills and knowledge not wallet. See I will never can fight against Bahrein's sultan's wallet - he will forever beat me with dollars, but maybe not in game. That is game I wanna, not some kind of run "who have more bucks" - sorry if ya don't understand this. And don't start cash-shops are onöy for cosmetics - I havn't seen any f2p which isan't turned into Buy4Win cuz ya havn't so many cosmetic fags who will pay every day for new costume or color.
So, to make their profit they will put in shops B4W items, sooner or later, and design their games so, that on end-game ya can't do w/out buying expensive amounts of stuff.
like i said on many other posts...and the posts from people on this thread prove it...
The free to play games are free to play....but the good ones are very adept at reeling the fish in to spend money.(by the way anyone who claims they have to spend money in free to play games....you are but a reeled in fish...sad isnt it?)
They are pretty clever in making you think you have to pay cash...you never have to pay cash for free to play games...there is always another way.
You have to admit they did a good job on some fo the people posting on this thread.....they do as good a job as the gold spammers.....yep we all hate them or love them....but go figure the gold spammers make tons of cash still....
I would love for everyone of you people who are bashing F2P MMOs to name me 1 single P2P that has been worth more then garbage since WoW. War, AoC, Aion, D&D, LotRO, Champions, Star Trek, all have been garbage. Though you people are more then willing to throw your money away for games like that but a game that doesn't force you to pay then it's a scam? Most of you people need your heads examined.
If I considered $15 a month throwing my money away, well then I'd have MUCH MUCH bigger problems then worrying about gaming. Even someone who works for minimum wage can afford a p2p MMO subscription. It's been repeated on here a million times, it is cheaper to play an MMO then most other forms of entertainment out there.
If $15 is hurting your budget then you shouldn't be playing video games and should instead be working on finding a job.
AGREE !!!
It seems some people. Most likely younger...or older but without a clue. No game can be completly free. It would be bankrupt day one and thats if they could somehow find someone willing to invest init to pay development costs.
What FTP does do ( as the site states for anyone who actually read it) is that it gives people the option of paying for what they choose, including nothing.
Personaly I don't care what the model is. If its a good game I'll play it. If its a bad game I won't.
But I don't tolerate cheating with wallet in same server. If there will come somea.holes with their big fat wallets of their fathers, and then jumping into game like "big-doers" even don't knowing basics of their class or skill, forgive me, I don't tolerate that.
...
So, to make their profit they will put in shops B4W items, sooner or later, and design their games so, that on end-game ya can't do w/out buying expensive amounts of stuff.
Okay, so you object to games where the only way to get the 'best' stuff or the high end stuff is through the shop.
Fair enough.
But you do know that not all F2P games are like that?
You seem to be stuck on thinking about an older model.
And in a game where PvP is less important (and not required at all) then how does other people's equipment make any difference to your game?
Comments
eve, lotr, and city of heroes were all pretty far from garbage.
I would att l2 in there too, but i'm not sure if it's older, or younger than wow.
RIP Ribbitribbitt you are missed, kid.
Currently Playing EVE, ESO
Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and not clothed.
Dwight D Eisenhower
My optimism wears heavy boots and is loud.
Henry Rollins
Agree that we need to open Anti-F2P movement too, or those f2p-fanboys just crying over the world loudly and gaming companies show their mind then - ya all wanna this, ya all vry for f2p. Damn it be, burn in hell, f2p and it's movement.
If ya look founder, he working in some gaming co., so ot's web is payed by f2p companies to spend lies and lies. fact.
If they say that devs need more money for content then I agree to pay not USD 15, but 20 or 25 or even 30 if it IS really good old-school real MMO not some wow-clone I never touched and never be. In last LOTRO started as good and nice game, tho there were so many instances and goods for everyone. But at end of 2009 it changed to crappy grind-fest and I'm glad I left it before that f2p move. That is really death to Middle Earth, R.I.P.
And all those lies even here - ya can play LOTRO for free too - NO, I can't. I am never interested in sitting in starting area and be some nerd noob. I wanna end-game but there ya must pay in f2p and pay very big dimes and nickls. Some pro-gamers-raiders in DDO have sayd to be on top level one must pay about 50 or more USD per WEEK! At minimum. And ya call it free???
