Problem is...how many console gamers WANT to use a keyboard and mouse? Wouldn't they already be gaming on a PC if they did? Any MMO that has a UI that can be simplified enough to work on a controller fails before it starts.
Consoles do NOT have better graphics than PCs, and no way a console MMO is going to have more content. XBox/PS3 specs can't compare to an average gaming rig. PCs are just superior machines.
Part of the reason some newer MMOs are crap is because of compromises made to allow them to be ported to consoles. Most companies aren't going to make console versions of MMOs because MS and SOE want a cut of those monthly fees, and because of the hassle of getting every patch approved.
I prefer consoles to PCs. I don't know if that makes me a "console gamer" as I still tend to play most games on PC because I also prefer keyboard/mouse to controller for genres like FPS and RPG.
I disagree that PCs are superior machines. I would say that consoles are, by far, better value for money despite the games being more expensive. My PS3 is about 3 years old, has never failed or needed to be upgraded. In that same time, I've gone through two PCs and a handful of other upgrades.
I didn't say PCs were better value for the money, I'm talking strictly horsepower, although I could probably build one for close to the cost of a console that would smoke a console. But a store bought PC, yeah no question a console is more bang for the buck.
When it was launched, my PS3s graphics rivalled the top of the line PCs of the day. They're lagging behind a little now, but the PS4 will likely be out in a couple of years and will level the playing field.
I'm also confident that the PS4 will support keyboard and mouse, either via USB or Bluetooth.
I'm sure the PS4/Xbox720 or whatever they call it will be equal to a slightly above mid level generic PC when they hit the shelves, but it won't be long before even an average PC easily surpasses consoles again. Again, I don't dispute a console can use a mouse and keyboard, question is, how many console gamers will use one?
I'm a little confused by your last statement. You say that newer MMOs are crap because of compromises made to allow them to be ported to consoles, but I'm not aware of ANY MMOs having been ported to consoles in the past few years. I don't believe that developers would spend time accounting for a console port that isn't planned to happen anyway.
AoC, CO, and STO were all supposed to be console port MMOs. AoC version was probably scrapped due to the disaster the game was at launch. I don't think the console version of AoC is officially scrapped, but they haven't talked about it in forever.
Cryptic HAS a version of CO that works on a XBox, but they couldn't come to an agreement with MS to put it on the market. They probably scrapped their plans for STO after that even though the plan was originally to make it work on consoles. There may be some other MMOs that I'm missing that never made it to consoles because of the PITA that MS (and I imagine SOE) can be.
I can only speak for myself, but I certainly would be very happy to play an MMO on a next generation console rather than on a PC. I don't know how many dedicated console gamers would say the same, as I don't imagine many of them are interested in MMOs in the first place. I do wonder how many PC MMO gamers would be happy to switch to a keyboard/mouse console though.
MMOs don't tend to be at the cutting edge of graphics, I don't think a console would struggle.
I didn't know that about CO and STO, but if I'm honest I avoided both titles completely due to the heavily instanced nature of the gameplay. I wasn't a big fan of the graphical engine either. I did hear about AoC being originally intended for an Xbox 360 launch, but having played the game, I don't see how it's much different than other generic themepark games. It's certainly a better game than WAR in my opinion, regardless of whatever compromises were made.
I can only speak for myself, but I certainly would be very happy to play an MMO on a next generation console rather than on a PC. I don't know how many dedicated console gamers would say the same, as I don't imagine many of them are interested in MMOs in the first place. I do wonder how many PC MMO gamers would be happy to switch to a keyboard/mouse console though.
MMOs don't tend to be at the cutting edge of graphics, I don't think a console would struggle.
I didn't know that about CO and STO, but if I'm honest I avoided both titles completely due to the heavily instanced nature of the gameplay. I wasn't a big fan of the graphical engine either. I did hear about AoC being originally intended for an Xbox 360 launch, but having played the game, I don't see how it's much different than other generic themepark games. It's certainly a better game than WAR in my opinion, regardless of whatever compromises were made.
I think this is another big issue. I don't think there's really much demand. Why hasn't Blizzard made a console version of WoW? It's not because they hate money LOL. Some MMOs make Mac versions, and Macs are a smaller gaming market than consoles are.
