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Skill-based = grindfest? (poll)
markyturnip
Member UncommonPosts: 837
in Darkfall
Just wondered how Darkfall would pitch itself in terms of the grind.
In the best games, raising skill points can be a fun and rewarding experience - requiring work, but not too much work.
At their worst, they can lead to incredibly dull gameplay - requiring endless tapping on a skill button in the middle of nowhere to raise skills by tiny amounts.
Any thoughts on where DF intends to position itself on the grind-scale?
Just for fun - here's a poll. Click on the number you feel will be closest to DF's grindiness. 1 being the most relaxed, 10 being the most grindy.
EDIT - Hmm... I forgot a dont know option. If you dont know, click 5.
Comments
read somewhere that a tester leveled a skill for 5 hours and got it to level 17. make of that what you will, im in favor
Got a skill to lvl 17? Am I missing something?
lol what do u think u are missing here?
IMO its going to be a huge grind trying to level skills that you dont use primarily. You wont notice any gring on your priamary skills.
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Got a skill to lvl 17? Am I missing something?
Unless this has recently changed, skills degenerate without use. How will that add to the "grind factor"? And, if so, to what degree? This was from one of so few of Tasos' past interviews. Take it with a grain of salt. And don't ask me for proof, look it up yourself and do research.
I think the grind will be more with gathering resources for crafting and building player cities than with actual leveling.
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Got a skill to lvl 17? Am I missing something?
Well you see, Darkfall is a sandbox type game in which you level up skills of your choice to advance your character instead of the more conventional leveling system. Anything else?
Got a skill to lvl 17? Am I missing something?
Well you see, Darkfall is a sandbox type game in which you level up skills of your choice to advance your character instead of the more conventional leveling system. Anything else?
... and those skills have a rank or level from 1-100. Each individual skill is leveled/ranked up, etc.
Also they do degenerate without use. This is good for those wishing to respec in a way so that they can reduce the soft cap.
Got a skill to lvl 17? Am I missing something?
Well you see, Darkfall is a sandbox type game in which you level up skills of your choice to advance your character instead of the more conventional leveling system. Anything else?
... and those skills have a rank or level from 1-100. Each individual skill is leveled/ranked up, etc.
Also they do degenerate without use. This is good for those wishing to respec in a way so that they can reduce the soft cap.
Degredation doesn't start until "master level" from a dev quote. Read somewhere that the master level is around 75. So if you increase a skill to 75, it will not drop below that level. Anything above 75 will decrease without use.
The level 17 in 5 hours quote was for spells. The same site states that it takes longer for spells to level than skills. There are also skills that open up as you increase your skill level that you begin to incease as well. So diversity will be very large if it works out right.
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Darkfall will most likely be a grind game to get your skills up, the primary skills you use all the time so these you won't notice as a grind as they are used in fighting etc. Secondary skills however, those I guess will be grindtastic :P
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MMO's played: SWG (pre cu/cu), WoW, AoC, WAR, DFO, Planetside
MMO's that I have tested: Lotro, L2, Aion, Ryzom
Quote from a tester that i read on another site concerning guild and crafting:
" Welcome to Grindfall........ " which kinda makes sense since building ships and towns or even acquiring mounts is through crafting and that requires resource gathering first.
Well so much for the "go back to your asian grindfest mmo Darkfall is not like the rest" argument that the fans keep spuing out.
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huge grind imo, UO was a "grindy" game also, at least for me.
There will probably be a little grind and that is part of the rpg element. I think once the world is more populated with people ( I hope pvp gives skill level increase ) and npcs, then the grind won't look so bad.
he also said he stood there, facing up firing a spell into the air (and usuing a macro for memory) for that 5 hours. He said that was a horrible grind but to me, facing the sky for 5 hours and firing spells into the air is not my idea of grinding
anyway the difference between the normal grind of games and a sandbox grind is that you have a lot more freedom on the grind and are rewarded much more. Grind magic, you get more spells, grind swordsmanship, you get better skills. Other MMO's the grind is usually quests (in order to level) and lets face it, most only have 1 set of quests for you to do in order to reach max level (quite a boring grind) whereas a sandbox game like darkfall allows you to pick and choose how you grind (farm a goblin camp for a few hours if you want, or move up and down the coast hunting beasts) as apposed to the quest based grind (static location of quests means you always go down a certain path or to a certain zone).
in my opinion (as this whole post has been) i like the darkfall style of grind (much like SWG) better than the quest grind.
