Howdy, Stranger!
It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!
Quick Links
New comer questions
dave6660
Member UncommonPosts: 2,699
After bouncing around from game to game lately I've decided to give FFXI a try. I haven't done much research on it so forgive me if I'm beating a dead horse.
I know that this is a very group oriented game (which is why I chose it). In order to be successful do you need a full group or can a duo or trio work? Moreover do most people want a full group with the perfect class composition just be begin?
Which classes are currently most in demand? Which do groups consider useless? Yes, we should all play the class we like most but I would like to minimize the time I spend spamming LFG even if that means playing my second or third choice.
How does the grind compare to Lineage 2?
Thanks.
There are certain queer times and occasions in this strange mixed affair we call life when a man takes this whole universe for a vast practical joke, though the wit thereof he but dimly discerns, and more than suspects that the joke is at nobody's expense but his own.
-- Herman Melville
Comments
You can work and do a lot of things with a group of 2-3 people. To be most efficent in exp parties 6 people (a full part) is prefered. You exp/hr is the highest with a full group. You can have less but you might not have enough damage or whatnot to kill a mob quickly thus taking longer and the exp/hr drops. You could have move than a full party (up to 18 in an alliance) but then the exp from a mob can get spread out too thin and even though you are killing quickly you will get very little exp from any given mob. Six people is the most optimal.
There has been and always will be a want in this game for the perfect set up. It goes back to the exp/hr idea. IN theory a specific class isn't needed at any given time, but the party roll is. For instance a Summoner (SMN) can play the roll of the healer later in the game if that is what the party needs, but if the party is good on healing they a can Damage Deal. A party should have a Tank, a Healer, a Support job, and fill the rest with Damage Dealers. Later in parties some job can multitask -- A Red Mage (RDM) can be a Support and Healer with the right party setup -- and you will also need someone who can refresh (to reduce down time) and/or haste (to speed up killing) a party thus creating better exp/hr. Some people don't really care if a party is not high-end extreme efficient like myself, but there are some people who are so anal that they must have the very best no questions asked.
Jobs that are most in demand are: Ninja (NIN) or Paladin (PLD) which are your tanks. Bard (BRD) or RDM who are your refreshers. WHM, RDM, Scholar (SCH) are healers.
Puppermaster (PUP) is considered useless by a lot of people standards, but that is because they don't give them a chance. If they are able to keep their skills up -- which they won't if they have to keep soloing -- and keep good gear they can be quite good. You will LFP on this job and never stop. Don't pick this job if you want quick parties. Find friends then bride your friends to party with you if you are interested in PUP.
Dark Knights (DRK) miss a lot and use big weapons with a lot of delay between attacks. With the right gear it can be good, just starting out it could be a problem.
Beastmaster (BST) is another solo job. You can charm pets and have them fight for you. Since you can solo with it people assume that you should be. I have always loved a BST in my party and, to be honest, I consider them they strongest job in the game. However people dont party with them so they don't get to see how great they are or can be -- a la PUP. The tides are turning though.
Honestly I have never played Linage II so I really can't compare for you. You get no exp for quests and up until recenly you have no exp for events. There are real time events -- sort of like public quests in WAR -- that you can join in and get exp, but these are very recent things and they are not usually as good on exp/hr as an exp party would be. Getting a job to lvl 75 is about 850k exp (it used to be more they lowered it a few years ago). It takes about 1/5 of that to get a support job to 37. Early on 4k/hr is very good, later in the game 6k/hr about as low as you can go before you start to cry. So ... assuming 5k/hr over the course of 850k ... ... ... ... yeah it is a grind.
Guy above me has it right, so I'll compare this to L2 for you since I played both. And uhh....well, it's no where near as bad as L2's grind, but it is higher then most(if not all) post-WoW MMOs. Thing is, because you are always in a group, it never feels like a grind, at least not in the same sense as L2, where you are usually by yourself at first, with the option of doing group oriented stuff like raids. I think FFXI also has the best end game of any MMO. I can tell you more if you want, but yeah.
--------------------------------------------------------------------
WoW: 70 NE Rogue(Akama)
FFXI: 75DRK/37WAR/18SAM/12THF(Fenrir)
Currently playing: Warhammer Online(or at least trying to).
"Puppermaster (PUP) is considered useless by a lot of people standards, but that is because they don't give them a chance. If they are able to keep their skills up -- which they won't if they have to keep soloing -- and keep good gear they can be quite good. You will LFP on this job and never stop. Don't pick this job if you want quick parties. Find friends then bride your friends to party with you if you are interested in PUP."
