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need advice on a pc build
this is my first build on own, so I need some advice from professionals like you, I have already set my mind on a build that I like but I think it needs some tweaking,
motherboard: Gigabyte GA-X58A-UD3R
processor: Intel® Core™ i7-920 2.66GHz Processor
video card: Gigabyte Radeon HD 5770 1GB DDR5
RAM: OCZ AMD Black Edition Series 4GB (2 x 2GB) DDR3 1600 MHZ
HDD: Western Digital (WD) Caviar 1TB 7200RPM SATA
PSU: OCZ StealthXStream 600W powersupply
case: Cooler Master Elite 332 case
I think that the processor is over the top and I want to replace it and just put a Intel® Core 2 Duo 3GHz 6MB (e8400) , and with the additional money replace my card with a SAPPHIRE HD5850 RADEON 1GB DDR5, what do you think?
They cripple the bird's wing, and then condemn it for not flying as fast as they.Malcolm X
Comments
You´ll certainly get a larger difference with a 5850 then a 5770 much more so then the difference in processor units. Combine that with the fact that not many, if any, games are putting multiple cpu cores to good use the answer should be quite clear.
My 2 cents atleast.
All statements I make is from my point of view unless stated otherwise.
If this is a gaming build, then your head is in the right place, to be sure (nice stuff), but the proportions are way out of whack. The GPU setup should be the most expensive component of a build, and certainly shouldn't cost less than the CPU. As a rule of thumb, having the GPU(s) cost twice what the GPU does, or cost maybe ~40% of your funding usually creates the correct balance of spending for maximum performance.
You didn't specify a budget, but the parts you linked run over $900 on Newegg (probably a hair over $1000, including shipping), and that's without an optical drive or a copy of windows included (putting the total price of the parts you linked, and the needed additions at $1100-$1150). For that price, you could get something like a Core I5 or Phenom II X4 based system with either a Radeon HD 5850, or better yet, a pair of 5770s.
Here's an example of a wish list I threw together for someone else that's in that budget range that you might want to glance at (http://secure.newegg.com/WishList/PublicWishDetail.aspx?WishListNumber=12870032). I went with two 5770s and a phenom II X4 955, but you could easily get a lower grade core I5 or a core I3 instead if you were dead set on Intel. I think that set of parts is probably at least in the ball park of what you should have in mind.
i7 has a triple channel memory controller, up that 4GB of RAM to 6GB (3 x 2GB sticks) and you'll see a huge jump in bandwidth.
I like your idea, but I dont want to start crossfire now, I want that as an further upgrade down the road so the 5850 would do with a downgrade in processor , but the motherboard I chose doesnt work with i5 due to diffrent socket(LGA1366) and I want to be able to upgrade to newer processor down the road without upping my motherboard, any solution to that?
They cripple the bird's wing, and then condemn it for not flying as fast as they.Malcolm X
Nope, not unless you want to wait six months to a year. Both Intel and AMD are coming out with completely new CPU architectures in Q1 2011, and it's a good bet that this new round will come with completely different sockets that will replace AM3, LGA1156 and LGA1366.
As for getting a 5850 and planning for Crossfire, there's nothing wrong with that approach, at all. Technically, nothing has the performance per dollar right now of the 5750 and 5770, and the reason is because after the Radeon HD 5000 series release, the 5800 series ended up a little higher priced than originally planned, while the 5700 series stayed at its planned price. That's why you get freak setups where two 5770s are cheaper and, on average, faster than a single 5870 (even though Crossfire isn't quite a 100% performance jump yet, though it's getting closer). Now, that said, if you want to buy a 5850, and then get another 5850 later, you'll be trading some value for some flat out performance, and that's not a terrible tradeoff, especially given that the 5850 is still a good value.
ok poster!you seem set on intel!witch isnt a bad call on one condition!do make absolutly sure mobo,network solution and cpu,support direct cache access(intel only techno).