I don't think graphics per se are the issue. AoC's graphics are top notch, but it was supposed to be a port. Look at WoW...if there's any MMO that should run on a current gen console, it should be WoW.
I think the small zones, heavy instancing, and small pop caps per zone of AoC, CO, and STO are IN PART due to the limited RAM and processing horsepower of current gen MMOs.
I can only speak for myself, but I certainly would be very happy to play an MMO on a next generation console rather than on a PC. I don't know how many dedicated console gamers would say the same, as I don't imagine many of them are interested in MMOs in the first place. I do wonder how many PC MMO gamers would be happy to switch to a keyboard/mouse console though.
MMOs don't tend to be at the cutting edge of graphics, I don't think a console would struggle.
I didn't know that about CO and STO, but if I'm honest I avoided both titles completely due to the heavily instanced nature of the gameplay. I wasn't a big fan of the graphical engine either. I did hear about AoC being originally intended for an Xbox 360 launch, but having played the game, I don't see how it's much different than other generic themepark games. It's certainly a better game than WAR in my opinion, regardless of whatever compromises were made.
I think this is another big issue. I don't think there's really much demand. Why hasn't Blizzard made a console version of WoW? It's not because they hate money LOL. Some MMOs make Mac versions, and Macs are a smaller gaming market than consoles are.
I don't think graphics per se are the issue. AoC's graphics are top notch, but it was supposed to be a port. Look at WoW...if there's any MMO that should run on a current gen console, it should be WoW.
I think the small zones, heavy instancing, and small pop caps per zone of AoC, CO, and STO are IN PART due to the limited RAM and processing horsepower of current gen MMOs.
It must have been because of the consoles. Games such as City of Heroes were also held back because of console versions and..
People you really cannot be this dumb? Please say your not that dumb
What the hell is this Console vs PC debate even about. Consoles today are nothing but PCs that use your TV as a monitor.
PS3/Xbox 360s are as powerful as your avg desktop unless you custom build your PC (which I do).
The main difference between consoles and PC are that PC have massive storage drives and the consoles have limited storage drives.
I would rather game on my PC then any console but that has nothing to do with the power of the console and more to do with a mouse and keyboard. I rather play with a mouse and keyboard then a controller. Just my personal opinion.
MMOs on Consoles? nothing new but they will never become mainstream for a few reasons.
1. Xbox Live cost money to just be able to go online then factor in a monthy fee to play a MMO and not many are going to spend that kind of money.
2. PS3 internet network is crap, you know it, I know it, Sony knows it, it would suck to try and play an MMO with the Sony online backbone.
3. Consoles battle each other to get games on their system, MMOs are designed to allow the most players to play without having to have the top of the line machine. aka WoW. Designed to run on older computers to get more people to play. What if Microsoft out bid Sony and now WoW is only playable on Xbox360s and not on PS3s. Do you think that the MMO companys would allow their player base to be cut in half right off the bat because of which console won the bidding war. NO I do not see that happening in the current greedy developer/publisher era the MMO genre is in.
People you really cannot be this dumb? Please say your not that dumb
What the hell is this Console vs PC debate even about. Consoles today are nothing but PCs that use your TV as a monitor.
PS3/Xbox 360s are as powerful as your avg desktop unless you custom build your PC (which I do).
The main difference between consoles and PC are that PC have massive storage drives and the consoles have limited storage drives.
I would rather game on my PC then any console but that has nothing to do with the power of the console and more to do with a mouse and keyboard. I rather play with a mouse and keyboard then a controller. Just my personal opinion.
MMOs on Consoles? nothing new but they will never become mainstream for a few reasons.
1. Xbox Live cost money to just be able to go online then factor in a monthy fee to play a MMO and not many are going to spend that kind of money.
2. PS3 internet network is crap, you know it, I know it, Sony knows it, it would suck to try and play an MMO with the Sony online backbone.
3. Consoles battle each other to get games on their system, MMOs are designed to allow the most players to play without having to have the top of the line machine. aka WoW. Designed to run on older computers to get more people to play. What if Microsoft out bid Sony and now WoW is only playable on Xbox360s and not on PS3s. Do you think that the MMO companys would allow their player base to be cut in half right off the bat because of which console won the bidding war. NO I do not see that happening in the current greedy developer/publisher era the MMO genre is in.
