Registered users - people with a registered account Subs - people with a registered account that are paying subscription fees.
Please learn your terms and dont mix and match them to suite your agenda. Its good they have 800k registered accounts but I'd like to know some sort of round about on subscriptions that are being retained.
You should read the source material that the OP provides, eh?
"Warhammer Online: Age of Reckoning, an MMO from EA's Mythic Entertainment studio, sold 1.2 million copies in the quarter -- with over 800 thousand current players. "
Cheers!
You should read the word in red. It doesnt' say "subs" it says "current players" . There's alot of people still using the iGamer Free trials and the 30 free days they're current players but they are not 'subs'.
btw im happy with the registered numbers if they can keep even half that'll be even more fantastic. Azril and bodypass can stfu
No they don't say 800K current players.
they say 800 K accounts ...the famous 750 K accounts created remember ...
The "missing" 400 K so called sold boxes are the number of boxes unsold in shops but of course they are already IN the bookkeeping of EA.
It's a twist and a clever one at that.
On Xfire : War has about 12 times less players than Wow at the moment.
So 4.5M divided by 12 = 400 K players. That is NOT 800 K, but indeed 50% of the original number of players about 4 weeks ago.
So cleverly worded, but you don't think about the stock in the shops and 400 K is still unsold to "accounts" but very well sold in EA's bookkeeping.
Agreed. On Sept 30th, Warhammer had about 400k actively playing players. The game has lost about another 30-40% since then, and is probably down to around 250k players. Since Sept 30th, the renewals have happened for both NA and EU.
There is no way that they would allow players to abandon 19 servers if they thought they would ever see 800k players ever again.
But really, its' just like AOC.. you can still find people on the AOC forums claiming the game has 500k players and that wow fanbois are exaggerating how low the subs are ( FWIW AOC = 75k).
Are you really sure that AoC currently has 75k active accounts?
That would really be dismal since it peaked at over 800k active accounts with 1.2m copies sold to the stores.
On the topic: I guess that Mythic should not have released the game in September and now we know why they had to change their name back from EA Mythic to just Mythic.
Question is what they mean by "current players". I don't think it's possible (at least not yet) for an MMO has 800k subscribers only a bit over a month after release, so I think it's safe to say "current players != subscribers". In addition, I'm still playing free and haven't had to subscribe yet (I believe GOA gave 2 us CE mofos, and possibly preorder mofos too, two extra weeks of free play). I will be subscribing when my free play runs out, though. Whatever is the case, I have a feeling Mark Jacobs is going to be one rich bastard *throws jealous fit*.
Originally posted by oscarkool2 Originally posted by Rhoklaw Originally posted by Xtort Originally posted by Azrile Agreed. On Sept 30th, Warhammer had about 400k actively playing players. The game has lost about another 30-40% since then, and is probably down to around 250k players. Since Sept 30th, the renewals have happened for both NA and EU. There is no way that they would allow players to abandon 19 servers if they thought they would ever see 800k players ever again. But really, its' just like AOC.. you can still find people on the AOC forums claiming the game has 500k players and that wow fanbois are exaggerating how low the subs are ( FWIW AOC = 75k).
We see what you did there. Seriously, WoW will never die with people like you. The reason they are merging the servers is that they saw that each server can handle much more people than initially planned. So, instead of a 4000 cap we now have a 8000 cap. That's the reason we see Med-Med or Low-Low servers. For example, my server Dark Crag. It was Full-Full to High-High then in 1 day it became a Med-Med server. There is ALWAYS an RvR action going on, at least in T4. Even at 5 AM! Scenarios pop every minute. I see minimum 40-50 people on Dragonwake-Warcamp when I log in. BUT Dark Crag is a Med-Med server. Got it? I don't think so... you can play with words, play with numbers, play with stupid Xfire charts. You can do all you want. But Warhammer is a very successful MMO which sits in the 2nd place of all MMOs out there. It can never be #1. The reason is WoW is a PvE/raiding game and it appeals to the majority of gamers. WoW is a good PvE game and has the best grinding/time sinks available. They do these very good, kudos to Blizzard. However, PvP sucks. Arenas suck. Expansions suck. Combat sucks. Nothing more, nothing less. Warhammer is a very good alternative to WoW, if you prefer PvP over PvE. So please, go back to WoW forums and tell them about Xfire charts and other kind of crap.
Thank you Xtort, you worded it perfectly and added the population cap increase on servers. Apparently when people start hating a game, they become relentless and won't face facts.
God, everyone says they raised the server pops but they really haven't. PROVE IT!! Because I do not believe they raised server pops since release. Go play your WAR and get off the forums. Facts are facts. Game has had a total of 800k players since release. Well, Im not playing anymore so make that 799,999k players. Oh wait, many hundreds of thousands arent playing anymore either. So please, stop talking your bs all over this forum and back up what you say with facts.
Info about rising caps is from MArk Jacobs. He stated this in his interviews and official infos on Herald. They raised caps at least 2 times. You can find Mythic's post on Warhammer Alliance by dev tracker and no, I wont post link for you, not worth my time, I am coming back to that nice big battle we have in Blackfire Pass last 2 days
Well I dont really believe there are 800k people playing this game tbf, its too early and there some work that needs to be done.