What is my wish for f2p? - Buy Shell's giftbox (can of gas and matches), pour over ya co and light it!
F2P is a marketting strategy taken up by gaming companies. There are many who oppose this strategy, those who see the reality of the situation in the long run, but obviously the number of people who do not see this reality far outnumber those who see it. The game companies take the vast mass majority who fall for this gimmick and give them way higher priority than the minority who have grasped the truth: thus more and more game companies are switching to F2P. They have all done their homework, statistics and math, and F2P is more profitable for them in the long haul. Its here to stay unless, the majority of gamers somehow wake up and smell the flowers with regards to F2P. The gaming community of players itself is what makes a company decide which marketting strategy to implement. So in an ironical sense , "WE" ourselves have brought about this trend.
<QQ moar plz. kkthxbai.>
I don't get why so many are so aggressively against F2P - no one is forcing you to play. And I agree with what's been said. It is free to "play" - as a gamer from the 70's, when gaming was done P&P (pen & paper style) todays games are graphically amazing. I was a player of Might & Magic - with it's early graphics it's laughable in comparison to what's currently available. Yet many still like & play the "retro style" games. (SNES, Nintendo & Gameboy + early pc games.)
Gamers play because it's our passion, to escape things for a short time. To recharge, reduce stress & to take a mini vacation in a world we've far more control over than our own - or so it often seems. How we do this is a personal choice - no one has the right to tell us what we can or can't play. It's called free will & the right to choose - if you don't like it find something else - no one is forcing you to like any MMO or stopping you from playing in the way you wish.
I've played B2P - Guild Wars which I've had for years & still enjoy playing. I've all the expansions & eagerly await the GW2 which promises a very interesting gaming style. I love the detail & quality of the graphics within it although the intensity can often be exhausting - lol. But it's just MHO.
I've played P2P - EQ, EQII, WoW, Shadowbane, DoC, as well as others. But with the economy, life changes & for other reasons I've cut out all P2P gaming. Even as a gamer, other priorities were more important than paying to play. To pay for several memberships was just too costly, so for me I chose another way to get my "gamers fix" without the cost. For those that only pay for one, the cost is relatively fair for a month of entertainment. But for a family that likes to play together, or group of friends - those costs can be too much over multiple game accts. & subscriptions. The station pass from Sony does offer a good bargain for the multiple game accts. but for some it's still out of reach.
I've played F2P - I discovered a whole world of F2P games when I went looking, from Shaiya, Mega10, Silkroad, Rohan, Fly4Fun, Luna, Perfect World to Pirates of the Carribean, DDO, Wizard 101 & SotNW - with dozens of others inbetween. Some are fun to play, others can be frustrating to learn at first, while others are just social games to meet up in with friends & family. Something to do together when you live far apart & want to stay connected. (But then I'm from a large family of gamer types - what better way to spend some time together online.)
I'm still a big bejeweled, bookworm & word search fan - playing online or off when the urge hits me. Many of the "web only" games offer the games free to play, but you would need to buy them to play anytime offline. I've been called strange by my sister cause I play bookworm to clear my head & help me think. When a word game goes hours & has me in the 30's level - it's good mental exercise, plus it gives me a place to use all those big & small words in my head that don't get used much.
So this site wants to promote some balancing changes in the F2P market. It's still free to dream & create, to make a website about a hobby or passion (preferably PG for myself, I'm not interested in the more violent & darkside obsessions out there. Even though those can most likely be found on the web too.) If others of like mind wish to join up - it's their right to be free to do so. If others aren't in agreement, they can ignore it or put up a site offering their own opinion. It's up to everyone to choose what they wish to promote. (even in comments and opinion posts)
Negativity, hate, ignorance, bigotry & untruths or positive, love, intelligence, tolerance & truth.
We all have a choice how we express ourselves - how we wish to communicate & be heard. We're all responsible for what we say, do, think & share.
IMHO I wish more posters would stop to think, before sharing their thoughts to temper them to the audience that is viewing them. It would be nice if we would listen to our better selves & avoid harsh words or condemnation. But the societies of the world hold many views - which is why so many seek out alternate worlds to "live" in, even if it's just in short visits.
