[quote]Originally posted by Bhazir I don't think you have played a healer ever if I see to your example. And never did PvP in a MMORPG. Mob AI in every game sucks, because it is based on algoritmes and once you know the behaviour of a mob you can predict what it is going to do and you can chainkill them with ease. This isn't any differnte in MMORPGs or FPS. And it takes your brain skills to know how to handle your char good enough. How many groups get wiped because a lousy tank or a healer that don't know who or what to use first and what spell to use for it and runs out of mana to cast. Or uses a healing spell that uses a to long incantation so the target is dead before the spell goes off? I have seen this many many times. A good player depents on the player and not on the char level you have. If you are fighting lower level mobs you have some more space to make some blunders but when fighting higher level mobs the correct timing of you spells/skills is the diference between dead or alive. And FPS is more brainless, just run around and shoot all you see that moves. Except the tactical shooters, but there aren't much good ones.
Because you beat a mob 5 levels over your own level you can't beat a player of your own level in a MMORPG.[/b][/quote]
I agree with you in that there are a ton of bad players out there. And it does take a lil grey matter to learn how to use you char efficiently. Although I think that it dont take THAT much brain power to this.
I have played a rogue, tank, or healer in almost every MMORPG out there. In most cases i dont care how good a player you are a low lvl player will never beat a high lvl one in most PVP MMORPGS. And as I look at the current offering in the genra it seems that these games are getting easier and are being dumbed down for the masses.
As fas as FPS games being brainless...I dont think so. You have to know map layouts, location of power ups, spawn points, choke points, weapon strenghts/ weaknesses, and out manuver/shoot your opponent. Even if someone knows all this stuff there is still a chance that a rookie can beat them.
Originally posted by saeben I feel you dude...im thinkin about quitin eq2. Im gonna go back to fps for awhile. I need a game where it depends on player skill and not on how long one can sit in front of the computer mindlessely pressing buttons for hours on end. I think that is the biggest flaw in MMORPGs these days. The guy that can spend 80hrs a week on the computer is gonna be uber. At least with FPS's and RTS games anyone with some skill can at least compete with they guy doin 80 hrs a week.
Honestly, I strongly recommend you (and anyone else out there who thinks the same way) try Jumpgate. There *is* levelling involved, but not a whole lot. By level 9 you have a PvP capable ship. You can make level 9 in just a few hours of levelling. Up until you get to level 9 the game might be kind of boring (a lot of this depending on what exactly you do to level). But once you get level 9 it really speeds up (you have one of the quickest ships in the game and can do some real damage, whether you kill the AI or start participating in PvP). There are usually battles just about every night, unfortunately, the community is small so it may seem sorta dead at times, but only new players can help that out
Active pilots 15?? There is more players in most normal multiplayer games. Correct if I am wrong and that system status isnt working or I was looking wrong page http://www.jossh.com/terminal_civilian.html and that the game actually have atleast like 500+ online any time.
It is entirely skill based. 500 skills, no classes (except for prestige classes which are optional). Pretty much the same system as UO, each skill advances independantly as you use it. There is no hard cap too, meaning you can always keeps getting your skills up, but it will get slower and slower. Also you can pretty much choose any of the 500 skills in the game, except a few. Some are limited to certain races, and some are limited to the prestige classes, but everything else is free for whoever (as long as you can find someone to teach it to you).
You can build ships, houses, cities, wage wars, it's full PVP.
The only problem is that it's not out yet. It is supposed to come out in 2005 (according to the Razorwax website). So yeah, aside from that it should be perfect for a UO player.
*Signature*The Pessimist says the cup is half empty. The Optimist says the cup is half full. The Pragmatist says the cup is half full of air. The Engineer says the cup is operating at 50% capacity. The Psychologist says the cup is your mother. The Punk Kid also says the cup is your mother. The Cricket Player says his cup is definately full. Everyone knows that Pamela Andersons cups are full. The Defendant says it was like that when he found it. Me, I just ask the waitress for a refill.
Originally posted by saeben I feel you dude...im thinkin about quitin eq2. Im gonna go back to fps for awhile. I need a game where it depends on player skill and not on how long one can sit in front of the computer mindlessely pressing buttons for hours on end. I think that is the biggest flaw in MMORPGs these days. The guy that can spend 80hrs a week on the computer is gonna be uber. At least with FPS's and RTS games anyone with some skill can at least compete with they guy doin 80 hrs a week.
Honestly, I strongly recommend you (and anyone else out there who thinks the same way) try Jumpgate. There *is* levelling involved, but not a whole lot. By level 9 you have a PvP capable ship. You can make level 9 in just a few hours of levelling. Up until you get to level 9 the game might be kind of boring (a lot of this depending on what exactly you do to level). But once you get level 9 it really speeds up (you have one of the quickest ships in the game and can do some real damage, whether you kill the AI or start participating in PvP). There are usually battles just about every night, unfortunately, the community is small so it may seem sorta dead at times, but only new players can help that out
Active pilots 15?? There is more players in most normal multiplayer games. Correct if I am wrong and that system status isnt working or I was looking wrong page http://www.jossh.com/terminal_civilian.html and that the game actually have atleast like 500+ online any time.
