Again, this brings me back to something that is REALLY bugging the hell outta me...how did SoE land the DC License? Does DC have any idea who they've hired? Sadly, practices like this are not uncommon for SoE and this is not an isolated incident. SoE has an established pattern and has a known MMO reputation of being a deceitful company...who in their right mind would hire SoE to do **edit**?! It's like none of the decision makers know d!ck about gaming, so they trust and listen to Smed. What a buncha nerds :P
SOE wrote a big check (and agreed to take over MxO and keep it around for a certain amount of tim, which ran out recently) and Warner Bros. cashed it. Warner doesn't care about their IPs to any great extent, and they are even less concerned with their comic book IPs. Look into the production history of the last Superman film (one of the least stupid of the bad ideas approved was offering Will Smith the Superman role, and he turned it down for the obvious reason). For the most part, the only reason some of the DC Comics cartoons, live action shows, and films have been respectful to the IPs to any extent is because the people behind the production of them had respect for the IPs (usually due to some of the older comic writers being involved with the production).
Given its development history and the revolving door of development leadership, DCO has little to no chance of even being 'not that bad'. If it flops and tarnished the reputation of the DC Comics IPs, SOE can just write another check and have a very good chance of developing DCO 2.
"...we're not going to sit here and just watch this game be run down into the ground because of these decisions..."
Unfortunetly, yes they will.
Then, after a few years, they will wonder why everyone else left, then tell them to 'get over it' when the ones that left explain why. There is one major thing SWG, EQ2, and Vanguard have in common. Someone will make a post on a forum asking why more people don't play the game, they then make angry responses to the posts from people explaining why they don't play the game.
Then, after a few years, they will wonder why everyone else left, then tell them to 'get over it' when the ones that left explain why. There is one major thing SWG, EQ2, and Vanguard have in common. Someone will make a post on a forum asking why more people don't play the game, they then make angry responses to the posts from people explaining why they don't play the game.
Hmmm...where have I seen that before? :P lol
And a great reply on DCUO. Interesting theory too...I guess with the comic book market tanked, DC needs to do something for $. Just a shame seeing good names wh0red out for fast ca$h.
This is scary! I haven't been on this site in so long I can't remember. I still get e-mails and such but it has been a while since I have been here. It's kind of like watch a day time soap, you can just pop in after a couple years and the story line hasn't changed. But in this case it's even the same characters. I have missed you guys posting. There was that whole other site that was started so no one had to post here and such.
I think people like the ones that post here was a lot of the reason I played the game. And I actually think that many of us rather we want to admit it or not would go back if they gave us pre-nge and even more for pre-cu.
As much as I hate to admit it I play WoW these days. I tried Eve and really liked it but I had no friends there and it was a big galaxy to fly around by your self. So I kind of settled into WOW. Well I was reading the only forum that I can get at work the other day and some was complaining about all the idoits in trade channel. Now keep in mind that I honestly have thought of SWG for what seems like years, and when I saw the post about trade the first thing to pop into my mind was we had our on server specific trade forum. That still amazes me. SWG was more than just a game it was another world that you could go to.
It was truely fun to sit out side the starport in theed spamming training 4421 scout for AP. I know that's sad but I enjoyed that kind of stuff. Any way it's good to log in here and see all the old friends long gone. Guys I'm proud to say that I would send my $15 a month to smedley himself if I could have the game back. Looking forward to the Old Republic and I think that it will be a good game, but I take my scout blaster and what ever type of survey device I need to plant my harvesters and run around Rori looking for avian meat or some quality tatooine wooly hide any day.
sorry for all the mistakes but I'm not real smart.
Disclaimer: I do not work for SoE, nor have I ever, nor will I ever. I once was part of a player volunteer program that SoE ran but that was about it, I have no say in what SoE does. With that out of the way, I thought it would be interesting to discuss how SoE could go about Origin/Classic SWG Servers, if they ever had the time, resources and inclination to bring them up. I discussed this with SWG Developers long ago and they seemed keen on the idea, but the live game always takes presedence so this was always a pipe-dream. It's fun to talk about dreams though, so what would you like to see in the way of Origin/Classic SWG Servers? They would likely be brought up as part of the Test Center servers and receive only maintenance updates, no additional content. Which patch level would you want to play, if at all? Patch Level Pre-CU: Pre-publish 9 Pre-CU: (Literally just before the Combat Upgrade) CU: Just before the NGE.
