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PelagatoPelagato Member UncommonPosts: 671

hey people, i am just wondering why all the flaming against cryptic, care to tell which things u hate about those developers and which ones you like???

I ask because some people is yelling that STO sucks, and when u ask why.. the only answer i see around the net is... OMG is cryptic crap, or cryptic sucks... and so forth...

Anyway care to elaborate at least one answer...

Comments

  • johnmatthaisjohnmatthais Member CommonPosts: 2,663

     You obviously haven't looked very hard. There are plenty of apt reasons for hating Cryptic in both the CO and STO forums here and all over the web, starting with RMTs and advantages for lifetime sub pre-orders, and ending god only knows where.

  • WickedjellyWickedjelly Member Posts: 4,990

    As john alluded to your best bet would be to go to the CO or STO forum to get a feel for what people's issues are with them.  As for myself , I hold nothing against them.  However, I also don't hold much faith in their ability to make an mmorpg worth more than a month or two playtime if that.

    Both games are very light on content and come across extremely generic.  I don't think either game is terrible though.  Kind of a shame with STO though.  With the right backing and some creativity that could have been one hell of a game when you consider all the stories and lore they had to work with.

    I think people are more disappointed in their offerings than anything else.  Plus, some are rather upset that the latest content update that is coming to CO is going to apparently be treated as an expansion that must be purchased considering one of the bigger complaints is the game is lacking in content, which of course between that and other things they have done in CO doesn't give some a lot of faith that things will be any different in STO.

    1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.

    2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.

    3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.

  • AIMonsterAIMonster Member UncommonPosts: 2,059

    1.  They don't listen to their player base... at all.  While most MMO developers for the most part do ignore (and should) their player base the majority of the time, a lot of legitmate concerns completely get ignored by Cryptic.  There was huge complaints about the respecing costs in Champions Online for instance that went unignored by the developers for the first couple months for release, and when they eventually put a fix in it barely helped the situation.  Specs and such went unbalanced for months on end. 

    2.  They release products unfinished.  Again looking at Champions Online - there was a huge patch that made sweeping changes across the board released only a couple of days after the game was released.  This meant that a lot of players who were happily playing with their current builds now how a defunct build with no respec given.  There was also a huge content gap that existed in the game as well as several bugged quests.

    3.  Their greed.  They try to milk players for as much as possible.  Any company that offers a lifetime subscription should be a red flag for some, (almost no MMO gamers will fully take advantage of the price of a lifetime subscription especially with a game lacking as much content as CO, it's simply a bad deal, but a lot of unthinking consumers jump on it.  The same scam is often used for gym memberships - very few will actually take full advantage of one) but the item malls being used for things that should be part of the subscription fee (like respecs and updated content) that are intentionally withheld by Cryptic or made difficult to obtain normally.

    I think that pretty much covers it.  Whether it's warrented or not is up to you decide.  I'd still recommend not buying a Cryptic product when it's released and waiting if possible because they seem to rush out the products and because they tend to make changes on release that may effect your enjoyment to compensate.

  • PelagatoPelagato Member UncommonPosts: 671

    Well I can see those 3 ways of behavior in a lot of mmo developers... example the aion team lol... the game is so unfinished if u ask me... and the devs seems are somewhat deaf... dunno about their greed...

  • WickedjellyWickedjelly Member Posts: 4,990
    Originally posted by Pelu


    Well I can see those 3 ways of behavior in a lot of mmo developers... example the aion team lol... the game is so unfinished if u ask me... and the devs seems are somewhat deaf... dunno about their greed...



     

    Yep, can't argue with that one.  Which really sucks because PvP wise that game is fun as hell.  Too bad you can't level through PvP :/

    The PvE at higher levels leaves a lot to be desired and that is putting it nicely.  Also,  NCSoft seems to be (least when I played )  putting hardly any effort at all into trying to promote community growth or support.

    1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.

    2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.

    3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.

  • PelagatoPelagato Member UncommonPosts: 671

    I got the same itch too...

  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 37,004

    I don't care for games that Cryptic makes.  I played COH and then COV and decided after a couple of months the game play was too shallow and both games were not proper MMO's.

    Nothing since then has convinced me that they do anything different, their last two games including STO are again, shallow and not the virtual worlds that I want to play.

    Hey, lots of people love Cryptic games, but I am definitely not a fan and it was a disappointment when they got the ST IP because I knew what sort of game they'd produce.