I said the community was really, really small right now. It's an old, old game that never had any real marketing done because 3DO screwed NetDevil over shortly before they went bankrupt. Since then the game has had no publisher and the only reason NetDevil was able to stay alive is by pulling almost all of it's resources out of Jumpgate (I say almost all because there is still a dev working on updates, we get about one per month), to start on Auto Assault. They happened to do this when they were working on the big expansion for Jumpgate, this caused all sorts of delays and months went by without patches so a lot of people quit. When the expansion finally released, it was pretty bad because it was incomplete (not enough people working on it). Most of that has been fixed at this point, though some of the stuff hasn't been put into the game yet, it's being worked on and other changes/fixes/additions have also been done that weren't part of the expansion.
We get around 40-50 on at night now and it's been climbing fairly steadily. And even though it's kind of empty, if you join one of the big squads you can generally have a lot of fun any night, whether you like PvPing or otherwise.
Suprising that they even keep it up, since doubt they make much profit. Actually they shouldnt even charge players for it and maybe it would get more players. Not like they would lose much profit.
[quote]Originally posted by WizardFriend [b]I'll check out Saga of Ryzom and Eve sounds cool, but I really enjoy fantasy more so I probably won't do that.[/quote]
I thought I liked fantasy, too. Then I started playing EVE.
Anyone who's pvp'd in Ultima online will never be satisfied with anyother system (there might be one or two exceptions, but its true). I dont kow why, maybe its the 2d interface which requires alot of player skill to manage (movement is very fast - and sometimes duels on mounts can be really entertaining). Of course uo has its flaws ... especially since aos.
Nobody has pointed out the obvious - UO is still out there and going strong. If you liked it quite a bit when you played it last time, it might be worth giving it another look, as it's as strong now as it's ever been.
hehe, uo is so addictive and awsome that i had to force myself not to play... was affecting my studies.
since then, made a promise to my gf i wouldnt go back to uo for quite some times - she was getting jealous of the amount of time i spent in uo, imagine that.
oh i'd love to go back to uo... just... after im done with some rl business... else it would never get done
Surely you have to go with Mourning (and maybe Dark and Light although not 100% clear on how complex the skill system in DnL is).
Mourning has a pure skill based system which also throws in things like a weapon having different methods of attack which use different skills. ie a sword can be used for a hack attack (which might use strength and agility) or slash attack (that uses focus and something - let's say). Plus i think there are things like stances that add further variables. Magic combat also has these additional variables.
Add in full PvP and the bloodlines system and i think this gives you the flexibility you are looking for.
Anyone know about the skill system in DnL in detail?
DnL will be a skill-tree system, with classes. (they are splitting these classes in an 'innovative way' whatever that means) you gain a level, you get points to spend on abilities in certain skill trees. same old same old in that respect.
A) deides is completely right UO rocked and my standards are probably ridiculously high for playing such a great game. I just got sick of it wiht all the expansions. They should of just stuck to what they were doing and maybe created a new game with ENTIRELY 3d graphics. I liked the 2d graphics though. It gave it a very unique atmosphere.
I tried Saga of Ryzom, it has a skill-tree system and each skill has "levels", it would of been good, but i thought the races were a little cooky, and it wasnt exactly classic fantasy(ive been playing DnD since just before 3.0 came out and my version of fantasy is like inbetween midieval and rennaisance with magic and dragons)
I'm going to look into these. I've also considered going back to UO, im waiting for my old guildies to respond to me and tell me how its going. (i only recognize a couple of members though, others quit i guess) Dark and Light doesn't sound like the game for me. Thanks all for posting, ill keep checking for more input if anyone has it. Thankyou
I looked into mourning yesterday..it looks good. The way PVP and skills are handled is pretty cool. I like that there is permadeath in the game, but you can continue through your bloodline (passing skills and items down) and its not supposed to take too long to get back to the power your last char had.
I looked in to darkfall and sounds more like the game I want if it turns out that way. I'll probably explore these two further or get sucked back into UO... one of the two.
Originally posted by leipuri Suprising that they even keep it up, since doubt they make much profit. Actually they shouldnt even charge players for it and maybe it would get more players. Not like they would lose much profit.
They keep it up merely because they love their game so much and though they might be losing money on it (no one other than NetDevil and Mightygames really know what kind of a contract they have, they could be making enough money from the MG contract that losses on the US server don't matter, I certainly have no idea), they don't want to see it die.