Carpe Diem & Carpe Noctum
Gamers, game on!
F2P Game Central
www.4mgk.com/gamecentral
A few interesting points in this thread.
F2P Group? Yeah, consumer groups really only have power when they can take their business elsewhere.
In most cases business = money... but in this case it is possible that simply by being there they offer something? What i mean is that no-one likes playing in an empty MMO world. In Spellborn for example - many people complainedthat the world was 'empty'. Maybe a few thousand F2P players could have helped populate it and encourage the P2Pers? In DDO the world certainly feels more alive with a lot of people running about... and of course the more people that are there the more potential customers there are?
Cash Shops and F2P
How exactly do people think these companies should make their money to stay in business?
I play DDO (have for a year) and have never spent a single cent on it (Yes! I am a cheapskate!) But I have a quality many people seem to lack? I have self control. I also have patience. I don't mind waiting to build up enough Favor to earn Turbine Points... in fact, as a Perma Deathplayer it is something that isn't really even a grind, it's a part of gameplay.
Simply as a result of playing I have built up enough Turbine Points to buy 4 Modules and if I ever complete all the content in those (tough to do as a Perma death player) I will have earnt enough Favor/TP to buy at least one more...and so on.
But, I don't begrudge Turbine making money off some kid who jumps into the game and wants to prove how 133t he is by zerging all the content and buying a +3 Greataxe and purple hair. Good on them. It really doesn't concern me - I found my +3 Greataxe in game and I don't need purple hair (although one of my characters did win a lottery and won.... purple hair!)
I think the thing that has turned many off F2P models is that many companies were greedy. You needed a +3 Greataxe to complete a certain dungeon and the only way to get it was in the shop. Well, don't support those games. I support the 'non greed' model that Turbine run.
Remember that at the end of the day they cannot actually make you enter your Credit Card details... that is entirely up to you.
F2P game quality
Please. Be serious.
Lack of quality in MMOs is not restricted to F2P games. I am sure that many of you can remember more than a couple of sub based MMOs that were more than lacking? Again, not really an issue for F2P customers alone. An issue for everyone.
The fact is... make a judgement for yourself on whether a game is 'worth' the money you are paying for it. If not - move on. In the case of F2P games - if you choose not to pay then the only cost involved is your time. Is the game worth your time?
PS I do currently have a sub for an MMO running - so I don't mind paying subs. It's just that at the moment I don't see the need. In future I may sub to other MMOs - but sadly I cannot see anything coming on the horizon that looks like it might be worth it. Until a great MMO arrives - I will continue to spend my time in 'quality' F2P games. And I might sub to EvE too - we'll see.
Nothing says irony like spelling ideot wrong.
Haaa, whatta oxymoron - "quality f2p" :P
Thjere is no quality cuz if there would, company would set the price and ppl would pay.
They need not tricky ppl in promising free and then starting to milk them,
Is LOTRO now quality? far from this, I left it at sub time due no quality content but mindless repeated grind. Same was with DDO - if turbine wpuldn't change it f2p that gameserver must be turned off. LOTRO which had at good times maybe like 300K players lost big part and ended up nearly only lifers in it. Again after throwing away real Tolkien's IP loving devs and buying in truck full of cheapo asian programmists to copy-paste they lost all, and f2p crap was last saviour.
If there will born "Really Quality" game, P2P - OK, I'm ready to pay double to that unwritten 15$. If it good, nice modern graphics and animation, no stupid manga-emo faces, normal content (not copy from WoW I personallu hate too) which will be added to game so that there is allways something to do even when ya play 5 hrs per day. If there is economy mostly player driven, if there is open world with adventure and dangers, with no instances, where some achivements are such - only few per server and even then very hard to find, if there be challenge - I would pay even more.
But f2p model is such due lieing to customers. Ppl woudn't pay for lame gameplay 100$ / week. But as f2p they pay 10$ todaay, 25$ tomorrow and when not counting end up with 100-200$ per week. That is all glory of f2p -ya, player, are cow whom to milk.