Sony's Network is definitely not as good as XBL as far as reliability but I think that's a non-issue regarding MMOs. From what I understand games like FFXI and, soon, FFXIV run on Square Enix's server hardware entirely. Not Sony's. I could be mistaken though.
I'll be getting FFXIV for my PS3 as my gaming computer has pretty much gone kaput. At some point I'll buy another PC and I'll probably also pick up the FFXIV pc version. I like having the option of playing on console OR pc with the very same account.
As nice as computers are for gaming, I do tend to run into serious issues with occasional viruses, driver issues, corrupt windows registry, & overheating, so it will be nice to have the PS3 as backup.
People you really cannot be this dumb? Please say your not that dumb
What the hell is this Console vs PC debate even about. Consoles today are nothing but PCs that use your TV as a monitor.
PS3/Xbox 360s are as powerful as your avg desktop unless you custom build your PC (which I do).
The main difference between consoles and PC are that PC have massive storage drives and the consoles have limited storage drives.
I would rather game on my PC then any console but that has nothing to do with the power of the console and more to do with a mouse and keyboard. I rather play with a mouse and keyboard then a controller. Just my personal opinion.
MMOs on Consoles? nothing new but they will never become mainstream for a few reasons.
1. Xbox Live cost money to just be able to go online then factor in a monthy fee to play a MMO and not many are going to spend that kind of money.
2. PS3 internet network is crap, you know it, I know it, Sony knows it, it would suck to try and play an MMO with the Sony online backbone.
3. Consoles battle each other to get games on their system, MMOs are designed to allow the most players to play without having to have the top of the line machine. aka WoW. Designed to run on older computers to get more people to play. What if Microsoft out bid Sony and now WoW is only playable on Xbox360s and not on PS3s. Do you think that the MMO companys would allow their player base to be cut in half right off the bat because of which console won the bidding war. NO I do not see that happening in the current greedy developer/publisher era the MMO genre is in.
Your last point doesn't make any sense. A company doesn't have to go exclusive and how is that different from going PC exclusive?
Do console players really want to play mmo`s and all they encompose?
Current gen consoles are capable of playing most games the same as a pc but who knows when the next gen consoles are coming out? Does anyone have any concrete evidence to show Sony or MS or actively making new consoles? I haven't heard anything. And don't assume they will be making them either since both the 360 and PS3 put their respective companies in bad financial shape, with the ps3 almost bankrupting Sony. I don't think either company is very eager to make a new one anytime soon.
Part of the problem with pc gaming these days is most games are developed and designed for the console first, with the pc port often being neglected. Its called "consolitis". Theres lots of examples out there of games ruined by being a bad port. Just look at Deus Ex 2. Expect the same treatment for console mmo`s.
Is a man not entitled to the herp of his derp?
Remember, I live in a world where juggalos and yugioh players are real things.
You guys enjoy your console MMO's. Hopefully that will take away all the carebears and casuals from the PC MMO Scene and we can finally get some good MMO's on PC again
yeah cause "hardcore" console gamers don't exist? Its thanks to the PC gamer that we have the so called label of carebear and casuals.
Dust 514 is suppose to be a MMOFPS of some sorts on the consoles. It's not some sor of single player game for the console. It may end up like a MAG typ game (hopefully better).
Dust 514 ..... IS NOT.... an MMO in its own right. It IS an FPS. You will be able to do missions generated by real players from EVE Online that are FPS missions. The outcome of those FPS missions you accept (which are typical FPS missions) will determine outcomes in certain things being done with the EVE Online MMO. They are only connected via this mission generation and not in any other way. Dust 514 will look and play like any FPS game...not an MMO.
Now, if you doubt this, I suggest you saunter on over the the CCP website and check it out.
It doesn't really matter. No matter which platform future MMO's are made for they will still be a half assed under invested POS rushed out to make a quick buck.
I guess if its on a console it at least has to be approved by Sony/Nintendo/MS to get released so it will be less buggy. So thats probably why so few MMO's are released on consoles....they actually have to work to be released.