I usualy hate every SOE loving word you write, so much, that it makes me vomit a little bit into my mouth.
This was the first post of yours in 4 years that hasn't invoked that reaction.
I still don't believe that you are not, or have not been an employee of SOE. You really aren't fooling anyone.
However in answer, I'd want to play Pre-Pub 9 Pre-CU. And if you can have a word with some of your work colleagues and make that happen, I would be grateful.
Disclaimer: I do not work for SoE, nor have I ever, nor will I ever. I once was part of a player volunteer program that SoE ran but that was about it, I have no say in what SoE does. With that out of the way, I thought it would be interesting to discuss how SoE could go about Origin/Classic SWG Servers, if they ever had the time, resources and inclination to bring them up. I discussed this with SWG Developers long ago and they seemed keen on the idea, but the live game always takes presedence so this was always a pipe-dream. It's fun to talk about dreams though, so what would you like to see in the way of Origin/Classic SWG Servers? They would likely be brought up as part of the Test Center servers and receive only maintenance updates, no additional content. Which patch level would you want to play, if at all? Patch Level Pre-CU: Pre-publish 9 Pre-CU: (Literally just before the Combat Upgrade) CU: Just before the NGE.
I usualy hate every SOE loving word you write, so much, that it makes me vomit a little bit into my mouth.
This was the first post of yours in 4 years that hasn't invoked that reaction.
I still don't believe that you are not, or have not been an employee of SOE. You really aren't fooling anyone.
However in answer, I'd want to play Pre-Pub 9 Pre-CU. And if you can have a word with some of your work colleagues and make that happen, I would be grateful.
Hehe, he doesnt work for SOE, and I would be extremely suprised if they could, do they have images of the old servers still? I have never over the years ever heard a Dev admit thiers more than a publish to publish back up. And if thier isnt, they dont have the resources, IE any Devs that could actually work on the coding. The guy that made all the changes killed himself, so who would know how to reverse all the changes done to the live game?
I would love to see SOE implement classic SWG Servers, as a matter of fact if they just had a single server it could be very successful. Large pop, old school mechanics, etc... seems like a win win to me.
I wish they would consider this seriously, it could make a monumental difference in reviving the game.
I wish they would consider this seriously, it could make a monumental difference in reviving the game.
Not sure it would revive the game to anywhere near pre-NGE levels, but the server(s) would be full, that's a given.
What it certainly would do though, is go a long way towards helping SOE gawd awful reputation.
The most baffling thing about SOE is the fact that they know they have a horrible reputation, yet they go out of their way to maintain it by continuing to do the things that earned them their reputation. When the president of the company feels the need to assure potential customers, of a game SOE was publishing (Vanguard), that his company would have absolutely nothing to do with the games development, it is obvious that he knows his company has a poor reputation.
Think about that, John Smedley promoted the fact that his company was not going to be involved in the development of Vanguard as a selling point for the game. Since then, there has been no attempts to do anything to improve the company's reputation. In fact, they have done plenty to further cement the company's reputation. It makes no sense.
The most baffling thing about SOE is the fact that they know they have a horrible reputation, yet they go out of their way to maintain it by continuing to do the things that earned them their reputation. When the president of the company feels the need to assure potential customers, of a game SOE was publishing (Vanguard), that his company would have absolutely nothing to do with the games development, it is obvious that he knows his company has a poor reputation. Think about that, John Smedley promoted the fact that his company was not going to be involved in the development of Vanguard as a selling point for the game. Since then, there has been no attempts to do anything to improve the company's reputation. In fact, they have done plenty to further cement the company's reputation. It makes no sense.
It's amazing how Smedley still has a job there. I mean he must just be the greatest brown noser of all time. How much more fail does it take?