BUT I think mythic is not gonnna loose out on the market, their MMO is a "success" as far as business is concerned if they have 200k people they are making money out of it and the game has been widely accepted AKA it wasnt a total fiasco like AoC or the "next big thing" before it, if they play the right cards and take the game in the direction people want they can make the player base grow over the next 6 months.
Originally posted by taus01 Words people, listen to the words! Do not get fooled by the companies. Shipped = sent to stores = not sold Sold = they got the money those are payed for Subscribers = people who put in all info incl. credit card or else payment Registered = people who have bought but not put in credit card or else and not renew
Do not get fooled, READ!
You know, there's nothing to get fooled about?
Why are people upset? This isn't the JFK murder or 9/11 conspiracy is it?
The game will have whatever population it has, that's the end of the story.
Not sure if anyone posted this as I got sick of reading this thread but here is one of the quotes.
"We are back in the MMO business with the launch of Warhammer Online. Currently, 800,000 people are playing online worldwide. In North America, we have 250,000 subscribers in less than two weeks and are seeing conversions of over 70%. Although it is still early days, we like what we are seeing"
Not sure if anyone posted this as I got sick of reading this thread but here is one of the quotes.
"We are back in the MMO business with the launch of Warhammer Online. Currently, 800,000 people are playing online worldwide. In North America, we have 250,000 subscribers in less than two weeks and are seeing conversions of over 70%. Although it is still early days, we like what we are seeing"
I also wanted to add. That 1.2 million is actually number of boxes sold to players.
They already announced 1.5 million boxes sold to retailers a long time ago. If they already sold 1.5 million boxes to retailers way back in September than it makes no sense that they sold 1.2 million boxes to retailers now doesn't it?
Originally posted by Thachsanh I also wanted to add. That 1.2 million is actually number of boxes sold to players. They already announced 1.5 million boxes sold to retailers a long time ago. If they already sold 1.5 million boxes to retailers way back in September than it makes no sense that they sold 1.2 million boxes to retailers now doesn't it?
And they also already announced that they had 750k account on october 10th before the free month was over for anyone. The 1.2 million dates from Sept 30th so it can't be sold to customers
Retailers can return copies if the game undersells, they have many different deals with companies
Originally posted by Thachsanh I also wanted to add. That 1.2 million is actually number of boxes sold to players. They already announced 1.5 million boxes sold to retailers a long time ago. If they already sold 1.5 million boxes to retailers way back in September than it makes no sense that they sold 1.2 million boxes to retailers now doesn't it?
And they also already announced that they had 750k account on october 10th before the free month was over for anyone. The 1.2 million dates from Sept 30th so it can't be sold to customers
Retailers can return copies if the game undersells, they have many different deals with companies
But the 800K also self-conflicted with the previous number does it not?
I was puzzled by these numbers at first but if you assume 2 things, it all makes sense.
1 - All EA public announcements are accurate.
2 - These are actual current number (after 10/18), not 9/30 number.
Chronically, it looks like this.
9/15 - EA announced WAR broke internal EA pre-order record and 1.5M boxes sold to retailers
9/25 - EA announced WAR reach 500K in the first week
9/30 - END of quarter
10/10 - EA announced WAR reach 750K
10/18 - 1st wave players free month over
10/31 - EA announced WAR reach 800K and 1.2M boxes sold.
Remember if this is the current number, EA is not the only company did this. Funcom did this too, remember the August 14 subscription number?
So, assuming this is the current number, they actually sold 1.2M boxes and about 400K players did not resub after the free month.
Originally posted by Thachsanh I also wanted to add. That 1.2 million is actually number of boxes sold to players. They already announced 1.5 million boxes sold to retailers a long time ago. If they already sold 1.5 million boxes to retailers way back in September than it makes no sense that they sold 1.2 million boxes to retailers now doesn't it?
And they also already announced that they had 750k account on october 10th before the free month was over for anyone. The 1.2 million dates from Sept 30th so it can't be sold to customers
Retailers can return copies if the game undersells, they have many different deals with companies
But the 800K also self-conflicted with the previous number does it not?
I was puzzled by these numbers at first but if you assume 2 things, it all makes sense.
1 - All EA public announcements are accurate.
2 - These are actual current number (after 10/18), not 9/30 number.
Chronically, it looks like this.
9/15 - EA announced WAR broke internal EA pre-order record and 1.5M boxes sold to retailers
9/25 - EA announced WAR reach 500K in the first week
9/30 - END of quarter
10/10 - EA announced WAR reach 750K
10/18 - 1st wave players free month over
10/31 - EA announced WAR reach 800K and 1.2M boxes sold.
Remember if this is the current number, EA is not the only company did this. Funcom did this too, remember the August 14 subscription number?
So, assuming this is the current number, they actually sold 1.2M boxes and about 400K players did not resub after the free month.
Actually what I *ponder* is why we dicuss this kind of thing so often.
Other than if we own shares in the company why do we care?
Either you have fun when you login or you don't....
If you are having fun.. then another 10 million people playing wont' change that. Only 40,000 playing won't change that.
Actually what I *ponder* is why we dicuss this kind of thing so often. Other than if we own shares in the company why do we care? Either you have fun when you login or you don't.... If you are having fun.. then another 10 million people playing wont' change that. Only 40,000 playing won't change that. If you are not having fun... kinda the same deal.