Dust 514 is suppose to be a MMOFPS of some sorts on the consoles. It's not some sor of single player game for the console. It may end up like a MAG typ game (hopefully better).
Dust 514 ..... IS NOT.... an MMO in its own right. It IS an FPS. You will be able to do missions generated by real players from EVE Online that are FPS missions. The outcome of those FPS missions you accept (which are typical FPS missions) will determine outcomes in certain things being done with the EVE Online MMO. They are only connected via this mission generation and not in any other way. Dust 514 will look and play like any FPS game...not an MMO.
Now, if you doubt this, I suggest you saunter on over the the CCP website and check it out.
Part of me would like to argue agains tthis and list features about dust that make it an mmo.
However a larger part of me knows this argument will continue on even after dust comes out. I think I'll wait till then to get involved in an argument about weather it is or not. Right now it's just too much we don't know about it to make a decision.
I dont know about PCs being more powerful than the Xbox or Playstation. Does anyone have actually Specs on these machines. That would be the only way to compare them to the average PC to be honest.
I do think that PC game demand in general has been going down for years. It will be a matter of time before MMOs are mainstream on the Xbox or Playstation. How many game stores do you see with more PC games for sell rather than the Xbox and Playstation? Years and years ago when I bought my copy of UO, PC games were 75% of the games out for sell. Now going to all the game stores in my area, I will see maybe one or half a row of PC games Vrs. rows and rows of different games for the Xbox, Playstation, or the Wii. Yes, It is just matter of time that MMOs will be played more on these platforms. Alll the other type of games have made the move, so will MMOs.
Problem is...how many console gamers WANT to use a keyboard and mouse? Wouldn't they already be gaming on a PC if they did? Any MMO that has a UI that can be simplified enough to work on a controller fails before it starts.
Consoles do NOT have better graphics than PCs, and no way a console MMO is going to have more content. XBox/PS3 specs can't compare to an average gaming rig. PCs are just superior machines.
Part of the reason some newer MMOs are crap is because of compromises made to allow them to be ported to consoles. Most companies aren't going to make console versions of MMOs because MS and SOE want a cut of those monthly fees, and because of the hassle of getting every patch approved.
They're probably gaming on a console because a) the price/hardware ratio is much higher and b) they don't want to fiddle around with the settings to get optimal game experience.
I don't think that has anything to do with keyboard and mouse.
And even though you're right in saying that PC's are superior machines, that doesn't mean the games will be superior. And the reason for that I said above.
Consoles offer much better hardware for the price. If you want to have a good PC (from the scratch), you need to pay a lot more. So, developers can't make the PC games too good looking because they want as many to play them as possible. Thus the graphics get toned down, even if the hardware (for some) is superior. Most potential players do not spend 1k cash to their PC's every year to keep up, so most of them are playing on much older rigs.
You see this with WoW, and SW:TOR. Graphics toned down so "everyone would get a chance to pay the subscription".
Then you see games like AoC (which was meant to be released on 360) and FFXIV. Since consoles are not that expensive, the developers can make the games as good looking as the console offers. It won't exclude those players with little cash because they can play on a console, while those with good PC's can get those settings even higher.
So, even though PC hardware is superior, doesn't mean that it will be used effectively. Especially in the case of MMO's.
While console MMO may not have any more content than PC MMO, there is no evidence that there would be less either. Consoles come with 20 to 120 GB hard disks already. That's more than enough for any game.
You have no proof that being developed on a console makes the game suffer. Absolutely none. "Compromises" such as what?
Using LOL is like saying "my argument sucks but I still want to disagree".
Problem is...how many console gamers WANT to use a keyboard and mouse? Wouldn't they already be gaming on a PC if they did? Any MMO that has a UI that can be simplified enough to work on a controller fails before it starts.
Consoles do NOT have better graphics than PCs, and no way a console MMO is going to have more content. XBox/PS3 specs can't compare to an average gaming rig. PCs are just superior machines.
Part of the reason some newer MMOs are crap is because of compromises made to allow them to be ported to consoles. Most companies aren't going to make console versions of MMOs because MS and SOE want a cut of those monthly fees, and because of the hassle of getting every patch approved.
