MMO Guilds: What makes them successful?

Zap-Robo · February 2005

I am starting the planning stages of a guild to be run in an upcoming MMO. I have played in a few fairly successful ones over several games, and worked closely with others - I have an idea of what I want to achieve.

But, in your own opinion what do you think are the elements of a successful MMO guild? Is it the dedication of the players? The strength of leadership?

And, what utilities should a successful guild command? A website? TeamSpeak? Chat channels? Forums? Something else?

I will be interested to hear what people think.

stephen_sof · February 2005

1st off you need a cool name

then i nice looking website

and all of the utilities you mentioned...

get about 10 very active members to join yoru guils then become friends with the devs of the game and get explusive stuf on the game...

then your succede :P unless your an incopetent bastard

Crabby · February 2005

Any successful guild, or clan needs a central theme that all of the members either enjoy, or agree with. A theme can be many things. Some would immediately think "goal" in exchange of theme, but theme can often times literally be...a THEME of the guild. The motif. Guild name, colors, banner, slogan, etc; Such an organization of "flavor" can go a long way in providing a sense of belonging or onwership to members, especially if such a theme was voted upon. And i nthe end, you want to keep people around anyway.

All of those other things are self-explainitory though I put less value on voice servers than any other tool used for a guild. Call me old fashioned, but I consider voice servers a raising fad. I can remember a time when things could get done in games absent of such "required" voice communication. And frankly, I'd take the guy who could "get it done" through practice and intrinsic "knowing" rather than the boob who needs to be told word for word.

Leadership is a sticky subject because most people talk a good game no matter what. I think a core component supplementing leadership is the political structure of the guild. I have seen a lot of guild leaders often times contradict themselves in this way. The dogma coming from the leadership didn't sync up with how the guild was actually run, or their attitudes put forth in the "off-hours." (not behind the mike during a guild meeting) In turn, this weakens the image and position of leadership. And since I am personally so conscious of such issues, it can severely damage any respect I could have for the institution.

Dekoth · February 2005

What makes a guild sucessful?

Depends on your definition of successful.

Do you define successful as being at the top of the game before other guilds, engaging the epic content first or close to it? This is my definition.

Or do you define it as a close knit family type group that gets on regularly to hunt together and enjoy the other aspects of the game.

I can give you the formula for the first, but the second as i have no interest in I cannot answer.

1st and most importantlly is the leadership. You must have good leaders, who are respectable, do not get on power trips and put forth more effort then the members at all time. Noone wants to follow a slacker.

2nd Dedicated members, self explanitory. Leaders set the standard and the members uphold it..pretty simple.

Things you need..

A website and forums is a given. Members need to be able to communicate offline effectively. Raid schedualing, future plans etc. A nice website is always a plus as this makes people want to be a part of your organization.

DKP system is a must. Loot councils, random rolling etc Do not work. They always lead to fighting and people leaving. DKP is nuetral and fair, while it has its flaws it is inarguable.

Teamspeak, should not be a requirement. If you want to make it available great, however do not require it as it turns alot of people off. Some people just hate using it. good example I dispise TS, I will happily use Ventrilo but I loath using TS and avoid it as often as possible.

Goals, make them often, make them clear and achieve them. Dont set goals and the guild stagnates.

Set your charter/rules and things in place up front. Do not spring them at the last moment, make certain they are accepted from the start. You do not understand how bad it sucks to get stuck with some asshat whos grandfathered in the guild because the rule he regularly breaks came after he was a member. There needs to be a clear policy to get rid of unwanted/needed members. Its not a fun thing to do, its not something you want or hope to do. However dispite the best thought out recruitment systems you will end up with idiots from time to time who make the guild look bad, you have to realize this and be prepared to deal with it.