Nothing says irony like spelling ideot wrong.
The only problem I have is with some publishing exec or developer more with a mind to making a buck than producing a good game trying to bring traditional F2P elements, such as being able to buy levels or gear that effect play with real money rather than earn them in to the kinds of game I like to play. If Blizzard decides to make a F2P version of WoW, that could even help the kind of player and developer that prefers the game that requires more effort by moving the population that prefers less effort to different servers.
However, WoW devs have been reluctant to make different play characteristics in cases where it would benefit different types of players such as PvP and PvE, so I am very skeptical that this would be a good idea. The same is true of any other publisher or game: if the effort isn't there to make the difference, then please don't make aF2P version.
Have played: Everquest, Asheron's Call, Horizons, Everquest2, World of Warcraft, Lord of the Rings Online, Warhammer, Age of Conan, Darkfall
From a marketing standpoint, this is a brilliant project. I wouldn't be surprised if those that are vehemently against it do more to generate awareness of the site than those who actually support it.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
wha??
It's a proven historical fact that beer saved humankind.
F2P is free to play to an extent. It has its limits. If you subscribe then you have full game access as well as all the little nice things like mounts, etc. However, if you don't subscribe then to be able to go over a certain level, have unlimited use of auction house, mail, and be able to have mounts, etc. then you have to purchase them from the store web site.
So it is F2P if you don't want all that. I haven't figured it up but I am guessing if someone was to figure it up you would probably find that you are spending more over all than you would if you just subscribe to the game and bought the expansions.
So in one aspect it is free but over the long haul it by far is not.
Gikku
making world of warcraft f2p, wow seriously? does mmorpg staffs every kid now? maybe you should pay wages or tell them to get a real job, f2p is bane, there is nothing free nor should be, f2p games are worth playing while they are in beta, once beta over game is dead , no self respecting gamer will play f2p games
Actually, it's the other way around sometimes.
You see - if you buy the packs you own them forever - so you can take as long as you like to do them. But you don't have access to packs/modules/zones you never brought. So a year from now you can still log in and access the stuff you brought.
Whereas if you subscribe you have access to everything but only while you maintain your subscription. You drop your subscription and you get locked out. If you become a long term subscriber you reach a point where you have paid more than if you had just brought the modules.
So, if you are the sort of player that likes to play MMOs, complete them, and then move on very quickly then subscription is almost certainly cheaper. If you want to try new content you need to re-subscribe.
But, if you are the sort who plays infrequently, maybe doesn't want to complete everything - or you just want to 'cherry pick' the best content and perhaps you want to come back over an extended period then buying the modules you want might work out cheaper. But if new content comes out - you will have to buy it. And if you buy stuff and lose interest then you payed for something you will never use.
Nothing says irony like spelling ideot wrong.
Fixed it for you... clearer?
Nothing says irony like spelling ideot wrong.
Change the name from f2p to ugwupf2p (You get what you pay for to play)
Getting into a P2P game costs more then 15 a month. You have to buy the game first, genius. If the game isn't popular then it sucks, cause without a decent community an MMO fails. I hope you have enough sence to figure that one out. So instead of wasting 15, you wasted around 60 dollars since you have to actually buy the game. Also before you even bring up console games, I can get a console game used and take it back for a full refund if I don't like it. You can't refund an MMO, I got lucky one time I sold my Darkfall account to someone so I didn't waste that 60 bucks. At least learn the cost of an MMO before retorting to a statement about throwing money away.
I would probably put more weight in what you say if your thinking was at least logical - but it isn't.
Here's why;
You say you would never touch a F2P game because of the poor quality - yet you admit that you played BOTH DDO and LotRO when they were subscription games?
They were subscription games yet they lacked 'quality'. So the F2P wasn't the issue was it?
Since then they have both gone F2P - so if anything they have had MORE dev time put into them than when you played them last?
So when they were subscription games - you had no problem trying them? Didn't you read any reviews? How is it you were so surprised that they were lacking? Why didn't you avoid them back then?
Yet now they are F2P you don't consider them worthy to even try?
How do you feel about games that offer 'Endless free trials' then? AoC and WAR for example?