Originally posted by WizardFriend Hi. This is my first post on these forums. I started playing UO about 6 years ago. I initially played on player run shards until I was able to get an account. I really liked UO, it was my first MMORPG. I had to quit though because of a long list of stacking complaints. I went on MMO-less for awhile, i think a year. Then I followed one of my friends who has been playing EQ since it came out onto EQII. It was okay for a couple of months(in other words it has become old recently). I still have an account, but find that it is somewhat boring. I dont have time ot play always so my firends get more and more powerful and Im stuck at low levels. Does anyone know of any good skill-based games out there?
I do not know if it was already mentioned, but the game you are looking for is Star Wars Galaxies. It unofficially is UO2. UO and SWG were designed by the exact same people. In fact one guy (Sunsword in the old SWG forums) went from UO to SWG, and back to UO. SWG is a 100% skill based game. As long as you play SWG with the intention of NOT trying to become a Jedi, then the game is very NICE and fun.
Comments
DARK AND LIGHT
should be out in coming months, for me the best game ever.
-Wizardly Friend
[quote]Originally posted by Bhazir
I don't think you have played a healer ever if I see to your example. And never did PvP in a MMORPG. Mob AI in every game sucks, because it is based on algoritmes and once you know the behaviour of a mob you can predict what it is going to do and you can chainkill them with ease. This isn't any differnte in MMORPGs or FPS. And it takes your brain skills to know how to handle your char good enough. How many groups get wiped because a lousy tank or a healer that don't know who or what to use first and what spell to use for it and runs out of mana to cast. Or uses a healing spell that uses a to long incantation so the target is dead before the spell goes off? I have seen this many many times. A good player depents on the player and not on the char level you have. If you are fighting lower level mobs you have some more space to make some blunders but when fighting higher level mobs the correct timing of you spells/skills is the diference between dead or alive. And FPS is more brainless, just run around and shoot all you see that moves. Except the tactical shooters, but there aren't much good ones.
Because you beat a mob 5 levels over your own level you can't beat a player of your own level in a MMORPG.[/b][/quote]
I agree with you in that there are a ton of bad players out there. And it does take a lil grey matter to learn how to use you char efficiently. Although I think that it dont take THAT much brain power to this.
I have played a rogue, tank, or healer in almost every MMORPG out there. In most cases i dont care how good a player you are a low lvl player will never beat a high lvl one in most PVP MMORPGS. And as I look at the current offering in the genra it seems that these games are getting easier and are being dumbed down for the masses.
As fas as FPS games being brainless...I dont think so. You have to know map layouts, location of power ups, spawn points, choke points, weapon strenghts/ weaknesses, and out manuver/shoot your opponent. Even if someone knows all this stuff there is still a chance that a rookie can beat them.
Honestly, I strongly recommend you (and anyone else out there who thinks the same way) try Jumpgate. There *is* levelling involved, but not a whole lot. By level 9 you have a PvP capable ship. You can make level 9 in just a few hours of levelling. Up until you get to level 9 the game might be kind of boring (a lot of this depending on what exactly you do to level). But once you get level 9 it really speeds up (you have one of the quickest ships in the game and can do some real damage, whether you kill the AI or start participating in PvP). There are usually battles just about every night, unfortunately, the community is small so it may seem sorta dead at times, but only new players can help that out
Almost forgot to provide links.
www.jossh.com
www.themis-group.com/jg
Just checked that page and found
as of 2005.2.3.3:23.6
Active pilots 15??
There is more players in most normal multiplayer games. Correct if I am wrong and that system status isnt working or I was looking wrong page http://www.jossh.com/terminal_civilian.html and that the game actually have atleast like 500+ online any time.
Why has noone mentioned Darkfall?
It is entirely skill based. 500 skills, no classes (except for prestige classes which are optional). Pretty much the same system as UO, each skill advances independantly as you use it. There is no hard cap too, meaning you can always keeps getting your skills up, but it will get slower and slower. Also you can pretty much choose any of the 500 skills in the game, except a few. Some are limited to certain races, and some are limited to the prestige classes, but everything else is free for whoever (as long as you can find someone to teach it to you).
You can build ships, houses, cities, wage wars, it's full PVP.
The only problem is that it's not out yet. It is supposed to come out in 2005 (according to the Razorwax website). So yeah, aside from that it should be perfect for a UO player.
*Signature*The Pessimist says the cup is half empty. The Optimist says the cup is half full. The Pragmatist says the cup is half full of air. The Engineer says the cup is operating at 50% capacity. The Psychologist says the cup is your mother. The Punk Kid also says the cup is your mother. The Cricket Player says his cup is definately full. Everyone knows that Pamela Andersons cups are full. The Defendant says it was like that when he found it. Me, I just ask the waitress for a refill.
www.atriarch.com
Type Seed Game into your search engine. Go to the game's website and learn about it. It may be the best game you've continued to ignore.