Vanguard wasn't the only game that soe had to give a press release that they were hands off on development. The day pirates of the burning sea announced it was partnering with soe, they had to put up a giant FAQ and seperate discussion forum in an attempt to calm down player fears that soe was going to have anything to do with the games development.
The same thing happened when gods and heroes partnered with soe.
Every time soe partners with someone, both companies have to immediately go into damage control, which speaks volumes about the reputation soe has.
To be honest I have to agree with the main sentiment in the thread. If SOE REALLY wanted to save the game then they should have done this years ago. Instead they stubbornly held onto the idea that the NGE was a good idea and that somehow it is what the community wanted even as people left in droves. SOE burned pretty much all of their bridges as they tried to shove the NGE down everybody's throat. And not only did they burn all their bridges they hurled insults and raped and pillaged their entire way along that road.
It is, as has been said, too little too late. There was a _massive_ community outcry even back during the CU to stop all the changes, that it was all too much too fast and it was going in the wrong direction. SOE outright IGNORED the community and instead of giving the players what THEY wanted SOE did what -SOE- wanted...which was a very thinly veiled attempt to WoW-ify their game. Which they failed at even doing that I might add.
Instead of fixing bugs, tweaking classes and adding content somehow the folks at SOE thought it would be a brilliant idea to shove out both the CU and NGE within a three month span. Introducing way more bugs without fixing many of the old ones, pissing off the community by COMPLETELY destroying the well received skill-based "leveling" and altogether just destroying the original concept of SWG. On top of all that they still haven't really recovered as far as actually smoothing out the game goes.
There are a LOT of things SOE is going to have to do to get back all of the trust they have lost; not just from the NGE. Lists are fun:
The RMT system for station has got to go.
The TCG for SWG has to go and NEVER come back for another game. WoW has done something similar, but the way the two things are handled are COMPLETELY different. The SWG TCG often introduces items that are not available in-game and that are actually needed for crafting classes. WoW is not only an actual print card game, but all of the loot cards are purely cosmetic stuff that have zero impact on the game itself.
Smed needs to be fired. There is no way around that. Too many people hate him and will never touch another SOE product specifically because of him.
SWG needs to be shut down. I can't imagine that the way the game is running now is producing a real profit for SOE and all it is is just a bad reminder to players about how much SOE screwed up.
Vanguard wasn't the only game that soe had to give a press release that they were hands off on development. The day pirates of the burning sea announced it was partnering with soe, they had to put up a giant FAQ and seperate discussion forum in an attempt to calm down player fears that soe was going to have anything to do with the games development. The same thing happened when gods and heroes partnered with soe.
Every time soe partners with someone, both companies have to immediately go into damage control, which speaks volumes about the reputation soe has.
I remember it was also a part of the Vanguard FAQ's. I wish I took a screenshot of it at the time because I thought it was funny as hell that it needed to be addressed in this way.
Vanguard wasn't the only game that soe had to give a press release that they were hands off on development. The day pirates of the burning sea announced it was partnering with soe, they had to put up a giant FAQ and seperate discussion forum in an attempt to calm down player fears that soe was going to have anything to do with the games development. The same thing happened when gods and heroes partnered with soe.
Every time soe partners with someone, both companies have to immediately go into damage control, which speaks volumes about the reputation soe has.
I remember it was also a part of the Vanguard FAQ's. I wish I took a screenshot of it at the time because I thought it was funny as hell that it needed to be addressed in this way.
Which is why I ultimately find it astounding that there are no Classic Servers. Yes, it's true, there is a cost involved in the technical aspects of running an MMO. And it's true that they might not get that money back in subscription revenue from the Classic Servers (although it's doubtful they would not be profitable). But it blows my mind that they can't see that implementing a Classic Server would actually pay back ten fold in other games in the future. They think they've only alienated 200k people via the NGE, but the number is probably pretty staggering when you think about how many people those 200k have told about SOE's evils. I alone have probably steered over 15 people (in person) away from SOE products.
An apology, and a Classic Server would make me rethink my stance.