One big reason is there are a lot of features in this game required a healthy population to work well. So, unlike any PvE center MMORPG, the more people you have on the servers, the better the game experience will be. In this game, you actually want the server to be crowded.
Originally posted by Thachsanh I also wanted to add. That 1.2 million is actually number of boxes sold to players. They already announced 1.5 million boxes sold to retailers a long time ago. If they already sold 1.5 million boxes to retailers way back in September than it makes no sense that they sold 1.2 million boxes to retailers now doesn't it?
And they also already announced that they had 750k account on october 10th before the free month was over for anyone. The 1.2 million dates from Sept 30th so it can't be sold to customers
Retailers can return copies if the game undersells, they have many different deals with companies
But the 800K also self-conflicted with the previous number does it not?
I was puzzled by these numbers at first but if you assume 2 things, it all makes sense.
1 - All EA public announcements are accurate.
2 - These are actual current number (after 10/18), not 9/30 number.
Chronically, it looks like this.
9/15 - EA announced WAR broke internal EA pre-order record and 1.5M boxes sold to retailers
9/25 - EA announced WAR reach 500K in the first week
9/30 - END of quarter
10/10 - EA announced WAR reach 750K
10/18 - 1st wave players free month over
10/31 - EA announced WAR reach 800K and 1.2M boxes sold.
Remember if this is the current number, EA is not the only company did this. Funcom did this too, remember the August 14 subscription number?
So, assuming this is the current number, they actually sold 1.2M boxes and about 400K players did not resub after the free month.
Actually what I *ponder* is why we dicuss this kind of thing so often.
Other than if we own shares in the company why do we care?
Either you have fun when you login or you don't....
If you are having fun.. then another 10 million people playing wont' change that. Only 40,000 playing won't change that.
If you are not having fun... kinda the same deal.
Some of us are interested on how games are doing, what are the industry trends, how many players like a certain type of game and things like that.
God, everyone says they raised the server pops but they really haven't. PROVE IT!! Because I do not believe they raised server pops since release. Go play your WAR and get off the forums. Facts are facts. Game has had a total of 800k players since release. Well, Im not playing anymore so make that 799,999k players. Oh wait, many hundreds of thousands arent playing anymore either. So please, stop talking your bs all over this forum and back up what you say with facts.
They clearly said it when the game first launched that the caps were kept low initially to force people to spread out and then would be raised. Im still looking for that original post to appease you naysayers.
Originally posted by metalhead980 Originally posted by strategy Strange indeed. But very possible 800K "registred" users and 1.2 M "sales".-----> So 400 K boxes were not registred?
that means 400 players already left which would explain the Xfire numbers. 800k is a great number suxs that they lost 1/3 of the population though
Fully expected and normal. As Mark Jacobs posted the other day, no game has 100% retention rate. Some portion of the population quit every day/month. As long as those losses are replaced by subsequent sales, the game will continue to grow.
Well, if you want to put it like that, then yeah, out of those 2 numbers, the 1.2M is the 9/30 number but the 800K is the current number. But then, if you applied the 70% conversion ratio from the above poster, with 800K number it come out about 1.142M boxes sold to players right? That's about 93.6% retailers to players ratio which also mean that they only have roughly 60K boxes left out there.
Those are actually very good numbers.
Since the topic was locked on VNboard I'm going to answer you here (how come it was locked?, there was no fighting)
You forgot to take into consideration that less than 750k people and more than 500k had bought the box 1 month before and had their month expire. That means that the 70% can only be applied to those since the other sales haven't expired yet
But the 800K also self-conflicted with the previous number does it not? I was puzzled by these numbers at first but if you assume 2 things, it all makes sense. 1 - All EA public announcements are accurate. 2 - These are actual current number (after 10/18), not 9/30 number. Chronically, it looks like this. 9/15 - EA announced WAR broke internal EA pre-order record and 1.5M boxes sold to retailers 9/25 - EA announced WAR reach 500K in the first week 9/30 - END of quarter 10/10 - EA announced WAR reach 750K 10/18 - 1st wave players free month over 10/31 - EA announced WAR reach 800K and 1.2M boxes sold. Remember if this is the current number, EA is not the only company did this. Funcom did this too, remember the August 14 subscription number? So, assuming this is the current number, they actually sold 1.2M boxes and about 400K players did not resub after the free month.
The report that is linked (or is it an analysis of EA's preliminary report?) says the data contains numbers from the second quarter which ended Sept 30.
From the first few lines in the original link.
Electronic Arts Inc. (ERTS: ERTS, , ) today announced preliminary financial results for its fiscal second quarter ended September 30, 2008.
Fiscal Second Quarter Results (comparisons are to the quarter ended September 30, 2007)
I must admit I am very confused now, especially considering the Oct 10 announcement of 750k accounts. How can a game have 800k active accounts/users/subscribers/whatever right now and be merging populations at the same time.
Agreed. On Sept 30th, Warhammer had about 400k actively playing players. The game has lost about another 30-40% since then, and is probably down to around 250k players. Since Sept 30th, the renewals have happened for both NA and EU. There is no way that they would allow players to abandon 19 servers if they thought they would ever see 800k players ever again. But really, its' just like AOC.. you can still find people on the AOC forums claiming the game has 500k players and that wow fanbois are exaggerating how low the subs are ( FWIW AOC = 75k).