Honestly, I strongly recommend you (and anyone else out there who thinks the same way) try Jumpgate. There *is* levelling involved, but not a whole lot. By level 9 you have a PvP capable ship. You can make level 9 in just a few hours of levelling. Up until you get to level 9 the game might be kind of boring (a lot of this depending on what exactly you do to level). But once you get level 9 it really speeds up (you have one of the quickest ships in the game and can do some real damage, whether you kill the AI or start participating in PvP). There are usually battles just about every night, unfortunately, the community is small so it may seem sorta dead at times, but only new players can help that out
Almost forgot to provide links.
www.jossh.com
www.themis-group.com/jg
Just checked that page and found
as of 2005.2.3.3:23.6
Active pilots 15??
There is more players in most normal multiplayer games. Correct if I am wrong and that system status isnt working or I was looking wrong page http://www.jossh.com/terminal_civilian.html and that the game actually have atleast like 500+ online any time.
I said the community was really, really small right now. It's an old, old game that never had any real marketing done because 3DO screwed NetDevil over shortly before they went bankrupt. Since then the game has had no publisher and the only reason NetDevil was able to stay alive is by pulling almost all of it's resources out of Jumpgate (I say almost all because there is still a dev working on updates, we get about one per month), to start on Auto Assault. They happened to do this when they were working on the big expansion for Jumpgate, this caused all sorts of delays and months went by without patches so a lot of people quit. When the expansion finally released, it was pretty bad because it was incomplete (not enough people working on it). Most of that has been fixed at this point, though some of the stuff hasn't been put into the game yet, it's being worked on and other changes/fixes/additions have also been done that weren't part of the expansion.
We get around 40-50 on at night now and it's been climbing fairly steadily. And even though it's kind of empty, if you join one of the big squads you can generally have a lot of fun any night, whether you like PvPing or otherwise.
[quote]Originally posted by WizardFriend
[b]I'll check out Saga of Ryzom and Eve sounds cool, but I really enjoy fantasy more so I probably won't do that.[/quote]
I thought I liked fantasy, too. Then I started playing EVE.
Anyone who's pvp'd in Ultima online will never be satisfied with anyother system (there might be one or two exceptions, but its true). I dont kow why, maybe its the 2d interface which requires alot of player skill to manage (movement is very fast - and sometimes duels on mounts can be really entertaining). Of course uo has its flaws ... especially since aos.
hehe, uo is so addictive and awsome that i had to force myself not to play... was affecting my studies.
since then, made a promise to my gf i wouldnt go back to uo for quite some times - she was getting jealous of the amount of time i spent in uo, imagine that.
oh i'd love to go back to uo... just... after im done with some rl business... else it would never get done
Surely you have to go with Mourning (and maybe Dark and Light although not 100% clear on how complex the skill system in DnL is).
Mourning has a pure skill based system which also throws in things like a weapon having different methods of attack which use different skills. ie a sword can be used for a hack attack (which might use strength and agility) or slash attack (that uses focus and something - let's say). Plus i think there are things like stances that add further variables. Magic combat also has these additional variables.
Add in full PvP and the bloodlines system and i think this gives you the flexibility you are looking for.
Anyone know about the skill system in DnL in detail?
DnL will be a skill-tree system, with classes. (they are splitting these classes in an 'innovative way' whatever that means) you gain a level, you get points to spend on abilities in certain skill trees. same old same old in that respect.
sadly enough.
A) deides is completely right UO rocked and my standards are probably ridiculously high for playing such a great game. I just got sick of it wiht all the expansions. They should of just stuck to what they were doing and maybe created a new game with ENTIRELY 3d graphics. I liked the 2d graphics though. It gave it a very unique atmosphere.
I tried Saga of Ryzom, it has a skill-tree system and each skill has "levels", it would of been good, but i thought the races were a little cooky, and it wasnt exactly classic fantasy(ive been playing DnD since just before 3.0 came out and my version of fantasy is like inbetween midieval and rennaisance with magic and dragons)
Darkfall sounds good
www.atriarch.com ? what is this?
Mourning, could a get a description if possible
I'm going to look into these. I've also considered going back to UO, im waiting for my old guildies to respond to me and tell me how its going. (i only recognize a couple of members though, others quit i guess) Dark and Light doesn't sound like the game for me. Thanks all for posting, ill keep checking for more input if anyone has it. Thankyou
-Wizardly Friend
I looked into mourning yesterday..it looks good. The way PVP and skills are handled is pretty cool. I like that there is permadeath in the game, but you can continue through your bloodline (passing skills and items down) and its not supposed to take too long to get back to the power your last char had.
-Wizardly Friend
-In memory of Laura "Taera" Genender. Passed away on Aug/13/08-
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