Ecco, you really are reaching now. No one should have to work that hard. Anyway, what Daffid said.
Again a little dig "No one should work that hard" why do the folks that have a problem with SOE have to always add a little dig at me? Seems like you are the one working hard to find problems with SOE. Really reaching? I simply asked a question that you have not answered. From my point of view you are the one reaching, claiming SOE will do something, based on past preformance, on an issue they have not been involved in before, as far as I know. It was a real question since I may have been wrong and maybe they have done this in a game and I am unaware of it. I have not played every SOE game. Instead of answering, you tell me I am reaching. Then Daffid says I am putting far to fine a point on your comments. So, does that mean I should not take your comment seriously? Then he admits there is no real example of SOE doing this. So who is reaching?
I have said this over and over, outside of SWG/NGE SOE has never done anything I have had a problem with. Remember, I do not have a problem with the marketplace in EQ2. I also could careless they said in the past they would not do this and changed their minds. It is not that big of a deal to me. I do not think this is some terrible game breaking thing. It is only an item mall in a game, not a conspiracy SOE has to defraud you. In essence that is what you are claiming they are doing. I have left mmos for a lot of reasons, including game changes that I disliked (NGE), when this happens I simply move on and try other games.
Just because you dont have a problem doesnt mean there isnt one SOE has systematcally destroyed some of the best IPs availble..
Everquest - PoP and everything since -ruined
SWG- NGE CU ruined
Matrix- Ruined lol so sad...
Vanguard - Dumbed down and ruined
PotBS- lol do i have to comment
EQ2 - they have dumbed down every facet of challenge in this once great game-Ruined
And now RMT , heres a clue every single item in EQ2 is already cocded for RMT .. this is a fact on there every server... This codong has been implemented for years in there Market server.. And it exists on every server just a matter of clearing it for RMT purchase on a particular server..
Enjoy yer game . you wear that Smed Da Liar Jughead cap well.,.
So I am a jughead, I forgot. umm did you, remember you used that one on me before? Again another SOE hater that has to insult me. Even though you have called me a jughead before I still have not insulted you. I guess insulting people is not my way. You think that jughead hat comment is so funny and insulting that you need to use it again. You started that simply because I mentioned I wear a WoW hat and said I would like an EQ2 hat. My aren't you the creative one. You really got me again. Can we try for a 3rd time?
Everquest - PoP and everything since -ruined
SWG- NGE CU ruined
Matrix- Ruined lol so sad...
Vanguard - Dumbed down and ruined
PotBS- lol do i have to comment
EQ2 - they have dumbed down every facet of challenge in this once great game-Ruined
I am assuming you have played these games if you have not then your comments mean nothing. Seems to me someone who spends that much money and time playing all these games by SOE and feels the way you do about SOE is a jughead. Why would you waste you time and money over and over again? They probably got a hat your size.
Lol wow a bit defensive huh .. The Jughead cap is meaning you are the Exact subscriber that Smed and SOE want to belive there propaganda and continue to pay for it.. I never called you a jughead ,i said you wear the Cap well... And again you are missing the point .. Think a bit maybe you will get it....
And No i havent palyed all those games ,
But then again, When I look in the backyard and see all the piles of Dogpie ,I dont need to step in each one to know that they Stink.. Some people do i suppose .. Now clean yer shoes and move on...
Lol wow a bit defensive huh .. The Jughead cap is meaning you are the Exact subscriber that Smed and SOE want to belive there propaganda and continue to pay for it.. I never called you a jughead ,i said you wear the Cap well... And again you are missing the point .. Think a bit maybe you will get it....
And No i havent palyed all those games ,
But then again, When I look in the backyard and see all the piles of Dogpie ,I dont need to step in each one to know that they Stink.. Some people do i suppose .. Now clean yer shoes and move on...
"And No i havent palyed all those games" That is all that is needed to be said. People come here and just say what ever they want about games that they never even played.
Do you even read my posts? Clean my shoes and move on? Why would I move on? I LIKE SOE GAMES (accept NGE)! Do you get that point? Some of you just can not accept not all of us think of SOE and Smed as some sort of devils that are trying to defraud you.
Isn't it ironic that while many SOE customers here are told that we should stop complaining/criticizing SOE because one or two posters are "tired" of hearing it (in a thread which criticism is the topic), one of them seems to want to go on and on in post after post about how persecuted he is here?
Really Ecco, you take this all far too personally. I''ve reminded you before; it's not about you, and you really don't have to reach so far and stretch so hard to twist something in a post to try to defuse the situation that SOE has created for itself (ie. my "working" comment). I suspect it is that behaviour, along with the persecustion angle, that is the reason you get the replies you do (which, by many internet-discussion board standards, have been really very civil).
But since it seems you won't accept a response unless I type it, even though I noted that Daffid nailed it in his reply (soIdidn't have to work so hard), this effort is just for you.
Game-affecting (as opposed to fluff) items are already being sold in the game. Based on SOE's past record on this very issue of saying one thing and doing another, no rational person can conclude that this is the time that they will keep their word. As Daffid pointed out, one SOE muckety-muck is already on record as stating that more is coming and talking about just how far they can go with this until they hack off enough people to the point where it offsets the game revenue (see: 85-90% comment). You're a smart guy and I suspect you knew what the answer to your query would be, so why I needed to type it (as opposed to Daffid's reply) befuddles me.
Not everyone wants to work as hard as you, you know.
For my part, I am a huge fan of the game, and enjoy playing it very much. While I provide info on the game here and other places, and advocate to others just how much fun EQ2 is (and how IMO it is the best fantasy-based MMO on the market right now) somehow I don't feel the need to play surrogate on a discussion board and defend them/tell their customers to shut up/whine because I am persecuted/tired of hearing about it when SOE makes bone-headed moves.
But thats just me.
So, if you feel you must, then keep rowing Ecco, I do enjoy reading your thoughts and eventually you'll get somewhere.
Ecco, you are asking for a specific example that you know doesn't exist yet, because SOE is breaking new ground here. From that you are taking a comment out of context and pushing it into a confined discussion that only works if you completely ignore everything up to date and focus on something that is only starting to happen right now.