Nothing says irony like spelling ideot wrong.
I've spent more money on worthless subscription-based games than I have on F2P games. F2P hasn't cornered the market on digital garbage. At least with F2P, I'm not forced to put down a dime up front and can take as long as I want to decide whether or not I wish to continue with it.
As for the free part of the content, in DDO you can have a perfectly viable character and full access to months worth of content without visiting the item shop. If you want "DA BEST"(TM) or "DA COOLEST"(TM), which is generally reflected by the tiniest of percentages difference, then be prepared to pay out. I won't speak for all F2Ps out there since I haven't played them, but any item shop using a similar model is perfectly fine by me.
Bleh F2P is already damaging many decent software companies IMHO. I don't support the whole movement, cause in the end YOU SHOULD NOT EXPECT SOMETHING FOR NOTHING.
What the software companies SHOULD learn from this is that AT LEAST they should offer extended free trials AT RELEASE, so as to not damage their own reputation and force people not to trust them any more (when they buy unfinished garbage betas instead of polished products - think Age of Conan, or more recently Elemental: War of Magic).
NEW IDEAS that can refresh the STALE state of MMORPGs
I actually really like LOTRO's model. Granted I really wish they would bring the price down on points, as I personally feel they are too much for what you get. HOWEVER, I think this kind of gaming should be high quality and retain high customer service. Too many F2P games are asian grinders and no matter how hard I try to get into them I just cannot.
I love the thought of being able to go a couple months of not playing w/out thinking 'Geez im wasting this subscription'. I also like the a' la carte idea of the whole model. Granted, anyone with a braincell will just pay 14.99 a month sub, but i'd love to see a compnay come out of the woodwork without the rediculous prices for points, and more options for picking and choosing the content you want.
This is just the beginning. In the next 5 years I would bet 5 gold that all studios, including Blizzard, will have a F2P model.
That is thing, I even don't say against different models, be so that dumbasses will play f2p (like in EQ2) in different servers.
But I don't tolerate cheating with wallet in same server. If there will come somea.holes with their big fat wallets of their fathers, and then jumping into game like "big-doers" even don't knowing basics of their class or skill, forgive me, I don't tolerate that.
That is like buying rights of doping use in Olympics, like buying medals for money. Ya say - me cheap, havn't enough buskc, maybe, maybe not - but I wanna challnge at equal skills and knowledge not wallet. See I will never can fight against Bahrein's sultan's wallet - he will forever beat me with dollars, but maybe not in game. That is game I wanna, not some kind of run "who have more bucks" - sorry if ya don't understand this. And don't start cash-shops are onöy for cosmetics - I havn't seen any f2p which isan't turned into Buy4Win cuz ya havn't so many cosmetic fags who will pay every day for new costume or color.
So, to make their profit they will put in shops B4W items, sooner or later, and design their games so, that on end-game ya can't do w/out buying expensive amounts of stuff.
like i said on many other posts...and the posts from people on this thread prove it...
The free to play games are free to play....but the good ones are very adept at reeling the fish in to spend money.(by the way anyone who claims they have to spend money in free to play games....you are but a reeled in fish...sad isnt it?)
They are pretty clever in making you think you have to pay cash...you never have to pay cash for free to play games...there is always another way.
You have to admit they did a good job on some fo the people posting on this thread.....they do as good a job as the gold spammers.....yep we all hate them or love them....but go figure the gold spammers make tons of cash still....
Yep i think its interesting indeed.
AGREE !!!
It seems some people. Most likely younger...or older but without a clue. No game can be completly free. It would be bankrupt day one and thats if they could somehow find someone willing to invest init to pay development costs.
What FTP does do ( as the site states for anyone who actually read it) is that it gives people the option of paying for what they choose, including nothing.
Personaly I don't care what the model is. If its a good game I'll play it. If its a bad game I won't.
Okay, so you object to games where the only way to get the 'best' stuff or the high end stuff is through the shop.
Fair enough.
But you do know that not all F2P games are like that?
You seem to be stuck on thinking about an older model.
And in a game where PvP is less important (and not required at all) then how does other people's equipment make any difference to your game?
Nothing says irony like spelling ideot wrong.