if intel you buy doesnt support it might as well just buy a standard amd system, for the same money you would get top of the line from amd as far as gcard goes ati 5770 is enough in todays world
and no processor network card and mobo dont have to be brand new since direct cache access have been out for 2 or 3 if not 4 generation of intel cpu!the second proc you suggested probably support it,and one last advice stay in the 58 serie because the lower mobo version ohave various issue that could bottleneck your system.
and no i i dont know if the mobo cpu and network card included in the part number you supplied all support direct cache access you ll have to do your own homework on that
for more info on direct cache access check intel website and speedguide.net(w7 section)
This pretty much right on.
or stick with a 5770 and save money for next comp.
if runing a 64bit os , 6 GB of ram is nice also.
The only real issues is a 8400 mebo is 775 i think somethign around there, and the new i7s are like 13xx or something. So... if you already ahev e8400 just up the video card will be ur best bet most likely. AS honestly, the i7s are great but ur not goign to see god gaming increases due to them and same with dd3 atm.
"Society in every state is a blessing, but government even in its best state is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one ..." - Thomas Paine
10.5.10
you may want to wait seven months, Intel promised by 2011 it would have 10GHz cpu and a 4GHz bus ! (not counting a quad core running at 2.5GHz)
If you take away half a hole, how much do you have left?
btw, you do not want a single hard drive (hd)... get a fast hd for system files 300 to 500GB and a second 1.5TB hd for storage and gaming (patitioned 500GB and 1TB) and a third hd for archive 1.5 to 3TB; blueray hd movies are like 12GB each.
edit
10K spin hd (raptors) usually have a bit faster access time, but the newer SSD (Solid State Drive) are supposed to be even faster. You do not need 10K spin hd for the 2nd & 3rd hd, 7.2K is fine but 5K is not. The reason one has extra hds is if something goes catastrophicly wrong with one's main hd you already have back-ups of your main data. And having separate partitions allows faster defraging rather than every time having to do the entire hd. The 2nd and 3rd hd assuming you are not going to do raid configuration lets you stash excess content off the main hd so it does not get filled with data one rarely uses or d/ls of game installs or game clients one does not play anymore.
SATA3 is a bit better than sata1 hd if the mobo (motherboard) supports it & usb3.
If you go with multiple hds, have enough room in the hd cage of the case for space between hd so there is room for ventilation.
You did not mention if you are going W7-dx10, W8-dx11 or Vista OS. You also need a quality fan for the cpu, and may want to reconsider the psu 800W, some of the gpu now pull over 300 W. Look for a case that has a replaceable filter thus helping filter incoming airflow.
You also need a read write dvd drive with software $20 to $50.
Audio panel (in one of the hd bays) in the front of the workstation makes it easier to access audio out if you use a av amplifier (surround sound out to amp & 5.1/7.1 speakers) or headphones.
Monitor 25" to 30" ~$300 vs $100 21" LCD, in the near future LED but years before their price gets real.
Make sure the mobo has ethernet for broadband connect.
High end hd storage comparison quad Velociraptors vs dual Western Digital SSD i.e. "a set of four 600GB Velociraptors running in RAID-5 array for a total storage of 1.8TB to represent best case spindle-based solution vs a pair of 256GB Western Digital SiliconEdge Blue SSDs in a RAID-0 array for the flash-based alternative." re. best performance in video rendering and editing configuration.
Think that setup will play 99% of games at max res with all settings on. In fact, you should downgrade the CPU to an i5 750 as it won't make much difference in gaming and you can save yourself some money. Could say same thing about the case aswell as it's a bit overkill, but if you just going for looks then it's OK.
The HD5770 is a great little card. Only suggestion I'd make is to go with the sapphire vapor-x series, as they are a bit overclocked and come with a very quiet cooler.
In 1 or 2 years when the 5770 starts getting a little old, just buy another one and crossfire it. No need to buy more expensive hardware than that when only a demo game (Metro) can't run on it with max settings.
great system, and if you go with the 5850 i suggest the XFX they come pre OC'd and a lifetime warranty.