Vanguard wasn't the only game that soe had to give a press release that they were hands off on development. The day pirates of the burning sea announced it was partnering with soe, they had to put up a giant FAQ and seperate discussion forum in an attempt to calm down player fears that soe was going to have anything to do with the games development. The same thing happened when gods and heroes partnered with soe.
Every time soe partners with someone, both companies have to immediately go into damage control, which speaks volumes about the reputation soe has.
I remember it was also a part of the Vanguard FAQ's. I wish I took a screenshot of it at the time because I thought it was funny as hell that it needed to be addressed in this way.
Which is why I ultimately find it astounding that there are no Classic Servers. Yes, it's true, there is a cost involved in the technical aspects of running an MMO. And it's true that they might not get that money back in subscription revenue from the Classic Servers (although it's doubtful they would not be profitable). But it blows my mind that they can't see that implementing a Classic Server would actually pay back ten fold in other games in the future. They think they've only alienated 200k people via the NGE, but the number is probably pretty staggering when you think about how many people those 200k have told about SOE's evils. I alone have probably steered over 15 people (in person) away from SOE products.
An apology, and a Classic Server would make me rethink my stance.
The thing is, with Vanguard it was pissed off former EQ players. SOE has tried to make nice with those folks by offering them something closer to what they want than what the current version of EQ is, with the progression servers. They also tease offering classic vanilla EQ servers, but they have yet to go through with that.
Vanguard wasn't the only game that soe had to give a press release that they were hands off on development. The day pirates of the burning sea announced it was partnering with soe, they had to put up a giant FAQ and seperate discussion forum in an attempt to calm down player fears that soe was going to have anything to do with the games development. The same thing happened when gods and heroes partnered with soe.
Every time soe partners with someone, both companies have to immediately go into damage control, which speaks volumes about the reputation soe has.
With PotBS, it was the folks at Flying Labs that pushed SOE's non involvement, not the Smed. It was also the head of Flying Labs that kept claiming SOE had changed and we should buy his game to reward SOE for being good and wonderful now. The only thing he could point to as an example of SOE changing into a good and wonderful company is that they were publishing his game.
The Vanguard announcement had the Smed himself touted the fact that his company would have nothing to do with the game's development as a selling point on the pre-beta Sigil boards. The Smed later promised to not make any major changes to the core mechanics of Vanguard, since he had learned his lesson with the failure of the NGE. He outright lied both times, as SOE employees were working on Vanguard prior to release, and Vanguard has been changed to be much closer to WoW in gameplay. I still find it funny that the Smed claimed the reason SOE was interested in buying Vanguard was because SOE lacked a 'hardcore' game in their lineup, and almost instantly after buying Vanguard they set about making it more like WoW (faster level progression, making sure the player knows where to go next, etc.).
I haven't found a replacement yet that appeals to me in the ways SWG did the first year that I played it. At this point, I'd go back to paying for both of my Pre-CU accounts regardless of whether it was SOE that put up classic servers or if it takes a flightless bird to do the job. Winner gets my $30/month bounty (and I'm ppretty sure it will be going to the right place).
Badger, did you ever bring this up with anyone at SOE? If you did, did you get any kind of response negative or positive?
I simply can't understand why they will not put up a server or two with classic pre-cu, it will fill a niche so needed in the market. I realistically see it having a loyal fan base of 25k-50k players. That's not very impressive true but it's $400k - $750k a month for something that is already there with minimal support needed.
Anyways, give us some feedback if you have any, even if it's negative.
I'd play any classic version. My favorite period was the post-CU where battle fatigue, dancer and doctor buffs were still present, not exactly sure if that was still present after patch 9 or not.
Remove Jedi from the game, and I'll never have a need to look for anything else MMO-wise. I know that's the supremely "iconic" class, but the alpha class nature caused a lot of unbalancing. I wouldn't even care if I had to start from scratch again.
For this to be a success though, I'm pretty sure you'd have to keep SoE, or the SoE name as far away from it as possible...just too much bad blood there, and "once bitten, twice shy" as they say.