Lastly, Even when you become an UBER guild DO not Be Assholes to everyone on the server. This will eventually come back to bite you in the ass. I have been in the #1~#2 guilds in the games I play always for many years now. It is fully unnecessary to be assholes to people just because. If your busy and some newbie is bugging you, just say Im busy. Do not treat the other people on the server like dirt, you never know when they will be up at your level kicking dirt in your eyes. unless of course they are a 13 y/o aoler smacktard who can't speak basic english, then feel free to insult them.

Wickes · February 2005

As people have said, it depends on what you're trying to accomplish. Just having a loose laid-back organization for fun and social isn't very demanding. If you want to raid big time, you need a lot of people and a lot of organizatrion, and the key is WORK ... I mean a lot of it, and let me assure you that it isn't that easy to find people who will work. A lot of people like to "play" officer without getting their hands dirty

I'd have to disagree with Dekoth a bit on the loot system. DKP is certainly one way, and a very good way. But in EQ1 we developed our own system (which I wouldn't even dream of trying to explain). Our guild was a very large semi-hardcore semi-casual raiding guild - sort of a blend between Dekoth's two types - and we wanted a system which favored the hardcore powergamers overall but still allowed the more casual people to grab something uber occasionally (sometimes even be the first to get it), so we had to develop something and we did. It worked very well for years, and is still working well for the people still playing EQ1.

I agree completely with the rest of Dekoth's suggestions.

Sicarim · February 2005

active leaders. its as simple as that.

sygmas · February 2005

Very nice responses, couldn't have said them better myself. Running a successful guild is a lot of hardwork, responsibility and dedication.

Really -- remember youre housin a lot of different people and they may not always get along, there will be various levels of drama and all sorts of things that occur over time. It takes a strong leader to deal with all that. Keep that in mind!

garrison13 · February 2005

Time, dedication and some good guild mates.

ianubisi · February 2005

Originally posted by Sicarim
active leaders. its as simple as that.

Absolutely correct.

Beyond that, however, you need consistent leadership. Create a charter and stick to it, though keep flexibility an important part of your toolset. Consistent, present leadership beats all other attributes.

sdoughty · February 2005

a good leader is needed, sum1 who will do just about anything for his guild mates, also sum1 who spends alot of the tym with the clan, i used to play a game, and out leader got to lvl100, or there abouts, which was a good lvl in this game, and she just stayed in the vault helping people who needed it, u also need members who will do anythiong for there leader, our leader had loadsa lil bro's n sistas, which let her gain xp off them, and thats how she lvled, so while she helped the clan, they cud go off, lvl and help her, and an active leader isnt all u need, u dont want an active leader who is just active lvling all the tym

kb4blu · February 2005

One problem I keep having with guilds is I cant spend all the time time I want playing a game so what happens is everyone else in the guild gets levels faster than I do. So what happens is those of us that are more casual gamers get left out of a lot of raids, dungeon crawling, etc.

I have had this happen in every guild I have ever been in. It seems that most guilds are for the high level people in a guild and the others are left out.

I suppose thats just the way it is.

If you could come up with a solution to this I think you would has a top notch guild.

I have been in guilds in AO, EQ, EQII, Eve, UO, SWG,FFXI, and some others I have forgotten.

doobster · February 2005

besides all the obviouses

not only active leaders, but active players. gotta have great people that you feel are your friedns and y ou know they feel the same. everyone has to be active.

Ken`Shiero · February 2005

You know what makes a good Guild? Not high level people but people who are on the most. The people who put in the most time on the game. I would take a level 20 person who is on almost every time im on than a person who comes on every blue moon.

People who really love the game dedicated players make successful guilds.

Anofalye · February 2005

A degree in politic could not harm.

Think of the server as the voters. Think of your guild as your political party. Think of the others guilds as ''opposition''. As much as you can help it, you want everyone on the server to drool at you and to actually like you. If you need to ditch a skilled jerk, if you can afford it, it will repay in recruits potentials in the long run, since the others skilled jerk will still come no matter if you are nice or evil but the skilled nice folks will only come if you are nice.

If your political party is great at widespreading on the server your accomplishment, dirty talking the main opposition, showing how you did this or that to help the server as a whole, then you will naturally draw everyone attention to your guild.