That includes the very action of RMT that we are talking about right now. One where they promised they would never put RMT into these games and now they are, but now people should believe they won't put better items in later? You would also have to ignore the fact that the lead designers goals right now do include adding armor/weapons from his very own words. It also centers around a design that is willing to piss of a portion of the player base that is below 80-100% of the players. Just that very attitude would scare the hell out of me. When a company has to minimize the amount of players they piss off when designing updates just sounds so backwards in terms of a subscription based industry.
In order to take SOE at face value when they claim they won't do something like add armor, there needs to be some faith in those words and no examples of them breaking similar types of promises in the past. I think we can all agree that really isn't a possibility based on their past actions and well the actions of last week. I mean we are talking about SOE keeping their word in a dicussion that is centered around them not keeping their word.
Lol wow a bit defensive huh .. The Jughead cap is meaning you are the Exact subscriber that Smed and SOE want to belive there propaganda and continue to pay for it.. I never called you a jughead ,i said you wear the Cap well... And again you are missing the point .. Think a bit maybe you will get it....
And No i havent palyed all those games ,
But then again, When I look in the backyard and see all the piles of Dogpie ,I dont need to step in each one to know that they Stink.. Some people do i suppose .. Now clean yer shoes and move on...
"And No i havent palyed all those games" That is all that is needed to be said. People come here and just say what ever they want about games that they never even played.
Do you even read my posts? Clean my shoes and move on? Why would I move on? I LIKE SOE GAMES (accept NGE)! Do you get that point? Some of you just can not accept not all of us think of SOE and Smed as some sort of devils that are trying to defraud you.
If you really think someone needs to play a game to have an opinion on it your credibilty if you had any is out the window .. I dont need to play (insert game here) to know that it doesnt provide features or elements that i may enjoy.. Or that a game does have features implemented that i think destroys immersion and gameplay..If a game peaks my intrest i do alotta reading on it 1st ... Gather as much info as i can .. then decide..
I dont need to step in the Dogpie to know its gonna stink .. Seems some people do ..
"We aren't going to be allowing RMT in any way, shape or form on the non-exchange enabled EQ II servers. Period. End of statement." ~ John Smedley
It should say...
We aren't going to be allowing RMT in any way, shape or form on the non-exchange enabled EQ II servers. Period. End of statement. Unless SOE is the one doing it.
I've been kind to SOE imho. I've given them 3 tries to show me what they are. I was hesitant after the whole money milking of EQ (having to pay for content when other games give you more content for free). I gave in and tried SWG. It was another great game, then NGE came out. Unlike most I was willing to give SOE a third try with EQ2. Now they've added in a cash shop to a subscription game? NEVER AGAIN!!! If SOE such as breathes near a product I will stay away from it like the plague.
Isn't it ironic that while many SOE customers here are told that we should stop complaining/criticizing SOE because one or two posters are "tired" of hearing it (in a thread which criticism is the topic), one of them seems to want to go on and on in post after post about how persecuted he is here? Really Ecco, you take this all far too personally. I''ve reminded you before; it's not about you, and you really don't have to reach so far and stretch so hard to twist something in a post to try to defuse the situation that SOE has created for itself (ie. my "working" comment). I suspect it is that behaviour, along with the persecustion angle, that is the reason you get the replies you do (which, by many internet-discussion board standards, have been really very civil). But since it seems you won't accept a response unless I type it, even though I noted that Daffid nailed it in his reply (soIdidn't have to work so hard), this effort is just for you. Game-affecting (as opposed to fluff) items are already being sold in the game. Based on SOE's past record on this very issue of saying one thing and doing another, no rational person can conclude that this is the time that they will keep their word. As Daffid pointed out, one SOE muckety-muck is already on record as stating that more is coming and talking about just how far they can go with this until they hack off enough people to the point where it offsets the game revenue (see: 85-90% comment). You're a smart guy and I suspect you knew what the answer to your query would be, so why I needed to type it (as opposed to Daffid's reply) befuddles me. Not everyone wants to work as hard as you, you know. For my part, I am a huge fan of the game, and enjoy playing it very much. While I provide info on the game here and other places, and advocate to others just how much fun EQ2 is (and how IMO it is the best fantasy-based MMO on the market right now) somehow I don't feel the need to play surrogate on a discussion board and defend them/tell their customers to shut up/whine because I am persecuted/tired of hearing about it when SOE makes bone-headed moves. But thats just me. So, if you feel you must, then keep rowing Ecco, I do enjoy reading your thoughts and eventually you'll get somewhere. Best to you.
You are totally mistaken. Moirae has said many time to stop complaining. When have I ever said this? Not once. I have suggested that those that are so down on SOE just move on. Not from the forums but from SOE do you understand? That is a lot different then telling you to stop complaining on this forum. This is a public forum and you are free to say what ever and how ever you want. Stop saying I keep telling you to stop complaining I do not. What I do is offer my view of things obviously different from yours. It seems that if I disagree with your feelings about SOE your think I do not want to hear from you or do not see things clearly. Wrong I simply would like to hear it without the digs or the saying I said stuff I never did. Yes I do go on about it, just look at this thread alone and how so many misquote and take digs at me. Seems like almost every post here that is different then my opinion has to go after me in some way or another. Stop doing it then I will not point it out.
When someone insults me and calls me a jughead more then once then claims they did not mean it ,yea I take that personnely. However I do not lose sleep or worry about it. I point it out in reguards to this discussion. I also have not blindly defended SOE as you and others keep suggesting. That is also totally untrue. My post history will prove that.
What I have been doing is pointing out I do not think the item mall is a scam. I think it is the future. You refuse to accept that is my true feeling so you respond to me as if I do not get it or am some kind of fanboi. Again, "keep rowing you might get somewhere". Why not just discuss your idea without the digs. Granted yours are not as obvious as being called a jughead or a viral marketer but they are there nonetheless.
SOE is a business they do what they can to make as much money as they can. Some seem to think SOE is some kind of charity. It is not it does what is in its best interests, that is what businesses do. I simply do not see anything you point out about SOE as some sort of calculated scam. Do they make mistake you bet they do but a scam? You say you love EQ2 and play it why would you give a company money you feel is scamming you?
scam (skm) Slang
n.