If the developers still have access to the old code, why not re-vamp it and put it out as a new game? The foundation for a great game is there already. Change some names around, update the graphics, fix some of the early bugs and push it out. It won't be "Star Wars" but it would be one hell of a Sci-Fi MMO. They would even have enough latitude to actually implement a faction-based PvP (aka. Galactic civil war) in a meaningful way without running afoul of lore constraints.
I didn't like the GCW revamp - Bria became swamped with bases. Noone could be bothered destroying the non-PVP bases so people stopped caring about the PVP ones too - defending/attacking PVP bases was a ritual until then. It was also ridiculous that you couldn't intervene as an overt against some non-PVPer killing your NPCs. If they didn't want to risk being killed they should have done it in the middle of nowhere, not in the middle of Theed.
I didn't like levels
I've no idea what patch number would be best given the above, but I'd be happy to play anything upto NGE anyway.
Badger, did you ever bring this up with anyone at SOE? If you did, did you get any kind of response negative or positive? I simply can't understand why they will not put up a server or two with classic pre-cu, it will fill a niche so needed in the market. I realistically see it having a loyal fan base of 25k-50k players. That's not very impressive true but it's $400k - $750k a month for something that is already there with minimal support needed. Anyways, give us some feedback if you have any, even if it's negative.
Love to know also if theres been anymore said about this. Is there still a dev interested in doing this or has the idea totally been blown off. Any news is better then none.
Even if they brought back Pre-CU today, the player base would not be there like it was. People are bitter from the SOE betrayal and won't trust them again. The community is what made Pre-CU great.
Even if they brought back Pre-CU today, the player base would not be there like it was. People are bitter from the SOE betrayal and won't trust them again. The community is what made Pre-CU great.
I don't disagree with you, it would never see roughly 300k players again. But 25k - 50k is very probable just because there isn't a game out there right now that feels the niche that pre-cu does.
Even if they brought back Pre-CU today, the player base would not be there like it was. People are bitter from the SOE betrayal and won't trust them again. The community is what made Pre-CU great.
I don't disagree with you, it would never see roughly 300k players again. But 25k - 50k is very probable just because there isn't a game out there right now that feels the niche that pre-cu does.
As far as concurrent players, I think you guys are definitely right. But I would venture a guess that with that amount of controversy the NGE has amassed, the opening numbers for a Pre-CU server(s) would actually be quite staggering for a short burst of time. Enough to recoup any costs involved in getting them up and running... and then some.
Comments
SOE wrote a big check (and agreed to take over MxO and keep it around for a certain amount of tim, which ran out recently) and Warner Bros. cashed it. Warner doesn't care about their IPs to any great extent, and they are even less concerned with their comic book IPs. Look into the production history of the last Superman film (one of the least stupid of the bad ideas approved was offering Will Smith the Superman role, and he turned it down for the obvious reason). For the most part, the only reason some of the DC Comics cartoons, live action shows, and films have been respectful to the IPs to any extent is because the people behind the production of them had respect for the IPs (usually due to some of the older comic writers being involved with the production).
Given its development history and the revolving door of development leadership, DCO has little to no chance of even being 'not that bad'. If it flops and tarnished the reputation of the DC Comics IPs, SOE can just write another check and have a very good chance of developing DCO 2.
Unfortunetly, yes they will.
Then, after a few years, they will wonder why everyone else left, then tell them to 'get over it' when the ones that left explain why. There is one major thing SWG, EQ2, and Vanguard have in common. Someone will make a post on a forum asking why more people don't play the game, they then make angry responses to the posts from people explaining why they don't play the game.
Hmmm...where have I seen that before? :P lol
And a great reply on DCUO. Interesting theory too...I guess with the comic book market tanked, DC needs to do something for $. Just a shame seeing good names wh0red out for fast ca$h.
This is scary! I haven't been on this site in so long I can't remember. I still get e-mails and such but it has been a while since I have been here. It's kind of like watch a day time soap, you can just pop in after a couple years and the story line hasn't changed. But in this case it's even the same characters. I have missed you guys posting. There was that whole other site that was started so no one had to post here and such.