The following statement is false
The previous statement is true
thanks all for your very helpful advices, I made a redesign for my build and I think it works great, one for amd and the other intel, waiting for some input on which way to go, thanks
INTEL build
motherboard: Gigabyte GA-P55A-UD3
processor: Intel® Core™ i5-750 2.66GHz Processor
video card: SAPPHIRE HD5850 RADEON 1GB DDR5
RAM: OCZ Platinum Series 4GB (2 x 2GB) DDR3 1333 Kit
HDD: Western Digital Caviar 1TB 7200RPM SATA 32MB buffer
PSU: OCZ Fatal1ty 700W powersupply
case: Cooler Master Elite 332 case
AMD
motherboard: ASUS M4A79XTD EVO 790X AM3 motherboard
processor: AMD Phenom™ II X4 965 3.4GHz
video card: SAPPHIRE HD5850 RADEON 1GB DDR5
RAM: OCZ Platinum Series 4GB (2 x 2GB) DDR3 1333 Kit
HDD: Western Digital Caviar 1TB 7200RPM SATA 32MB buffer
PSU: OCZ Fatal1ty 700W powersupply
case: Cooler Master Elite 332 case
also I am not sure on the whole using diffrent hard disks for faster load times, all the HDDs I searched were 7200 rpm whether its 320GB or 1 TB, sorry for the noob question I think I am not getting it
They cripple the bird's wing, and then condemn it for not flying as fast as they.Malcolm X
I´m not a harddrive afficienado (spelled that one wrong i´m sure) but I think people are getting at the fact that access times means alot aswell, 2 drives that spins at 7200rpm can be differentiated by that access time. The faster it "finds" the file the faster it can read it and usually with many smaller files, that many games use, you can see quite a large difference in loading times and everything seems abit smoother in it´s delivery.
A friend of mine uses a velociraptor from Western Digital and he says he notices quite a large difference when compared to his 800gb drive which rotates at the same rpm.
All statements I make is from my point of view unless stated otherwise.
When it comes to hard drives look at the cache size you can get your hands on a 500gig or 1TB drive with a 32meg cache it will perform better than most raptors. If you have the money to spend an 80gig SSD for your OS and a regular platter drive for your storage would be the best option but SSD's are still a bit expensive.
The E8400 ($168 @ newegg) is a very good chip (I have an E8500 in my own gaming rig). However, it is getting a little old. It was released almost 2.5 years ago. It is also not a very good value. The chip has been so popular with gamers that the price has not really dropped. As a matter of fact, the E8400 is currently 10-15% more than I bought my E8500 for 1.5 years ago. They probably need to drop about $30 in price. I would probably not recommend anyone upgrade from the E8400 (it runs current games great), but I would also not recommend anyone buy one new either (unless they get one at a truly exceptional price).
You might want to look into the AMD Phenom II X4 965 ($182 @ newegg). It beats the E8400 by about 10-20% in games and by a lot more in other applications. I have used this chip in several systems and everyone seems to be happy with it. It is fast.
If you don't like AMD, you should try the Intel Core i5-750 ($199 @ newegg). It is comparable to the AMD 965 on most games and a touch faster than it in other opplications.
If you want to try an even faster processor, the next step I would recommend is the Intel Core i7-930 ($289 @ newegg). It is only about 5-10% faster in games than the previous two, but it is a good bit faster on other applications.
The ATI 5770 and 5850 are both good cards. From everything I have seen, the 5850 is significantly faster than the 5770, but also significantly more money. However, the 5770 runs every current game I have seen great. It all depends on what you want to spend.
I have been recomending the i5-750 or AMD 965 / 5770 to a lot of gamers. I have yet to find one not satisfied with the results.
"Those who dislike things based only on the fact that they are popular are just as shallow and superficial as those who only like them for the same reason."
Your solid either way. Performance will be pretty much the same on either platform, tipping one way or another depending on optimization of the app.