A fraudulent business scheme; a swindle.
tr.v. scammed, scam·ming, scams
To defraud; swindle.
If you believe this (and you have the right to) and it seems you do. Again, I ask why not just move on from SOE. This thread was about a "scam" wasn't it or did I misread the title?
Show me where I stated that SOE is running a scam? Physician, heal thyself.
Ah, it's not even amusing anymore. Seriously, Ecco. I see that now, even when it is pointed out how your behaviour opens you to the very responses you decry and that it is not at all about you personally, you will continue on that same path.
Okay, it's not my tree. Have a good time, just don't be surprised when you are verbally dismissed by those here for your off-topic whining. It's not a very becoming sight and gets in the way of the discussion.
"We aren't going to be allowing RMT in any way, shape or form on the non-exchange enabled EQ II servers. Period. End of statement." ~ John Smedley
It should say... We aren't going to be allowing RMT in any way, shape or form on the non-exchange enabled EQ II servers. Period. End of statement. Unless SOE is the one doing it.
I've been kind to SOE imho. I've given them 3 tries to show me what they are. I was hesitant after the whole money milking of EQ (having to pay for content when other games give you more content for free). I gave in and tried SWG. It was another great game, then NGE came out. Unlike most I was willing to give SOE a third try with EQ2. Now they've added in a cash shop to a subscription game? NEVER AGAIN!!! If SOE such as breathes near a product I will stay away from it like the plague.
Now you see, I understand this person very clearly. They state their feelings and say they will never again buy a SOE product. No insults to those that are ok with SOE. They aren't happy and are moving on from SOE. That is an intelligent thing to do if you feel this way. Don't support a company who you feel is scamming you makes sense to me.
Lol wow a bit defensive huh .. The Jughead cap is meaning you are the Exact subscriber that Smed and SOE want to belive there propaganda and continue to pay for it.. I never called you a jughead ,i said you wear the Cap well... And again you are missing the point .. Think a bit maybe you will get it....
And No i havent palyed all those games ,
But then again, When I look in the backyard and see all the piles of Dogpie ,I dont need to step in each one to know that they Stink.. Some people do i suppose .. Now clean yer shoes and move on...
"And No i havent palyed all those games" That is all that is needed to be said. People come here and just say what ever they want about games that they never even played.
Do you even read my posts? Clean my shoes and move on? Why would I move on? I LIKE SOE GAMES (accept NGE)! Do you get that point? Some of you just can not accept not all of us think of SOE and Smed as some sort of devils that are trying to defraud you.
If you really think someone needs to play a game to have an opinion on it your credibilty if you had any is out the window .. I dont need to play (insert game here) to know that it doesnt provide features or elements that i may enjoy.. Or that a game does have features implemented that i think destroys immersion and gameplay..If a game peaks my intrest i do alotta reading on it 1st ... Gather as much info as i can .. then decide..
I dont need to step in the Dogpie to know its gonna stink .. Seems some people do ..
No I do not think you need to play a game to have an opinion on it. However why would anyone take your opinion seriously if you have not played the games you are making claims about.
Everquest - PoP and everything since -ruined
SWG- NGE CU ruined
Matrix- Ruined lol so sad...
Vanguard - Dumbed down and ruined
PotBS- lol do i have to comment
EQ2 - they have dumbed down every facet of challenge in this once great game-Ruined
You were not commenting about features you were making blanket comments on games you have not even played.
You are totally mistaken. Moirae has said many time to stop complaining. When have I ever said this? Not once. I have suggested that those that are so down on SOE just move on. Not from the forums but from SOE do you understand? That is a lot different then telling you to stop complaining on this forum. This is a public forum and you are free to say what ever and how ever you want. Stop saying I keep telling you to stop complaining I do not. What I do is offer my view of things obviously different from yours. It seems that if I disagree with your feelings about SOE your think I do not want to hear from you or do not see things clearly. Wrong I simply would like to hear it without the digs or the saying I said stuff I never did. Yes I do go on about it, just look at this thread alone and how so many misquote and take digs at me. Seems like almost every post here that is different then my opinion has to go after me in some way or another. Stop doing it then I will not point it out. When someone insults me and calls me a jughead more then once then claims they did not mean it ,yea I take that personnely. However I do not lose sleep or worry about it. I point it out in reguards to this discussion. I also have not blindly defended SOE as you and others keep suggesting. That is also totally untrue. My post history will prove that. What I have been doing is pointing out I do not think the item mall is a scam. I think it is the future. You refuse to accept that is my true feeling so you respond to me as if I do not get it or am some kind of fanboi. Again, "keep rowing you might get somewhere". Why not just discuss your idea without the digs. Granted yours are not as obvious as being called a jughead or a viral marketer but they are there nonetheless. SOE is a business they do what they can to make as much money as they can. Some seem to think SOE is some kind of charity. It is not it does what is in its best interests, that is what businesses do. I simply do not see anything you point out about SOE as some sort of calculated scam. Do they make mistake you bet they do but a scam? You say you love EQ2 and play it why would you give a company money you feel is scamming you? scam (skm) Slang
n.
A fraudulent business scheme; a swindle.
tr.v. scammed, scam·ming, scams
To defraud; swindle.
If you believe this (and you have the right to) and it seems you do. Again, I ask why not just move on from SOE. This thread was about a "scam" wasn't it or did I misread the title?
I personally think SOE is only a few short steps away from turning things around. It would do the mmo industry as a whole a lot of good if one of the bigger publishers turned things around and got back to making quality games and stopped setting examples of "what not to do".
Let me ask you this about the cash shop items:
Are they the same type of content that has been available to players of the game in the past
Was that content included in the subscription fee
What is the possible justification for now charging an additional money for content that was previously included with the subscription fee. That is by its very nature a scam. SOE is now double selling items to its subscribers.
Just like they are with the rmt card games. Same developers, more money required to get content. Content that was surprisingly 'slowed' down around the same time.
Most successful businesses do what is in their best interest while best serving the customer. The idea that the ends justify the means doesn't rationalize anything.