I think people like the ones that post here was a lot of the reason I played the game. And I actually think that many of us rather we want to admit it or not would go back if they gave us pre-nge and even more for pre-cu.
As much as I hate to admit it I play WoW these days. I tried Eve and really liked it but I had no friends there and it was a big galaxy to fly around by your self. So I kind of settled into WOW. Well I was reading the only forum that I can get at work the other day and some was complaining about all the idoits in trade channel. Now keep in mind that I honestly have thought of SWG for what seems like years, and when I saw the post about trade the first thing to pop into my mind was we had our on server specific trade forum. That still amazes me. SWG was more than just a game it was another world that you could go to.
It was truely fun to sit out side the starport in theed spamming training 4421 scout for AP. I know that's sad but I enjoyed that kind of stuff. Any way it's good to log in here and see all the old friends long gone. Guys I'm proud to say that I would send my $15 a month to smedley himself if I could have the game back. Looking forward to the Old Republic and I think that it will be a good game, but I take my scout blaster and what ever type of survey device I need to plant my harvesters and run around Rori looking for avian meat or some quality tatooine wooly hide any day.
sorry for all the mistakes but I'm not real smart.
I don't claim to be right, I'm just posting.
There would be a lot of preconditions for this to be possible.
One, and this is non-negotiable, is the head of John Smedley on a platter.
CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.
Once a denizen of Ahazi
I usualy hate every SOE loving word you write, so much, that it makes me vomit a little bit into my mouth.
This was the first post of yours in 4 years that hasn't invoked that reaction.
I still don't believe that you are not, or have not been an employee of SOE. You really aren't fooling anyone.
However in answer, I'd want to play Pre-Pub 9 Pre-CU. And if you can have a word with some of your work colleagues
and make that happen, I would be grateful.
I usualy hate every SOE loving word you write, so much, that it makes me vomit a little bit into my mouth.
This was the first post of yours in 4 years that hasn't invoked that reaction.
I still don't believe that you are not, or have not been an employee of SOE. You really aren't fooling anyone.
However in answer, I'd want to play Pre-Pub 9 Pre-CU. And if you can have a word with some of your work colleagues
and make that happen, I would be grateful.
Hehe, he doesnt work for SOE, and I would be extremely suprised if they could, do they have images of the old servers still? I have never over the years ever heard a Dev admit thiers more than a publish to publish back up. And if thier isnt, they dont have the resources, IE any Devs that could actually work on the coding. The guy that made all the changes killed himself, so who would know how to reverse all the changes done to the live game?
Pre Pub 9 would be awesome imo.
I would love to see SOE implement classic SWG Servers, as a matter of fact if they just had a single server it could be very successful. Large pop, old school mechanics, etc... seems like a win win to me.
I wish they would consider this seriously, it could make a monumental difference in reviving the game.
Not sure it would revive the game to anywhere near pre-NGE levels, but the server(s) would be full, that's a given.
What it certainly would do though, is go a long way towards helping SOE gawd awful reputation.
Not sure it would revive the game to anywhere near pre-NGE levels, but the server(s) would be full, that's a given.
What it certainly would do though, is go a long way towards helping SOE gawd awful reputation.
The most baffling thing about SOE is the fact that they know they have a horrible reputation, yet they go out of their way to maintain it by continuing to do the things that earned them their reputation. When the president of the company feels the need to assure potential customers, of a game SOE was publishing (Vanguard), that his company would have absolutely nothing to do with the games development, it is obvious that he knows his company has a poor reputation.
Think about that, John Smedley promoted the fact that his company was not going to be involved in the development of Vanguard as a selling point for the game. Since then, there has been no attempts to do anything to improve the company's reputation. In fact, they have done plenty to further cement the company's reputation. It makes no sense.
It's amazing how Smedley still has a job there. I mean he must just be the greatest brown noser of all time. How much more fail does it take?
Vanguard wasn't the only game that soe had to give a press release that they were hands off on development. The day pirates of the burning sea announced it was partnering with soe, they had to put up a giant FAQ and seperate discussion forum in an attempt to calm down player fears that soe was going to have anything to do with the games development.