They're probably gaming on a console because a) the price/hardware ratio is much higher and b) they don't want to fiddle around with the settings to get optimal game experience.
I don't think that has anything to do with keyboard and mouse.
And even though you're right in saying that PC's are superior machines, that doesn't mean the games will be superior. And the reason for that I said above.
Consoles offer much better hardware for the price. If you want to have a good PC (from the scratch), you need to pay a lot more. So, developers can't make the PC games too good looking because they want as many to play them as possible. Thus the graphics get toned down, even if the hardware (for some) is superior. Most potential players do not spend 1k cash to their PC's every year to keep up, so most of them are playing on much older rigs.
You see this with WoW, and SW:TOR. Graphics toned down so "everyone would get a chance to pay the subscription".
Then you see games like AoC (which was meant to be released on 360) and FFXIV. Since consoles are not that expensive, the developers can make the games as good looking as the console offers. It won't exclude those players with little cash because they can play on a console, while those with good PC's can get those settings even higher.
So, even though PC hardware is superior, doesn't mean that it will be used effectively. Especially in the case of MMO's.
While console MMO may not have any more content than PC MMO, there is no evidence that there would be less either. Consoles come with 20 to 120 GB hard disks already. That's more than enough for any game.
You have no proof that being developed on a console makes the game suffer. Absolutely none. "Compromises" such as what?
QFT all of it.
Consoles are starting to see more MMO development, and if you look at the two titles being released by SOE, DCUO will be F2P and so will The Agency from what I remember. Controls will be optimized for use with controllers which I favor as far as playability in MMOs rather than the mouse and keyboard. I've successfully mapped a controller via switchblade when playing MMOs thanks to Cryptic actually making a good controls layout for use with Champions Online (quite possibly the only thing they did right).
Console MMOs will also be easier to create as they already know the hardware specs, and what the systems are capable of, whereas they can only put recommended specifications without taking into account any additional software or alternate hardware configurations that could cause performance problems in-game.
The console MMO market is largely untapped, and console gamers make up roughly the majority of the gaming market.
PS3 already has an MMO, sort of. Playstation@Home is built sort of like an instanced MMO. It's purely social/minigames though. It's fairly popular and most people tend to use a keyboard to chat on it.
Actually, all three consoles have built in delivery systems for free to play MMOs.
And that makes perfect sense when you think about the audience that most microtransaction games cater to. The other day I saw a $5 Nexon points card at the counter of a gas station. Now imagine these games delivered over XBox Live Arcade, PSN or the Wii Shop channel. $15 gets you the game and a few gpotatoes to start rolling with.
The idea isn't that far out there and I'm sure that there are a few F2P games chomping at the bit to get in on this market.
PS3 already has an MMO, sort of. Playstation@Home is built sort of like an instanced MMO. It's purely social/minigames though. It's fairly popular and most people tend to use a keyboard to chat on it.
In all seriousness though, I think the above poster has it right. Only F2P games with cards sold at 711 are going to have the best stance in that market, it's still full of people who "won't pay twice for a game" (subscriptions). I have no idea why anyone with Xbox live would pay even more monthly either, hard niche to hit and milk.
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All these comments are distracting the thread from what the OP was onto, which was something good I think.
He's right, people DO want a different kind of MMO. I believe there are PC MMO players waiting for it, and also console players waiting for a good MMO they can play. And by design, an MMO on a console would have to be different in feel.
I think PC dominates in the MMO world because it's simply more comfortable to spread out and get ready for a big gaming session at your desk. You have a drink there, maybe some food, a comfier chair geared more toward just you instead of a couch. And I think with PC MMOs, you play the game in Windowed mode so you can constantly cross-check with websites on the internet. The console gamer doesn't do those things as much when he games; he sits down and wants something fun to lose himself in immediately, that keeps up with itself and constantly presents him something new to focus on.
So a console MMO would have to cater to that; be simpler, more focus on gameplay and not grinds and gear that you need the internet as constant reference for. Players should be thinking about the gameplay itself when they play, not how they can get an edge by constantly referencing guides and equipment lists. Make an MMO that peaks in its entertainment not from the physical experience of playing it at your computer, but on the fun and variety of the gameplay. Modern MMOs are all about repeating the same tasks over and over, and all about the progression curve, and always having your eye on what's NEXT, never on what's right in front of you.