We see what you did there. Seriously, WoW will never die with people like you.
The reason they are merging the servers is that they saw that each server can handle much more people than initially planned.
So, instead of a 4000 cap we now have a 8000 cap. That's the reason we see Med-Med or Low-Low servers. For example, my server Dark Crag. It was Full-Full to High-High then in 1 day it became a Med-Med server. There is ALWAYS an RvR action going on, at least in T4. Even at 5 AM! Scenarios pop every minute. I see minimum 40-50 people on Dragonwake-Warcamp when I log in. BUT Dark Crag is a Med-Med server.
Got it? I don't think so... you can play with words, play with numbers, play with stupid Xfire charts. You can do all you want. But Warhammer is a very successful MMO which sits in the 2nd place of all MMOs out there.
It can never be #1. The reason is WoW is a PvE/raiding game and it appeals to the majority of gamers. WoW is a good PvE game and has the best grinding/time sinks available. They do these very good, kudos to Blizzard. However, PvP sucks. Arenas suck. Expansions suck. Combat sucks. Nothing more, nothing less.
Warhammer is a very good alternative to WoW, if you prefer PvP over PvE.
So please, go back to WoW forums and tell them about Xfire charts and other kind of crap.
Thank you Xtort, you worded it perfectly and added the population cap increase on servers. Apparently when people start hating a game, they become relentless and won't face facts.
God, everyone says they raised the server pops but they really haven't. PROVE IT!! Because I do not believe they raised server pops since release. Go play your WAR and get off the forums. Facts are facts. Game has had a total of 800k players since release. Well, Im not playing anymore so make that 799,999k players. Oh wait, many hundreds of thousands arent playing anymore either. So please, stop talking your bs all over this forum and back up what you say with facts.
The problem is.. you haters dont have facts either. you spout things like "PROVE IT!" yet NOONE can prove what the current numbers are yet this entire threat is speculating what we thing they are.
So if you want facts.. you are in the wrong thread.
But the 800K also self-conflicted with the previous number does it not? I was puzzled by these numbers at first but if you assume 2 things, it all makes sense. 1 - All EA public announcements are accurate. 2 - These are actual current number (after 10/18), not 9/30 number. Chronically, it looks like this. 9/15 - EA announced WAR broke internal EA pre-order record and 1.5M boxes sold to retailers 9/25 - EA announced WAR reach 500K in the first week 9/30 - END of quarter 10/10 - EA announced WAR reach 750K 10/18 - 1st wave players free month over 10/31 - EA announced WAR reach 800K and 1.2M boxes sold. Remember if this is the current number, EA is not the only company did this. Funcom did this too, remember the August 14 subscription number? So, assuming this is the current number, they actually sold 1.2M boxes and about 400K players did not resub after the free month.
The report that is linked (or is it an analysis of EA's preliminary report?) says the data contains numbers from the second quarter which ended Sept 30.
From the first few lines in the original link.
Electronic Arts Inc. (ERTS: ERTS, , ) today announced preliminary financial results for its fiscal second quarter ended September 30, 2008.
Fiscal Second Quarter Results (comparisons are to the quarter ended September 30, 2007)
I must admit I am very confused now, especially considering the Oct 10 announcement of 750k accounts. How can a game have 800k active accounts/users/subscribers/whatever right now and be merging populations at the same time.
They are not merging populations. They are allowing charactor transfers. Some people like low pop servers, most people like high pop servers. With a game like WAR, high population servers are better because you do not have to wait for a queue.
I play late at night, usually around 3 AM EST, and the Tier 3 queue is 1 minute to 5 minutes on a medium pop server (med during primetime). When it starts hitting 5 AM, it jumps to about 20 minutes.
I can imagine how hard a low population server is when it comes to RvR.
The definition of insanity: doing the same thing over and over expecting different results.
The problem is.. you haters dont have facts either. you spout things like "PROVE IT!" yet NOONE can prove what the current numbers are yet this entire threat is speculating what we thing they are. So if you want facts.. you are in the wrong thread.
Well............they are shutting servers, it is not a sign that the game is doing well.
That's a fact.
Of course I can't produce any number until EA will release them (if)
But the fact that they don't come clean on the number of subscribers instead of the number of accounts, isn't a good sign either.
Blizzard stated clearly they have 11 Million subscribers, what EA has to hide?
Threads like this one are why speculating what MMO subscriptions are is really a mute point.
Players like us DEMAND to know what the up-to-the-minute subs are for every MMO on the planet.
MMO's that are owned by publicly traded companies like:
WoW, WAR, and AoC have no choice but to oblige us.
They produce numbers that meet the requirements required by their stockholders... but those numbers are not good enough for us. I am thoroughly convinced that no number ever released about an MMO subscription will be accepted unequivocally... it's just not our nature.
So then the question becomes...
Why do we even bother to ask for subscription numbers?
It's not like the numbers will be believed, even if given. So I ask... what is the point?
Threads like this one are why speculating what MMO subscriptions are is really a mute point.
Players like us DEMAND to know what the up-to-the-minute subs are for every MMO on the planet. MMO's that are owned by publicly traded companies like: WoW, WAR, and AoC have no choice but to oblige us. They produce numbers that meet the requirements required by their stockholders... but those numbers are not good enough for us. I am thoroughly convinced that no number ever released about an MMO subscription will be accepted unequivocally... it's just not our nature.