The same thing happened when gods and heroes partnered with soe.
Every time soe partners with someone, both companies have to immediately go into damage control, which speaks volumes about the reputation soe has.
To be honest I have to agree with the main sentiment in the thread. If SOE REALLY wanted to save the game then they should have done this years ago. Instead they stubbornly held onto the idea that the NGE was a good idea and that somehow it is what the community wanted even as people left in droves. SOE burned pretty much all of their bridges as they tried to shove the NGE down everybody's throat. And not only did they burn all their bridges they hurled insults and raped and pillaged their entire way along that road.
It is, as has been said, too little too late. There was a _massive_ community outcry even back during the CU to stop all the changes, that it was all too much too fast and it was going in the wrong direction. SOE outright IGNORED the community and instead of giving the players what THEY wanted SOE did what -SOE- wanted...which was a very thinly veiled attempt to WoW-ify their game. Which they failed at even doing that I might add.
Instead of fixing bugs, tweaking classes and adding content somehow the folks at SOE thought it would be a brilliant idea to shove out both the CU and NGE within a three month span. Introducing way more bugs without fixing many of the old ones, pissing off the community by COMPLETELY destroying the well received skill-based "leveling" and altogether just destroying the original concept of SWG. On top of all that they still haven't really recovered as far as actually smoothing out the game goes.
There are a LOT of things SOE is going to have to do to get back all of the trust they have lost; not just from the NGE. Lists are fun:
The RMT system for station has got to go.
The TCG for SWG has to go and NEVER come back for another game. WoW has done something similar, but the way the two things are handled are COMPLETELY different. The SWG TCG often introduces items that are not available in-game and that are actually needed for crafting classes. WoW is not only an actual print card game, but all of the loot cards are purely cosmetic stuff that have zero impact on the game itself.
Smed needs to be fired. There is no way around that. Too many people hate him and will never touch another SOE product specifically because of him.
SWG needs to be shut down. I can't imagine that the way the game is running now is producing a real profit for SOE and all it is is just a bad reminder to players about how much SOE screwed up.
Did I mention that Smed needs to be fired?
I remember it was also a part of the Vanguard FAQ's. I wish I took a screenshot of it at the time because I thought it was funny as hell that it needed to be addressed in this way.
I remember it was also a part of the Vanguard FAQ's. I wish I took a screenshot of it at the time because I thought it was funny as hell that it needed to be addressed in this way.
Which is why I ultimately find it astounding that there are no Classic Servers. Yes, it's true, there is a cost involved in the technical aspects of running an MMO. And it's true that they might not get that money back in subscription revenue from the Classic Servers (although it's doubtful they would not be profitable). But it blows my mind that they can't see that implementing a Classic Server would actually pay back ten fold in other games in the future. They think they've only alienated 200k people via the NGE, but the number is probably pretty staggering when you think about how many people those 200k have told about SOE's evils. I alone have probably steered over 15 people (in person) away from SOE products.
An apology, and a Classic Server would make me rethink my stance.
I remember it was also a part of the Vanguard FAQ's. I wish I took a screenshot of it at the time because I thought it was funny as hell that it needed to be addressed in this way.
Which is why I ultimately find it astounding that there are no Classic Servers. Yes, it's true, there is a cost involved in the technical aspects of running an MMO. And it's true that they might not get that money back in subscription revenue from the Classic Servers (although it's doubtful they would not be profitable). But it blows my mind that they can't see that implementing a Classic Server would actually pay back ten fold in other games in the future. They think they've only alienated 200k people via the NGE, but the number is probably pretty staggering when you think about how many people those 200k have told about SOE's evils. I alone have probably steered over 15 people (in person) away from SOE products.
An apology, and a Classic Server would make me rethink my stance.
The thing is, with Vanguard it was pissed off former EQ players. SOE has tried to make nice with those folks by offering them something closer to what they want than what the current version of EQ is, with the progression servers. They also tease offering classic vanilla EQ servers, but they have yet to go through with that.