Well, it's discontinued now. Apparently, Microsoft doesn't care that people liked them and in some cases even needed them to be able to use a computer without arthritis pain; and they still pretend that the market isn't important even though there's a huge demand for them - 1-2.
SOE seems to be following the software giant's footsteps in not caring about customers if they aren't the biggest fish in the sea. This is how businesses work; it's nothing personal, but you're just not worth the money.
Welcome to the niche market, of which you are now a part.
Also, yes, what SOE did was pretty nasty... the timing of the RMT system was very unkind, but according to common business practice teachings, they would be foolish not to capitalize on consumer ignorance even if it makes them hated by a portion of their playerbase.
So you are REQUIRED to use their Stationcash option? Word to the wise, they are not making you do anything and if you don't like it quit being a little nancy and cancel your sub leave the rest of the world to their own. Not to mention this has been talked to death for the last few days use the search function and vent in on of the already exhisting threads.
I would have canceled my subs last month BEFORE I would have paid for the expansion! 80 euros total!!
That's what is the issue here!
I dont give a crap about this system. They said it would NEVER come into EverQuest 2.
More even so, that they DELIBERATELY waited till couple weeks after the TSO expansion and kept it all secret to MAXIMISE expansion sales! As they knew lot of people would have canceled and NOT buy the expansion if they announced this lets say end of october / early november.
I don't know what SCAM means in your dictionary. But in mine this is a SCAM. Pure and simple!
And when you look into their feedback thread on the official forums, then you will see that a lot of people feel the exact same about this.
Cheers
which is exactly why I wont play any SOE games ever. I dont care if theyre just the publisher. SOE can NOT be trusted.
This is no different than the crap SOE pulled on their community with SWG. They lie when it means more profits. They cant be trusted.
Maybe now you all will finally learn to stay away from SOE
It's SOE, they'll do anything for a penny now, instead of a game that will last and make millions later. I played EQ for awhile until I started to get the feeling that SOE was just robbing me with all their expansions. It wasn't until WoW came out that I asked myself, "Why the heck am I paying for an expansion every 6 months, when in other games you get the exact same thing for free?" After I tought about this question, I haven't touched anything SOE has even come close to since. I will NEVER forgive SOE for what they did to EQ, I will NEVER play another SOE game EVER.
I'm suprised they're not offering to powerlevel you for cash...SOE sucks!
Dear God, man! Do you read what you write before you hit Post? I enjoyed years of SOE's 6 month expansions when I used to play EQ because it always gave me something to do. I never got bored playing EQ (until POP). WOW had me bored and waiting for an expansion for 18 months... 18 MONTHS! Can you honestly say you found something to keep you entertained during that 18 months before the Burning Crusade was released? WOW has like, a handful of places to grind out day after day after day after day after day after - you get the picture. EQ expansions always added to my variety and made playing a game less tedious than game play should be.
Think about the size of any EQ expansion and name me one game (besides LOTRO or Vanguard) that gives away that amount of content (zones/new mobs/loot/innovation) for free on a reguar basis.
How many free zones did WOW ever give away? 5 maybe? And the loot is all still basically 'Something Something of The Boar or Monkey' or whatever.
I think a lot of people are in the same situation. There needs to be something done at SOE to regain the trust of consumers. As things stand right now there is no valid reason to believe this company will not do anything they want to make a buck regardless of how their customers feel. Why invest playtime in a game when the odds are really good that the company running the game will pull the rug out from underneath your feet and make drastic changes you oppose. It is a shame really, because the talent at SOE has always seemed to be held hostage by these choices and the customers are treated with no respect at all.
Let's fast-forward 5 years, once the next 'big' mainstream MMO is released and lets see how desperate Blizzard will get trying to keep the revenues rolling in from WOW...
I think a lot of people are in the same situation. There needs to be something done at SOE to regain the trust of consumers. As things stand right now there is no valid reason to believe this company will not do anything they want to make a buck regardless of how their customers feel. Why invest playtime in a game when the odds are really good that the company running the game will pull the rug out from underneath your feet and make drastic changes you oppose. It is a shame really, because the talent at SOE has always seemed to be held hostage by these choices and the customers are treated with no respect at all.
Let's fast-forward 5 years, once the next 'big' mainstream MMO is released and lets see how desperate Blizzard will get trying to keep the revenues rolling in from WOW...
For how many years now has Blizzard released critically acclaimed games that are powerhouse titles in their respective fields. WoW hopefully will not dominate the market in 5 years, because that just means 5 more years of crap releases. Somehow I suspect they will have more successful titles in that time and I'm not even a fan of their other games.
Where do you think SOE is going to be in five years if they keep running business as they are now? They are having enough trouble keeping their top talent let alone customers. It's a shame too, because underneath all that muck is a company that wants to make games.
Defending a game/company is one thing. But this is fanaticism, or even beyond that.
so exactly how many posts does it take before it turns into fanaticism? can you quantify that? because one can say that those attacking the game are just as fanatical as those defending it.
thing is those defending it are actually more in the right since they play the game and a stupid post like the OP may turn someone away from the game. where as those bashing the game can just say "hey that sucks glad im not playing it" and post about the game they are playing.
Defending a game/company is one thing. But this is fanaticism, or even beyond that.
so exactly how many posts does it take before it turns into fanaticism? can you quantify that? because one can say that those attacking the game are just as fanatical as those defending it.
thing is those defending it are actually more in the right since they play the game and a stupid post like the OP may turn someone away from the game. where as those bashing the game can just say "hey that sucks glad im not playing it" and post about the game they are playing.
I think netspook was pointing out they hypocracy on Moirae who seems to have the same cut/paste response for anyone with anything but positive comments.
As for saying someone defending being more "right" are you so sure about that?
Is it right for a company to promise never to introduce RMT in any way shape or form into non-station exchange servers and then turn around and do it?
Is it right for that same company to do so without even the slightest consideration of the customers opinion?
Is it right for a company do sneak this feature in without any hint that it is even a possibility?
Is it right to continually do these types of things shortly after they sell an expansion pack?
Is it right for a company to say "station cash is here to stay" before they have even had a chance to hear what their customers have to say on the matter?