Then you need the skill to recruit the best, not every citizen is a great asset in a party, althought they are all your friends, even if you would rather died then have them in your guild, you need to make them feel good with you, happy with you, appreciative...

If you follow those rules, others guilds that are rude with you will see their members /q when they are racing you. When you help the others guilds who previously try to race you, you may very well be able to recruit a few keys elements.

If you form an alliance with another guild, make sure you will be more successfull then they will be, put that extra effort needed to make everyone understand your guild is the stronglink. Dont be afraid to call a raid off. Power is to be able to determine when to do something and when not to. If you know you cant win a race to mob Y, then dont waste your energy, call the raid off, and focus on something else, you need to achieve stuff of course, but you rather do little for 4 nights and achieve complete uberness 3 nights, then fail 3 times and succeed 4 times. ''Open raid'' should be when someone else in the guild(not you or raid leader) is organising a raid, so peoples know it might be messy when you are not there. Be generous with your ''allies'', it will draw attention and nice recruits to you, it will somewhat piss your guild and they will be better and more effective to not need ''allies'' ASAP.

I wont go into details, this is just a general drawing.

Dekoth · February 2005

Originally posted by Wickes

As people have said, it depends on what you're trying to accomplish. Just having a loose laid-back organization for fun and social isn't very demanding. If you want to raid big time, you need a lot of people and a lot of organizatrion, and the key is WORK ... I mean a lot of it, and let me assure you that it isn't that easy to find people who will work. A lot of people like to "play" officer without getting their hands dirty
I'd have to disagree with Dekoth a bit on the loot system. DKP is certainly one way, and a very good way. But in EQ1 we developed our own system (which I wouldn't even dream of trying to explain). Our guild was a very large semi-hardcore semi-casual raiding guild - sort of a blend between Dekoth's two types - and we wanted a system which favored the hardcore powergamers overall but still allowed the more casual people to grab something uber occasionally (sometimes even be the first to get it), so we had to develop something and we did. It worked very well for years, and is still working well for the people still playing EQ1.
I agree completely with the rest of Dekoth's suggestions.

Agreed, there are other systems that can work, but they need to be estabilished and well thought out before getting implemented. For a guild that is looking to raid top end content the easiest loot system template to use is DKP. Most guild will use this and modify it to their taste. Most of the guilds I have been in while they used dkp, it was modified to fit the guild. But for a large Raid guild, as i said loot councils and random rolling on high demand loot just does not work. Now on the lower demand stuff it can.

Now as to the mention of guild alliances/mergers.

An alliance can be a good thing, but it can have its inherit problems. One of the most successful way's I have seen this done is for each guild to have their estabilished loot system usually dkp, and loot distribution was usually handled via, one raid one guild got first pick of the drops to let their members "bid" on, and the next the other guild got first pick.

Mergers...Simply put Dont. I have been playing games like this and other clan/guild based games for closing in on 10 years, I have seen hundreds of guilds merge...I have seen them all fail. First if you are doing a merger to salvage your guild..its not gonna work. Second if you are absorbing a smaller guild you must estabilish some things first, their members at a minimum must go through a probationary period to see if they fit into the guild just like any other recruit, and the guild being absorbed must understand clearly that some members simply may not make the cut. However to be honest the easiest thing is to simply avoid this as it rarly works without alot of drama which usually only further tears the guild apart.

Zap-Robo · February 2005

All good feedback so far - thanks! Any more, for any more?

Shadus · February 2005

There has to be a tight inner core to the guild to be successful and they have to be pretty hardcore about whatever they are playing.

I've been part of 2 "massive" (250+ and 500+ members) guilds and a few "large" (100-250 members) guilds... there is always an inner core that functions as the mainstay, if they poof, the guild fails. End of story. You can have all or none of the applications, it's all about the people.

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MMO Guilds: What makes them successful?

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MMO Guilds: What makes them successful?

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