The trouble is, console hardware cycles just don't mesh well with the long development times of MMORPGs. Current ones have what, maybe 3 years left at most? By the time a real MMORPG comes out, they'd only have a year or two of life left in them.
It is kind of a funny generation, it started in what, 2005, but just now Sony finally has started breaking even on each PS3 sold, even though it (and the 360) are now woefully underpowered compared to PCs.
The trouble is, console hardware cycles just don't mesh well with the long development times of MMORPGs. Current ones have what, maybe 3 years left at most? By the time a real MMORPG comes out, they'd only have a year or two of life left in them.
It is kind of a funny generation, it started in what, 2005, but just now Sony finally has started breaking even on each PS3 sold, even though it (and the 360) are now woefully underpowered compared to PCs.
The technology doesn't really take as huge steps as before though. There's really no "need" for PS4 / Xbox 720 anytime soon. I don't think PC is that much ahead of PS3, at least if the games are properly optimized. And I wouldn't say the newer PC games are much ahead of consoles in terms of visuals yet. They could be, but how many people have money for the PC's that would run those kind of games with good graphics or already have such a rig? Not many, I'd say.
Using LOL is like saying "my argument sucks but I still want to disagree".
Comments
I can only speak for myself, but I certainly would be very happy to play an MMO on a next generation console rather than on a PC. I don't know how many dedicated console gamers would say the same, as I don't imagine many of them are interested in MMOs in the first place. I do wonder how many PC MMO gamers would be happy to switch to a keyboard/mouse console though.
MMOs don't tend to be at the cutting edge of graphics, I don't think a console would struggle.
I didn't know that about CO and STO, but if I'm honest I avoided both titles completely due to the heavily instanced nature of the gameplay. I wasn't a big fan of the graphical engine either. I did hear about AoC being originally intended for an Xbox 360 launch, but having played the game, I don't see how it's much different than other generic themepark games. It's certainly a better game than WAR in my opinion, regardless of whatever compromises were made.
I think this is another big issue. I don't think there's really much demand. Why hasn't Blizzard made a console version of WoW? It's not because they hate money LOL. Some MMOs make Mac versions, and Macs are a smaller gaming market than consoles are.
I don't think graphics per se are the issue. AoC's graphics are top notch, but it was supposed to be a port. Look at WoW...if there's any MMO that should run on a current gen console, it should be WoW.
I think the small zones, heavy instancing, and small pop caps per zone of AoC, CO, and STO are IN PART due to the limited RAM and processing horsepower of current gen MMOs.
It must have been because of the consoles. Games such as City of Heroes were also held back because of console versions and..
oh, wait..
People you really cannot be this dumb? Please say your not that dumb
What the hell is this Console vs PC debate even about. Consoles today are nothing but PCs that use your TV as a monitor.
PS3/Xbox 360s are as powerful as your avg desktop unless you custom build your PC (which I do).
The main difference between consoles and PC are that PC have massive storage drives and the consoles have limited storage drives.
I would rather game on my PC then any console but that has nothing to do with the power of the console and more to do with a mouse and keyboard. I rather play with a mouse and keyboard then a controller. Just my personal opinion.
MMOs on Consoles? nothing new but they will never become mainstream for a few reasons.
1. Xbox Live cost money to just be able to go online then factor in a monthy fee to play a MMO and not many are going to spend that kind of money.
2. PS3 internet network is crap, you know it, I know it, Sony knows it, it would suck to try and play an MMO with the Sony online backbone.
3. Consoles battle each other to get games on their system, MMOs are designed to allow the most players to play without having to have the top of the line machine. aka WoW. Designed to run on older computers to get more people to play. What if Microsoft out bid Sony and now WoW is only playable on Xbox360s and not on PS3s. Do you think that the MMO companys would allow their player base to be cut in half right off the bat because of which console won the bidding war. NO I do not see that happening in the current greedy developer/publisher era the MMO genre is in.