All I keep hearing from people who think they are in the right is "It doesn't affect me so I don't care" which is usually followed by some form of GTFO if you don't like it. This is the virtual equivalent of sticking fingers in ones ears and singing la la la as loud as you can.
As much as you may think the post by the original poster is stupid at least it is largly fact filled. If the actions of this company chase away potential customers then the problem is with the company and not the person who exposes those issues don't you agree?
Something to think about. Maybe more people would be playing these games if this company didn't do things of this nature. I know it sounds strange, but think about it.
does this cashshop give u items that lets u lvl faster? be stronger? get a big advantage? or is it just stuff IE: cosmetics.. items for house , clothes?.
Defending a game/company is one thing. But this is fanaticism, or even beyond that.
so exactly how many posts does it take before it turns into fanaticism? can you quantify that? because one can say that those attacking the game are just as fanatical as those defending it.
thing is those defending it are actually more in the right since they play the game and a stupid post like the OP may turn someone away from the game. where as those bashing the game can just say "hey that sucks glad im not playing it" and post about the game they are playing.
I think netspook was pointing out they hypocracy on Moirae who seems to have the same cut/paste response for anyone with anything but positive comments.
As for saying someone defending being more "right" are you so sure about that?
Is it right for a company to promise never to introduce RMT in any way shape or form into non-station exchange servers and then turn around and do it?
Is it right for that same company to do so without even the slightest consideration of the customers opinion?
Is it right for a company do sneak this feature in without any hint that it is even a possibility?
Is it right to continually do these types of things shortly after they sell an expansion pack?
Is it right for a company to say "station cash is here to stay" before they have even had a chance to hear what their customers have to say on the matter?
All I keep hearing from people who think they are in the right is "It doesn't affect me so I don't care" which is usually followed by some form of GTFO if you don't like it. This is the virtual equivalent of sticking fingers in ones ears and singing la la la as loud as you can.
the hypocrisy is actually on the side of the attackers how many changes has EQ2 made to help out the soloer. especially when they said before launch that "soloing would be done in "lobbies" of dungeons while waiting for groups to form". that was a lie but i bet you don't count that since it worked in the benefit of the soloer.
Or changes to most of the zones from many heroic mobs to NO heroic mobs ... again making it easy to solo. them changing that thus changing the focus of the game from a group oriented game to a solo WoW centric game is a lie but no one brings that up as being a lie.
it's amazing its always a lie when it doesn't go in the flamers favor ... he said it ... wow congrats you found something SOE decided to change thier mind on heres a button. Let me go reread through some blizzard interviews i bet i could point out a bunch of crap that they "lied" about.
time change ... things change. When i was 10 i said i would never ever eat salad ... now I have a salad with many of my meals.
Defending a game/company is one thing. But this is fanaticism, or even beyond that.
so exactly how many posts does it take before it turns into fanaticism? can you quantify that? because one can say that those attacking the game are just as fanatical as those defending it.
thing is those defending it are actually more in the right since they play the game and a stupid post like the OP may turn someone away from the game. where as those bashing the game can just say "hey that sucks glad im not playing it" and post about the game they are playing.
I think netspook was pointing out they hypocracy on Moirae who seems to have the same cut/paste response for anyone with anything but positive comments.
<snip>
Correct.
Ravanos:
You know very well that there's no exact number for that. But when someone is so obsessed with defending something that she posts dozens of times within the same thread, telling everyone who disagree how wrong they are and how sick she is of hearing about it... Then it passed fanaticism a long time ago. Imo, at least.
As for turning ppl away from the game: I'm certain Moirae is doing a much better job there than the OP.
Comments
Again a little dig "No one should work that hard" why do the folks that have a problem with SOE have to always add a little dig at me? Seems like you are the one working hard to find problems with SOE. Really reaching? I simply asked a question that you have not answered. From my point of view you are the one reaching, claiming SOE will do something, based on past preformance, on an issue they have not been involved in before, as far as I know. It was a real question since I may have been wrong and maybe they have done this in a game and I am unaware of it. I have not played every SOE game. Instead of answering, you tell me I am reaching. Then Daffid says I am putting far to fine a point on your comments. So, does that mean I should not take your comment seriously? Then he admits there is no real example of SOE doing this. So who is reaching?
I have said this over and over, outside of SWG/NGE SOE has never done anything I have had a problem with. Remember, I do not have a problem with the marketplace in EQ2. I also could careless they said in the past they would not do this and changed their minds. It is not that big of a deal to me. I do not think this is some terrible game breaking thing. It is only an item mall in a game, not a conspiracy SOE has to defraud you. In essence that is what you are claiming they are doing. I have left mmos for a lot of reasons, including game changes that I disliked (NGE), when this happens I simply move on and try other games.
Just because you dont have a problem doesnt mean there isnt one SOE has systematcally destroyed some of the best IPs availble..
Everquest - PoP and everything since -ruined
SWG- NGE CU ruined
Matrix- Ruined lol so sad...
Vanguard - Dumbed down and ruined
PotBS- lol do i have to comment
EQ2 - they have dumbed down every facet of challenge in this once great game-Ruined
And now RMT , heres a clue every single item in EQ2 is already cocded for RMT .. this is a fact on there every server... This codong has been implemented for years in there Market server.. And it exists on every server just a matter of clearing it for RMT purchase on a particular server..
Enjoy yer game . you wear that Smed Da Liar Jughead cap well.,.
So I am a jughead, I forgot. umm did you, remember you used that one on me before? Again another SOE hater that has to insult me. Even though you have called me a jughead before I still have not insulted you. I guess insulting people is not my way. You think that jughead hat comment is so funny and insulting that you need to use it again. You started that simply because I mentioned I wear a WoW hat and said I would like an EQ2 hat. My aren't you the creative one. You really got me again. Can we try for a 3rd time?
Everquest - PoP and everything since -ruined
SWG- NGE CU ruined
Matrix- Ruined lol so sad...
Vanguard - Dumbed down and ruined
PotBS- lol do i have to comment
EQ2 - they have dumbed down every facet of challenge in this once great game-Ruined
I am assuming you have played these games if you have not then your comments mean nothing. Seems to me someone who spends that much money and time playing all these games by SOE and feels the way you do about SOE is a jughead. Why would you waste you time and money over and over again? They probably got a hat your size.