So then the question becomes... Why do we even bother to ask for subscription numbers? It's not like the numbers will be believed, even if given. So I ask... what is the point?
This is not true. Three times this year Blizzard has given us straight subscription numbers (people who have paid within the last month). Eve also makes it's subscription numbers clearly visiable. Warhammer and AOC are the only two games that hide their subscription numbers by using terms like 'activated accounts' and other BS. Both games have shown substantial losses in players which is why they try to spin it by using irrelevant numbers.
Threads like this one are why speculating what MMO subscriptions are is really a mute point.
Players like us DEMAND to know what the up-to-the-minute subs are for every MMO on the planet. MMO's that are owned by publicly traded companies like: WoW, WAR, and AoC have no choice but to oblige us. They produce numbers that meet the requirements required by their stockholders... but those numbers are not good enough for us. I am thoroughly convinced that no number ever released about an MMO subscription will be accepted unequivocally... it's just not our nature.
So then the question becomes... Why do we even bother to ask for subscription numbers? It's not like the numbers will be believed, even if given. So I ask... what is the point?
This is not true. Three times this year Blizzard has given us straight subscription numbers (people who have paid within the last month). Eve also makes it's subscription numbers clearly visiable. Warhammer and AOC are the only two games that hide their subscription numbers by using terms like 'activated accounts' and other BS. Both games have shown substantial losses in players which is why they try to spin it by using irrelevant numbers.
All I ask is you link directly where, in the 11 million announcement, where they specifically state that they do not include specific people that are not "people who have paid within the last month" because they, like any other MMO company out there, will probably include those within the free month of a fully paid game. Since you have now frequently stated that the basic game is selling higher than most other MMOs, can you prove directly that they are not including those numbers, like you insist everyone else is outside of WOW (and constantly try and justify how every other game's population is conciderably lower than the public announcement numbers) , but make an effort to try and state that WOW does not.
This is why many do not trust what you say because you hold WOW to an exteremly low burden of proof, take anything they say as fact, but even where other games state figures in the same manner as WOW does, you constantly try to debunk them and "prove" it is much lower that the official numbers state. Until you hold WOW to the same burden of "Proof" you constantly hold all other games to, you viewpoint is uneven.
Originally posted by trevornor All I ask is you link directly where, in the 11 million announcement, where they specifically state that they do not include specific people that are not "people who have paid within the last month" because they, like any other MMO company out there, will probably include those within the free month of a fully paid game. Since you have now frequently stated that the basic game is selling higher than most other MMOs, can you prove directly that they are not including those numbers, like you insist everyone else is outside of WOW (and constantly try and justify how every other game's population is conciderably lower than the public announcement numbers) , but make an effort to try and state that WOW does not.
I'm not part of this debate but I was curious to find out the truth on this so...
World of Warcraft subscribers include individuals who have paid a subscription fee or have an active prepaid card to play World of Warcraft, as well as those who have purchased the game and are within their free month of access. Internet Game Room players who have accessed the game over the last thirty days are also counted as subscribers. The above definition excludes all players under free promotional subscriptions, expired or cancelled subscriptions, and expired prepaid cards. Subscribers in licensees’ territories are defined along the same rules
____________
So people who are in their free month are included
Those that are in free trials are not
Asian players are included if they logged in the past 30 days
Blizzard is very clear about their definition of subscriber and its on every press release they have. EA and Funcom are not clear and try to deceive as much as they can legally
Comments
You should read the source material that the OP provides, eh?
"Warhammer Online: Age of Reckoning, an MMO from EA's Mythic Entertainment studio, sold 1.2 million copies in the quarter -- with over 800 thousand current players. "
Cheers!
You should read the word in red. It doesnt' say "subs" it says "current players" . There's alot of people still using the iGamer Free trials and the 30 free days they're current players but they are not 'subs'.
btw im happy with the registered numbers if they can keep even half that'll be even more fantastic. Azril and bodypass can stfu
No they don't say 800K current players.
they say 800 K accounts ...the famous 750 K accounts created remember ...
The "missing" 400 K so called sold boxes are the number of boxes unsold in shops but of course they are already IN the bookkeeping of EA.
It's a twist and a clever one at that.
On Xfire : War has about 12 times less players than Wow at the moment.
So 4.5M divided by 12 = 400 K players. That is NOT 800 K, but indeed 50% of the original number of players about 4 weeks ago.
So cleverly worded, but you don't think about the stock in the shops and 400 K is still unsold to "accounts" but very well sold in EA's bookkeeping.
Agreed. On Sept 30th, Warhammer had about 400k actively playing players. The game has lost about another 30-40% since then, and is probably down to around 250k players. Since Sept 30th, the renewals have happened for both NA and EU.
There is no way that they would allow players to abandon 19 servers if they thought they would ever see 800k players ever again.
But really, its' just like AOC.. you can still find people on the AOC forums claiming the game has 500k players and that wow fanbois are exaggerating how low the subs are ( FWIW AOC = 75k).
Are you really sure that AoC currently has 75k active accounts?
That would really be dismal since it peaked at over 800k active accounts with 1.2m copies sold to the stores.
On the topic: I guess that Mythic should not have released the game in September and now we know why they had to change their name back from EA Mythic to just Mythic.