    I wasn't wrong.

     

    "See normal people, I'm not one of them" | G-Easy & Big Sean

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    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing FO76 at the moment.

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  • PelagatoPelagato Member UncommonPosts: 671

    is kinda late, but i give more head into this tomorrow ok

  • ReklawReklaw Member UncommonPosts: 6,495
    Originally posted by Pelu


    hey people, i am just wondering why all the flaming against cryptic, care to tell which things u hate about those developers and which ones you like???
    I ask because some people is yelling that STO sucks, and when u ask why.. the only answer i see around the net is... OMG is cryptic crap, or cryptic sucks... and so forth...
    Anyway care to elaborate at least one answer...



     

    I do not hate them, I just never liked how they made MMO's, know plenty of people that do like Cryptics take on MMO's. And as a gamer rather have my fellow gamers to find the game to enjoy regardless my own feelings towards it.

    I love superhero's, ever since I was a kid, went to the movies, collected comics, toy's and what nots, yet when CoH/V was made it didn't excite me, did of course try them but I simple have a very different view on what a superhero MMORPG could be, again doesn't make those games bad as said before know plenty of people who loved it, for me they just far to limited to satisfied my MMORPG needs, I already play tons of other genre of games that are build full of combat and my view on MMORPG is that they should or could be so much more then just a full combat oriented game.

    Star Trek, again something I grew up with, loved the series, yes ALL of them, but already knew when Cryptic got the IP that it wouldn't become the Star Trek MMORPG I would have pictured it to be, so I already knew not to get disappointed by it as I knew Cryptics view on MMO differs from mine.

    You will not hear me say STO sucks as that's for sorry to say "kids" who use words like that, I just say STO isn't a MMO that suites my playstyle I want out of a MMORPG, disappointed? of course cause we all know how deep the IP is and it would be amazing to try and capture that depth into a MMORPG, especially with a IP like Star Trek, but as said not really disappointed with it due to knowing Cryptic.

    But I also know in these day's I am a very niche gamer when it comes to MMORPG, a minority, like for example the masses never could get into a MMO like Star Wars Galaxies (pre-cu) as they in most cases needed to be held by the hand which when the game was released wasn't that way so people complained and complained about the lack of content, while for a MMORPG player like me the game was filled with content, just not the hold your hand type of content, but the life my characters live in the Star Wars universe (gamerswise) way.  So I understand that certain company's want to try and atract the masses, we know many have a very short attention span, so we can't have to much depth in MMORPG targetted at the masses as from experiance I see the masses lack the patience to get really involved with MMORPG, which does not make the masses wrong, but just different in how I like a MMORPG to be, so they make these A-titles as they are made these day's.

    Overall I do hope plenty of people will continue to enjoy STO for what it is, regardless how I or anyone else feels about it.

  • Gabby-airGabby-air Member UncommonPosts: 3,440

    I quite agree with reklaw, i've loved cryptic's work and respect the devs but their games never really grabbed me although after checking out STO i would say i might just play it later on. The real problem and what bothered me about them was the management, lifetime bonuses, pre-order races and all that crap that's thrown at you simply annoys me and it feels like there catering to console players from rmt as in DLC, super instance based and in general never liked management.

  • arcdevilarcdevil Member Posts: 864
    Originally posted by Pelu


    Well I can see those 3 ways of behavior in a lot of mmo developers... example the aion team lol... the game is so unfinished if u ask me... and the devs seems are somewhat deaf... dunno about their greed...

     

    If you think Aion is unfinished (it is), you dont want to be 200ft close to any pc that has STO installed...

  • ScotScot Member LegendaryPosts: 14,147

    Cryptic do seem to have lost their way since CoX. That was a ground breaking game, and still is worth a look if you have not played it. But the passion and creativity then went out of the window. Deciding to do CO was almost saying, “Ok we know how to do a Superhero MMO, lets churn erm out!”. While the conversion of ST to STO has been slapdash at best.

    A company is both a set of individuals and an ethos, if too many go or the ethos changes it becomes a different beast. So past success never assures future success.

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  • tehikktehikk Member Posts: 497

    I've got nothing against Cryptic, I just wish their games offered less instancing and more content.