Lol wow a bit defensive huh .. The Jughead cap is meaning you are the Exact subscriber that Smed and SOE want to belive there propaganda and continue to pay for it.. I never called you a jughead ,i said you wear the Cap well... And again you are missing the point .. Think a bit maybe you will get it....
And No i havent palyed all those games ,
But then again, When I look in the backyard and see all the piles of Dogpie ,I dont need to step in each one to know that they Stink.. Some people do i suppose .. Now clean yer shoes and move on...
Actually ecco and I have a very good point. That you people are overreacting and need to get over it.
"And No i havent palyed all those games" That is all that is needed to be said. People come here and just say what ever they want about games that they never even played.
Do you even read my posts? Clean my shoes and move on? Why would I move on? I LIKE SOE GAMES (accept NGE)! Do you get that point? Some of you just can not accept not all of us think of SOE and Smed as some sort of devils that are trying to defraud you.
Isn't it ironic that while many SOE customers here are told that we should stop complaining/criticizing SOE because one or two posters are "tired" of hearing it (in a thread which criticism is the topic), one of them seems to want to go on and on in post after post about how persecuted he is here?
Really Ecco, you take this all far too personally. I''ve reminded you before; it's not about you, and you really don't have to reach so far and stretch so hard to twist something in a post to try to defuse the situation that SOE has created for itself (ie. my "working" comment). I suspect it is that behaviour, along with the persecustion angle, that is the reason you get the replies you do (which, by many internet-discussion board standards, have been really very civil).
But since it seems you won't accept a response unless I type it, even though I noted that Daffid nailed it in his reply (so I didn't have to work so hard), this effort is just for you.
Game-affecting (as opposed to fluff) items are already being sold in the game. Based on SOE's past record on this very issue of saying one thing and doing another, no rational person can conclude that this is the time that they will keep their word. As Daffid pointed out, one SOE muckety-muck is already on record as stating that more is coming and talking about just how far they can go with this until they hack off enough people to the point where it offsets the game revenue (see: 85-90% comment). You're a smart guy and I suspect you knew what the answer to your query would be, so why I needed to type it (as opposed to Daffid's reply) befuddles me.
Not everyone wants to work as hard as you, you know.
For my part, I am a huge fan of the game, and enjoy playing it very much. While I provide info on the game here and other places, and advocate to others just how much fun EQ2 is (and how IMO it is the best fantasy-based MMO on the market right now) somehow I don't feel the need to play surrogate on a discussion board and defend them/tell their customers to shut up/whine because I am persecuted/tired of hearing about it when SOE makes bone-headed moves.
But thats just me.
So, if you feel you must, then keep rowing Ecco, I do enjoy reading your thoughts and eventually you'll get somewhere.
Best to you.
Ecco, you are asking for a specific example that you know doesn't exist yet, because SOE is breaking new ground here. From that you are taking a comment out of context and pushing it into a confined discussion that only works if you completely ignore everything up to date and focus on something that is only starting to happen right now.
That includes the very action of RMT that we are talking about right now. One where they promised they would never put RMT into these games and now they are, but now people should believe they won't put better items in later? You would also have to ignore the fact that the lead designers goals right now do include adding armor/weapons from his very own words. It also centers around a design that is willing to piss of a portion of the player base that is below 80-100% of the players. Just that very attitude would scare the hell out of me. When a company has to minimize the amount of players they piss off when designing updates just sounds so backwards in terms of a subscription based industry.
In order to take SOE at face value when they claim they won't do something like add armor, there needs to be some faith in those words and no examples of them breaking similar types of promises in the past. I think we can all agree that really isn't a possibility based on their past actions and well the actions of last week. I mean we are talking about SOE keeping their word in a dicussion that is centered around them not keeping their word.
"And No i havent palyed all those games" That is all that is needed to be said. People come here and just say what ever they want about games that they never even played.
Do you even read my posts? Clean my shoes and move on? Why would I move on? I LIKE SOE GAMES (accept NGE)! Do you get that point? Some of you just can not accept not all of us think of SOE and Smed as some sort of devils that are trying to defraud you.
If you really think someone needs to play a game to have an opinion on it your credibilty if you had any is out the window .. I dont need to play (insert game here) to know that it doesnt provide features or elements that i may enjoy.. Or that a game does have features implemented that i think destroys immersion and gameplay..If a game peaks my intrest i do alotta reading on it 1st ... Gather as much info as i can .. then decide..
I dont need to step in the Dogpie to know its gonna stink .. Seems some people do ..
"We aren't going to be allowing RMT in any way, shape or form on the non-exchange enabled EQ II servers. Period. End of statement." ~ John Smedley
It should say...
We aren't going to be allowing RMT in any way, shape or form on the non-exchange enabled EQ II servers. Period. End of statement. Unless SOE is the one doing it.
I've been kind to SOE imho. I've given them 3 tries to show me what they are. I was hesitant after the whole money milking of EQ (having to pay for content when other games give you more content for free). I gave in and tried SWG. It was another great game, then NGE came out. Unlike most I was willing to give SOE a third try with EQ2. Now they've added in a cash shop to a subscription game? NEVER AGAIN!!! If SOE such as breathes near a product I will stay away from it like the plague.
You are totally mistaken. Moirae has said many time to stop complaining. When have I ever said this? Not once. I have suggested that those that are so down on SOE just move on. Not from the forums but from SOE do you understand? That is a lot different then telling you to stop complaining on this forum. This is a public forum and you are free to say what ever and how ever you want. Stop saying I keep telling you to stop complaining I do not. What I do is offer my view of things obviously different from yours. It seems that if I disagree with your feelings about SOE your think I do not want to hear from you or do not see things clearly. Wrong I simply would like to hear it without the digs or the saying I said stuff I never did. Yes I do go on about it, just look at this thread alone and how so many misquote and take digs at me. Seems like almost every post here that is different then my opinion has to go after me in some way or another. Stop doing it then I will not point it out.