Question is what they mean by "current players". I don't think it's possible (at least not yet) for an MMO has 800k subscribers only a bit over a month after release, so I think it's safe to say "current players != subscribers". In addition, I'm still playing free and haven't had to subscribe yet (I believe GOA gave 2 us CE mofos, and possibly preorder mofos too, two extra weeks of free play). I will be subscribing when my free play runs out, though. Whatever is the case, I have a feeling Mark Jacobs is going to be one rich bastard *throws jealous fit*.
We see what you did there. Seriously, WoW will never die with people like you.
The reason they are merging the servers is that they saw that each server can handle much more people than initially planned.
So, instead of a 4000 cap we now have a 8000 cap. That's the reason we see Med-Med or Low-Low servers. For example, my server Dark Crag. It was Full-Full to High-High then in 1 day it became a Med-Med server. There is ALWAYS an RvR action going on, at least in T4. Even at 5 AM! Scenarios pop every minute. I see minimum 40-50 people on Dragonwake-Warcamp when I log in. BUT Dark Crag is a Med-Med server.
Got it? I don't think so... you can play with words, play with numbers, play with stupid Xfire charts. You can do all you want. But Warhammer is a very successful MMO which sits in the 2nd place of all MMOs out there.
It can never be #1. The reason is WoW is a PvE/raiding game and it appeals to the majority of gamers. WoW is a good PvE game and has the best grinding/time sinks available. They do these very good, kudos to Blizzard. However, PvP sucks. Arenas suck. Expansions suck. Combat sucks. Nothing more, nothing less.
Warhammer is a very good alternative to WoW, if you prefer PvP over PvE.
So please, go back to WoW forums and tell them about Xfire charts and other kind of crap.
Thank you Xtort, you worded it perfectly and added the population cap increase on servers. Apparently when people start hating a game, they become relentless and won't face facts.
God, everyone says they raised the server pops but they really haven't. PROVE IT!! Because I do not believe they raised server pops since release. Go play your WAR and get off the forums. Facts are facts. Game has had a total of 800k players since release. Well, Im not playing anymore so make that 799,999k players. Oh wait, many hundreds of thousands arent playing anymore either. So please, stop talking your bs all over this forum and back up what you say with facts.
Info about rising caps is from MArk Jacobs. He stated this in his interviews and official infos on Herald. They raised caps at least 2 times. You can find Mythic's post on Warhammer Alliance by dev tracker and no, I wont post link for you, not worth my time, I am coming back to that nice big battle we have in Blackfire Pass last 2 days
Well I dont really believe there are 800k people playing this game tbf, its too early and there some work that needs to be done.
BUT I think mythic is not gonnna loose out on the market, their MMO is a "success" as far as business is concerned if they have 200k people they are making money out of it and the game has been widely accepted AKA it wasnt a total fiasco like AoC or the "next big thing" before it, if they play the right cards and take the game in the direction people want they can make the player base grow over the next 6 months.
that means 400 players already left which would explain the Xfire numbers.
800k is a great number suxs that they lost 1/3 of the population though
PLaying: EvE, Ryzom
Waiting For: Earthrise, Perpetuum
You know, there's nothing to get fooled about?
Why are people upset? This isn't the JFK murder or 9/11 conspiracy is it?
The game will have whatever population it has, that's the end of the story.
Why whine about it?
Not sure if anyone posted this as I got sick of reading this thread but here is one of the quotes.
"We are back in the MMO business with the launch of Warhammer Online. Currently, 800,000 people are playing online worldwide. In North America, we have 250,000 subscribers in less than two weeks and are seeing conversions of over 70%. Although it is still early days, we like what we are seeing"
I also wanted to add. That 1.2 million is actually number of boxes sold to players.
They already announced 1.5 million boxes sold to retailers a long time ago. If they already sold 1.5 million boxes to retailers way back in September than it makes no sense that they sold 1.2 million boxes to retailers now doesn't it?
And they also already announced that they had 750k account on october 10th before the free month was over for anyone. The 1.2 million dates from Sept 30th so it can't be sold to customers
Retailers can return copies if the game undersells, they have many different deals with companies
And they also already announced that they had 750k account on october 10th before the free month was over for anyone. The 1.2 million dates from Sept 30th so it can't be sold to customers
Retailers can return copies if the game undersells, they have many different deals with companies
But the 800K also self-conflicted with the previous number does it not?
I was puzzled by these numbers at first but if you assume 2 things, it all makes sense.
1 - All EA public announcements are accurate.
2 - These are actual current number (after 10/18), not 9/30 number.
Chronically, it looks like this.
9/15 - EA announced WAR broke internal EA pre-order record and 1.5M boxes sold to retailers
9/25 - EA announced WAR reach 500K in the first week
9/30 - END of quarter
10/10 - EA announced WAR reach 750K
10/18 - 1st wave players free month over
10/31 - EA announced WAR reach 800K and 1.2M boxes sold.
Remember if this is the current number, EA is not the only company did this. Funcom did this too, remember the August 14 subscription number?
So, assuming this is the current number, they actually sold 1.2M boxes and about 400K players did not resub after the free month.
And they also already announced that they had 750k account on october 10th before the free month was over for anyone. The 1.2 million dates from Sept 30th so it can't be sold to customers
Retailers can return copies if the game undersells, they have many different deals with companies
But the 800K also self-conflicted with the previous number does it not?