I tend to prefer AMD just because they don't price gouge like Intel... but thats just me.
I would say the AMD build is the better performer of the 2. To match the Phenom II 965 with C3 stepping you really need atleast a Core i7 to beat its performance, and even then one on an LGA-1366 motherboard. Most people tend to think just because AMD doesn't have the performance crown any of the Core family can beat any of the AMD family, but its not really true. If you were spending under $500 on a processor, the AMDs will have better performance per dollar.
Intels 80 GB X-25 SSD isn't that expensive now and it is faster than a Raptor. It also makes no sound or generate any heat. I have 4 raided myself.
However I think that OP should use all mosey possible to get a good graphix card and instead cut down on all other stuff. The 480 GTX is really the only choice now. The GFX card does a lot more than anything else and spending half the budget on it makes sense if you game a lot.
Nobody even mentions Nvidia?
Funny I was just reading an article on Toms Hardware about balanced PC gaming builds.. Check it out for some solid info, this is the 3rd part of the series, you may want to start with part 1.
Part 1: http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/build-balanced-platform,2469.html
Part 2: http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/balanced-gaming-pc,2477.html
Part 3: http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/balanced-gaming-pc-overclock,2625.html
Toms Hardware Guide is my 'PC Bible' Good luck on your build!
My current Build:
MOBO: Asus Rampage II Gene (IROG rules)
CPU: Intel Core i7 920 (2.67GHz) / Xigmatek Dark Knight air-cooler
GPU: Nvidia 9800 GTX+ 512MB (yes, I know I need an upgrade)
RAM: 6GB (3x2GB - Triple channel MOBO, but I need to upgrade to Win7-64bit to take full advantage)
HDD: I have several, and will finally switch the OS on to a SSD when I upgrade to Win7-64bit
PSU: Antec TruePower 850W
CASE: Coolermaster Storm Scout
Jules: You know the shows on TV?
Vincent: I don't watch TV.
Jules: Yeah, but, you are aware that there's an invention called television, and on this invention they show shows, right?
For right now I wait to upgrade. Nvidia's offerings, dollar for dollar, are currently either under powered against ATI's cards or extremely over priced for the newest batch. I give it another 6 months and the card wars will settle in again. I don't want to spend more than $250 on a card. My $0.02
Best cards for the $$$ for May 2010...
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/graphics-card-radeon-hd-5870-geforce-gtx-480,2621.html
Peace
Jules: You know the shows on TV?
Vincent: I don't watch TV.
Jules: Yeah, but, you are aware that there's an invention called television, and on this invention they show shows, right?
I am going with the AMD build, less expensive and surely seems like its the same performance as the intel build,
also the 5850 is better than the 470 GTX , since the 470 is just a tiny bit better in performance than 5850 but packs alot of heat and power consumption and also is more expensive, nvidia just failes there.
thanks all for the advice you have given me
They cripple the bird's wing, and then condemn it for not flying as fast as they.Malcolm X
Nope, they are pretty solidly underneath ATIs boot-heel at this point.
When I built my rig I went with an AMD build for a few reasons. Basically the upgrade compatibility on my MB, the price and overall performance is perfect for what I want to do with my rig. I can do everything with this build, even if it takes me a minute longer to convert my video file. The nice thing is that the new 6 core chips are out and all I have to do is update the bios on my mother board and drop the chip in and BAM!! im ready to go. Its a thought. I trust that whatever you get you enjoy it
nvidia are fair but they have a few issue the major one being the failure to make the chip
ati as been churning their chip at a high yield for close to a year with weeks and weeks in the 100% yield waffer
nvidia mm lets say that it cost them huge pile of money and even the chip you get has good chance to be a weak chip add to that the fact that they have to run a lot hotter and you get the reason why gamer go with ati .
ati waffer yield has been the best for months run a lot cooler and if you oc has less chance of overheating or having issue
ati is just a safer bet!
At least I red that somewhere.