MMO wish list:
-Changeable worlds
-Solid non level based game
-Sharks with lasers attached to their heads
Skill progression is supposed to be diversity-based. Like in DMoMM multiplayer. Will there be grind for the guy shooting mana missiles in the air all day to get fast to GM skill? Sure. But i doubt it would be needed that much to be competitive.
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Well I hope it takes ages.. I'm used to slow skill rising with EQ and I absolutely loved it.
edit: of course if you chose to do nothing but shoot in the air for 5 hours it will be very boring, as shooting yourself in the foot will be very painful.. doh.
Speaking of grinding, I remember playing RFonline (Codemasters years ago and not the new CCR one), that players would grind their buff skills afk overnight in safe zone areas (so as not got get ganked). I wonder if players will do ths same, such as casting fireballs in the air while afk and sleep overnight. I will they probably get ganked as soon as someone notices they are afk. In RFonline the players went to grind their buffs in the noobie areas to avoid such things.
For me skill based means: No more alts. You can develop your character the way you want. If I want to heal and use a bow, I can do it. If I dualwielding and fire spells, I can do it.
About the grind. I voted 7. I think Darkfall will be a huge grind, from 50 and up, but every mmorpg is a grind in high levels, is part of the cake.
but ppl will do if its teh faster way to level up that skill, there is imo mob grind, quest grind and skill grind if i have to chose one ill take mob grind every day, but thats about tastes.
There is a huge problem here! In DF you dont have to grind if you dont want to. And if you want, there is more grind then you can handle.
So its a choice.
Some betaplayers havent grind anything. Therefore it could be a "1" or a "10", with you decide.
but ppl will do if its teh faster way to level up that skill, there is imo mob grind, quest grind and skill grind if i have to chose one ill take mob grind every day, but thats about tastes.
Yep, there will always be one form of grind in any MMO, you cant get away from it.
Exp grind to make levels
Skill grind to build skill levels
Quest grind to make levels.
You will always have at least one of them, my favorite game (EQ) had two of them. And those are listed in my order of preference.
Every MMO have grinding. Resources, skill, level, quest, reputation, Item grinding. Everything that you do continuously is grinding. Its just the question if its boring or not. It become boring if grind the same thing. Combining many different actions that you like make it fun and relaxing.
As example the best aspect of WoW is that he hides grinding very well while force you to do many different things so you do not feel everything as grinding. The big downside is that this system limit your freedom in the game. Its designed especially for players that do nto know how to play MMO's. In practice even in WoW everything is one big grindfest.
For an experienced MMO player obvious grinding is not a problem but even advantage, its enought if game give you enough different tools to spend your time, so you can not get boring, but still can do whaterver you want. Thats the man difference between Theme Park and Sandbox. Sanbox give the freedom to do whatever you want with the tools implemented till Theme Park drive you thorught hidden sandbox system behind.
Where themepark games try to hide that they are copying WOW, games like Mortal Online and Darkfall make no attempt to hide their inspiration
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LordOfDarkDesire
10+ Mega-grindathlon with cream topping and chocolate crust.
you can apply that to all MMO's, they ( or any other dev. ) just need to try to make the grind fun, for me the grind in EQ was fun and for others it was a hell, for me the grind in wow ( quests ) or uo ( level skills ) was a nigthmare and for others it was fun, just tastes.
you can apply that to all MMO's, they ( or any other dev. ) just need to try to make the grind fun, for me the grind in EQ was fun and for others it was a hell, for me the grind in wow ( quests ) or uo ( level skills ) was a nigthmare and for others it was fun, just tastes.
Im not really following you here. Isnt EQ levelbased? You have no choice then to level up (everything)?
In DF you have nothing to level up if you dont want to. You can begin to kill other players and dragons the first day if you want. But some decide to stand in the spawn area and cut wood for 4 months to raise wood cutting skill, thats a big difference you know.
And the word "grind", it comes from when you have no choice : ) If you decides to do it, its called playing.