I was puzzled by these numbers at first but if you assume 2 things, it all makes sense.
1 - All EA public announcements are accurate.
2 - These are actual current number (after 10/18), not 9/30 number.
Chronically, it looks like this.
9/15 - EA announced WAR broke internal EA pre-order record and 1.5M boxes sold to retailers
9/25 - EA announced WAR reach 500K in the first week
9/30 - END of quarter
10/10 - EA announced WAR reach 750K
10/18 - 1st wave players free month over
10/31 - EA announced WAR reach 800K and 1.2M boxes sold.
Remember if this is the current number, EA is not the only company did this. Funcom did this too, remember the August 14 subscription number?
So, assuming this is the current number, they actually sold 1.2M boxes and about 400K players did not resub after the free month.
Actually what I *ponder* is why we dicuss this kind of thing so often.
Other than if we own shares in the company why do we care?
Either you have fun when you login or you don't....
If you are having fun.. then another 10 million people playing wont' change that. Only 40,000 playing won't change that.
If you are not having fun... kinda the same deal.
One big reason is there are a lot of features in this game required a healthy population to work well. So, unlike any PvE center MMORPG, the more people you have on the servers, the better the game experience will be. In this game, you actually want the server to be crowded.
And they also already announced that they had 750k account on october 10th before the free month was over for anyone. The 1.2 million dates from Sept 30th so it can't be sold to customers
Retailers can return copies if the game undersells, they have many different deals with companies
But the 800K also self-conflicted with the previous number does it not?
I was puzzled by these numbers at first but if you assume 2 things, it all makes sense.
1 - All EA public announcements are accurate.
2 - These are actual current number (after 10/18), not 9/30 number.
Chronically, it looks like this.
9/15 - EA announced WAR broke internal EA pre-order record and 1.5M boxes sold to retailers
9/25 - EA announced WAR reach 500K in the first week
9/30 - END of quarter
10/10 - EA announced WAR reach 750K
10/18 - 1st wave players free month over
10/31 - EA announced WAR reach 800K and 1.2M boxes sold.
Remember if this is the current number, EA is not the only company did this. Funcom did this too, remember the August 14 subscription number?
So, assuming this is the current number, they actually sold 1.2M boxes and about 400K players did not resub after the free month.
Actually what I *ponder* is why we dicuss this kind of thing so often.
Other than if we own shares in the company why do we care?
Either you have fun when you login or you don't....
If you are having fun.. then another 10 million people playing wont' change that. Only 40,000 playing won't change that.
If you are not having fun... kinda the same deal.
Some of us are interested on how games are doing, what are the industry trends, how many players like a certain type of game and things like that.
They clearly said it when the game first launched that the caps were kept low initially to force people to spread out and then would be raised. Im still looking for that original post to appease you naysayers.
Edit: link
While not the original post that I read, that there confirms that capacity limits were being changed based on concurrent population.
that means 400 players already left which would explain the Xfire numbers.
800k is a great number suxs that they lost 1/3 of the population though
Fully expected and normal. As Mark Jacobs posted the other day, no game has 100% retention rate. Some portion of the population quit every day/month. As long as those losses are replaced by subsequent sales, the game will continue to grow.
Since the topic was locked on VNboard I'm going to answer you here (how come it was locked?, there was no fighting)
You forgot to take into consideration that less than 750k people and more than 500k had bought the box 1 month before and had their month expire. That means that the 70% can only be applied to those since the other sales haven't expired yet
The report that is linked (or is it an analysis of EA's preliminary report?) says the data contains numbers from the second quarter which ended Sept 30.
From the first few lines in the original link.
Electronic Arts Inc. (ERTS: ERTS, , ) today announced preliminary financial results for its fiscal second quarter ended September 30, 2008.
Fiscal Second Quarter Results (comparisons are to the quarter ended September 30, 2007)
I must admit I am very confused now, especially considering the Oct 10 announcement of 750k accounts. How can a game have 800k active accounts/users/subscribers/whatever right now and be merging populations at the same time.
Here Daffid011
vnboards.ign.com/warhammer_online_age_of_reckoning_general_board/b22997/109240021/p4/
Scroll down to the last 4 messages
We see what you did there. Seriously, WoW will never die with people like you.
The reason they are merging the servers is that they saw that each server can handle much more people than initially planned.
So, instead of a 4000 cap we now have a 8000 cap. That's the reason we see Med-Med or Low-Low servers. For example, my server Dark Crag. It was Full-Full to High-High then in 1 day it became a Med-Med server. There is ALWAYS an RvR action going on, at least in T4. Even at 5 AM! Scenarios pop every minute. I see minimum 40-50 people on Dragonwake-Warcamp when I log in. BUT Dark Crag is a Med-Med server.
Got it? I don't think so... you can play with words, play with numbers, play with stupid Xfire charts. You can do all you want. But Warhammer is a very successful MMO which sits in the 2nd place of all MMOs out there.
It can never be #1. The reason is WoW is a PvE/raiding game and it appeals to the majority of gamers. WoW is a good PvE game and has the best grinding/time sinks available. They do these very good, kudos to Blizzard. However, PvP sucks. Arenas suck. Expansions suck. Combat sucks. Nothing more, nothing less.