    If they had those two things, they'd be awesome. :)

    "The question that sometimes drives me hazy: Am I, or the others crazy?" - Albert Einstein

  • DataDayDataDay Member UncommonPosts: 1,538

    Cryptic isnt the same company they used to be. They hired Bill Roper ffs. He is the failure behind Hellgate london and has always wanted to try and force as many money making methods into a game as possible, including RMT plus Subscriptions plus services and expansions all in one. Hes a sick b**tard thats for sure.

  • AxehiltAxehilt Member RarePosts: 10,504

    Cryptic is weird.  In many ways they're the most innovative MMORPG studio around.  Seriously there're so many distinct innovative concepts that've come out of that studio, it's ridiculous.

    Which is why it made no sense that CO failed so abyssmally at being fun.  Even CO has some amazingly innovative features (the Role system is just begging for a better MMORPG to come along and utilize it.)  But the core gameplay is so mucked up by a Soloing focus and the Freeform Advancement system that it was just completely unenjoyable.

    I still have a lot of respect for Cryptic.  They're a studio with a tremendous capacity for innovation.  But CO was such a spectacular failure in my eyes that it's going to be a stretch for me to ever get around to trying STO. 

    "What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver

  • GdemamiGdemami Member EpicPosts: 12,321


    Originally posted by Pelu
    hey people, i am just wondering why all the flaming against cryptic, care to tell which things u hate about those developers and which ones you like???
    I ask because some people is yelling that STO sucks, and when u ask why.. the only answer i see around the net is... OMG is cryptic crap, or cryptic sucks... and so forth...
    Anyway care to elaborate at least one answer...

    They expect a game no one was promising or aiming at even and when it was released, they feel disappointed...and hurt.

    STO is not a bad game, it is just not what some people would like to see as Star Trek IP based game.

  • metatronicmetatronic Member Posts: 329

    Ya its pretty sad what they did to the Star Trek IP.. The game wasn't all that bad.. I preordered it before they announced open beta so I got suckered in.

    The whole "guildwar instance" thing left a sour taste in my mouth, after I puked a little.. The graphics were decent, ran flawlessly on my pc but the game play was very repetitive and boring.

    I think any space mmo coming out now days needs to be setup more like eve online in terms of an open server or what would appear as open and not instanced. I think if they took Eve's world design and kept the sto space combat or maybe tweaked it a bit to make it more complex, they would have a great game. I also find the loot in sto very boring.. and being that theres no crafting system, it doesn't help matters.

    I think companies like this have a very short lifespan. I doubt we will see another game from cryptic. If they do make another one, it will be surprising to see what IP they wreck next but im willing to bet after first month retentions numbers from sto come back to the accounting department at cryptic, there wont be any more 5 million dollar failures in the future.

     

  • MMO_DoubterMMO_Doubter Member Posts: 5,056
    Originally posted by Pelu


    hey people, i am just wondering why all the flaming against cryptic, care to tell which things u hate about those developers and which ones you like???
    I ask because some people is yelling that STO sucks, and when u ask why.. the only answer i see around the net is... OMG is cryptic crap, or cryptic sucks... and so forth...
    Anyway care to elaborate at least one answer...

    You haven't looked very hard, then. Several of us have been quite clear on what we dislike about Cryptic's business practices.

    "" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2

  • tyanyatyanya Member Posts: 199

    I'm not certain Cryptic are getting any more negativity than any other mmo studio....Although prior to CO's release I think they had a lot more support and consideration. Back then they had a few projects under their belt that were notable for breaking with the norm and were 'more than the sum of their parts' by virtue of the interest and enthusiasm put into them. 

    The studios investment and ambition are notable by their absense in their latest games, and the only imagination on display seems to revolve around methods of parting money from the playerbase as quickly as possible. Suddenly all the worse aspects of the corporate monsters of MMO-dom have been paired with the limitations of a small studio without the ability to fill their games with any variety of content is not where anyone wanted to see Cryptic =/

  • PapadamPapadam Member Posts: 2,102

    Well this seems to be the way Atari/Cryptic (Craptari) works

    1. Get a popular IP

    2. Make a MMO as fast and cheap as possible.

    3. Create alot of hype.

    4. Sell as many lifetimesubs and pre-orders  before launch as possible.

    5. Release the shallow, unfinished MMO

    6. Sell items and content with microtransactions ontop of the monthly sub

    7. Ignore the players/fans

     

    If WoW = The Beatles
    and WAR = Led Zeppelin
    Then LotrO = Pink Floyd

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