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Pvp in mmorpg's
Shaikura
Member Posts: 61
Ok,first i've tried it in some games that i've played.(Eve,Ao and wow) i just don't get whats so great to you guys about it.To me real pvp is what fps games are about.Pvp in these games is nothing but point and click.Real pvp is all about twitch muscle and the left mouse to me.So can any of you guys tell me whats so great about it in mmorpg's?I find it kind of boring in these games.When i want real pvp i load up ureal or battlefield 1942 or any other shooter.
Comments
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Doesn't seem that different to me. FPS is just simpler and more twitch based.
I only know about pvp in EvE, and although gate camping can be boring as heck, i also know that some of my biggest adrenalin rushes has come from pvp experiences in eve, and as someone mentioned a lot has to do with the cost of dying. In an fps you usually respawn somewhere nearby the action and are back at it within a minute. In eve it may take days to get your ship/clone/eq/money back in order, or it could take minutes (but your respawn in rarely minutes away). So dying is a real pain, and thus trying not to die has everything to do with lost stuff and lost time, whereas in an fps the only thing that takes a real hit is your ego.
So what you lose in constant twitch action you make up for in your will to no die, risk v reward.
I would make an argument about how tactics, strategy, fleet composition and capabilities are more prevelant in an mmo than an fps, but i know many who play team games have to use all these to compete, so i think the point is debatable.
I know i haven't seen a 80 v 80 team match spanned across several solar systems in an fps, and i know that after the clock stops ticking in an fps there are no long term, in game, effects of the outcome. This i think is the area where mmo beat fps long term, 2-3 great victories can gain for your side, new land to own, or at the very least a crushing blow in terms of lost capital.
I could go on ad nauseam, but i think that is ok for a couple of quick points as to why mmo pvp is great.
And just to add, real pvp is not only twitch based, it is anything that encompass player versus player, political, economic, or combat. In the same way that war is not just people shooting bullets at each other, its logistics, strategy, moral, economics, geography, etc...
So what makes it great to you guys is taking the other guys stuff?Pvp in shooters(if you don't cheat)is knowing how to move around quickly, aiming and shooting at the same time.Its knowing how to use your keyboard and mouse.Sure you just respawn and don't lose anything,but its about skill against skill.If just taking someone else's stuff is what its all about,it would just get boring to me.And its still just point and click.
In eve its about who has the better ship loadout and skills trained.I mean you really don't do much at all.Not like in fps.Or did i miss something?
I was recommending PvP using real players kills and not just skill points but I think that not many people like it because of... lag issues?
Yeah I heard someone in vendetta complain about having the highest level ship in the game and being shot down by a ship thats requires a lower level and more agile than his.
Yes, it happens in skilled based PvP.
Some people think that twitch based PvP means just another FPS which I disagree with.
There was a game called Aces High which featured flight phsyics and skilled based PvP.
The is plenty of skill in PVP mmorpgs. You have you do know what skills work well against what classes, and what order to use them. And thats all gonna change depending on what skills he uses against you.
I clearly prefer the FPS(BF) style pvp, it feels more intuitative to me than clicking a combination of keys (and have to consider what type of armor and damage shield the opponent has).
There's also another 'problem' with this for me. We don't enjoy being killed by others, even in games. If there's a way to improve our chance to win, we'll use it. In mmorpgs that means grinding and camping for more levels, skills and equipment. So, to make sure others do not have any advantage over you in pvp, you end up grinding and camping.
I haven't seen any real tempting FPS mmorpgs yet, but it's all about ideas, something will bubble up sooner or later.
As long as PvP is optional and completely irrelevant toward the PvE world, I actually MAY enjoy PvP a lot or just ignore it if not.
If PvP is enforced, I dont even bother to buy the game unless I know this is what I want(not the case with real time PvP ever so far).
- "If I understand you well, you are telling me until next time. " - Ren
Well.... It really about I am better than you and you are worst than me. But you have to take into effect that your character most of the time your main or secondary character is fitted out with all the best weapons ungraded armor and most refined spells what ever your profession is and you want to try them out another persons to character to see who is the best. I have see it come down to who had stayed up a hour longer than the other guy, our who has the better connection with higher level friends.
Our if you are angry and want to take out your anger on the first sucka you see. There are some people out there just attack noobs in hunting parties which I hate. Its all about what you would want to do in your spare time but to me the feeling that you can get attacked anytime really keeps me on point .
Besides killing is fun, in moderation of course
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I must not fear, fear is the mind killer.
Fear is the little death that leads to obliteration, I must permit fear to pass over me and through me.
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The type of skill I was talking about is not character skills. But actual player skills as in a twitch based movement.
And and these days, common mmo players define SKILLS as character skills on what to use against other classes or other what type of things you can do in a common point and click mmo with a dice rolling combat system.
This is just the old argument about twitch-based vs. non-twitch.
MMORPGs are not twitch-based, for the most part. The idea is that your character's in-game skills are what matter, not the real life player's out-of-game typing ability, hand-eye coordination and the like. MMORPGs by their nature mean playing an in-game character, not testing your out of game finger dexterity and reflexes. It carries over from pen and paper RPGs, where, for example, your ability to swing a sword is not dependent on your real-life strength.
I have nothing against folks who like games that test one's out of game reflexes against those of a another player. There are plenty of these games around. But MMORPGs are not, for the most part, designed this way. So if you want a game that tests your out of game coordination and dexterity (ie, player skill as compared with character skill), then you're better off with a FPS than with an MMORPG.
Although some will say that if its not twitched based that there is no player skill, i would argue that they are missing the point. there is more to combat than how big your weapon is, and well you can use it. IF you are pvp'ing you need to play the person, and this takes more than twiched based skills to acomplish.
Knowing ones enemy - their capabilities and weaknesses, knowing ones own capabilites and weaknesses and those of ones allies will stand you in much better sted than just being fast and accurate. In eve, just having a big battle ship and the best eq, with the required skills will not make you win every fight, not by a long shot. If this was true a month old player should be able to buy an account off a 2 year old player, test out the settings and then go wtfpwn everyting in sight, but as they dont have months of pvp experience, they are in reality a floating liability and will most likely lose their ship within a few days. Skill at the game is what will keep you alive, and alllow you to beat you enemy.
Also alot of pvp'rs are not in it for the looting, some do, and its a nice treat as an afterthough, the main reason they pvp is for fun, and to carry out the tactical so that the overall strategy can be followed. Its not about winning the battle its about winning the war.
anyhow....im biased i guess