I'm a little saddened by that because I'm actually leveling Puppetmaster at the moment (currently 67) and I've found it incredibly useful and alot of people impressed with the job once they've given it a chance. I just don't want to give the topic author the wrong idea here, alot of people have the idea that PUP is worthless and shouldn't be invited but it can be incredibly versatile and the combination of the damage from the automaton and the master can be sizable.
Sure, alot of people don't like PUP sadly, but it's not worthless at all, they're actually quite powerful and its a very very fun job to play.
“The contents of this post do not necessarily reflect the views of MMORPG.com and its management.”
I am saddened by this as well ... my PUP is 75. It was painful and very disheartening. Fact of the matter is it is true. People don't like Puppetmaster. I got bitched at for hours by an ls mate because I wasn't coming to a testimonial farming as my whm when we needed a healer. The long and short of it ... PUP has Cure V, but i still had to listen to it for an hour before he'd give the idea a chance.
Thanks for the input guys. I settled on a Monk as my first class. Later on when the Ninja becomes available I do want to give him a try.
There are certain queer times and occasions in this strange mixed affair we call life when a man takes this whole universe for a vast practical joke, though the wit thereof he but dimly discerns, and more than suspects that the joke is at nobody's expense but his own.
-- Herman Melville
It is a group oriented game to say the least.You can do a lot of stuff with 3 players nicely,heck i can do a lot using 2 accounts myself.The problem is that the real tough stuff takes a full party or 5 anyhow.
If you start worrying about xp/hr and superficial reasons for enjoying a game,you will burn out and find it boring.There is so much to learn and experience in this game it can easily get over whelming.This game is not like your typical WOW/EQ game,it has many similarties but there are many hidden aspects of the game,that only vets have learned over time.Unlike many other games,you really can't run away from a battle gone wrong.Yes you can zone if one is very close by and yes you can 15 sec flee if you are thief or sub thf,but usually you will just die.
This game uses interupts,meaning mobs can and will interupt some of your most useful things like hoping to warp from a battle or teleport from a battle.Thnis game is very intircate in all of it's aspects,you rarely have an abundance of mp to do any more than just battle,then you need rest.If there is one class that is needed a ton in this game it is of course tanks,however aside from that RDM are the most useful.The reason being is there ability to make fights go smoother,rather than have some mob use a buff that you can't do anything about except wait for it to wear off.
Whatever you do in the game or whatever route you take...NEVER take gil for granted.This is the worst game by miles for gaining game currency.There is no question in my mind ,they wanted this game to be a huge time sink and they wanted rare items to remain rare so every tom dick and jane doesn't have the same elite gear.You will not get good results selling anything to npcs and only the rarest of items sell often on the auction house.
I would suggest not being a tank to start this game.You will need very good gear and often take criticism from players who take the game far too seriously.A healer role is nice but again for a noob who doesn't know about macros and stuff it would be stressfull.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Perhaps someday I could use your imput on a Puppetmaster guide?
“The contents of this post do not necessarily reflect the views of MMORPG.com and its management.”
As a word of helpful advise. If you are wanting to go Ninja, wait. Ninja is a very expensive job with tools and scrolls. If you buy just the two base scrolls for shadows you are looking at about 500k gil and that's just when you hit 37. Not to mention all the shadows you will be buying, i'd definately reccomend waiting. If you're going with Monk i'd say level up warrior at the same time that way when you can do the subjob thing you can swap back and forth. Also you will need Warrior leveled up for Ninja too so that you can provoke and tank.
EVE - Sharvala
FFXI - Shazamalicious
Guild Wars - Xavier Lucifer & Charlize the Necro
"Ranged...stuck...tree...15 random words... suck... noob fanboy... I MAKE GUIDE!"
I am saddened by this as well ... my PUP is 75. It was painful and very disheartening. Fact of the matter is it is true. People don't like Puppetmaster. I got bitched at for hours by an ls mate because I wasn't coming to a testimonial farming as my whm when we needed a healer. The long and short of it ... PUP has Cure V, but i still had to listen to it for an hour before he'd give the idea a chance.
This is, sadly, one of the huge ugly warts on the players at large in FFXI - though not all are like that.
Here's the problem...
Players go by what's "obvious" about a job. If the job has a clear-cut usefulness in a group, as a Tank, DD, etc... then they know off the bat where it fits in a party setup, and consider it a "useful job".