Warhammer is a very good alternative to WoW, if you prefer PvP over PvE.
So please, go back to WoW forums and tell them about Xfire charts and other kind of crap.
Thank you Xtort, you worded it perfectly and added the population cap increase on servers. Apparently when people start hating a game, they become relentless and won't face facts.
God, everyone says they raised the server pops but they really haven't. PROVE IT!! Because I do not believe they raised server pops since release. Go play your WAR and get off the forums. Facts are facts. Game has had a total of 800k players since release. Well, Im not playing anymore so make that 799,999k players. Oh wait, many hundreds of thousands arent playing anymore either. So please, stop talking your bs all over this forum and back up what you say with facts.
The problem is.. you haters dont have facts either. you spout things like "PROVE IT!" yet NOONE can prove what the current numbers are yet this entire threat is speculating what we thing they are.
So if you want facts.. you are in the wrong thread.
The report that is linked (or is it an analysis of EA's preliminary report?) says the data contains numbers from the second quarter which ended Sept 30.
From the first few lines in the original link.
Electronic Arts Inc. (ERTS: ERTS, , ) today announced preliminary financial results for its fiscal second quarter ended September 30, 2008.
Fiscal Second Quarter Results (comparisons are to the quarter ended September 30, 2007)
I must admit I am very confused now, especially considering the Oct 10 announcement of 750k accounts. How can a game have 800k active accounts/users/subscribers/whatever right now and be merging populations at the same time.
They are not merging populations. They are allowing charactor transfers. Some people like low pop servers, most people like high pop servers. With a game like WAR, high population servers are better because you do not have to wait for a queue.
I play late at night, usually around 3 AM EST, and the Tier 3 queue is 1 minute to 5 minutes on a medium pop server (med during primetime). When it starts hitting 5 AM, it jumps to about 20 minutes.
I can imagine how hard a low population server is when it comes to RvR.
The definition of insanity: doing the same thing over and over expecting different results.
Well............they are shutting servers, it is not a sign that the game is doing well.
That's a fact.
Of course I can't produce any number until EA will release them (if)
But the fact that they don't come clean on the number of subscribers instead of the number of accounts, isn't a good sign either.
Blizzard stated clearly they have 11 Million subscribers, what EA has to hide?
Threads like this one are why speculating what MMO subscriptions are is really a mute point.
Players like us DEMAND to know what the up-to-the-minute subs are for every MMO on the planet.
MMO's that are owned by publicly traded companies like:
WoW, WAR, and AoC have no choice but to oblige us.
They produce numbers that meet the requirements required by their stockholders... but those numbers are not good enough for us. I am thoroughly convinced that no number ever released about an MMO subscription will be accepted unequivocally... it's just not our nature.
So then the question becomes...
Why do we even bother to ask for subscription numbers?
It's not like the numbers will be believed, even if given. So I ask... what is the point?
This is not true. Three times this year Blizzard has given us straight subscription numbers (people who have paid within the last month). Eve also makes it's subscription numbers clearly visiable. Warhammer and AOC are the only two games that hide their subscription numbers by using terms like 'activated accounts' and other BS. Both games have shown substantial losses in players which is why they try to spin it by using irrelevant numbers.
This is not true. Three times this year Blizzard has given us straight subscription numbers (people who have paid within the last month). Eve also makes it's subscription numbers clearly visiable. Warhammer and AOC are the only two games that hide their subscription numbers by using terms like 'activated accounts' and other BS. Both games have shown substantial losses in players which is why they try to spin it by using irrelevant numbers.
All I ask is you link directly where, in the 11 million announcement, where they specifically state that they do not include specific people that are not "people who have paid within the last month" because they, like any other MMO company out there, will probably include those within the free month of a fully paid game. Since you have now frequently stated that the basic game is selling higher than most other MMOs, can you prove directly that they are not including those numbers, like you insist everyone else is outside of WOW (and constantly try and justify how every other game's population is conciderably lower than the public announcement numbers) , but make an effort to try and state that WOW does not.
This is why many do not trust what you say because you hold WOW to an exteremly low burden of proof, take anything they say as fact, but even where other games state figures in the same manner as WOW does, you constantly try to debunk them and "prove" it is much lower that the official numbers state. Until you hold WOW to the same burden of "Proof" you constantly hold all other games to, you viewpoint is uneven.
Have a good night.
I'm not part of this debate but I was curious to find out the truth on this so...
www.mcvuk.com/press-releases/41601/WORLD-OF-WARCRAFTreg-SURPASSES-11-MILLION-SUBSCRIBERS-WORLDWIDE
____________
World of Warcraft’s Subscriber Definition
World of Warcraft subscribers include individuals who have paid a subscription fee or have an active prepaid card to play World of Warcraft, as well as those who have purchased the game and are within their free month of access. Internet Game Room players who have accessed the game over the last thirty days are also counted as subscribers. The above definition excludes all players under free promotional subscriptions, expired or cancelled subscriptions, and expired prepaid cards. Subscribers in licensees’ territories are defined along the same rules
____________
So people who are in their free month are included
Those that are in free trials are not
Asian players are included if they logged in the past 30 days
Blizzard is very clear about their definition of subscriber and its on every press release they have. EA and Funcom are not clear and try to deceive as much as they can legally