When someone insults me and calls me a jughead more then once then claims they did not mean it ,yea I take that personnely. However I do not lose sleep or worry about it. I point it out in reguards to this discussion. I also have not blindly defended SOE as you and others keep suggesting. That is also totally untrue. My post history will prove that.
What I have been doing is pointing out I do not think the item mall is a scam. I think it is the future. You refuse to accept that is my true feeling so you respond to me as if I do not get it or am some kind of fanboi. Again, "keep rowing you might get somewhere". Why not just discuss your idea without the digs. Granted yours are not as obvious as being called a jughead or a viral marketer but they are there nonetheless.
SOE is a business they do what they can to make as much money as they can. Some seem to think SOE is some kind of charity. It is not it does what is in its best interests, that is what businesses do. I simply do not see anything you point out about SOE as some sort of calculated scam. Do they make mistake you bet they do but a scam? You say you love EQ2 and play it why would you give a company money you feel is scamming you?
scam (skm) Slang
n.
A fraudulent business scheme; a swindle.
tr.v. scammed, scam·ming, scams
To defraud; swindle.
If you believe this (and you have the right to) and it seems you do. Again, I ask why not just move on from SOE. This thread was about a "scam" wasn't it or did I misread the title?
Show me where I stated that SOE is running a scam? Physician, heal thyself.
Ah, it's not even amusing anymore. Seriously, Ecco. I see that now, even when it is pointed out how your behaviour opens you to the very responses you decry and that it is not at all about you personally, you will continue on that same path.
Okay, it's not my tree. Have a good time, just don't be surprised when you are verbally dismissed by those here for your off-topic whining. It's not a very becoming sight and gets in the way of the discussion.
And that's about all I have to say about that.
Going to work now.
Best to all of you here!
Now you see, I understand this person very clearly. They state their feelings and say they will never again buy a SOE product. No insults to those that are ok with SOE. They aren't happy and are moving on from SOE. That is an intelligent thing to do if you feel this way. Don't support a company who you feel is scamming you makes sense to me.
It.
Is.
Not.
About.
You.
"And No i havent palyed all those games" That is all that is needed to be said. People come here and just say what ever they want about games that they never even played.
Do you even read my posts? Clean my shoes and move on? Why would I move on? I LIKE SOE GAMES (accept NGE)! Do you get that point? Some of you just can not accept not all of us think of SOE and Smed as some sort of devils that are trying to defraud you.
If you really think someone needs to play a game to have an opinion on it your credibilty if you had any is out the window .. I dont need to play (insert game here) to know that it doesnt provide features or elements that i may enjoy.. Or that a game does have features implemented that i think destroys immersion and gameplay..If a game peaks my intrest i do alotta reading on it 1st ... Gather as much info as i can .. then decide..
I dont need to step in the Dogpie to know its gonna stink .. Seems some people do ..
No I do not think you need to play a game to have an opinion on it. However why would anyone take your opinion seriously if you have not played the games you are making claims about.
Everquest - PoP and everything since -ruined
SWG- NGE CU ruined
Matrix- Ruined lol so sad...
Vanguard - Dumbed down and ruined
PotBS- lol do i have to comment
EQ2 - they have dumbed down every facet of challenge in this once great game-Ruined
You were not commenting about features you were making blanket comments on games you have not even played.
I personally think SOE is only a few short steps away from turning things around. It would do the mmo industry as a whole a lot of good if one of the bigger publishers turned things around and got back to making quality games and stopped setting examples of "what not to do".
Let me ask you this about the cash shop items:
What is the possible justification for now charging an additional money for content that was previously included with the subscription fee. That is by its very nature a scam. SOE is now double selling items to its subscribers.
Just like they are with the rmt card games. Same developers, more money required to get content. Content that was surprisingly 'slowed' down around the same time.
Most successful businesses do what is in their best interest while best serving the customer. The idea that the ends justify the means doesn't rationalize anything.
Edit: typos
This reminds me of when Microsoft made the Trackball Explorer, the most comfortable mouse ever made.
Well, it's discontinued now. Apparently, Microsoft doesn't care that people liked them and in some cases even needed them to be able to use a computer without arthritis pain; and they still pretend that the market isn't important even though there's a huge demand for them - 1 -2.
SOE seems to be following the software giant's footsteps in not caring about customers if they aren't the biggest fish in the sea. This is how businesses work; it's nothing personal, but you're just not worth the money.
Welcome to the niche market, of which you are now a part.
Also, yes, what SOE did was pretty nasty... the timing of the RMT system was very unkind, but according to common business practice teachings, they would be foolish not to capitalize on consumer ignorance even if it makes them hated by a portion of their playerbase.
I don't agree with these practices because I think consumer loyalty is more important than a quick buck*, but whatever. It's just an opinion.
*There was a better source for this in a more current magazine, but lurking turned up nothing. Old forum post is old.
I would have canceled my subs last month BEFORE I would have paid for the expansion! 80 euros total!!
That's what is the issue here!
I dont give a crap about this system. They said it would NEVER come into EverQuest 2.
More even so, that they DELIBERATELY waited till couple weeks after the TSO expansion and kept it all secret to MAXIMISE expansion sales! As they knew lot of people would have canceled and NOT buy the expansion if they announced this lets say end of october / early november.
I don't know what SCAM means in your dictionary. But in mine this is a SCAM. Pure and simple!
And when you look into their feedback thread on the official forums, then you will see that a lot of people feel the exact same about this.
Cheers
which is exactly why I wont play any SOE games ever. I dont care if theyre just the publisher. SOE can NOT be trusted.
This is no different than the crap SOE pulled on their community with SWG. They lie when it means more profits. They cant be trusted.
Maybe now you all will finally learn to stay away from SOE
Dear God, man! Do you read what you write before you hit Post? I enjoyed years of SOE's 6 month expansions when I used to play EQ because it always gave me something to do. I never got bored playing EQ (until POP). WOW had me bored and waiting for an expansion for 18 months... 18 MONTHS! Can you honestly say you found something to keep you entertained during that 18 months before the Burning Crusade was released? WOW has like, a handful of places to grind out day after day after day after day after day after - you get the picture. EQ expansions always added to my variety and made playing a game less tedious than game play should be.