If it's not so clear-cut and they don't understand the job that well, if at all, then they don't know how it can benefit a party and they're often considered to be useless. It's an ego thing in that case. It's not "cool" to admit you don't understand a job. It's "cool" to pretend you do and deem it "useless".
Combine that with the bandwagon behavior of many players who will simply go along with what everyone else says and consider it "fact", and you have one of the worst self-imposed problems the FFXI community suffers.
Bard went through this, believe it or not, back when NA players were just learning. It wasn't a clear-cut job and people thought the idea of singing/playing instruments to be (pardon the term) "gay". So they wouldn't go near it and Bards had a hard time finding groups.
That is until they found out just what it can do for a party. All of a sudden, there were people who wouldn't join a party unless they had a Bard and, at the least, they're a very popular job now in parties.
Same with Monk. I remember being knocked for *months* for playing a "useless job" like Monk. Then people realized their usefulness, not only against anything made of bone, but in HNM (raid battles basically) due to their ability to do high damage (potentially over 1k per shot) with Chi Blast. All of a sudden, everyone was leveling Monk.
In short, you're dealing with a combination of player ignorance, player ego combined with bandwagon behavior. People are also obsessed with the idea of "the right way to play the game", and refuse to play any other way; not realizing there are *many* "right ways" to play. They stick vehemently to whatever the current "right" play style is.
I'd say FFXI can be broken down as such:
- 10% of the players actually play the game, experiment with the jobs and learn their true potential, ignoring what the latest "conventional wisdom" is.
- 40% can't be bothered to experiment and assume to know what they're talking about.
- The remaining 50% ride the bandwagon of what the 40% tell them, following online guides and such to the letter, without bothering to research or learn for themselves.
Puppet Master may yet find its "home" among parties, as soon as someone proves just what they can do. And believe me, as much as people might say "but people know what PUP can do" blah blah... They said the same about Monk and Bard before those jobs became popular. It was common-knowledge. "Everyone" knew they were useless... And then just as quickly, everyone changed their tune and realized they weren't.
That's why there's a certain... ahh... "nobility" (for lack of a better word) in playing PUP (as well as other soloable jobs/combos). You don't get parties as much, perhaps, but it leads to you really learning the job inside and out and soloing things that others would have a very difficult time taking on even in a group.
Go to YouTube and look up Elmerthepointy (all one word like that). Check his videos, he has some showing him soloing some ENMs, etc. as PUP.
and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
Monk is a great class to start out as.
People understand the role of DD in a party, so they will invite you, Plus it will allow you to learn the game and group mechanics without too much responsibilty.
Monk was my first job, and i loved it.
This mindset is exactly what i had to deal with when i leveled Red Mage. I subbed SMN. I tried to explain that though it doesn't have the stuff people are used to it has benefits especially at later levels like nice buffs, auto-refresh for me, a much bigger MP pool and i could cure well too. Add this on top of never running out of MP despite refreshing, hasting, curing, enfeebling, and buffing my party would could around.
EVE - Sharvala
FFXI - Shazamalicious
Guild Wars - Xavier Lucifer & Charlize the Necro
"Ranged...stuck...tree...15 random words... suck... noob fanboy... I MAKE GUIDE!"
I suggest first thing is pick up a English server and get the most popular linkshell so you can chat with other people. On my server, there are lot of people can't speak English but use Macro for their emotion on you. It's very moody environment.
And people like to EXAMINE you. The word Examine is pretty offensive if you are not examine by a Doctor. Some people really uses this as offense or disrespectful because everyone can tell the suck level 1 uniform, whatelse worthy a check.
So I think the word "examine" used in chat log is break privacy but it is actually to check your armors. So the function is nothing wrong but Examine is improperly used.
I found out if your in party and won the dice then the loot will be distributed to you 2-3 minutes after your group got the kill. You won't see the dice because it is system work. If your group disbanded then no one will receive any loot for those undelivered loots. And, if you joined a party, although you are far away from the combat but you still have opportunity to win the dice but not exp.
If you grouped with high level then you get less exp or no exp.
I am level 7 atm. I don't see the need for group atm. And, I have seen some high levels keep coming back to Gelbasa outpost, I supposed they were not able to find a group to do quest so they solo it at higher levels. Since the game already for years so it is certainly difficult to get group for low or middle level quest because most people got high level and they could help each other with their low level alt. One other difficult thing is there is no guild.
My opinion is if you can't select a good server then you are on your own. And what mmo is not group oriented?