Sooner or Later
Sony's Network is definitely not as good as XBL as far as reliability but I think that's a non-issue regarding MMOs. From what I understand games like FFXI and, soon, FFXIV run on Square Enix's server hardware entirely. Not Sony's. I could be mistaken though.
I'll be getting FFXIV for my PS3 as my gaming computer has pretty much gone kaput. At some point I'll buy another PC and I'll probably also pick up the FFXIV pc version. I like having the option of playing on console OR pc with the very same account.
As nice as computers are for gaming, I do tend to run into serious issues with occasional viruses, driver issues, corrupt windows registry, & overheating, so it will be nice to have the PS3 as backup.
Your last point doesn't make any sense. A company doesn't have to go exclusive and how is that different from going PC exclusive?
Couple of thoughts:
Do console players really want to play mmo`s and all they encompose?
Current gen consoles are capable of playing most games the same as a pc but who knows when the next gen consoles are coming out? Does anyone have any concrete evidence to show Sony or MS or actively making new consoles? I haven't heard anything. And don't assume they will be making them either since both the 360 and PS3 put their respective companies in bad financial shape, with the ps3 almost bankrupting Sony. I don't think either company is very eager to make a new one anytime soon.
Part of the problem with pc gaming these days is most games are developed and designed for the console first, with the pc port often being neglected. Its called "consolitis". Theres lots of examples out there of games ruined by being a bad port. Just look at Deus Ex 2. Expect the same treatment for console mmo`s.
Is a man not entitled to the herp of his derp?
Remember, I live in a world where juggalos and yugioh players are real things.
yeah cause "hardcore" console gamers don't exist? Its thanks to the PC gamer that we have the so called label of carebear and casuals.
Dust 514 ..... IS NOT.... an MMO in its own right. It IS an FPS. You will be able to do missions generated by real players from EVE Online that are FPS missions. The outcome of those FPS missions you accept (which are typical FPS missions) will determine outcomes in certain things being done with the EVE Online MMO. They are only connected via this mission generation and not in any other way. Dust 514 will look and play like any FPS game...not an MMO.
Now, if you doubt this, I suggest you saunter on over the the CCP website and check it out.
Let's party like it is 1863!
It doesn't really matter. No matter which platform future MMO's are made for they will still be a half assed under invested POS rushed out to make a quick buck.
I guess if its on a console it at least has to be approved by Sony/Nintendo/MS to get released so it will be less buggy. So thats probably why so few MMO's are released on consoles....they actually have to work to be released.
Part of me would like to argue agains tthis and list features about dust that make it an mmo.
However a larger part of me knows this argument will continue on even after dust comes out. I think I'll wait till then to get involved in an argument about weather it is or not. Right now it's just too much we don't know about it to make a decision.
Into the breach meatbags
I dont know about PCs being more powerful than the Xbox or Playstation. Does anyone have actually Specs on these machines. That would be the only way to compare them to the average PC to be honest.
I do think that PC game demand in general has been going down for years. It will be a matter of time before MMOs are mainstream on the Xbox or Playstation. How many game stores do you see with more PC games for sell rather than the Xbox and Playstation? Years and years ago when I bought my copy of UO, PC games were 75% of the games out for sell. Now going to all the game stores in my area, I will see maybe one or half a row of PC games Vrs. rows and rows of different games for the Xbox, Playstation, or the Wii. Yes, It is just matter of time that MMOs will be played more on these platforms. Alll the other type of games have made the move, so will MMOs.
They're probably gaming on a console because a) the price/hardware ratio is much higher and b) they don't want to fiddle around with the settings to get optimal game experience.
I don't think that has anything to do with keyboard and mouse.
And even though you're right in saying that PC's are superior machines, that doesn't mean the games will be superior. And the reason for that I said above.
Consoles offer much better hardware for the price. If you want to have a good PC (from the scratch), you need to pay a lot more. So, developers can't make the PC games too good looking because they want as many to play them as possible. Thus the graphics get toned down, even if the hardware (for some) is superior. Most potential players do not spend 1k cash to their PC's every year to keep up, so most of them are playing on much older rigs.
You see this with WoW, and SW:TOR. Graphics toned down so "everyone would get a chance to pay the subscription".