With PotBS, it was the folks at Flying Labs that pushed SOE's non involvement, not the Smed. It was also the head of Flying Labs that kept claiming SOE had changed and we should buy his game to reward SOE for being good and wonderful now. The only thing he could point to as an example of SOE changing into a good and wonderful company is that they were publishing his game.
The Vanguard announcement had the Smed himself touted the fact that his company would have nothing to do with the game's development as a selling point on the pre-beta Sigil boards. The Smed later promised to not make any major changes to the core mechanics of Vanguard, since he had learned his lesson with the failure of the NGE. He outright lied both times, as SOE employees were working on Vanguard prior to release, and Vanguard has been changed to be much closer to WoW in gameplay. I still find it funny that the Smed claimed the reason SOE was interested in buying Vanguard was because SOE lacked a 'hardcore' game in their lineup, and almost instantly after buying Vanguard they set about making it more like WoW (faster level progression, making sure the player knows where to go next, etc.).
I haven't found a replacement yet that appeals to me in the ways SWG did the first year that I played it. At this point, I'd go back to paying for both of my Pre-CU accounts regardless of whether it was SOE that put up classic servers or if it takes a flightless bird to do the job. Winner gets my $30/month bounty (and I'm ppretty sure it will be going to the right place).
Badger, did you ever bring this up with anyone at SOE? If you did, did you get any kind of response negative or positive?
I simply can't understand why they will not put up a server or two with classic pre-cu, it will fill a niche so needed in the market. I realistically see it having a loyal fan base of 25k-50k players. That's not very impressive true but it's $400k - $750k a month for something that is already there with minimal support needed.
Anyways, give us some feedback if you have any, even if it's negative.
I'd play any classic version. My favorite period was the post-CU where battle fatigue, dancer and doctor buffs were still present, not exactly sure if that was still present after patch 9 or not.
Remove Jedi from the game, and I'll never have a need to look for anything else MMO-wise. I know that's the supremely "iconic" class, but the alpha class nature caused a lot of unbalancing. I wouldn't even care if I had to start from scratch again.
For this to be a success though, I'm pretty sure you'd have to keep SoE, or the SoE name as far away from it as possible...just too much bad blood there, and "once bitten, twice shy" as they say.
If the developers still have access to the old code, why not re-vamp it and put it out as a new game? The foundation for a great game is there already. Change some names around, update the graphics, fix some of the early bugs and push it out. It won't be "Star Wars" but it would be one hell of a Sci-Fi MMO. They would even have enough latitude to actually implement a faction-based PvP (aka. Galactic civil war) in a meaningful way without running afoul of lore constraints.
i liked mind wounds, battle fatigue and so on.
I didn't like the GCW revamp - Bria became swamped with bases. Noone could be bothered destroying the non-PVP bases so people stopped caring about the PVP ones too - defending/attacking PVP bases was a ritual until then. It was also ridiculous that you couldn't intervene as an overt against some non-PVPer killing your NPCs. If they didn't want to risk being killed they should have done it in the middle of nowhere, not in the middle of Theed.
I didn't like levels
I've no idea what patch number would be best given the above, but I'd be happy to play anything upto NGE anyway.
Love to know also if theres been anymore said about this. Is there still a dev interested in doing this or has the idea totally been blown off. Any news is better then none.
Even if they brought back Pre-CU today, the player base would not be there like it was. People are bitter from the SOE betrayal and won't trust them again. The community is what made Pre-CU great.
I don't disagree with you, it would never see roughly 300k players again. But 25k - 50k is very probable just because there isn't a game out there right now that feels the niche that pre-cu does.
I don't disagree with you, it would never see roughly 300k players again. But 25k - 50k is very probable just because there isn't a game out there right now that feels the niche that pre-cu does.
As far as concurrent players, I think you guys are definitely right. But I would venture a guess that with that amount of controversy the NGE has amassed, the opening numbers for a Pre-CU server(s) would actually be quite staggering for a short burst of time. Enough to recoup any costs involved in getting them up and running... and then some.