Think about the size of any EQ expansion and name me one game (besides LOTRO or Vanguard) that gives away that amount of content (zones/new mobs/loot/innovation) for free on a reguar basis.
How many free zones did WOW ever give away? 5 maybe? And the loot is all still basically 'Something Something of The Boar or Monkey' or whatever.
[url=http://www.flickr.com/photos/28371832@N02/2648951313/[/url]
Let's fast-forward 5 years, once the next 'big' mainstream MMO is released and lets see how desperate Blizzard will get trying to keep the revenues rolling in from WOW...
[url=http://www.flickr.com/photos/28371832@N02/2648951313/[/url]
Let's fast-forward 5 years, once the next 'big' mainstream MMO is released and lets see how desperate Blizzard will get trying to keep the revenues rolling in from WOW...
For how many years now has Blizzard released critically acclaimed games that are powerhouse titles in their respective fields. WoW hopefully will not dominate the market in 5 years, because that just means 5 more years of crap releases. Somehow I suspect they will have more successful titles in that time and I'm not even a fan of their other games.
Where do you think SOE is going to be in five years if they keep running business as they are now? They are having enough trouble keeping their top talent let alone customers. It's a shame too, because underneath all that muck is a company that wants to make games.
Start by counting you own posts in this thread only, and then tell me:
Who is the one sounding like a broken record?
Defending a game/company is one thing. But this is fanaticism, or even beyond that.
so exactly how many posts does it take before it turns into fanaticism? can you quantify that? because one can say that those attacking the game are just as fanatical as those defending it.
thing is those defending it are actually more in the right since they play the game and a stupid post like the OP may turn someone away from the game. where as those bashing the game can just say "hey that sucks glad im not playing it" and post about the game they are playing.
so exactly how many posts does it take before it turns into fanaticism? can you quantify that? because one can say that those attacking the game are just as fanatical as those defending it.
thing is those defending it are actually more in the right since they play the game and a stupid post like the OP may turn someone away from the game. where as those bashing the game can just say "hey that sucks glad im not playing it" and post about the game they are playing.
I think netspook was pointing out they hypocracy on Moirae who seems to have the same cut/paste response for anyone with anything but positive comments.
As for saying someone defending being more "right" are you so sure about that?
Is it right for a company to promise never to introduce RMT in any way shape or form into non-station exchange servers and then turn around and do it?
Is it right for that same company to do so without even the slightest consideration of the customers opinion?
Is it right for a company do sneak this feature in without any hint that it is even a possibility?
Is it right to continually do these types of things shortly after they sell an expansion pack?
Is it right for a company to say "station cash is here to stay" before they have even had a chance to hear what their customers have to say on the matter?
All I keep hearing from people who think they are in the right is "It doesn't affect me so I don't care" which is usually followed by some form of GTFO if you don't like it. This is the virtual equivalent of sticking fingers in ones ears and singing la la la as loud as you can.
As much as you may think the post by the original poster is stupid at least it is largly fact filled. If the actions of this company chase away potential customers then the problem is with the company and not the person who exposes those issues don't you agree?
Something to think about. Maybe more people would be playing these games if this company didn't do things of this nature. I know it sounds strange, but think about it.
does this cashshop give u items that lets u lvl faster? be stronger? get a big advantage? or is it just stuff IE: cosmetics.. items for house , clothes?.
so exactly how many posts does it take before it turns into fanaticism? can you quantify that? because one can say that those attacking the game are just as fanatical as those defending it.
thing is those defending it are actually more in the right since they play the game and a stupid post like the OP may turn someone away from the game. where as those bashing the game can just say "hey that sucks glad im not playing it" and post about the game they are playing.
I think netspook was pointing out they hypocracy on Moirae who seems to have the same cut/paste response for anyone with anything but positive comments.
As for saying someone defending being more "right" are you so sure about that?
Is it right for a company to promise never to introduce RMT in any way shape or form into non-station exchange servers and then turn around and do it?
Is it right for that same company to do so without even the slightest consideration of the customers opinion?
Is it right for a company do sneak this feature in without any hint that it is even a possibility?
Is it right to continually do these types of things shortly after they sell an expansion pack?
Is it right for a company to say "station cash is here to stay" before they have even had a chance to hear what their customers have to say on the matter?
All I keep hearing from people who think they are in the right is "It doesn't affect me so I don't care" which is usually followed by some form of GTFO if you don't like it. This is the virtual equivalent of sticking fingers in ones ears and singing la la la as loud as you can.
the hypocrisy is actually on the side of the attackers how many changes has EQ2 made to help out the soloer. especially when they said before launch that "soloing would be done in "lobbies" of dungeons while waiting for groups to form". that was a lie but i bet you don't count that since it worked in the benefit of the soloer.
Or changes to most of the zones from many heroic mobs to NO heroic mobs ... again making it easy to solo. them changing that thus changing the focus of the game from a group oriented game to a solo WoW centric game is a lie but no one brings that up as being a lie.
it's amazing its always a lie when it doesn't go in the flamers favor ... he said it ... wow congrats you found something SOE decided to change thier mind on heres a button. Let me go reread through some blizzard interviews i bet i could point out a bunch of crap that they "lied" about.
time change ... things change. When i was 10 i said i would never ever eat salad ... now I have a salad with many of my meals.
OMG IM A LIAR!!!!
well now i know not to get EQ2 for sure thanks for the heads up
so exactly how many posts does it take before it turns into fanaticism? can you quantify that? because one can say that those attacking the game are just as fanatical as those defending it.
thing is those defending it are actually more in the right since they play the game and a stupid post like the OP may turn someone away from the game. where as those bashing the game can just say "hey that sucks glad im not playing it" and post about the game they are playing.
I think netspook was pointing out they hypocracy on Moirae who seems to have the same cut/paste response for anyone with anything but positive comments.
<snip>
Correct.
Ravanos:
You know very well that there's no exact number for that. But when someone is so obsessed with defending something that she posts dozens of times within the same thread, telling everyone who disagree how wrong they are and how sick she is of hearing about it... Then it passed fanaticism a long time ago. Imo, at least.
As for turning ppl away from the game: I'm certain Moirae is doing a much better job there than the OP.