Then you see games like AoC (which was meant to be released on 360) and FFXIV. Since consoles are not that expensive, the developers can make the games as good looking as the console offers. It won't exclude those players with little cash because they can play on a console, while those with good PC's can get those settings even higher.
So, even though PC hardware is superior, doesn't mean that it will be used effectively. Especially in the case of MMO's.
While console MMO may not have any more content than PC MMO, there is no evidence that there would be less either. Consoles come with 20 to 120 GB hard disks already. That's more than enough for any game.
You have no proof that being developed on a console makes the game suffer. Absolutely none. "Compromises" such as what?
QFT all of it.
Consoles are starting to see more MMO development, and if you look at the two titles being released by SOE, DCUO will be F2P and so will The Agency from what I remember. Controls will be optimized for use with controllers which I favor as far as playability in MMOs rather than the mouse and keyboard. I've successfully mapped a controller via switchblade when playing MMOs thanks to Cryptic actually making a good controls layout for use with Champions Online (quite possibly the only thing they did right).
Console MMOs will also be easier to create as they already know the hardware specs, and what the systems are capable of, whereas they can only put recommended specifications without taking into account any additional software or alternate hardware configurations that could cause performance problems in-game.
The console MMO market is largely untapped, and console gamers make up roughly the majority of the gaming market.
PS3 already has an MMO, sort of. Playstation@Home is built sort of like an instanced MMO. It's purely social/minigames though. It's fairly popular and most people tend to use a keyboard to chat on it.
Actually, all three consoles have built in delivery systems for free to play MMOs.
And that makes perfect sense when you think about the audience that most microtransaction games cater to. The other day I saw a $5 Nexon points card at the counter of a gas station. Now imagine these games delivered over XBox Live Arcade, PSN or the Wii Shop channel. $15 gets you the game and a few gpotatoes to start rolling with.
The idea isn't that far out there and I'm sure that there are a few F2P games chomping at the bit to get in on this market.
http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2008/12/12/
In all seriousness though, I think the above poster has it right. Only F2P games with cards sold at 711 are going to have the best stance in that market, it's still full of people who "won't pay twice for a game" (subscriptions). I have no idea why anyone with Xbox live would pay even more monthly either, hard niche to hit and milk.
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All these comments are distracting the thread from what the OP was onto, which was something good I think.
He's right, people DO want a different kind of MMO. I believe there are PC MMO players waiting for it, and also console players waiting for a good MMO they can play. And by design, an MMO on a console would have to be different in feel.
I think PC dominates in the MMO world because it's simply more comfortable to spread out and get ready for a big gaming session at your desk. You have a drink there, maybe some food, a comfier chair geared more toward just you instead of a couch. And I think with PC MMOs, you play the game in Windowed mode so you can constantly cross-check with websites on the internet. The console gamer doesn't do those things as much when he games; he sits down and wants something fun to lose himself in immediately, that keeps up with itself and constantly presents him something new to focus on.
So a console MMO would have to cater to that; be simpler, more focus on gameplay and not grinds and gear that you need the internet as constant reference for. Players should be thinking about the gameplay itself when they play, not how they can get an edge by constantly referencing guides and equipment lists. Make an MMO that peaks in its entertainment not from the physical experience of playing it at your computer, but on the fun and variety of the gameplay. Modern MMOs are all about repeating the same tasks over and over, and all about the progression curve, and always having your eye on what's NEXT, never on what's right in front of you.
Or something like that.
The trouble is, console hardware cycles just don't mesh well with the long development times of MMORPGs. Current ones have what, maybe 3 years left at most? By the time a real MMORPG comes out, they'd only have a year or two of life left in them.
It is kind of a funny generation, it started in what, 2005, but just now Sony finally has started breaking even on each PS3 sold, even though it (and the 360) are now woefully underpowered compared to PCs.
R.I.P. City of Heroes and my 17 characters there
The technology doesn't really take as huge steps as before though. There's really no "need" for PS4 / Xbox 720 anytime soon. I don't think PC is that much ahead of PS3, at least if the games are properly optimized. And I wouldn't say the newer PC games are much ahead of consoles in terms of visuals yet. They could be, but how many people have money for the PC's that would run those kind of games with good graphics or already have such a rig? Not many, I'd say.